Nickslycat Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 They just paid 8 million up front for a WR who will never play a down for the Bengals. Mike wants to win this year! He wants a legacy. Mankins would make this OL top 5 in the NFL. Can you imagine Carson with time to look at 3 or 4 receivers? Unfucking stopable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scharm Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 [quote name='JC' timestamp='1282773840' post='910144'] Obviously not that easy..or we wouldn't be having these interior line problems would we? [/quote] Actually you can take this current line and see exactly why overpaying for interior is not a good idea. I don't think this is a great pass protecting line but they have already proven to lead a top rushing attack. The protection according to the position coach is much better at this point than it was last year. So I guess, define "problems". I felt pretty good about this line not to select one of the interior line draft prospects back in April and have not seen anything that makes me want to overpay for a guard today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JC Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 [quote name='scharm' timestamp='1282783011' post='910195'] Actually you can take this current line and see exactly why overpaying for interior is not a good idea. I don't think this is a great pass protecting line but they have already proven to lead a top rushing attack. The protection according to the position coach is much better at this point than it was last year. So I guess, define "problems". I felt pretty good about this line not to select one of the interior line draft prospects back in April and have not seen anything that makes me want to overpay for a guard today. [/quote] This line looked like absolute ass towards the end of the season..and hasn't looked to much better during pre-season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scharm Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 [quote name='JC' timestamp='1282784604' post='910205'] This line looked like absolute ass towards the end of the season..and hasn't looked to much better during pre-season. [/quote] Nah that's an overstatement to justify this crazy idea of trading a 1st or whatever plus a huge contract for a guard. Please explain the line problems and draw conclusions on how this is going to derail the offense from improving. Quite frankly I just don't see it yet in preseason and I think it clear now that the problems with offense were with the skill positions. Let's not play this typical internet arguement game. Is this a great pass protecting line? No. Are they playing a scheme that puts extra pressure on the tackles to protect one on one? I don't think they are. Last off season everyone freaked out because they didn't trade up to get a center or pay another average center 5 mil a year. The line proved people wrong despite the above inaccurate assessment. I certainly don't feel they need to do the drastic steps suggested in this thread. Did Brandon Marshall even fetch a first? Now people are wanting to trade a first or second for a guard? Crazy Crazy talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 [quote name='BengalRep85-9' timestamp='1282778116' post='910171'] Wasn't Whit a LT at LSU his entire career there? [/quote] Yes but we drafted him to play LG and only moved him to LT because Levi was never the same after getting beat up by Joey Porter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigris Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 I think it was moreso his knee (wasn't it the knee?) than it was taking a beat down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JC Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 [quote name='scharm' timestamp='1282789213' post='910230'] Nah that's an overstatement to justify this crazy idea of trading a 1st or whatever plus a huge contract for a guard. Please explain the line problems and draw conclusions on how this is going to derail the offense from improving. Quite frankly I just don't see it yet in preseason and I think it clear now that the problems with offense were with the skill positions. Let's not play this typical internet arguement game. Is this a great pass protecting line? No. Are they playing a scheme that puts extra pressure on the tackles to protect one on one? I don't think they are. Last off season everyone freaked out because they didn't trade up to get a center or pay another average center 5 mil a year. The line proved people wrong despite the above inaccurate assessment. I certainly don't feel they need to do the drastic steps suggested in this thread. Did Brandon Marshall even fetch a first? Now people are wanting to trade a first or second for a guard? Crazy Crazy talk. [/quote] I never said I wanted to trade for him. I was simply pointing out that yes..interior line play is worth a big contract and no there is not a abundance of talent out there to be had, or I'm sure we would have found it somehow. Plus, the whole offense sputtered last year when we couldn't throw the ball because Carson usually didn't have two seconds to look down field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1282775628' post='910151'] We