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Is this what flying has come down to?

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http://www.prisonplanet.com/tsa-now-putting-hands-down-fliers-pants.html

The TSA’s invasive new screening measures include officers literally putting their hands down people’s pants if they are wearing baggy clothing in a shocking new elevation of groping procedures that have stoked a nationwide revolt against privacy-busting airport security measures.

Forget John Tyner’s “don’t touch my junk” experience at the hands of TSA goons in San Diego recently, another victim of Big Sis was told by TSA officials that it was now policy to go even further when dealing with people wearing loose pants or shorts.

Going through airport security this past weekend, radio host Owen JJ Stone, known as “OhDoctah,” related how he was told that the rules had been changed and was offered a private screening. When he asked what the procedure entailed, the TSA agent responded, “I have to go in your waistband, I have to put my hand down your pants,” after which he did precisely that.

Stone chose to conduct the search in public in the fear that the TSA worker would be even more aggressive in a private room.

“If you’re wearing sweat pants or baggy clothing, I was wearing sweat pants they’re not baggy, they’re sweat pants,” said Stone, adding that the agent pulled out his waistband before patting his backside and his crotch.

Even the TSA agent who put his hands down the man’s pants was embarrassed at what he had been told to do by his superiors, apologizing profusely to the victim.
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[quote name='Go Skins' timestamp='1289938367' post='942098']
http://www.prisonplanet.com/tsa-now-putting-hands-down-fliers-pants.html

The TSA’s invasive new screening measures include officers literally putting their hands down people’s pants if they are wearing baggy clothing in a shocking new elevation of groping procedures that have stoked a nationwide revolt against privacy-busting airport security measures.

Forget John Tyner’s “don’t touch my junk” experience at the hands of TSA goons in San Diego recently, another victim of Big Sis was told by TSA officials that it was now policy to go even further when dealing with people wearing loose pants or shorts.

Going through airport security this past weekend, radio host Owen JJ Stone, known as “OhDoctah,” related how he was told that the rules had been changed and was offered a private screening. When he asked what the procedure entailed, the TSA agent responded, “I have to go in your waistband, I have to put my hand down your pants,” after which he did precisely that.

Stone chose to conduct the search in public in the fear that the TSA worker would be even more aggressive in a private room.

“If you’re wearing sweat pants or baggy clothing, I was wearing sweat pants they’re not baggy, they’re sweat pants,” said Stone, adding that the agent pulled out his waistband before patting his backside and his crotch.

Even the TSA agent who put his hands down the man’s pants was embarrassed at what he had been told to do by his superiors, apologizing profusely to the victim.
[/quote]

http://www.rodale.com/airport-body-scan-radiation

THE DETAILS: There are two types of body scanners being put into place. Millimeter-wave imaging-technology units do not produce ionizing radiation, the kind we're exposed to when we get X-rays, or, in much higher doses, when we have CT scans. Currently, there are 40 millimeter-wave scanning machines already in use in 19 U.S. airports. They are used as either the primary screening machines that passengers walk through, or more commonly, for secondary or random screenings. The other type of body scanning that has been tested by TSA uses backscatter technology, which does produce small amounts of ionizing radiation by using extremely weak X-rays. After testing them in a pilot program, the administration has 150 of these machines on order, and they will be deployed to U.S. airports in the coming months.

WHAT IT MEANS: The first step is to put the radiation exposure in perspective. According to TSA, the amount of radiation you're exposed to during a two-second millimeter-wave scan exposes you to radio-wave radiation that is 10,000 times less powerful than radiation levels that pulse from a cellphone. A backscatter scan exposes you to the same amount of radiation you would experience during two minutes of a cross-country or ocean plane flight, thanks to cosmic radiation in the atmosphere. According to the National Council on Radiation Protection and Measurement (NCRP), a traveler subjected to at least 2,500 backscatter scans a year would barely reach the Negligible Individual Dose. In same report, NCRP found that a traveler subjected to at least 2,500 backscatter scans per year would barely reach the Negligible Individual Dose.
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[quote name='sois' timestamp='1289941570' post='942117']
How are you going to get to Europe?
[/quote]

I'm hoping the TSA comes to their collective senses or there are enough riots in the airports to force them to do so in the next 8 months before we leave...
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[quote name='sois' timestamp='1289942433' post='942120']
Just request the hottest chick to feel you up, make a lemon situation lemonade.

