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TheBeaverHunter

Thoughts on the Same old Bengals Free Agent extravaganza

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The reality is that we lost one player we shouldn't have.... Whitworth.

So, we were always an injury away from this exact scenario.

Doesn't mean I'm happy about it, but the sky isn't falling.

 

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6 minutes ago, LostInDaJungle said:

The reality is that we lost one player we shouldn't have.... Whitworth.

So, we were always an injury away from this exact scenario.

Doesn't mean I'm happy about it, but the sky isn't falling.

 

I'm assuming you're talking about what everyone expected for 2017 (losing Zeitler was inevitable) and not 2016 because we're a couple pieces down from where we were last season.

I've calmed down a bit since the day Whit signed in LA but I still don't understand why some people are so optimistic about Ogbuehi. He wasn't just sort of mediocre or anything last year, he looked like he doesn't belong on an NFL field in any capacity.

I agree that the sky isn't falling but only because a lot could change between now and week 1 of the regular season, but if Ogbuehi is starting week 1 at LT I'm going to be very, very nervous. I think a complete scheme change on offense would benefit the team more than trying to force Og and Fisher to try to play the same style as the guys they're replacing.

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Just now, omgdrdoom said:

I'm assuming you're talking about what everyone expected for 2017 (losing Zeitler was inevitable) and not 2016 because we're a couple pieces down from where we were last season.

I've calmed down a bit since the day Whit signed in LA but I still don't understand why some people are so optimistic about Ogbuehi. He wasn't just sort of mediocre or anything last year, he looked like he doesn't belong on an NFL field in any capacity.

I agree that the sky isn't falling but only because a lot could change between now and week 1 of the regular season, but if Ogbuehi is starting week 1 at LT I'm going to be very, very nervous. I think a complete scheme change on offense would benefit the team more than trying to force Og and Fisher to try to play the same style as the guys they're replacing.

Well, Ogubuehi was Whit's backup last year. We were always an ankle sprain away from playing him or Fisher at LT.

I think that losing Whit really highlights how incompetent our FO is, but from a "guys on the field" perspective, it's not the end of the world.

For as badly as Oggie looked on the Right Side, it fits his draft profile to a tee.  He was never a power guy with great hand technique, he's always been a guy who likes to "catch" defenders. He would have been a top 10 pick as a Junior. Judging him off one bad season in which he didn't get a full training camp at an unfamiliar position is kinda... Meh.

Speaking of which - what an awesome guy Whit is: http://www.cincyjungle.com/2017/3/15/14930952/whitworth-help-ogbuehi-offseason-retire-bengals

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9 minutes ago, LostInDaJungle said:

Well, Ogubuehi was Whit's backup last year. We were always an ankle sprain away from playing him or Fisher at LT.

I think that losing Whit really highlights how incompetent our FO is, but from a "guys on the field" perspective, it's not the end of the world.

For as badly as Oggie looked on the Right Side, it fits his draft profile to a tee.  He was never a power guy with great hand technique, he's always been a guy who likes to "catch" defenders. He would have been a top 10 pick as a Junior. Judging him off one bad season in which he didn't get a full training camp at an unfamiliar position is kinda... Meh.

Speaking of which - what an awesome guy Whit is: http://www.cincyjungle.com/2017/3/15/14930952/whitworth-help-ogbuehi-offseason-retire-bengals

Yeah Whit is great, just highlights how much it sucks to lose someone like that when you see all the articles like this coming out. Oh well, can't worry about him anymore I guess..until he retires and maybe we can snag him as a coach? Not every player would make a good coach but he strikes me as the type that would be nice to have around to teach things to the younger guys.

If we didn't take Ogbuehi, another team would have shortly after (probably), but I still wasn't a huge fan of the pick at the time. I liked the Fisher pick but would have preferred a different direction in round 1. I will say there weren't a whole lot of options in positions of need that would have been obvious fits for our schemes.

I'd completely agree that it's tough to judge a guy from just this one season, but it wasn't just a bad season, it was a horrible, awful, BAD season. He didn't look like he should be on an NFL field kind of bad. Were there any positives at all with him last year? Anything to look forward to if you're being realistic and not just "I think he's going to get better because I said so" kind of arguments? I've been looking for ways to look at it from a positive standpoint, and the only thing I've mentioned that I can think of is if we overhaul the scheme to fit the athletic tackles we've drafted and stop the bullshit with trying to be this run first, maulers needed up front kind of team. We've had a couple years where Dalton racks up the attempts, but I want to see him throwing the ball more than Drew Brees.