havent exactly invested much in the way of even mid round draft pics in it either (outside of luigis). The last high pick interior linemen we drafted was Whit and he was moved outside. [/quote] and really, you can't count whitworth as a guard, at least not in their mindset. he was a top college tackle that they drafted with plans to eventually play tackle in this league. it's a natural progression for most tackles to start inside at guard first, exactly as whitworth's career has progressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='scharm' timestamp='1282783011' post='910195'] Actually you can take this current line and see exactly why overpaying for interior is not a good idea. I don't think this is a great pass protecting line but they have already proven to lead a top rushing attack. The protection according to the position coach is much better at this point than it was last year. So I guess, define "problems". I felt pretty good about this line not to select one of the interior line draft prospects back in April and have not seen anything that makes me want to overpay for a guard today. [/quote] we'll see how that plays out as the season progresses, but it wouldn't be a stretch of the imagination to say we've seen some of the same concerns that plagued us last year concerning a need at interior offensive line. personally, i think it's an issue that we might try to put off, much as we did this year, but sooner or later we're going to need to address...with an emphasis on the sooner. and quite honestly, just because you didn't see it as a concern, doesn't mean it's not one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='Tigris' timestamp='1282789901' post='910235'] I think it was moreso his knee (wasn't it the knee?) than it was taking a beat down. [/quote] ok, if that makes you feel more comfortable at night. the fact remains he wasn't worth a fuck thereafter. i'm convinced porter and his gang pretty much ruined levi's comeback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1282872343' post='910470'] and really, you can't count whitworth as a guard, at least not in their mindset. he was a top college tackle that they drafted [b]with plans to eventually play tackle in this league. [/b]it's a natural progression for most tackles to start inside at guard first, exactly as whitworth's career has progressed. [/quote] no they didn't He was drafted pre-Levi injury. They knew he could backup tackle, but I've seen no indication that they ever planned for him taking over at tackle. When he was drafted both Levi and Willie were healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredtoast Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1282873347' post='910474'] ok, if that makes you feel more comfortable at night. the fact remains he wasn't worth a fuck thereafter. i'm convinced porter and his gang pretty much ruined levi's comeback. [/quote] So let me get this straight. A guy blows his knee out and misses 10 games, but you think his decline was due to an offseason bar fight where he wasn't even injured? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phatcat Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1282873347' post='910474'] ok, if that makes you feel more comfortable at night. the fact remains he wasn't worth a fuck thereafter. i'm convinced porter and his gang pretty much ruined levi's comeback. [/quote] Dang.... for some reason i hate when someone uses "fact" in a message board post. I guess I am not as certain as you as to the "facts". In my very humble opinion Levi started on his decline coming back to play inside a week after knee surgery. Do I know that as a "fact"? No i dont. Just a different opinion than yours........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackBengal Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1282874701' post='910486'] no they didn't He was drafted pre-Levi injury. They knew he could backup tackle, but I've seen no indication that they ever planned for him taking over at tackle. When he was drafted both Levi and Willie were healthy. [/quote] I am pretty sure that you are incorrect. He was drafted as a tackle and when his name was announced at the draft he was called a tackle. The plan was to start him off as a guard with the idea that he could be moved to tackle later in his career if needed. Just because Willie and Levi were healthy at the time doesnt mean that the Bengals didnt see him as a tackle. Here is what Hobson wrote back in April of 2006 immediately after Whit was drafted: [quote]The Bengals offered a surprise Saturday in the second round when they selected LSU left tackle Andrew Whitworth with the 55th pick, two selections after the Cowboys grabbed Notre Dame tight end Anthony Fasano. [b]The move looks to be a hedge against losing starting left tackle Levi Jones in free agency next season after his contact expires, but the Bengals say it merely gives them a chance to add another top lineman.