sois Posted April 7, 2010 Report Share Posted April 7, 2010 Cover Your Ass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted April 7, 2010 Report Share Posted April 7, 2010 [quote name='sois' date='07 April 2010 - 06:04 PM' timestamp='1270677876' post='875924'] Cover Your Ass [/quote] I'm surprised you and not the military guys didnt get the acronym. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted April 7, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2010 [quote name='Jamie_B' date='07 April 2010 - 06:27 PM' timestamp='1270679279' post='875928'] I'm surprised you and not the military guys didnt get the acronym. [/quote] Hmmm...I don't ever recall using it...but Jesus Christ, you of all people should know the sheer volume of acronyms used by the military...and more get created all the time. Can't keep track of them all. Coincidentally Jamie, what is your opinion of all this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted April 7, 2010 Report Share Posted April 7, 2010 [quote name='Bunghole' date='07 April 2010 - 06:49 PM' timestamp='1270680548' post='875930'] Hmmm...I don't ever recall using it...but Jesus Christ, you of all people should know the sheer volume of acronyms used by the military...and more get created all the time. Can't keep track of them all. Coincidentally Jamie, what is your opinion of all this? [/quote] I actually learnt CYA from a military guy so... It's sad, but it isn't surprising. I dont have much to offer other than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted April 7, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2010 There are many people in the blogosphere that believe the pilots committed a war crime especially WRT the engagement of the van. I tend not to think so, based on earlier events on that day as well as the vane not having any markings defining it as a rescue vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTBengalsFan Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='Bunghole' date='07 April 2010 - 07:44 PM' timestamp='1270683879' post='875936'] There are many people in the blogosphere that believe the pilots committed a war crime especially WRT the engagement of the van. I tend not to think so, based on earlier events on that day as well as the vane not having any markings defining it as a rescue vehicle. [/quote] I agree, this was at the height of the "surge" in one of the hot zones. Everyone was on edge. People here have a very emotional reaction to this, I know I did. You have to stop to realize some context here. I mean, imagine what Vietnam would have been like if it was all being recorded on video and the internet existed? The real problem, as I see it, is that having such a huge standing army pretty much guarantees conflicts every few years or so. What point is there of having a such a huge standing army if no one has any combat experience? Gets kinda hard to fill out the ranks in leadership if no one has actually been in a war. It pretty much becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted April 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='CTBengalsFan' date='07 April 2010 - 08:37 PM' timestamp='1270687069' post='875944'] I agree, this was at the height of the "surge" in one of the hot zones. Everyone was on edge. People here have a very emotional reaction to this, I know I did. You have to stop to realize some context here. I mean, imagine what Vietnam would have been like if it was all being recorded on video and the internet existed? The real problem, as I see it, is that having such a huge standing army pretty much guarantees conflicts every few years or so. What point is there of having a such a huge standing army if no one has any combat experience? Gets kinda hard to fill out the ranks in leadership if no one has actually been in a war. It pretty much becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. [/quote] Maybe, I prefer to think of it as readiness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTBengalsFan Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='Bunghole' date='07 April 2010 - 11:16 PM' timestamp='1270696605' post='875975'] Maybe, I prefer to think of it as readiness. [/quote] Readiness for what? Who on this earth is going to invade the United States? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted April 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='CTBengalsFan' date='07 April 2010 - 11:23 PM' timestamp='1270697022' post='875979'] Readiness for what? Who on this earth is going to invade the United States? [/quote] Readiness for anything that can happen..