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What happened to Carson Palmer?


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[quote name='Gary' date='09 January 2010 - 08:13 PM' timestamp='1263086028' post='854880']
Even after his injury though he was still pretty damn good.. Probowl MVP.. I knew he wasn't the same QB but he wasn't as bad as he was this year.. We got a backup QB this year in Palmer.. He played like he was filling in for someone.

This begs the question... I got Colt Brennen shoved in my face with a ton of Hawaii games a couple years back... What about bringing in a guy like him? I know he isn't the biggest QB but I am surprised he has not made a roster yet. Another guy I like that might give us a couple years (and is better than any backup we have) is Ryan Dinwiddie. He was the QB for Lance Briggs at Elk Grove High school. Played at Boise State and put up record numbers and turned them into the college program we all know today. He has bounced around a bit, but Dinwiddie has an arm.. I think we need to bring in a few guys to light a fire under Palmer or take his job.

EDIT: err nm Brennan is with the Redskins still.. Forgot about his injury.
[/quote]



keep this in mind. in the pro bowl, with the limited pass rush due to the no blitz rules, a QB is afforded considerably more comfort while sitting back there in the pocket. perhaps that played a factor in that MVP performance vs. the reguar season?
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Some of the Factors

1. Ineffective pass protection

2. Penalties put the team in to tough holes.

3. Predictable Unimaginative Lazy playcalling.

4. Loss of Henry (God Bless him) and Housh's production puts the defensive focus on C.J.

5. Too much emphasis on run throws impairs the rhythm of the pass game and its new parts.

6. Inability to get productive replacements for Housh and Henry.

7. Too much rotation on the Offensive Line.

8. Andre Smith (God Bless his Mammoth ass) missing lots of meaningful time.
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[quote name='The Scales' date='09 January 2010 - 08:47 PM' timestamp='1263088065' post='854982']
Some of the Factors

1. Ineffective pass protection

2. Penalties put the team in to tough holes.

3. Predictable Unimaginative Lazy playcalling.

4. Loss of Henry (God Bless him) and Housh's production puts the defensive focus on C.J.

5. Too much emphasis on run throws impairs the rhythm of the pass game and its new parts.

6. Inability to get productive replacements for Housh and Henry.

7. Too much rotation on the Offensive Line.

8. Andre Smith (God Bless his Mammoth ass) missing lots of meaningful time.
[/quote]

Receivers under 9 feet tall
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[quote name='Bengals1181' date='09 January 2010 - 08:37 PM' timestamp='1263087470' post='854958']
I don't think he's got a lot of faith in the WR's either. Some of that's on them, some of its on him IMO.

Carson doesn't have a lot around him to trust, but I do think he has trust issues.


He got a lot of balls his way today, but for some reason I get the feeling that Carson and Coles aren't very chummy.
[/quote]

Trust has nothing to do with overthrowing receivers all day. Fact is he played horribly and Chad did not step up when it mattered. The team was beaten by a better team and Shayne missing two FGs does not get us a victory according to my math.

Carson is the team leader. He has to take control of the team during a time of adversity and lead them thru it. He just isn't a leader. He is a system QB that has to have time to make it thru his progressions to be effective. He is great at this. Asking him to call audibles and win games when it matters is not his game. Never has been.

Give him better blocking and WRs and he will be effective.
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[quote name='SF2' date='09 January 2010 - 08:59 PM' timestamp='1263088741' post='854997']
Trust has nothing to do with overthrowing receivers all day. Fact is he played horribly and Chad did not step up when it mattered. The team was beaten by a better team and [color="#FF0000"]Shayne missing two FGs does not get us a victory according to my math.[/color]

Carson is the team leader. He has to take control of the team during a time of adversity and lead them thru it. He just isn't a leader. He is a system QB that has to have time to make it thru his progressions to be effective. He is great at this. Asking him to call audibles and win games when it matters is not his game. Never has been.

Give him better blocking and WRs and he will be effective.
[/quote]


Truth.

For all the people pissed at shayne, even if he did make both FGs we still lose by 4.
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[quote name='Jamie_B' date='09 January 2010 - 09:00 PM' timestamp='1263088831' post='855001']
Truth.

