Is History Siding With Obama’s Economic Plan?

[Homer_Rice]

[quote name='Bunghole' post='695494' date='Sep 4 2008, 07:02 PM']Football starts tonight.[/quote]
Historically speaking, Bung, football began many millenia ago on the wide expanses of the Eurasian Steppe. Some bored goat-herders, having eaten dinner, and thus deprived of their normal noctural interaction with their beasts, began goofing off around the campfire. One far-sighted lad, whose nickname was "Big Shep", conceived of using the another end of the goat. This revelation came to him as he observed a stinking pile of offal with a goat's head laying on top.

Picking up the head, he discovered the goats jaws clamped tight in rigor mortis, thus bringing a premature end to Plan A. He quickly came to a revelation, though, and thus Plan B was born in his mind.

He called out to his mates: "Hey, Bisthurk! Hey Grfpisk! Try to take this head away from me." Laughing maniacally he dashed through the camp, jumping over the fire and disappeared into the dark. Bisthurk and Grfpisk dashed after him into the black night. The howls of glee and thumps of bodies smashing together were loud, but not nearly so loud as the roars of a nearby lion pride on the prowl.

A few days thereafter, some other goatherds looked down into a ravine and saw three stinking piles of offal with human heads nearby. One of the men climbed down ino the ravine and asked, "Do we know these boys?" A fellow at the top of the ravine said, "I don't know. I'll need to take a closer look." The first herder picked up one of the heads and tossed it up to the man at the top of the ravine.

And that's how the forward pass was invented.

[Vol_Bengal]

[quote name='bengalsfansince68' post='695478' date='Sep 4 2008, 06:35 PM']Consider it done!
If Obama takes some money from the filthy rich that the republicans have created and gives it to the poor I will consider it completely justified.
Phuck John McCain.[/quote]

Well done... you've learned well from following politics...

Take text out of a sentence and use it to make your point however you see fit... nice.


Again, all I said if you'll read back is some will agree with it and other won't. Yet, you have to get ugly about it. It is your opinion - it isn't right, it isn't wrong. It just is.

[sois]

[quote name='Bunghole' post='695474' date='Sep 4 2008, 05:31 PM']I believe that Congress would have to draw up a bill that represents the President's "plan", and then ratify it.[/quote]

So it doesn't really matter who the president is.

These guys don't even have their own ideas about economics. They've both admitted that much. They will probably have cabinet guys who draw up the plans. I guess those guys are the really powerful people.

Are my assumptions on the right track?

[Vol_Bengal]

[quote name='sois' post='695627' date='Sep 5 2008, 02:06 AM']So it doesn't really matter who the president is.

These guys don't even have their own ideas about economics. They've both admitted that much. They will probably have cabinet guys who draw up the plans. I guess those guys are the really powerful people.

Are my assumptions on the right track?[/quote]

In all truth, the president controls significantly less than in the past. For most anything to get done Congress has to create bill, approve, etc. and then the president signs into law.

You're assumptions are mostly accurate.

[|Bunghole|]

[quote name='Homer_Rice' post='695523' date='Sep 4 2008, 06:40 PM']Historically speaking, Bung, football began many millenia ago on the wide expanses of the Eurasian Steppe. Some bored goat-herders, having eaten dinner, and thus deprived of their normal noctural interaction with their beasts, began goofing off around the campfire. One far-sighted lad, whose nickname was "Big Shep", conceived of using the another end of the goat. This revelation came to him as he observed a stinking pile of offal with a goat's head laying on top.

Picking up the head, he discovered the goats jaws clamped tight in rigor mortis, thus bringing a premature end to Plan A. He quickly came to a revelation, though, and thus Plan B was born in his mind.

He called out to his mates: "Hey, Bisthurk! Hey Grfpisk! Try to take this head away from me." Laughing maniacally he dashed through the camp, jumping over the fire and disappeared into the dark. Bisthurk and Grfpisk dashed after him into the black night. The howls of glee and thumps of bodies smashing together were loud, but not nearly so loud as the roars of a nearby lion pride on the prowl.

