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If the first 8 picks fall like this....

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36 minutes ago, MichaelWeston said:

Hobson had a mock that had us taking Howard. I would need to purchase a new television. 

Don't like that pick at all. But I'm kind of at the point where there's not a single player likely to be available at 9 that I'm really excited about. After the top 5, it's a bunch of guys who would be mid-1st rounders in most other drafts. 

I wish we had 40 times for Reuben Foster and Corey Davis. Those two would be near the top of my wishlist in this scenario, but I'm very curious how fast they really are and don't like the idea of drafting a guy we don't have numbers on (like Ced Ogbuehi) and didn't get a chance to put through workouts. 

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Maybe this is outside the bounds of your question but... trade down.  No QBs taken?  Trade it.

If we absolutely have to take someone?  Zach Cunningham.

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Foster is a vicious hitter. He likes to make big hits. And he has good form. If you look at his senior year game tape, he is almost textbook.
He's also a guy like Burfict, who will throw his body around. And like Burfict, it could be a long term issue.
But c'mon, playing LB in today's NFL is a concussion factory. And as Newton's 14th law tells us, delivering a big hit means you take a big hit in return. Backs are huge, coming at them with a head of steam and trying to take them low while they wrestle a 300lb. gorilla.
I'm not asking Reuben Foster to go out and cure cancer, I'm asking him to penetrate on an A-gap blitz. I'm asking him to make TE's poopy themselves a little bit when they (might) catch the ball over the middle. I'm asking him to fly to the RB screen and demolish the guy. I want him and Burfict to be a Nickel D you're afraid to catch a short ball on. 3rd and 8 becomes a down where you start hearing footsteps when that 6 yard pass comes your way.
And all of that is going to come with some woozy moments on the sideline, I don't are how good your form is. These guys aren't choosing between being a human crash test dummy for the NFL and a Bio-Tech firm, I've had smarter dogs than some of these guys. 
From an athletic standpoint, he's a true sideline to sideline presence who excels in pass coverage. This dude can flat out move, and he comes with a head of steam. His short area burst one he sniffs out the play is astounding. He can hit the hole like a RB, and is fast enough to cover the best TE's. And was excellent in coverage in college. Combine my ass, this kid looks like he was born in pads and with the gift of flight. His game tape shows him taking a good number of plays "off" when the ball isn't coming to him, but when he's on... This is a dude who will fly over the pile on 4th and 1 to save a TD. Or slice through the A gap to make a big play. Or can blanket a TE. Or keep pace with a RB going out to the flat or a wheel route.
On the mental side... Google some interviews, but I'm thinking Burfict would win a chess game against him. Doesn't strike as a Mensa member. Burfict, at his finest, has a football IQ that is through the roof. Foster's bulb run's at a lower current, but he is still well above average at reading and reacting. He's going to excel in man to man situations, but will get lost in zone coverage sometimes. He doesn't diagnose the plays/routes at an elite level. It's teachable, or at worst, he's not Rey Maualuga bad.
Foster is worthy of top 10 consideration in an age where MLB's aren't considered first rounders. Straight up believe it, this guy is very good.

His read and react time is average at best. I do not see his coverage skills as great. I think theyre vinny rey. Okay but not elite. Hes not so much better than any other lb in this class. To be a top 10 pick u have to be head and shoulders above the rest. See garrett, lattimore, etc. I do not see the bobby wagner comparison. Also, multiple scouts have said he is not a mike he is a will. We do not need a will. Plus, he has MAJOR durability concerns. Give me a guy like mcmillan who is always around the ball in the second or a guy like anzalone who is the best cover lb in this draft in the third over a guy who most experts belive will be the second lb drafted.


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Don't like that pick at all. But I'm kind of at the point where there's not a single player likely to be available at 9 that I'm really excited about. After the top 5, it's a bunch of guys who would be mid-1st rounders in most other drafts. 
I wish we had 40 times for Reuben Foster and Corey Davis. Those two would be near the top of my wishlist in this scenario, but I'm very curious how fast they really are and don't like the idea of drafting a guy we don't have numbers on (like Ced Ogbuehi) and didn't get a chance to put through workouts. 

