|Bunghole| Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 This guy was obviously a complete crazy person, but it would be really helpful if the likes of Palin/Angle/Beck/Bachmann would simply realize that their violent rhetoric may have consequences. Or alternately, just shut the fuck up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 [quote name='Bunghole' timestamp='1294602631' post='960398'] This guy was obviously a complete crazy person, but it would be really helpful if the likes of Palin/Angle/Beck/Bachmann would simply realize that their [color="#FF0000"]violent rhetoric may have consequences[/color]. Or alternately, just shut the fuck up. [/quote] This. (And I would include Sharron Angle and her "2nd amendment remedies" in that) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Tigers Johnson| Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1294602976' post='960400'] This. (And I would include Sharron Angle and her "2nd amendment remedies" in that) [/quote] How ever tactless the political propaganda was, reasonable people know that there is no intention to have something like this happen..... This is a crazy person who fell through the cracks of society and if they are this over the top they will always find a reason to do something like this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 [quote name='Tigers Johnson' timestamp='1294604444' post='960405'] How ever tactless the political propaganda was, reasonable people know that there is no intention to have something like this happen..... This is a crazy person who fell through the cracks of society and if they are this over the top they will always find a reason to do something like this... [/quote] Perhaps but throwing a match on the fire doesnt help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 The Sheriff had something to say about that as well. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ysrF8pRuWc[/media] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 Pointing fingers at Republicans over this is just ridiculous and is politicizing this tragedy. I think it is sick and disgusting. This piece of shit is no different than the VT shooter and all the other pieces of shit like them. I mean really, had he shot a Repulican, would it have been the Democrats fault? By the way, that Sherrif is a Democrat. Like I said, I wish something like this would bring us all together. Not point fingers and blame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 [quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1294607028' post='960430'] Pointing fingers at Republicans over this is just ridiculous and is politicizing this tragedy. I think it is sick and disgusting. This piece of shit is no different than the VT shooter and all the other pieces of shit like them. I mean really, had he shot a Repulican, would it have been the Democrats fault? By the way, that Sherrif is a Democrat. Like I said, I wish something like this would bring us all together. Not point fingers and blame. [/quote] I include anyone that would use that type of vitriolic language, regardless of party. And the Sherrif is right. I would like us to come together on it too, but at the same time people should stand up and tell those using that language they are in the wrong and it needs to stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1294607372' post='960435'] I include anyone that would use that type of vitriolic language, regardless of party. And the Sherrif is right. I would like us to come together on it too, but at the same time people should stand up and tell those using that language they are in the wrong and it needs to stop. [/quote] Saying that vitriol was the cause, is politicizing it. A fucking nutjob was the cause. And nutjobs aren't exclusive to one party or another. Of course you can't come together if vitriol is continued. They go hand in hand. I am not condoning it. Pointing fingers, politicizing and grandstanding won't help this Country come together either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 [quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1294608151' post='960437'] Saying that vitriol was the cause, is politicizing it. A fucking nutjob was the cause. And nutjobs aren't exclusive to one party or another. Of course you can't come together if vitriol is continued. They go hand in hand. I am not condoning it. Pointing fingers, politicizing and grandstanding won't help this Country come together either. [/quote] I don't agree with that at all. We have created a atmosphere in this country where a segment no matter how small believes that armed revolution is an option, regardless of what reason this person may or may not of had to do this. Remember this congresswoman has been threatened before, it's the same congresswoman who had a brick thrown through her campaign office window. There is a certain responsibility of folks that use that language, because it incites. This person may or may not have been a nutcase or considered himself a political revolutionary, and I'm sure those fact will come out. But again this isnt the first time this woman has been threatened or had physical violence done to her or her offices. That cant be a coincidence. And we shoulnt dismiss it, we should stand up to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1294608740' post='960440'] I don't agree with that at all. We have created a atmosphere in this country where a segment no matter how small believes that armed revolution is an option, regardless of what reason this person may or may not of had to do this. Remember this congresswoman has been threatened before, it's the same congresswoman who had a brick thrown through her campaign office window. There is a certain responsibility of folks that use that language, because it incites. This person may or may not have been a nutcase or considered himself a political revolutionary, and I'm sure those fact will