A few days thereafter, some other goatherds looked down into a ravine and saw three stinking piles of offal with human heads nearby. One of the men climbed down ino the ravine and asked, "Do we know these boys?" A fellow at the top of the ravine said, "I don't know. I'll need to take a closer look." The first herder picked up one of the heads and tossed it up to the man at the top of the ravine.

And that's how the forward pass was invented.[/quote]
Despite you're age, you've still got that sardonic wit. Don't let Father Time take that from you too!

[CTBengalsFan]

[img]http://www.be-logic.org/uploaded/10_1220321711.jpg[/img]

[Vol_Bengal]

[quote name='CTBengalsFan' post='695729' date='Sep 5 2008, 11:40 AM'][img]http://www.be-logic.org/uploaded/10_1220321711.jpg[/img][/quote]

same information as my link above. I just thought that the one I referenced made it simpler to understand... you got the dollar amounts listed as the one you have does, but also percentages, etc.

[rudi32]

Soo. Am I reading this right? If you make under $227K which I imagine we all do, they are about the same. The only difference is in the extreem wealthy?

If thats correct, then whats the big deal? I mean neither one will help us, the middle class. I imagine most hosehold incomes are around the 100K mark.

Dunno, If I am reading it right, the neither one will help the middle class

[Vol_Bengal]

[quote name='rudi32' post='695735' date='Sep 5 2008, 11:53 AM']Soo. Am I reading this right? If you make under $227K which I imagine we all do, they are about the same. The only difference is in the extreem wealthy?

If thats correct, then whats the big deal? I mean neither one will help us, the middle class. I imagine most hosehold incomes are around the 100K mark.

Dunno, If I am reading it right, the neither one will help the middle class[/quote]

If you're in the $100,000 range Obama will save you $281 more dollars per year ($5.40 / week, $0.77 / day) than McCain would, according to this chart.

This chart doesn't talk at all about all the other taxes that will change potentially. Business taxes and the effect those will have on you (hiring / reduction in work force, etc.), inheritance / death tax, etc., etc., etc.

[rudi32]

[quote name='Vol_Bengal' post='695774' date='Sep 5 2008, 12:43 PM']If you're in the $100,000 range Obama will save you $281 more dollars per year ($5.40 / week, $0.77 / day) than McCain would, according to this chart.

This chart doesn't talk at all about all the other taxes that will change potentially. Business taxes and the effect those will have on you (hiring / reduction in work force, etc.), inheritance / death tax, etc., etc., etc.[/quote]


thx, thats what I thought. I am not gonna vote for a guy who will save me 3 quarters. If he would give me a few grand i might .......nah, who am I kidding I am not voting for barack hussein obama

[SINcinnati513]

I just don't understand how taxes can be cut with the current shape we are financially. Has Obama or McCain said anything about cutting spending?

[sois]

[quote name='Vol_Bengal' post='695652' date='Sep 5 2008, 06:41 AM']In all truth, the president controls significantly less than in the past. For most anything to get done Congress has to create bill, approve, etc. and then the president signs into law.

You're assumptions are mostly accurate.[/quote]

Cool, my vote really DOESN'T matter!

[sois]

[quote name='SINcinnati513' post='695805' date='Sep 5 2008, 01:31 PM']I just don't understand how taxes can be cut with the current shape we are financially. Has Obama or McCain said anything about cutting spending?[/quote]

Cutting spending seems like the best idea. Can I vote for you?

[Vol_Bengal]

[quote name='SINcinnati513' post='695805' date='Sep 5 2008, 02:31 PM']I just don't understand how taxes can be cut with the current shape we are financially. Has Obama or McCain said anything about cutting spending?[/quote]

McCain has said he wants to downsize government... whether that actually would come to fruition remains to be seen.