/Angle'd
[/quote]

this. I'd say... "I opt out. I want to be frisked... by blondie over there."

Then enjoy every second of it. B)

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[quote name='Vol_Bengal' timestamp='1289942698' post='942122']
this. I'd say... "I opt out. I want to be frisked... by blondie over there."

Then enjoy every second of it. B)
[/quote]

As I told Sois yesterday, If they all looked like Jessica Alba I'd spend my days going in and out of airport security. Sadly, that's not the case.

And seriously, the scanners are worthless and the groping is a symptom of a power-mad agency putting on "Security Theater"...

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[quote name='Elflocko' timestamp='1289942842' post='942124']
As I told Sois yesterday, If they all looked like Jessica Alba I'd spend my days going in and out of airport security. Sadly, that's not the case.

And seriously, the scanners are worthless and the groping is a symptom of a power-mad agency putting on "Security Theater"...
[/quote]


Your luck you'd get one that looks like [url="http://forum.go-bengals.com/index.php?showtopic=57544&pid=942127&st=0"]this[/url].
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[quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1289943536' post='942130']
Your luck you'd get one that looks like [url="http://forum.go-bengals.com/index.php?showtopic=57544&pid=942127&st=0"]this[/url].
[/quote]


I'm sure she's proud of her GED and really likes wearing those blue latex gloves...
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[quote][size="5"][b]Freedom fades as we grope for answers[/b][/size]

By Margery Eagan | Tuesday, November 16, 2010 | http://www.bostonherald.com


So here are your airport choices: submit to sexual molestation or spread your legs, hands over head, and get radiated while some TSA guys down the hall check out your naked body.

To use the overused line, the terrorists have won.

Somewhere, wherever, Osama bin Laden revels in how he’s cowed and humiliated all of us once tough, brave, freedom-loving Americans. I just can’t believe we’re letting the government get away with this baloney.

Think about this, you fools who actually believe naked scanning and crotch grabbing will prevent future terrorists attacks. Think about your 15-year-old daughter’s breasts being squeezed by some stranger.

Think about your pregnant wife being X-rayed, which damages the unborn. Many scientists insist scanners will also increase cancer risk in small children and adolescents. Think of those already sexually molested now facing a public, government-sponsored molestation anytime they take the shuttle to New York.

Meanwhile, while we pathetic little lambs agree to be treated like mass-murder suspects, Osama’s minions are devising clever ways to circumvent us.

[b]Of course, the biggest pusher of scanners is Michael Chertoff, the ex-Homeland Security chief under former President George Bush. The California company that makes the back scanner-style machine was his private client while he was all over TV singing scanners’ praises.[/b]

[i][b]The current Homeland Security chief, Janet Napolitano, has no credibility either. She’s still insisting scanners are “safe, efficient” and that privacy is protected because “the imaging technology that we use cannot store, export, print or transmit images.”

Whoops. U.S. Marshals have already admitted saving 35,000 naked body images from a scanning machine at a federal courthouse in Florida.[/b][/i]

I can’t wait for the lucrative TSA black market in naked body scans of 15-year-old boys and girls — and those of famous celebrities.

I can’t wait either for the next so-called “necessary” safety measure. Scanners don’t detect contraband in body cavities. Get ready for airport colonoscopies and gynecological exams. Why not? We all know the safety-first hysterics idiotic mantra: “If that colonoscopy saves one life...”