For all the people pissed at shayne, even if he did make both FGs we still lose by 4.
[/quote]

Not if we score on the opening possession when Coles fubmled. Should woulda coulda I know, but it was there for the taking.
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[quote name='oldschooler' date='09 January 2010 - 08:34 PM' timestamp='1263087273' post='854948']
He doesn't trust his blocking and isn't finishing his throws.
It is all mental and a trust issue.
[/quote]


zinger! i'm not sure this is something he'll ever be able to overcome. these concerns are obviously a byproduct of his two major injuries. he should be beyond those fears by now, but i'm afraid that's not the case.
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[quote name='SF2' date='09 January 2010 - 08:59 PM' timestamp='1263088741' post='854997']
[b]Trust has nothing to do with overthrowing receivers all day. [/b] Fact is he played horribly and Chad did not step up when it mattered. The team was beaten by a better team and Shayne missing two FGs does not get us a victory according to my math.

Carson is the team leader. He has to take control of the team during a time of adversity and lead them thru it. He just isn't a leader. He is a system QB that has to have time to make it thru his progressions to be effective. He is great at this. Asking him to call audibles and win games when it matters is not his game. Never has been.

Give him better blocking and WRs and he will be effective.
[/quote]


no, it has to do with not trusting the oline, which has also been discussed.
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Before we give up on Palmer, we need to remember that people were ready to run Ken Anderson out of town right before he won the league MVP award. In the history of the league, there have been cases of QBs being given up on, only to return and do great things. It's already been said, but put a line in front of him and find someone who can catch the ball, and he will be fine.
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[quote name='OneHeartBeat' date='09 January 2010 - 09:04 PM' timestamp='1263089066' post='855007']
Not if we score on the opening possession when Coles fubmled. Should woulda coulda I know, but it was there for the taking.
[/quote]

the jets missed on multiple opportunities too, most importantly the braylon edwards drop of a perfect TD pass.

"if wishes were horses, we'd all ride"....as the song goes (DB11).
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[quote name='SF2' date='09 January 2010 - 07:59 PM' timestamp='1263088741' post='854997']
Trust has nothing to do with overthrowing receivers all day.[/quote]

He wasn't following through on his throws. He was releasing it too early,
causing it to sail. That has everything to do with trust and nerves.


[quote]Shayne missing two FGs does not get us a victory according to my math.
[/quote]


You need to get a Rosetta Stone for Football Math then.

If he made the first FG, then they are down by 7 and driving for the tying score.


If he had made the second one (which they probably wouldn't have even attempted
had he made the first one), then they would have been down by 4 with about
3 minutes left. Instead, his second miss was the death knell.
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[quote name='oldschooler' date='09 January 2010 - 09:16 PM' timestamp='1263089764' post='855031']
He wasn't following through on his throws. He was releasing it too early,
causing it to sail. That has everything to do with trust and nerves.





You need to get a Rosetta Stone for Football Math then.

If he made the first FG, then they are down by 7 and driving for the tying score.


If he had made the second one (which they probably wouldn't have even attempted
had he made the first one), then they would have been down by 4 with about
3 minutes left. Instead, his second miss was the death knell.
[/quote]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Still defending this team huh? OMG we lost for years at least we made the playoffs that's pretty sweet huh? :lol: :lol: :lol: There is no defending this team after this embarassment.

20 FUCKING YEARS SINCE A PLAYOFF WIN. 20 FUCKING YEARS. HOW MUCH LONGER DO YOU NEED BEFORE IT BECOMES FUCKING RIDICULOUS?

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[quote name='oldschooler' date='09 January 2010 - 09:16 PM' timestamp='1263089764' post='855031']
He wasn't following through on his throws. He was releasing it too early,
causing it to sail. That has everything to do with trust and nerves.





You need to get a Rosetta Stone for Football Math then.

If he made the first FG, then they are down by 7 and driving for the tying score.


If he had made the second one (which they probably wouldn't have even attempted
had he made the first one), then they would have been down by 4 with about
3 minutes left. Instead, his second miss was the death knell.
[/quote]


We lost by 10, if shayne made both we still lost by 4.
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[quote name='BengalsOwn' date='09 January 2010 - 08:19 PM' timestamp='1263089970' post='855035']
[img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif[/img] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif[/img] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif[/img]

Still defending this team huh? OMG we lost for years at least we made the playoffs that's pretty sweet huh? [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif[/img] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif[/img] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif[/img] There is no defending this team after this embarassment.