This is why im a big fan of trading down to 15 and getting an extra second rounder so we can go lb and center in round 2. After the top 5, theres not really anymore top 10 players that jump out.

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Maybe this is outside the bounds of your question but... trade down.  No QBs taken?  Trade it.
If we absolutely have to take someone?  Zach Cunningham.

Hea falling further and further.... May be a second rounder at this point.

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Trading down sounds great, but with a lack of quality QB prospects it's not very likely.  Trading down requires another team that wants to trade up.  What top-10 pick is going to be there that we can't use, but some other team covets? 

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Get me Foster and let him and Taze hurt people. It's really fucking simple st this point. Pick the talented, scary person and let them be talented and scary. Foster isn't going to need much coaching, which is good, because he ain't gonna get it with our flaccid fucking coaching staff

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26 minutes ago, B.A.B. said:

Get me Foster and let him and Taze hurt people. It's really fucking simple st this point. Pick the talented, scary person and let them be talented and scary. Foster isn't going to need much coaching, which is good, because he ain't gonna get it with our flaccid fucking coaching staff

I've wanted them to embrace this thug/dirty image myself, but this isn't the 1970's & there are two sets of rules in play.  We've seen firsthand how other teams get away with things ours can't & Goodell just loves a convenient scapegoat.

OTOH, if we're going to get fucked over anyway as it seems, it'd be kind of fun to see how much damage could be done in the meantime.  Point being I'd much rather see La'verne Bell unconscious on the field than one of ours.  Obviously taking the high road hasn't worked out for them when there's a narrative being pushed with little regard for the facts of the matter.  Let's go the NHL route and send in the goons!

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1 hour ago, T-Dub said:

Trading down sounds great, but with a lack of quality QB prospects it's not very likely.  Trading down requires another team that wants to trade up.  What top-10 pick is going to be there that we can't use, but some other team covets? 

Somebody that wants a QB ahead of Queefland @12?  Not sure who it would be though.

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Just now, snarkster said:

Somebody that wants a QB ahead of Queefland @12?  Not sure who it would be though.

 

Are any of the QB's really worth the move?

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1 hour ago, T-Dub said:

I've wanted them to embrace this thug/dirty image myself, but this isn't the 1970's & there are two sets of rules in play.  We've seen firsthand how other teams get away with things ours can't & Goodell just loves a convenient scapegoat.

OTOH, if we're going to get fucked over anyway as it seems, it'd be kind of fun to see how much damage could be done in the meantime.  Point being I'd much rather see La'verne Bell unconscious on the field than one of ours.  Obviously taking the high road hasn't worked out for them when there's a narrative being pushed with little regard for the facts of the matter.  Let's go the NHL route and send in the goons!

Yeah. I mean if we're going to lose I'd rather lose while punching someone in the mouth, figuratively. I haven't heard any talk about Foster doing Taze like things on the field. And the way he tackles and really lays into the ball carryer. Man.

 

He doesn't really seem like the type of Lb we draft though. We like rangy, quicker, smaller, shittier LBs for the most part. Shit. I don't even know who our LB coach is these days since Hunley left. That must've been at least 4 or 5 yrs ago

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3 hours ago, T-Dub said:

 

Are any of the QB's really worth the move?

I wouldn't give up a second round pick for any of these QBs.  Heck I'd be tempted to suck on purpose this year for the kid from USC in next year's draft.

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Trading down sounds great, but with a lack of quality QB prospects it's not very likely.  Trading down requires another team that wants to trade up.  What top-10 pick is going to be there that we can't use, but some other team covets? 

Imo? Colts for foster. Possibly cardinals for trubisky

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5 hours ago, B.A.B. said:

Yeah. I mean if we're going to lose I'd rather lose while punching someone in the mouth, figuratively. I haven't heard any talk about Foster doing Taze like things on the field. And the way he tackles and really lays into the ball carryer. Man.

 

He doesn't really seem like the type of Lb we draft though. We like rangy, quicker, smaller, shittier LBs for the most part. Shit. I don't even know who our LB coach is these days since Hunley left. That must've been at least 4 or 5 yrs ago

I think Jim Hasslett is the LB coach...or Matt Burke, that name sounds familiar.