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This just reminds me of the 2011 Off-season just put us at #32 already and predict us all 1-15....and everyone can keep whining.

 

Bet we go 10-6 with this group, I'm not worried, there is nothing we can do to make this a superbowl caliber team this offseason, so I don't get why people want us to get all agressive and over pay for ok players. 

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4 minutes ago, omgdrdoom said:

Anything to look forward to if you're being realistic and not just "I think he's going to get better because I said so" kind of arguments?

If I'm being realistic, the Coaching staff and Duke Tobin all think he'll do much better.

Cue the complaints about the coaching staff...

If you can't find anyone between Lewis, Alexander, Zampese, Whitworth and Tobin to trust when they say he's going to be in a better situation next year and that will lead to better play, then I'm not sure why you're even rooting for the Gals. But the point is still irrelevant. In 2016 were were a Whitworth injury away from starting him as our LT.

Signing Whitworth in no way guarantees that Ced wouldn't have started at LT next year.

I'm not happy with losing Whit, but he's just one guy. If the team isn't ready to move forward with this, then the team isn't built well period.

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1 minute ago, LostInDaJungle said:

If I'm being realistic, the Coaching staff and Duke Tobin all think he'll do much better.

Cue the complaints about the coaching staff...

If you can't find anyone between Lewis, Alexander, Zampese, Whitworth and Tobin to trust when they say he's going to be in a better situation next year and that will lead to better play, then I'm not sure why you're even rooting for the Gals. But the point is still irrelevant. In 2016 were were a Whitworth injury away from starting him as our LT.

Signing Whitworth in no way guarantees that Ced wouldn't have started at LT next year.

I'm not happy with losing Whit, but he's just one guy. If the team isn't ready to move forward with this, then the team isn't built well period.

Agreed, except I honestly don't care if he left or not. I'd rather use that $12 million on Efeirt and Burfict and cross my fingers on Ced, burfict and efeirt are young in their primes and really aren't replaceable.

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10 minutes ago, LostInDaJungle said:

If I'm being realistic, the Coaching staff and Duke Tobin all think he'll do much better.

Cue the complaints about the coaching staff...

If you can't find anyone between Lewis, Alexander, Zampese, Whitworth and Tobin to trust when they say he's going to be in a better situation next year and that will lead to better play, then I'm not sure why you're even rooting for the Gals. But the point is still irrelevant. In 2016 were were a Whitworth injury away from starting him as our LT.

Signing Whitworth in no way guarantees that Ced wouldn't have started at LT next year.

I'm not happy with losing Whit, but he's just one guy. If the team isn't ready to move forward with this, then the team isn't built well period.

You keep saying he's just one guy but we did lose Zeitler too. Weren't you arguing with me in a different thread about a month ago saying he's the best RG in the league, or at least better than David DeCastro? I just figured you'd be concerned losing a top 3 LT in the NFL and a top 3 (from what you insinuated in the past) RG without good in house replacements?

We're 1 injury away from AJ McCarron starting at QB. We're 1 injury away from Clayton Fejedelem starting at safety. We're 1 injury away from a LOT of bad situations. It's kind of an illogical argument you're making about the 1 injury away ordeal. It doesn't make much sense as you can apply that to any position and claim it isn't the end of the world losing ANY player on the team.

I've read where Whit is going to work with him, but where has Whit given his praise of Ced where he believes he's going to be a good LT next year? I see people saying things similar to that but I can't find anything that actually reads that Whit thinks Ced will be greatly improving. I 10000% believe Ced will be better in 2017 than 2016, that's without a doubt IMO. He was one of the worst tackles in the entire NFL with the strength and technique you'd expect to see a from a 7th rounder, so he needs to improve more than just a little bit to keep Andy upright. I'm not worried about Ooogieboogie improving, I'm worried about him improving enough.

It's another illogical argument to insinuate that I shouldn't be rooting for the Bengals if I don't trust the current coaching staff. There are pros and cons to every coach on the team, but even if you put all the positives together and ignore the negatives, I don't think you can just assume Ogbuehi is going to improve drastically in 1 offseason.

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16 minutes ago, turningpoint said:

This just reminds me of the 2011 Off-season just put us at #32 already and predict us all 1-15....and everyone can keep whining.

 

Bet we go 10-6 with this group, I'm not worried, there is nothing we can do to make this a superbowl caliber team this offseason, so I don't get why people want us to get all agressive and over pay for ok players. 