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 I'm in the middle on that argument. We do need a strong and ready military..... But last I checked they fall under the department of defense, not the department of imperialism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTBengalsFan Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='Jamie_B' date='07 April 2010 - 11:33 PM' timestamp='1270697608' post='875982'] I'm in the middle on that argument. We do need a strong and ready military..... But last I checked they fall under the department of defense, not the department of imperialism. [/quote] It used to be call the Department of War, and we used to declare war on countries. Now it's an Orwellian type thing where we call invading countries that haven't done anything to us defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='CTBengalsFan' date='07 April 2010 - 10:35 PM' timestamp='1270697728' post='875983'] It used to be call the Department of War, and we used to declare war on countries. Now it's an Orwellian type thing where we call [b]invading countries that haven't done anything to us[/b] defense. [/quote] Whoever gave you positive rep for this post, should have the privilege taken away. Who did we invade that hasn't done anything to us? I hope you are talking about a war we aren't in now. Anyway, it is unfortunate what happened in the video. But it looked to me that some were carrying guns. And I heard someone say a guy had an RPG. And that someone was shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted April 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='CTBengalsFan' date='07 April 2010 - 08:37 PM' timestamp='1270687069' post='875944'] I agree, this was at the height of the "surge" in one of the hot zones. Everyone was on edge. People here have a very emotional reaction to this, I know I did. You have to stop to realize some context here. I mean, imagine what Vietnam would have been like if it was all being recorded on video and the internet existed? The real problem, as I see it, is that having such a huge standing army pretty much guarantees conflicts every few years or so. What point is there of having a such a huge standing army if no one has any combat experience? Gets kinda hard to fill out the ranks in leadership if no one has actually been in a war. It pretty much becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. [/quote] I've re-read this thread, and been thinking about this post. I'm wondering...[i]how[/i] does having a large standing military ensure that you'll invariably use it every few years? I appreciate the fact that you want combat veterans leading your green soldiers into battle, but the USA certainly doesn't go to war with that particular purpose in mind. Other than that fact, I completely agree with your point about the context within which this video needs to be viewed, with it being the height of insurgent activity and ethnic violence, IED bombings, these guys had already been battling insurgents all day that day, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='oldschooler' date='08 April 2010 - 08:56 AM' timestamp='1270731386' post='876024'] Whoever gave you positive rep for this post, should have the privilege taken away. Who did we invade that hasn't done anything to us? [/quote] LOLz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sois Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 Does "not give us free oil" = doing something to us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='Jamie_B' date='08 April 2010 - 10:27 AM' timestamp='1270740477' post='876049'] LOLz [/quote] Typical. If you have nothing to add. Add nothing. Was Saddam and some of the U.N Nations PROFITTING from our sanctions? Yes. Did Iraq abide by the terms of their surrender? No. Did we give him a decade to comply? Yes. Did Saddam want to make not only us, but the World, believe he had WMDs? Yes. Did he shoot at our pilots patrolling the No Fly Zones? Yes. Did we give him one last chance to comply? Yes. Did he comply then? No. Did we give him a chance to surrender or be taken out? Yes. To me it is no different than if Japan or Germany wasn't abiding by the terms of their surrender. Saddam had every chance to stay in power and abide by the terms of his surrender. He thumbed his nose at us for over a decade. He should have been taken out in 1991. He could have prevented our invasion. Sure you can say Bush and Company trumped up the charges. But even without those trumped up charges, there was cause to invade. To say he did NOTHING? LOLz indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='sois' date='08 April 2010 - 11:33 AM' timestamp='1270740803' post='876050'] Does "not give us free oil" = doing something to us? [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='oldschooler' date='08 April 2010 - 11:57 AM' timestamp='1270742254' post='876062'] Typical. If you have nothing to add. Add nothing. Was Saddam and some of the U.N Nations PROFITTING from our sanctions? Yes. Did Iraq abide by the terms of their surrender? No. Did we give him a decade to comply? Yes. Did Saddam want to make not only us, but the World, believe he had WMDs? Yes. Did he shoot at our pilots patrolling the No Fly Zones? Yes. Did we give him one last chance to comply? Yes. Did he comply then? No. Did we give him a chance to surrender or be taken out? Yes. To me it is no different than if Japan or Germany wasn't abiding by the terms of their surrender. Saddam