Obama wanting nationalized medicine, etc. really can't do anything but increase government which would increase spending.


Now, having said that, with our current administration and congress spending like drunken sailors on shore leave I don't know where Obama stands from that point. Would he reduce some from current levels, but not as much as McCain. Would it actually go up from current levels, etc.? I don't know.


I did like McCain saying that any pork barrel spending bill that came across his desk would be vetoed and he'd make sure those that were included in it would be outed and "made famous"... that has been a gripe of mine for years. If we'd just stop the wasteful spending improving congresspeople's real estate ventures by doing government projects in the vicinity, etc. we'd have a shitload of money to use in other places, like balancing the budget, paying off the deficit, etc.

[SINcinnati513]

Yea, I heard McCain say that last night. That may mean no new spending, but it doesn't exactly correlate to cutting departments and programs.

Come to think of it, I haven't heard anything about social security in quite some time. Maybe they're saving everything for the debates. But it's funny how once each party makes their nomination, policies get talked about even less. It's all about personal life and, "oh, well he seems like he really cares about America," and " well he was a POW he really has more experience." You never really hear anyone argue that this policy is better than this policy. Or I'm voting for so-and-so because he has this great idea how to solve our problems with inflation.

I understand that it is important to know as much as you can about someone before voting for them. But all of this being a popularity contest instead of a presidential election really irritates me. Has it always been this way?

[Homer_Rice]

[quote name='Bunghole' post='695675' date='Sep 5 2008, 08:30 AM']Despite you're age, you've still got that sardonic wit. Don't let Father Time take that from you too!
[/quote]
Thus far, Father Time seems to be in a gift-giving phase. To date it's gray hair and occasional hemorrhoids.

[|Bengal Migration|]

[quote name='rudi32' post='695793' date='Sep 6 2008, 04:12 AM'][b]thx, thats what I thought. I am not gonna vote for a guy who will save me 3 quarters. [/b] If he would give me a few grand i might .......nah, who am I kidding I am not voting for barack hussein obama[/quote]
I wonder how many folks realize this is about the size of the Bush tax cuts, also (middle class). $300/yr, or about 82 cents a day.

[Vol_Bengal]

[quote name='KangarWhoDey' post='695933' date='Sep 5 2008, 09:00 PM']I wonder how many folks realize this is about the size of the Bush tax cuts, also (middle class). $300/yr, or about 82 cents a day.[/quote]

Not sure which tax cut you're referring to or the dollar amount you're referring to... but when I calculate it at $100,000 which is what rudi mentioned above (didn't put any itemization / exemption, etc.) from current tax rate his 2003 tax cut was going to save a little more than $2300 / yr, which comes down to $44.23 / week or $6.30 / day. Bear with me though, that $2300 wasn't exact it was more than that, according to the calculator.

Only when I go down to $50,000 annual gross income does it come back at like $332 in tax savings. Again, don't know where you were pulling that data so I don't know what annual gross you were working from.


[url="http://www.smartmoney.com/tax/filing/index.cfm?story=bushtaxcut#table"]Bush's 2003 Tax Cut Calculator[/url]

[Missing Link]

I wouldn't give a damn if I had to pay two more grand a year in taxes. I just want the idealogical nut jobs that fucked this country up to begin with out the door .....

"ACCOUNTABILITY" or "HOLDNG THE GUILTY ACCOUNTABLE" comes in various forms .... This year it comes November 2nd in the voting booth!

[rudi32]

[quote name='Missing Link' post='695970' date='Sep 5 2008, 10:01 PM']I wouldn't give a damn if I had to pay two more grand a year in taxes. I just want the idealogical nut jobs that fucked this country up to begin with out the door .....