Isn't the point to at least try to win more football games than other teams? I'd rather sign some "ok" players and try to improve the team instead of just sticking with what we have because of the "oh well, we can't make ourselves a contender anyway so fuck it" kind of thinking.

5 minutes ago, turningpoint said:

Agreed, except I honestly don't care if he left or not. I'd rather use that $12 million on Efeirt and Burfict and cross my fingers on Ced, burfict and efeirt are young in their primes and really aren't replaceable.

Yeah those 1491 career yards from Eifert are irreplaceable.

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1 hour ago, omgdrdoom said:

You keep saying he's just one guy but we did lose Zeitler too. Weren't you arguing with me in a different thread about a month ago saying he's the best RG in the league, or at least better than David DeCastro? I just figured you'd be concerned losing a top 3 LT in the NFL and a top 3 (from what you insinuated in the past) RG without good in house replacements?

We're 1 injury away from AJ McCarron starting at QB. We're 1 injury away from Clayton Fejedelem starting at safety. We're 1 injury away from a LOT of bad situations. It's kind of an illogical argument you're making about the 1 injury away ordeal. It doesn't make much sense as you can apply that to any position and claim it isn't the end of the world losing ANY player on the team.

I've read where Whit is going to work with him, but where has Whit given his praise of Ced where he believes he's going to be a good LT next year? I see people saying things similar to that but I can't find anything that actually reads that Whit thinks Ced will be greatly improving. I 10000% believe Ced will be better in 2017 than 2016, that's without a doubt IMO. He was one of the worst tackles in the entire NFL with the strength and technique you'd expect to see a from a 7th rounder, so he needs to improve more than just a little bit to keep Andy upright. I'm not worried about Ooogieboogie improving, I'm worried about him improving enough.

It's another illogical argument to insinuate that I shouldn't be rooting for the Bengals if I don't trust the current coaching staff. There are pros and cons to every coach on the team, but even if you put all the positives together and ignore the negatives, I don't think you can just assume Ogbuehi is going to improve drastically in 1 offseason.

I both believe that Zeitler was a top tier RG and can buy the argument that RG's aren't worth Tackle money. As much as I may think highly of Zeitler's play, he wasn't coming back. So even thought I would have resigned him, that's just not on the table, and never was.

True, we're one play away from a lot of guys starting. It's a next man up league. If we lost Dalton, it would be McCarron's turn to lead the team. The same reason I won't freak out if we fail to sign Eifert next year. Either Fisher or Oggie will step up in camp. Andre the Hutt is back so RT is at lest there...

http://www.cincyjungle.com/2017/2/22/14684316/bengals-whitworth-explains-issues-ogbuehi-fisher

I think it was a horrible move by the coaching staff to just give the RT spot to a guy who didn't even have a full camp. It also shows you the confidence they do have in him. A full offseason would do him wonders. Frankly, his injury history scares the hell out of me.

I'm just saying as a fan, if you can't trust the coaches, the scouts or the players... Why? But for all of the wailing and gnashing of teeth, we've lost one guy we planned on having back. 

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1 hour ago, omgdrdoom said:

Isn't the point to at least try to win more football games than other teams? I'd rather sign some "ok" players and try to improve the team instead of just sticking with what we have because of the "oh well, we can't make ourselves a contender anyway so fuck it" kind of thinking.

Yeah those 1491 career yards from Eifert are irreplaceable.

No, I believe the Bengals staff thinks they have better players on their team already, and at this point in time, I'm in agreement.  If they don't have a better player, I'm damn sure they didn't just agree to let whit and zeitler walk, what I'm sure they said, hmm well we have invested a lot in ced o and fisher, we really can't have them on our bench, we could use thie $12million for other players who's contracts are coming up. Zietler for $10million or Andre for half that, is there that much of a drop off? No. 

Could you imagine this board next off-season if we had to let burfict walk and go re-sign Mauluga off the street because we decide to pay Zeitler over bringing in Andre?

Also, the Efiert comment you made is a joke I hope.

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It gets more and more difficult to be a Bengals fan as the years go by.

 

it was nice to start having winning seasons at first, even if we got embarrassed in the playoffs each year. But after a couple years, expectations raise. They weren't the Cincinnati Browns anymore, they were something we could be fairly proud of.

But having success in the NFL isn't simply making it into the playoffs and getting the boot in the first round every year. That just means you may be the 12th best team out of 32. Not exactly amazing.