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12 hours ago, T-Dub said:

 

Scouting stuff I've read has him undersized for anything other than WLB in our 4-3 & a poor tackler to boot.  Can't see spending the 9th overall pick on a situational pass-rushing LB.  Even that role is questionable - simply running around people isn't going to work at this level.

You obviously don't know what you are talking about, he doesn't "simply run around people". Watch his game tape vs. ND from 2015, at the 0:25 mark he beats a OT inside and makes a TFL, for an example of his motor go to the 2:02 mark and watch him use that 4.5/40 speed to chase down a RB on a screen with a 20 yard head start. 

Not quite sure of your sources but he's way more than a situational pass rushing LB that runs around people, that is an ignorant generalization that doesn't come to describing what he did in college or what he can do in the NFL. He took on OT's the majority of the snaps he played in college from his DE position and had 47 TFL's, 17.5 sacks, and 199 tackles; you don't get those stats by simply running around people at any level of the game.

Reddick runs through, over, and round people; he did it in college and the Senior Bowl practice.  He could play any LB position in the 4-3, including SLB and MLB. I would welcome him at MLB and cut Rey Maualuga, he can learn under Vinny Rey and take over once he learns the defensive calls, etc. 

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9 hours ago, happyrid said:

Don't like that pick at all. But I'm kind of at the point where there's not a single player likely to be available at 9 that I'm really excited about. After the top 5, it's a bunch of guys who would be mid-1st rounders in most other drafts. 

I wish we had 40 times for Reuben Foster and Corey Davis. Those two would be near the top of my wishlist in this scenario, but I'm very curious how fast they really are and don't like the idea of drafting a guy we don't have numbers on (like Ced Ogbuehi) and didn't get a chance to put through workouts. 

It's very interesting that there are no workout results for Foster even though Bama had it's pro day and he was there.

We know he failed the combine by getting sent home early for something stupid, but why no results from the Bama pro day? Something is fishy, imo. If he would have ran a 4.5/40 it would have been breaking news, which leads me to believe that he didn't perform well or didn't run at all which is again troubling because it seems he trying to hide something. 

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4 minutes ago, PatternMaster said:

It's very interesting that there are no workout results for Foster even though Bama had it's pro day and he was there.

We know he failed the combine by getting sent home early for something stupid, but why no results from the Bama pro day? Something is fishy, imo. If he would have ran a 4.5/40 it would have been breaking news, which leads me to believe that he didn't perform well or didn't run at all which is again troubling because it seems he trying to hide something. 

He had shoulder surgery in early February with a 4-month recovery time.

He's not going to be able to do any workouts or anything, which makes me a little bit nervous because everyone will be just guessing as to how athletic he really is. Not a deal-breaker, but if you're taking a non-premium position like MLB at #9 you want a guy who has checked all the boxes IMO.

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1 minute ago, happyrid said:

He had shoulder surgery in early February with a 4-month recovery time.

He's not going to be able to do any workouts or anything, which makes me a little bit nervous because everyone will be just guessing as to how athletic he really is. Not a deal-breaker, but if you're taking a non-premium position like MLB at #9 you want a guy who has checked all the boxes IMO.

Thanks for the update.

So he has shoulder problems, concussion history, and you don't know how he compares athletically to the prospects available in the draft. Seems like a risky pick for #9 to me. Imo, projecting Foster at #9 is lazy because it's been the pick since the end of the season. Foster doesn't seem all that impressive to me, I've watched his game film and almost every tackle he makes is when he is unblocked or 5 yards down the field, I know he played for Bama but I don't get the hype. 

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I think they will trade down a couple slots and hope Foster slides but be happy to take Reddick instead.  He will be there if Foster ain't.  But I see a trade for sure.  Its The Bengal Way.

Try to get Mixon as high as second round (package extra picks from lower rounds) or hope he slides to them in the third for sure.

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10 hours ago, LostInDaJungle said:

Foster is a vicious hitter. He likes to make big hits. And he has good form. If you look at his senior year game tape, he is almost textbook.

He's also a guy like Burfict, who will throw his body around. And like Burfict, it could be a long term issue.