20 FUCKING YEARS SINCE A PLAYOFF WIN. 20 FUCKING YEARS. HOW MUCH LONGER DO YOU NEED BEFORE IT BECOMES FUCKING RIDICULOUS?
[/quote]



I am sorry, but this post, in reponse to what I said, makes no sense at all to me.


Where did I defend this team? Where? Seriously. I said Carson doesn't trust
his blocking. And Shayne's misses killed. And the last miss was the death knell.

Now how in the hell you turn that into laughter about me defending this team
and ENDING IT IN ALL CAPS, is beyond me.

Go have another drink or 10.
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[quote name='oldschooler' date='09 January 2010 - 09:24 PM' timestamp='1263090274' post='855040']
I am sorry, but this post, in reponse to what I said, makes no sense at all to me.


Where did I defend this team? Where? Seriously. I said Carson doesn't trust
his blocking. And Shayne's misses killed. And the last miss was the death knell.

Now how in the hell you turn that into laughter about me defending this team
and ENDING IT IN ALL CAPS, is beyond me.

Go have another drink or 10.
[/quote]

Hell I dunno...I don't think I even read your post...just expected the same bullshit after 6 years of posting with you...

There has to be a breaking point, no?

And yes, I am a little inebriated. And disgusted. And embarassed.
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[quote name='Jamie_B' date='09 January 2010 - 08:24 PM' timestamp='1263090248' post='855039']
We lost by 10, if shayne made both we still lost by 4.
[/quote]



Yeah, because if he had made both, then the game would
have played out exactly the same, right?

If he made the last one. They had 3 timeouts left.
They could have tried an onside kick or tried to
hold them on Defense. They would have at least had
some life left. When Shayne missed though, it was the
death knell, nail in the coffin, whatever you want to call it. Period.
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[quote name='oldschooler' date='09 January 2010 - 09:28 PM' timestamp='1263090501' post='855047']
Yeah, because if he had made both, then the game would
have played out exactly the same, right?

If he made the last one. They had 3 timeouts left.
They could have tried an onside kick or tried to
hold them on Defense. They would have at least had
some life left. When Shayne missed though, it was the
death knell, nail in the coffin, whatever you want to call it. Period.
[/quote]

Alright, I read this one, and I agree.

Shayne fucked us, and changed the way the offense and defense played the game. I was telling my guests, "oh we need to just kick it here, and then hope we get the ball back and hope we can score a TD"

That's a horrible strategy if "shayneamatica" or what the fuck ever people have called him was reliable.
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[quote name='oldschooler' date='09 January 2010 - 09:28 PM' timestamp='1263090501' post='855047']
Yeah, because if he had made both, then the game would
have played out exactly the same, right?

If he made the last one. They had 3 timeouts left.
They could have tried an onside kick or tried to
hold them on Defense. They would have at least had
some life left. When Shayne missed though, it was the
death knell, nail in the coffin, whatever you want to call it. Period.
[/quote]


Old come on man, I agree Shayne should have made them and am ready to part ways, but there were alot more problems than just him today. We put on a display of every single thing that we did wrong over the season in one game.
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[quote name='BengalsOwn' date='09 January 2010 - 08:26 PM' timestamp='1263090403' post='855044']
Hell I dunno...I don't think I even read your post...just expected the same bullshit after 6 years of posting with you...

There has to be a breaking point, no?

And yes, I am a little inebriated. And disgusted. And embarassed.
[/quote]



Obviously you don't read my post. I don't care though.
Because you not reading my post and me reading your's
amounts to the same thing. Neither of us gets anything out of it.


And no there is no breaking point. I will not turn against this team,
be embarrassed, whatever. I am disappointed in the ending. But I
enjoyed the hell out of the ride.
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[quote name='Jamie_B' date='09 January 2010 - 08:31 PM' timestamp='1263090666' post='855052']
Old come on man, I agree Shayne should have made them and am ready to part ways, but there were alot more problems than just him today. We put on a display of every single thing that we did wrong over the season in one game.
[/quote]



Did I say Shayne was the sole reason we lost?
No. But to act like if he would have made them
that we would have still lost, no question, and/or
by the same score? I don't agree with that at all.
They would still had a chance. That beats the hell
out of dead and buried.
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