For a team that never has quite enough talent/competent coaches to win a damn playoff game, every offseason they went into with the plan that they will stay as status quo as they possibly could be. They have never taken steps to truly get better, all they do is stay status quo, or worse. For a team that never had the talent to win a postseason game, they were consistently drafting "for the future" or drafting high round projects. Very rarely has this team EVER been in a win now mode. Just always been completely content with being slightly above mediocre, and if they happen to better than slightly better than mediocre- then they consider that their own Super Bowl. Wouldn't surprise me if Mike brown has bought himself some "best GM in he world" coffee mugs and some trophies for each year they made it into the wild card round. Probably spends a month patting himself on the back for the major victory of making the playoffs again.

Each year that goes by and I watch the Bengals do virtually nothing to improve the team makes me more and more apathetic towards the team. They obviously don't want to win as bad as fans do. They haven't done anything this offseason except get worse. Significantly worse. And here they are- standing pat and doing nothing in FA. Meanwhile, teams with the goal of winning super bowls like the Patriots have done everything in their power to improve on what was already the best team in the NFL.

The Bengals annual free agent vomiting is frustrating. Infuriating. Depressing. Disheartening.

 

holier than thou types will say it's "just a game"..: but everyone knows it's much more than that for real fans. Just one time I wish I could watch as my team takes the necessary steps to try to win a Super Bowl... but I know that will likely never happen- there isn't enough pride in PBS to ever do what it takes to win at that level.

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I just heard a teeny, teeny, weeny violin playing.

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29 minutes ago, kennethmw said:

I just heard a teeny, teeny, weeny violin playing.

Probably what Mike brown considers the most effective way to hear modern, up to date music. Meanwhile, virtually the entire rest of the league is streaming music online.

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1 hour ago, kennethmw said:

I just heard a teeny, teeny, weeny violin playing.

 

*single tear*

 

Man if I thought the Bengals were that damned tragic I surely wouldn't be wasting my time on them.  So weird!

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Frickmwmw and frackdub- two of the reasons the board membership has died significantly over the past few years and sent all the members to http://thebengalsboard.com/ .....your condescending, worthless contributions to the conversation are once again completely unwarranted and totally non-consequential.

Great for you two that you are so excited and completely happy with the regressive progress the Bengals have been making in the past two offseasons. You must be so much bigger and better fans than virtually every other Bengal fan out there. Hell of claim to fame, I guess.

 

meanwhile,  most of the rest of us will continue to hope that someday the Bengals actually take winning in the postseason seriously.

 

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2 minutes ago, big_dish said:

Frickmwmw and frackdub- two of the reasons the board membership has died significantly over the past few years and sent all the members to http://thebengalsboard.com/ .....your condescending, worthless contributions to the conversation are once again completely unwarranted and totally non-consequential.

Great for you two that you are so excited and completely happy with the regressive progress the Bengals have been making in the past two offseasons. You must be so much bigger and better fans than virtually every other Bengal fan out there. Hell of claim to fame, I guess.

 

meanwhile,  most of the rest of us will continue to hope that someday the Bengals actually take winning in the postseason seriously.

 

Actually, the grownups are somewhere else. And couldn't you and your ilk just go to whodey revolution?  

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43 minutes ago, big_dish said:

Frickmwmw and frackdub- two of the reasons the board membership has died significantly over the past few years and sent all the members to http://thebengalsboard.com/ .....your condescending, worthless contributions to the conversation are once again completely unwarranted and totally non-consequential.

Great for you two that you are so excited and completely happy with the regressive progress the Bengals have been making in the past two offseasons. You must be so much bigger and better fans than virtually every other Bengal fan out there. Hell of claim to fame, I guess.

 

meanwhile,  most of the rest of us will continue to hope that someday the Bengals actually take winning in the postseason seriously.

 

 

That's an interesting interpretation, with (as per usual) little connection to reality.  You accusing someone else of "worthless contributions" is hilarious. What contribution have you made other than non-stop whining about how perpetually doomed and awful the Bengals are, but *sniffle* you'll always be a fan.  Yes, where would we be without you turning every thread into your own sad-sack pity party. Well boo-hoo, but if anything drove people away it was coming to what is supposed to be a Bengals Fan Forum and finding "fans" that not only think the team sucks, but want to argue the point ad nauseum.

If you find that condescending that's your own issue.  Quit making strained little strawman arguments accusing people of being superfans if they aren't crying in their beers 24/7 and maybe you won't feel like everyone else is patronizing.  Like.. WTF does that even mean? If you think the franchise is inept, doomed, etc - in what sense of the word are you a "fan" of it? This isn't me trying to elevate myself, I truly could give a fuck about where I fit on this bizarre fan hierarchy you seem to imagine.  It's a simple question of why you spend so much time complaining about every aspect of something that 1. provides no value other than entertainment when you don't sound entertained 2. you have zero control over.