had every chance to stay in power and abide by the terms of his surrender. He thumbed his nose at us for over a decade. He should have been taken out in 1991. He could have prevented our invasion. Sure you can say Bush and Company trumped up the charges. But even without those trumped up charges, there was cause to invade. To say he did NOTHING? LOLz indeed. [/quote] So where do you get your blindfolds? I bet they are american flag colored. [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='Jamie_B' date='08 April 2010 - 11:46 AM' timestamp='1270745167' post='876070'] So where do you get your blindfolds? I bet they are american flag colored. [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif[/img] [/quote] Why do you always have to be a fucking asshole? What did I say that would lead you to think I am blind? Were any of those questions and answers false? Did we not go to war with him? Were there not terms to his surrender? Either try and have a converstion, or shut the fuck up. Asshole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='oldschooler' date='08 April 2010 - 12:59 PM' timestamp='1270745971' post='876074'] Why do you always have to be a fucking asshole? What did I say that would lead you to think I am blind? Was any of those questions and answers false? Did we not go to war with him? Were there not terms to his surrender? Either try and have a converstion, or shut the fuck up. Asshole. [/quote] Maybe because we went through this time and time again and your opinions were as wrong then as they are now. You continue to have justification for a unnecessary war, and if I'm an asshole about it its because I've grown weary of you and your ilk that justify this. We had no need or business in Iraq, I dont care if Ahab wants his whale or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sois Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='Jamie_B' date='08 April 2010 - 10:02 AM' timestamp='1270746128' post='876077'] You continue to have justification for a unnecessary war, and if I'm an asshole about it its because I've grown weary of you and your ilk that justify this. We had no need or business in Iraq, I dont care if Ahab wants his whale or not. [/quote] It's justified. They have something we want. It's pretty simple. All of this other stuff is just spin to make it look more noble. This is what wars are. Stronger countries taking over weaker ones. We have the power to take their resources. That is the business we have over there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='Jamie_B' date='08 April 2010 - 12:02 PM' timestamp='1270746128' post='876077'] Maybe because we went through this time and time again and your opinions were as wrong then as they are now. You continue to have justification for a unnecessary war, and if I'm an asshole about it its because I've grown weary of you and your ilk that justify this. We had no need or business in Iraq, I dont care if Ahab wants his whale or not. [/quote] No. Your a fucking asshole because you attack me for my beliefs. And my beliefs are based on fucking facts. You did not, or could not dispute one fucking thing I said. Instead you attack me. So fuck you asshole. Get it? Asshole. I am not trying to debate whether or not you think we should have went. I was repsonding to someone that said we invaded a country that did NOTHING. Saddam did do something. He never complied with the terms of surrender. He wanted us and the World to believe he had WMDs. He shot at our pilots. He had chances to comply. Numerous chances. He didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='sois' date='08 April 2010 - 01:08 PM' timestamp='1270746492' post='876080'] It's justified. They have something we want. It's pretty simple. All of this other stuff is just spin to make it look more noble. This is what wars are. Stronger countries taking over weaker ones. We have the power to take their resources. That is the business we have over there. [/quote] that is at least honest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='sois' date='08 April 2010 - 12:08 PM' timestamp='1270746492' post='876080'] It's justified. They have something we want. It's pretty simple. All of this other stuff is just spin to make it look more noble. This is what wars are. Stronger countries taking over weaker ones. We have the power to take their resources. That is the business we have over there. [/quote] You know what. Forget it. No sense in getting into all of this again. Some people think and believe what they want. I think Saddam should have been taken out in 1991. And after a decade of him thumbing his nose, was glad to finally see it happen. It's that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted April 8, 2010 Report Share Posted April 8, 2010 [quote name='Jamie_B' date='08 April 2010 - 12:08 PM' timestamp='1270746537' post='876082'] that is at least honest [/quote] How was what I said not honest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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