But c'mon, playing LB in today's NFL is a concussion factory. And as Newton's 14th law tells us, delivering a big hit means you take a big hit in return. Backs are huge, coming at them with a head of steam and trying to take them low while they wrestle a 300lb. gorilla.

I'm not asking Reuben Foster to go out and cure cancer, I'm asking him to penetrate on an A-gap blitz. I'm asking him to make TE's poopy themselves a little bit when they (might) catch the ball over the middle. I'm asking him to fly to the RB screen and demolish the guy. I want him and Burfict to be a Nickel D you're afraid to catch a short ball on. 3rd and 8 becomes a down where you start hearing footsteps when that 6 yard pass comes your way.

And all of that is going to come with some woozy moments on the sideline, I don't are how good your form is. These guys aren't choosing between being a human crash test dummy for the NFL and a Bio-Tech firm, I've had smarter dogs than some of these guys. 

From an athletic standpoint, he's a true sideline to sideline presence who excels in pass coverage. This dude can flat out move, and he comes with a head of steam. His short area burst one he sniffs out the play is astounding. He can hit the hole like a RB, and is fast enough to cover the best TE's. And was excellent in coverage in college. Combine my ass, this kid looks like he was born in pads and with the gift of flight. His game tape shows him taking a good number of plays "off" when the ball isn't coming to him, but when he's on... This is a dude who will fly over the pile on 4th and 1 to save a TD. Or slice through the A gap to make a big play. Or can blanket a TE. Or keep pace with a RB going out to the flat or a wheel route.

On the mental side... Google some interviews, but I'm thinking Burfict would win a chess game against him. Doesn't strike as a Mensa member. Burfict, at his finest, has a football IQ that is through the roof. Foster's bulb run's at a lower current, but he is still well above average at reading and reacting. He's going to excel in man to man situations, but will get lost in zone coverage sometimes. He doesn't diagnose the plays/routes at an elite level. It's teachable, or at worst, he's not Rey Maualuga bad.

Foster is worthy of top 10 consideration in an age where MLB's aren't considered first rounders. Straight up believe it, this guy is very good.

He's a vicious hitter that has NEVER forced a fumble in his entire college career...got it. 

You seem to not take his concussion history seriously, which is odd because it can cause players to miss games(Burfict), retire early(Chris Borland), sue the Bengals(Ben Utecht) and the NFL(class action lawsuit)...but you're right, it's no big deal. 

Foster isn't a bad player; but a guy with no forced fumbles, INT's, and only 7 PD's(2 last season) in his college career doesn't seem to be the football god you are describing. If he has the gift of flight, the ability to fly over the pile on 4th and 1 to save a TD, can slice through the A gap to make big play, and be able to blanket a TE in the seam and a RB in the flat wouldn't he have more sacks, PD's, FF's, INT's etc...He has NO INT's, FF's in college career despite playing on the most talented defense in the country, by far. He will have 6 defensive teammates get drafted in the first 3 rounds of the draft but he couldn't make any big plays, something is fishy about that. 

The Bengals don't need a guy who can make a tackle when he has an unimpeded line on the ball carrier, they have guys on the roster who can do that already and you can find a guy in later rounds to do that. They need a big time playmaker, a guy who can make the impact plays you describe, but Foster hasn't made in college. 

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11 minutes ago, High School Harry said:

I think they will trade down a couple slots and hope Foster slides but be happy to take Reddick instead.  He will be there if Foster ain't.  But I see a trade for sure.  Its The Bengal Way.

Try to get Mixon as high as second round (package extra picks from lower rounds) or hope he slides to them in the third for sure.

The only thing about a trade is who wants to trade with them into the #9 slot and what are they willing to give up to in order to trade into that slot. I think a trade would be ideal but I don't know of any team that wants to get into #9 especially if the draft plays out like it does in the OP. Maybe a team that wants a CB, but this draft is deep with CB's and they can could just stand pat and get a good player without giving up anything in return. 

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9 minutes ago, PatternMaster said:

you don't know how he compares athletically to the prospects available in the draft.

Seriously man, that's way too much importance put on how guys run around in shorts. "Gee, I can't draft this guy to kill people, I don't know exactly how well he competes in track and field events!" Seems to also explain your love affair with the big combine performers.