Why make yourself miserable? Follow #teamslikethepatriots or go fishing or something else that you can actually enjoy.

Unless, as it seems from here, what you truly enjoy is complaining until everyone else is as miserable as you..

If this is all so inconsequential why are you addressing it in the first place?

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Well this thread was asking for people to address the usual Bengals failure of Free Agency. So- that's exactly what I did. Reading comprehension is important here. I dont care what the fuck a loser in life like Kennethmwmwmw and whatever TDub is, think.

The Bengals have an owner that doesn't care about winning in the postseason, and a coach that doesn't know how to win in the postseason. Both facts.

You two can go give them rimjobs for the next 10 years. Don't give a fuck. Anyone living in reality know both are absolutely worthless when it comes to the goal of an NFL franchise, so your laissez-faire approach and opinions regarding the desired success of this team are absolutely not in line with the vast majority of Bengals fans. In fact- you're acceptance and enjoyment in mediocrity is so crazy that it's almost as if you aren't even Bengals fans, just a couple of rabble rousers on a message board trying to annoy the fuck out of everyone. Which has worked well. Probably own the other message boards and have been coming here for years with the intention of driving members here to the other boards where they don't have to have your stupid asses commenting nonsensical condescending bullshit on every thread.

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2 hours ago, big_dish said:

Well this thread was asking for people to address the usual Bengals failure of Free Agency. So- that's exactly what I did. Reading comprehension is important here. I dont care what the fuck a loser in life like Kennethmwmwmw and whatever TDub is, think.

The Bengals have an owner that doesn't care about winning in the postseason, and a coach that doesn't know how to win in the postseason. Both facts.

You two can go give them rimjobs for the next 10 years. Don't give a fuck. Anyone living in reality know both are absolutely worthless when it comes to the goal of an NFL franchise, so your laissez-faire approach and opinions regarding the desired success of this team are absolutely not in line with the vast majority of Bengals fans. In fact- you're acceptance and enjoyment in mediocrity is so crazy that it's almost as if you aren't even Bengals fans, just a couple of rabble rousers on a message board trying to annoy the fuck out of everyone. Which has worked well. Probably own the other message boards and have been coming here for years with the intention of driving members here to the other boards where they don't have to have your stupid asses commenting nonsensical condescending bullshit on every thread.

 

Blah blah fuckin blah.  The team sucks, the message board is ruined..  Yet here you remain. 

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Come join JungleNoise forum.    Leave these two  c0ck holsters here to hold each others hand and attack anyone that argues with what the Bengals are doing.  

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12 minutes ago, SocalBengalEd said:

Come join JungleNoise forum.    Leave these two  c0ck holsters here to hold each others hand and attack anyone that argues with what the Bengals are doing.  

 

Yes, what's stopping you? Take your pity-party to wherever the rest of the miserable bastards congregate.  I'm sure if the lot of you only complain hard enough, that'll be the thing to finally get the team over the hump. Nothing pathetic about that at all, no sir.

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5 hours ago, T-Dub said:

 

Yes, what's stopping you? Take your pity-party to wherever the rest of the miserable bastards congregate.  I'm sure if the lot of you only complain hard enough, that'll be the thing to finally get the team over the hump. Nothing pathetic about that at all, no sir.

SocalEd has been a negative Nancy for quite a while now, it's kind of enjoyable to see, just makes me laugh mostly. He is the definition of the voice of the common uneducated fan. 

WHODEY! loving this off-season so far. The team will re-build and be better.

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Can you ladies take your little tea party somewhere else? There was a football discussion going on at some point in this thread.

If I wanted to click on people calling each other names once an hour, I'd have more of my family on my Facebook.

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8 hours ago, LostInDaJungle said:

Can you ladies take your little tea party somewhere else? There was a football discussion going on at some point in this thread.

If I wanted to click on people calling each other names once an hour, I'd have more of my family on my Facebook.

:lol:

 

But seriously folks..  What do you want to hear? You said it yourself; "same old Bengals".  When they've tried throwing money around in free agency they've ended up with Terrell Owens.  We all know they aren't likely to be major players in FA.  It's a mid-market franchise at best & they generally have a bean-counter approach to how they operate.  You don't have to like it but you might as well accept it.

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