"ACCOUNTABILITY" or "HOLDNG THE GUILTY ACCOUNTABLE" comes in various forms .... This year it comes November 2nd in the voting booth![/quote]


so You are voting for a write in

sweet.

cause they both suck, one is just the lesser of 2 evils

[Missing Link]

[quote name='rudi32' post='695980' date='Sep 5 2008, 11:56 PM']so You are voting for a write in

sweet.

cause they both suck, one is just the lesser of 2 evils[/quote]

No, they don't both "suck" ..... One definately sucks because he's a 30+ year career politician who's make a nice living sucking off of the mammory of government to earn a pay check and great benefits while accomplishing next to nothing and changing his position on issues to whatever direction the political wind is blowing.

The only thing you can say about the other is that he's unproven ..... Given the results he's achieved personally and professionally in life to get him where he is today and also knowing he is managing one of the best political campaigns I've ever witnessed in my lifetime, .... I'll take my chances.

Even if Obama gets 1/5 of the things done he wants to get done, he's 100X time improvement over the last 8 years of ineptitude, lies, croniesm, corruption, and gross fiscal neglegence.

It's time the people get their government back and let the hyper-elite go figure out who they can screw next.

[rudi32]

[quote name='Missing Link' post='696204' date='Sep 6 2008, 07:59 PM']No, they don't both "suck" ..... One definately sucks because he's a 30+ year career politician who's make a nice living sucking off of the mammory of government to earn a pay check and great benefits while accomplishing next to nothing and changing his position on issues to whatever direction the political wind is blowing.

The only thing you can say about the other is that he's unproven ..... Given the results he's achieved personally and professionally in life to get him where he is today and also knowing he is managing one of the best political campaigns I've ever witnessed in my lifetime, .... I'll take my chances.

Even if Obama gets 1/5 of the things done he wants to get done, he's 100X time improvement over the last 8 years of ineptitude, lies, croniesm, corruption, and gross fiscal neglegence.

It's time the people get their government back and let the hyper-elite go figure out who they can screw next.[/quote]


LMAO
like hussein ist elite...lol

[Nati Ice]

[quote name='rudi32' post='696206' date='Sep 6 2008, 09:38 PM']LMAO
like hussein ist elite...lol[/quote]
yes, the poor black guy who was raised by his single mother and grandparents and earned his way into columbia and then graduated magna cum laude from harvard as the harvard law review president only to turn down large job offers to work as a community organizer and a professor at one of the nations most prestegious schools is the elitist. not the shithead who only got into the naval academy because of his daddy and grandpappy and miraculously stayed in to finish 894th out of 899 only to steal a pilot slot from another much more deserving individual and then proceeded to crash 5 planes before dating a multimillionaire beer heiress 20 years his youth while still married to his first wife whom he had left after she suffered a catostophic injury and lost 4 inches of her heighth in the process. yes, clearly the poor underprivlidged guy who earned everything hes got by intelligence and hard work is the elitist, not the asshole whose daddy spoiled him rotten.

but no no, youre right, barack is "exoctic," and his middle name is hussein and he clearly chose it to be so. yes the intelligent fellow whos rise to grace is the american dream epitomized is the "elitist" because hes earned his shit and enunciates, while the spoiled asshole with 11 houses and a hundred million in the bank whos abondoned everything he stood for for a chance to suckle at the teet of the republican party is the "everyman," give me a fucking break.

[STRAYCAT]

[quote name='Nati Ice' post='696210' date='Sep 6 2008, 10:09 PM']yes, the poor black guy who was raised by his single mother and grandparents and earned his way into columbia and then graduated magna cum laude from harvard as the harvard law review president only to turn down large job offers to work as a community organizer and a professor at one of the nations most prestegious schools is the elitist. not the shithead who only got into the naval academy because of his daddy and grandpappy and miraculously stayed in to finish 894th out of 899 only to steal a pilot slot from another much more deserving individual and then proceeded to crash 5 planes before dating a multimillionaire beer heiress 20 years his youth while still married to his first wife whom he had left after she suffered a catostophic injury and lost 4 inches of her heighth in the process. yes, clearly the poor underprivlidged guy who earned everything hes got by intelligence and hard work is the elitist, not the asshole whose daddy spoiled him rotten.