[/b] The 6-7, 330-pound Whitworth is extremely durable and reliable. He had 52 career starts, played every snap in nine games last season, finished with a streak of 22 straight games without giving up a sack, and was called for just five penalties this season. Bengals head coach Marvin Lewis gave an abrupt "no" when asked if the selection has an impact on the Bengals future of Jones and Pro Bowl right tackle Willie Anderson, also headed into free agency. T[b]he Bengals feel Whitworth can eventually play right tackle, or move inside to guard, as well as play left tackle. Offensive coordinator Bob Bratkowski said they wouldn't have drafted him if he played only left tackle.[/b] http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Bengals-shock-with-LT-Whitworth/B2D68D01-FB03-4188-93E5-4E1C15A871A7 [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1282874701' post='910486'] no they didn't He was drafted pre-Levi injury. They knew he could backup tackle, but I've seen no indication that they ever planned for him taking over at tackle. When he was drafted both Levi and Willie were healthy. [/quote] and mike was planning on shitcanning both their expensive asses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1282876151' post='910497'] and mike was planning on shitcanning both their expensive asses. [/quote] lol is that why he had just given them both extensions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='fredtoast' timestamp='1282875108' post='910487'] So let me get this straight. A guy blows his knee out and misses 10 games, but you think his decline was due to an offseason bar fight where he wasn't even injured? [/quote] fred he was in the middle of rehabbing his knee. in what strange universe do you think tangling with a group of goons, getting wrestled down to the floor, then while down getting kicked at random by multiple grown men...tell me, how would that work to improve your rehabilitation process? are you going to use the words spoken from levi's damaged pride that said "nah, they didn't kick my ass...they didn't hurt me?" I HAD MY CONCERNS AT THE TIME AND STILL DO TO THIS DAY. THAT EVENT WAS NOT BENEFICIAL TO LEVI JONES. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1282876752' post='910502'] fred he was in the middle of rehabbing his knee. in what strange universe do you think tangling with a group of goons, getting wrestled down to the floor, then while down getting kicked at random by multiple grown men...tell me, how would that work to improve your rehabilitation process? are you going to use the words spoken from levi's damaged pride that said "nah, they didn't kick my ass...they didn't hurt me?" I HAD MY CONCERNS AT THE TIME AND STILL DO TO THIS DAY. THAT EVENT WAS NOT BENEFICIAL TO LEVI JONES. [/quote] I'm starting to wonder if Jeb has a multi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackBengal Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1282876151' post='910497'] and mike was planning on shitcanning both their expensive asses. [/quote] huh? Didnt Mike give both Levi and Willie huge contract extensions shortly thereafter? Pretty much the opposite of "planning on shitcanning" both of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='Bengal Migration' timestamp='1282876868' post='910503'] I'm starting to wonder if Jeb has a multi. [/quote] nah, Ed's not that bad. Scharm on the other hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1282876255' post='910499'] lol is that why he had just given them both extensions? [/quote] you have to cover your ass in the short term. during that period you have a top college LT that didn't allow any sacks learn the game of the NFL. you act like the extensions were longterm, you know they weren't. i think it should be noted, there's nothing wrong with rebuilding the way they did with whitworth. that's the way everyone operates. whenever i mention mike's name, everyone's alarm bells seem to go off. that's cute. you can all calm down now. false alarm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='Bengal Migration' timestamp='1282876868' post='910503'] I'm starting to wonder if Jeb has a multi. [/quote] quit that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1282876989' post='910506'] you have to cover your ass in the short term. during that period you have a top college LT that didn't allow any sacks learn the game of the NFL. [b]you act like the extensions were longterm, you know they weren't.[/b] [/quote] wait, shortly after drafting Whitworth they give Willie a 5 year extension and Levi a 6yr extension, and you're seriously trying to say they drafted him to replace either one of them? You're off your damn rocker. He was either drafted as depth, or to replace Steinbach (which he did) or Bobbie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1282877383' post='910513'] wait, shortly after drafting Whitworth they give Willie a 5 year extension and Levi a 6yr extension, and you're seriously trying to say they drafted him to replace either one of them? You're off your damn rocker. He was either drafted as depth, or to replace Steinbach (which he did) or Bobbie. [/quote] oh how about i admit i was wrong? where's that rocker? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 [quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1282877511' post='910515'] oh how about i admit i was wrong? where's that rocker? [/quote] its ok Jeb, just don't do it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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