All you have to do is watch game tape. And I respect that you know what you're talking about, but we'll also have to agree to disagree. The stronger you try to make your argument by going after Foster - Who is still considered a top 10 pick by many, honestly just weakens your argument. And long before people fell in love with Reddick's 40 time, and a 6 hour MRI wait Foster was a top ten pick on most everyone's boards. The kid can ball, and he's a good kinda nasty. Not heavily panalized, no off field issues.

Foster can plug into any place in your scheme. Ideally, he's a run and hit Will backer like Burfict, but he's being drafted at Mike. He could play inside in a 3-4. He's not without his issues, but his floor is very high.

With Reddick you're projecting him to be a player he hasn't been yet at a position he hasn't played yet. Yes, Johnson's versatility allows us to go 4-3 Under when we want. that's a 3-4 with a different tackle-end alignment. So if we redesign around Reddick to feature the 4-3 Under, he replaces Johnson or becomes our Strongside backer? The strongside is like a 3-4 ILB in the 4-3 under, the Leo replaces the RE.

If we're upgrading from Johnson, give me a DE who can rush the passer. #9 is too high to take a strong side backer with our scheme. Reddick doesn't flash the type of talent you build a scheme around anyway. If it's not Foster, it doesn't have to be another LB. So give me Taco Charlton and see if we can upgrade the pass rush. If the first 8 picks went the way the OP proposed, and I was dead set against drafting Foster and Charlton, I might even have to start looking at Howard or Lamp.

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5 minutes ago, LostInDaJungle said:

Seriously man, that's way too much importance put on how guys run around in shorts. "Gee, I can't draft this guy to kill people, I don't know exactly how well he competes in track and field events!" Seems to also explain your love affair with the big combine performers.

All you have to do is watch game tape. And I respect that you know what you're talking about, but we'll also have to agree to disagree. The stronger you try to make your argument by going after Foster - Who is still considered a top 10 pick by many, honestly just weakens your argument. And long before people fell in love with Reddick's 40 time, and a 6 hour MRI wait Foster was a top ten pick on most everyone's boards. The kid can ball, and he's a good kinda nasty. Not heavily panalized, no off field issues.

Foster can plug into any place in your scheme. Ideally, he's a run and hit Will backer like Burfict, but he's being drafted at Mike. He could play inside in a 3-4. He's not without his issues, but his floor is very high.

With Reddick you're projecting him to be a player he hasn't been yet at a position he hasn't played yet. Yes, Johnson's versatility allows us to go 4-3 Under when we want. that's a 3-4 with a different tackle-end alignment. So if we redesign around Reddick to feature the 4-3 Under, he replaces Johnson or becomes our Strongside backer? The strongside is like a 3-4 ILB in the 4-3 under, the Leo replaces the RE.

If we're upgrading from Johnson, give me a DE who can rush the passer. #9 is too high to take a strong side backer with our scheme. Reddick doesn't flash the type of talent you build a scheme around anyway. If it's not Foster, it doesn't have to be another LB. So give me Taco Charlton and see if we can upgrade the pass rush. If the first 8 picks went the way the OP proposed, and I was dead set against drafting Foster and Charlton, I might even have to start looking at Howard or Lamp.

I've watch Foster's game tape and I just don't see any explosive playmaker, he's a solid player that can make a tackle but he's nothing special that would warrant a top 10 pick, imo. 

As for the 4-3 under, he would be the SLB, and it wouldn't be a redesign because the Bengals use the 4-3 as their base defense. It would literally mean one guy moves over a few feet and one lines up closer to the LOS, not a total redesign of the defense like you keep suggesting. 

I would rather have Barnett #9, a pure pass rusher that can impact the game, but he's not an option in this scenario. Therefore I would go with the next best defensive player that can impact the game and to me it's Reddick because he can rush the passer and play in coverage better than anyone available in this scenario. 

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6 minutes ago, PatternMaster said:

As for the 4-3 under, he would be the SLB

Then I'll just stand on my position that we don't use the SLB enough to warrant a #9 pick on the guy.

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Hobson had a mock that had us taking Howard. I would need to purchase a new television. 

After QB and 3 Tech TE is the last position they should draft

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