Refusing to complete the screening process once it’s begun subjects you to civil penalties. My new hero, John Tyner, found that out when he refused to let a TSA screener, in his moving rallying cry, “Don’t touch my junk.” Tyner is facing a $10,000 fine.

Oh, what a passive, steam-rolled embarrassment of a nation we’ve become. As Ben Franklin said so well, “Those who would give up essential liberty to buy a little temporary safety deserve neither.” That’s us, 2010: deserving neither.[/quote]

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/columnists/view.bg?articleid=1296656&srvc=rss
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I am disappointed that nobody enjoyed the Spinal Tap link. With that said...what is the Israeli model with their El-Al airline, and if it isn't as invasive as this is, why don't we adopt that model? When is the last time an Israeli airliner was hijacked? The 1970's? THEY know security.
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[quote name='Bunghole' timestamp='1289957894' post='942196']
I am disappointed that nobody enjoyed the Spinal Tap link. With that said...what is the Israeli model with their El-Al airline, and if it isn't as invasive as this is, why don't we adopt that model? When is the last time an Israeli airliner was hijacked? The 1970's? THEY know security.
[/quote]


This is how:

[quote] [size="5"][b]The 'Israelification' of airports: High security, little bother[/b][/size]

December 30, 2009

Cathal Kelly

While North America's airports groan under the weight of another sea-change in security protocols, one word keeps popping out of the mouths of experts: Israelification.

That is, how can we make our airports more like Israel's, which deal with far greater terror threat with far less inconvenience.

"It is mindboggling for us Israelis to look at what happens in North America, because we went through this 50 years ago," said Rafi Sela, the president of AR Challenges, a global transportation security consultancy. He's worked with the RCMP, the U.S. Navy Seals and airports around the world.

"Israelis, unlike Canadians and Americans, don't take s--- from anybody. When the security agency in Israel (the ISA) started to tighten security and we had to wait in line for — not for hours — but 30 or 40 minutes, all hell broke loose here. We said, 'We're not going to do this. You're going to find a way that will take care of security without touching the efficiency of the airport."

That, in a nutshell is "Israelification" - a system that protects life and limb without annoying you to death.

Despite facing dozens of potential threats each day, the security set-up at Israel's largest hub, Tel Aviv's Ben Gurion Airport, has not been breached since 2002, when a passenger mistakenly carried a handgun onto a flight. How do they manage that?

"The first thing you do is to look at who is coming into your airport," said Sela.

The first layer of actual security that greets travellers at Tel Aviv's Ben Gurion International Airport is a roadside check. All drivers are stopped and asked two questions: How are you? Where are you coming from?

"Two benign questions. The questions aren't important. The way people act when they answer them is," Sela said.

Officers are looking for nervousness or other signs of "distress" — behavioural profiling. Sela rejects the argument that profiling is discriminatory.

"The word 'profiling' is a political invention by people who don't want to do security," he said. "To us, it doesn't matter if he's black, white, young or old. It's just his behaviour. So what kind of privacy am I really stepping on when I'm doing this?"

Once you've parked your car or gotten off your bus, you pass through the second and third security perimeters.

Armed guards outside the terminal are trained to observe passengers as they move toward the doors, again looking for odd behaviour. At Ben Gurion's half-dozen entrances, another layer of security are watching. At this point, some travellers will be randomly taken aside, and their person and their luggage run through a magnometer.

"This is to see that you don't have heavy metals on you or something that looks suspicious," said Sela.

You are now in the terminal. As you approach your airline check-in desk, a trained interviewer takes your passport and ticket. They ask a series of questions: Who packed your luggage? Has it left your side?

"The whole time, they are looking into your eyes — which is very embarrassing. But this is one of the ways they figure out if you are suspicious or not. It takes 20, 25 seconds," said Sela.

Lines are staggered. People are not allowed to bunch up into inviting targets for a bomber who has gotten this far.

At the check-in desk, your luggage is scanned immediately in a purpose-built area. Sela plays devil's advocate — what if you have escaped the attention of the first four layers of security, and now try to pass a bag with a bomb in it?