but no no, youre right, barack is "exoctic," and his middle name is hussein and he clearly chose it to be so. yes the intelligent fellow whos rise to grace is the american dream epitomized is the "elitist" because hes earned his shit and enunciates, while the spoiled asshole with 11 houses and a hundred million in the bank whos abondoned everything he stood for for a chance to suckle at the teet of the republican party is the "everyman," give me a fucking break.[/quote]


So he was in the right place as far as being married to the right woman AFTER he was shot down in vietnam and had every bone broken in captivity . He elected to stay after being discovered. Obamma orginized what
and passed what bill? Give me a fucking break.they want to get on Sarah about her experience...well Clinton was only a gov.....Bush was a gov......Reagan was a gov....so what!

[Nati Ice]

[quote name='STRAYCAT' post='696211' date='Sep 6 2008, 10:20 PM']So he was in the right place as far as being married to the right woman AFTER he was shot down in vietnam and had every bone broken in captivity . He elected to stay after being discovered. Obamma orginized what
and passed what bill?[/quote]
and this has to do with the charge of being "elitist" how?

i get it, you dont like him, rudi doesnt like him, and every other hyperconservative (thats a bad thing) on this board doesnt like him. thats cool, nobody ever said you had to, but these inane accusations need to stop. wtf does "elitist" even mean? if it means what i suspect it means then you might want to read my post again and see who the real "elitist" is.




per the rest of your response: yes mccain was a pow, we get it. he followed his orders as an officer and stayed until it was his rightful time to leave. he performed his his job as ordered and that is highly commendable, however president does not a pow make.

and for the bills? how about introducing a bipartisan bill designed to prevent nuclear proliferation, supporting multiple bills to construct a fence along the southern border, initiatives expanding current laws designed to prevent proliferation of mines and missles, working on bills against lobbyists, election fraud, and in support of new energy initiatives, doing tons of shit to help out the va, sponsoring a bill ensuring iranian gas and oil sanctions, and sponsoring a bill to secure employment for family members taking care of injured soldiers which that piece of shit bush shot down. did i mention that i believe that all but one of those were bipartisan?

you can sit around saying he hasnt done shit in the limited time hes been in the senate if that continues to give you the stiffy i assume it does, however it is dishonest and couldnt be further from the truth. in fact he has done a shitton of work in the senate given his admittedly short stint.

[quote name='STRAYCAT' post='696211' date='Sep 6 2008, 10:20 PM']Give me a fucking break.they want to get on Sarah about her experience...well Clinton was only a gov.....Bush was a gov......Reagan was a gov....so what![/quote]and look how shittily bush and reagan conducted foreign policy

ill take a highly intelligent man with advanced degrees, who taught constitutional law, spent 7 years in the state senate, and then spent 4 years in the national senate over some former bad sportscaster publicity stunt steelers fan who took 6 colleges to get a fucking communications degree from idaho and then spent 6 years as mayor of a town of 5,000 (something she wasnt qualified for and left greatly in debt), then 2 years on a board of directors for an indicted senators 527 group, and then as a governor of a state with a population much less than a third of the size of the greater cincinnati area where she supported earmarks and the bridge to nowhere until it was politically convenient for her not to.

she is a stupid fuck whos record shows her being the heir apperant to the bush chaney throne, cutting back on essentials and social programs that work only to massively increase funding elsewhere indebting the constituency, screwing up the environment, cutting taxes to even further endebt the state and then sent back govt hush money to its citizens to help offset "fuel costs," all with a little religious crazyness and piousness sprinkled in for good measure. she is a younger less qualified female george bush without the education. she is not fit to be mayor of wasilly and shes sure as shit not fit to be vp of this great nation. fuck, her own mother in law hates her and wont vote for her.