"I once put this question to Jacques Duchesneau (the former head of the Canadian Air Transport Security Authority): say there is a bag with play-doh in it and two pens stuck in the play-doh. That is 'Bombs 101' to a screener. I asked Ducheneau, 'What would you do?' And he said, 'Evacuate the terminal.' And I said, 'Oh. My. God.'

"Take Pearson. Do you know how many people are in the terminal at all times? Many thousands. Let's say I'm (doing an evacuation) without panic — which will never happen. But let's say this is the case. How long will it take? Nobody thought about it. I said, 'Two days.'"

A screener at Ben-Gurion has a pair of better options.

First, the screening area is surrounded by contoured, blast-proof glass that can contain the detonation of up to 100 kilos of plastic explosive. Only the few dozen people within the screening area need be removed, and only to a point a few metres away.

Second, all the screening areas contain 'bomb boxes'. If a screener spots a suspect bag, he/she is trained to pick it up and place it in the box, which is blast proof. A bomb squad arrives shortly and wheels the box away for further investigation.

"This is a very small simple example of how we can simply stop a problem that would cripple one of your airports," Sela said.

Five security layers down: you now finally arrive at the only one which Ben-Gurion Airport shares with Pearson — the body and hand-luggage check.

"But here it is done completely, absolutely 180 degrees differently than it is done in North America," Sela said.

"First, it's fast — there's almost no line. That's because they're not looking for liquids, they're not looking at your shoes. They're not looking for everything they look for in North America. They just look at you," said Sela. "Even today with the heightened security in North America, they will check your items to death. But they will never look at you, at how you behave. They will never look into your eyes ... and that's how you figure out the bad guys from the good guys."

That's the process — six layers, four hard, two soft. The goal at Ben-Gurion is to move fliers from the parking lot to the airport lounge in a maximum of 25 minutes.

This doesn't begin to cover the off-site security net that failed so spectacularly in targeting would-be Flight 253 bomber Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab — intelligence. In Israel, Sela said, a coordinated intelligence gathering operation produces a constantly evolving series of threat analyses and vulnerability studies.

"There is absolutely no intelligence and threat analysis done in Canada or the United States," Sela said. "Absolutely none."

But even without the intelligence, Sela maintains, Abdulmutallab would not have gotten past Ben Gurion Airport's behavioural profilers.

So. Eight years after 9/11, why are we still so reactive, so un-Israelified?

Working hard to dampen his outrage, Sela first blames our leaders, and then ourselves.

"We have a saying in Hebrew that it's much easier to look for a lost key under the light, than to look for the key where you actually lost it, because it's dark over there. That's exactly how (North American airport security officials) act," Sela said. "You can easily do what we do. You don't have to replace anything. You have to add just a little bit — technology, training. But you have to completely change the way you go about doing airport security. And that is something that the bureaucrats have a problem with. They are very well enclosed in their own concept."

And rather than fear, he suggests that outrage would be a far more powerful spur to provoking that change.

"Do you know why Israelis are so calm? We have brutal terror attacks on our civilians and still, life in Israel is pretty good. The reason is that people trust their defence forces, their police, their response teams and the security agencies. They know they're doing a good job. You can't say the same thing about Americans and Canadians. They don't trust anybody," Sela said. "But they say, 'So far, so good'. Then if something happens, all hell breaks loose and you've spent eight hours in an airport. Which is ridiculous. Not justifiable

"But, what can you do? Americans and Canadians are nice people and they will do anything because they were told to do so and because they don't know any different."[/quote]
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And you're correct; we [b]should[/b] be adopting that model, or something similar.

Unfortunately, there's too much money to be made by the POWERS THAT BE in hocking ineffective and potentially dangerous scanners, then sexually assaulting innocent Americans to force them via fear and intimidation into using said scanners as well as growing an inept government leviathan that has swelled to over 67,000 employees and still can't do their fucking job. That, and no one wants to pay the salaries required to get truly qualified people working as security personnel so we're stuck with imbeciles abusing their power who would otherwise be flipping burgers for a cartoon clown.

The underwear bomber didn't get through security [b]here[/b], rather he boarded his flight in Amsterdam. That incident occurred due to yet another breakdown in our "intelligence" and a complete lack of common sense.

"Hmmm, let's see; I've got a guy from a known terrorist country flying to America in the middle of winter to a cold-ass city with no luggage and no coat... Welcome aboard, Sir!"

It's fucking idiocy...
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[quote name='Elflocko' timestamp='1289959235' post='942202']
And you're correct; we [b]should[/b] be adopting that model, or something similar.

Unfortunately, there's too much money to be made by the POWERS THAT BE in hocking ineffective and potentially dangerous scanners, then sexually assaulting innocent Americans to force them via fear and intimidation into using said scanners as well as growing an inept government leviathan that has swelled to over 67,000 employees and still can't do their fucking job. That, and no one wants to pay the salaries required to get truly qualified people working as security personnel so we're stuck with imbeciles abusing their power who would otherwise be flipping burgers for a cartoon clown.

The underwear bomber didn't get through security [b]here[/b], rather he boarded his flight in Amsterdam. That incident occurred due to yet another breakdown in our "intelligence" and a complete lack of common sense.

"Hmmm, let's see; I've got a guy from a known terrorist country flying to America in the middle of winter to a cold-ass city with no luggage and no coat... Welcome aboard, Sir!"

It's fucking idiocy...
[/quote]


Yes but it may keep Americans safe


:ninja:

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[quote name='Elflocko' timestamp='1289959235' post='942202']
And you're correct; we [b]should[/b] be adopting that model, or something similar.

Unfortunately, there's too much money to be made by the POWERS THAT BE in hocking ineffective and potentially dangerous scanners, then sexually assaulting innocent Americans to force them via fear and intimidation into using said scanners as well as growing an inept government leviathan that has swelled to over 67,000 employees and still can't do their fucking job. That, and no one wants to pay the salaries required to get truly qualified people working as security personnel so we're stuck with imbeciles abusing their power who would otherwise be flipping burgers for a cartoon clown.

The underwear bomber didn't get through security [b]here[/b], rather he boarded his flight in Amsterdam. That incident occurred due to yet another breakdown in our "intelligence" and a complete lack of common sense.

"Hmmm, let's see; I've got a guy from a known terrorist country flying to America in the middle of winter to a cold-ass city with no luggage and no coat... Welcome aboard, Sir!"

It's fucking idiocy...
[/quote]
Flying into the US from any country overseas requires an entirely different set of guidelines be followed from SOP at that airport. Here, I can't even get[b] to the ticket counter[/b] without having my passport checked if I'm on a flight to the US (even though I stop at another country in between). I also get to endure a secondary search in the airbridge before boarding, that would not happen for any other int'l flight.

The whole take your shoes off bit? Only for flights to the US.

And trust me, security at AMS is no joke. :D

You've got your finger on it - At best, the whole thing is a fucking scam for companies who make the equipment to make $$ off of taxpayers. At worst, it's a dry run to see how much of this shit we'll tolerate as "free" citizens before the full police state kicks in.

And if you believe in underwear bombers, I'm sure you're really looking forward to having Santa visit next month as well. :P

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[quote name='Bengal Migration' timestamp='1289961895' post='942210']
Flying into the US from any country overseas requires an entirely different set of guidelines be followed from SOP at that airport. Here, I can't even get[b] to the ticket counter[/b] without having my passport checked if I'm on a flight to the US (even though I stop at another country in between). I also get to endure a secondary search in the airbridge before boarding, that would not happen for any other int'l flight.

The whole take your shoes off bit? Only for flights to the US.

And trust me, security at AMS is no joke. :D

You've got your finger on it - At best, the whole thing is a fucking scam for companies who make the equipment to make $$ off of taxpayers. At worst, it's a dry run to see how much of this shit we'll tolerate as "free" citizens before the full police state kicks in.

And if you believe in underwear bombers, I'm sure you're really looking forward to having Santa visit next month as well. :P
[/quote]

I was [b]really[/b] hoping you would chime in on this (CincyInDC as well) as you travel internationally more than any other people on this board. I was [b]stunned[/b] when I saw the difference in security between here and Germany, and the more I see the TSA's power grab and the sheer idiocy of them spending billions fighting last months threats it just infuriates me. Glad it just isn't my perception in the differences.

So, do they play with your genitals before getting on a plane in Singapore, or Australia, or Germany, or... ?

The TSA makes me [b]hate[/b] this fucking country sometimes...

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[quote name='Elflocko' timestamp='1289962435' post='942214']
I was [b]really[/b] hoping you would chime in on this (CincyInDC as well) as you travel internationally more than any other people on this board. I was [b]stunned[/b] when I saw the difference in security between here and Germany, and the more I see the TSA's power grab and the sheer idiocy of them spending billions fighting last months threats it just infuriates me. Glad it just isn't my perception in the differences.

So, do they play with your genitals before getting on a plane in Singapore, or Australia, or Germany, or... ?

The TSA makes me [b]hate[/b] this fucking country sometimes...
[/quote]
I've never witnessed anything as described in this thread as far as the excessive searching goes. I did get my radiation dose in Chicago on my way to Cincy a few weeks ago with the new body scanners. I thought about requesting the alternative procedure, but I decided to STFU and move on.

The procedures (and lengthy security lines) in the US are excessive compared to anywhere else in the world I've been. I can land here, go through passport control, duty free (cheep booze! :D ) baggage claim, and customs - AND CATCH A TAXI HOME - faster than I can even get my luggage from baggage claim in Chicago when entering the US. Of course, Changi has been rated the #1 airport in the world, so that *might* have something to do with that. :D

The only thing I've witnessed that even remotely compares to the harassment you see in US airports is arriving into Australia. Customs there can be a nightmare. It's bad enough that they have a documentary TV show (think "Cops" in the airport) highlighting the crap that goes on there. Luckily, we've been through there enough that security seems to "sense" that we've been through that crap before, and we tend to get a pass through the worst of it. But waiting an hour in a line to have your entire belongings thoroughly searched by hand is not unheard of.

PS- hope to see you in Germany next fall :drinks:

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[quote name='Bengal Migration' timestamp='1289963066' post='942216']
I've never witnessed anything as described in this thread as far as the excessive searching goes. I did get my radiation dose in Chicago on my way to Cincy a few weeks ago with the new body scanners. I thought about requesting the alternative procedure, but I decided to STFU and move on.

The procedures (and lengthy security lines) in the US are excessive compared to anywhere else in the world I've been. I can land here, go through passport control, duty free (cheep booze! :D ) baggage claim, and customs - AND CATCH A TAXI HOME - faster than I can even get my luggage from baggage claim in Chicago when entering the US. Of course, Changi has been rated the #1 airport in the world, so that *might* have something to do with that. :D

The only thing I've witnessed that even remotely compares to the harassment you see in US airports is arriving into Australia. Customs there can be a nightmare. It's bad enough that they have a documentary TV show (think "Cops" in the airport) highlighting the crap that goes on there. Luckily, we've been through there enough that security seems to "sense" that we've been through that crap before, and we tend to get a pass through the worst of it. But waiting an hour in a line to have your entire belongings thoroughly searched by hand is not unheard of.

[b]PS- hope to see you in Germany next fall [/b] :drinks:
[/quote]

Italy\Monaco\Spain won out this year. We got a deal that we couldn't pass up (cruise and airfare for less than our airfare to Germany last year). I'm just hoping I don't get arrested by TSA on the way out...

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