come out. But again this isnt the first time this woman has been threatened or had physical violence done to her or her offices. That cant be a coincidence. And we shoulnt dismiss it, we should stand up to it. [/quote] We sure seem to be coming together, aren't we? Jamie, I am sure every Congressman gets threatened. Anyway, I am not going to argue with you about it. Because we are in agreement that it needs to end. What we are in disagreement over is if virtiol was the cause of THIS episode. This guy seems to be ANTI-GOVERMENT. NOT ANTI-DEMOCRAT. I have no reason to believe that he shot the Congresswoman for any other reason than because she was the one in his Congressional district. So yes, I think the politicizing is disgusting and uncalled for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 [quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1294609573' post='960445'] We sure seem to be coming together, aren't we? Jamie, I am sure every Congressman gets threatened. Anyway, I am not going to argue with you about it. Because we are in agreement that it needs to end. What we are in disagreement over is if virtiol was the cause of THIS episode. This guy seems to be ANTI-GOVERMENT. NOT ANTI-DEMOCRAT. I have no reason to believe that he shot the Congresswoman for any other reason than because she was the one in his Congressional district. So yes, I think the politicizing is disgusting and uncalled for. [/quote] I dont see where calling on those spitting the vitrol to stop is politicizing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|kennethmw| Posted January 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1294585203' post='960347'] title fixed [/quote] Thanks Jamie, I didn't know how. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 [quote name='kennethmw' timestamp='1294611082' post='960454'] Thanks Jamie, I didn't know how. [/quote] n/p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 The 2nd person of interest is clear. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/01/09/national/main7228312.shtml?tag=breakingnews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Tigers Johnson| Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1294610194' post='960449'] I dont see where calling on those spitting the vitrol to stop is politicizing it. [/quote] At the very minimum, it appears that you are trying to make a few Republicans look bad because a nut job shot a Democrat.... Am I tired of mudslinging politics? Hell yes. Is using this shooting of a human being who happens to be a democrat by a head case as a tool to put a bad spin on the Republican party in bad taste? Hell yes. Both sides of the aisle slings mud.... Should it stop? Yes. Should this be used as an example to shame people about it? Hell No! This is about a nut job who shot a good person. I pray for her health and recovery. I look forward to the day she enters the House again to thunderous applause! The fact we are even discussing anything else to me is completely disgusting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='Tigers Johnson' timestamp='1294620537' post='960489'] At the very minimum, it appears that you are trying to make a few Republicans look bad because a nut job shot a Democrat.... Am I tired of mudslinging politics? Hell yes. Is using this shooting of a human being who happens to be a democrat by a head case as a tool to put a bad spin on the Republican party in bad taste? Hell yes. Both sides of the aisle slings mud.... Should it stop? Yes. Should this be used as an example to shame people about it? Hell No! This is about a nut job who shot a good person. I pray for her health and recovery. I look forward to the day she enters the House again to thunderous applause! The fact we are even discussing anything else to me is completely disgusting. [/quote] I dont see it that way, I said specifically "regardless of party" Why should we not shame them? What they are doing is wrong regardless of party and contributes to an political environment in which some think armed revolution is ok, be it some tea party members or black panther types. This should not be allowed in our society and we should shame those who would contribute to it. Not standing up to it doesnt end it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Tigers Johnson| Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1294620976' post='960494'] I dont see it that way, I said specifically "regardless of party" Why should we not shame them? What they are doing is wrong regardless of party and contributes to an political environment in which some think armed revolution is ok, be it some tea party members or black panther types. This should not be allowed in our society and we should shame those who would contribute to it. Not standing up to it doesnt end it. [/quote] So if you tell someone to go jump off a bridge and they actually do it that it is your fault? So every nutcase has to be told what to do? They can't just dream things up on their own? Nut case's are nut case's for a reason. If they are going to kill, they will find the reason no matter what anyone does or says.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='Tigers Johnson' timestamp='1294621193' post='960495'] So if you tell someone to go jump off a bridge and they actually do it that it is your fault? So every nutcase has to be told what to do? They can't just dream things up on their own? Nut case's are nut case's for a reason. If they are going to kill, they will find the reason no matter what anyone does or says.... [/quote] Are you telling me words dont have the power to motivate people to do bad things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1294620976' post='960494'] I dont see it that way, I said specifically "regardless of party" Why should we not shame them? What they are doing is wrong regardless of party and contributes to an political environment in which some think armed revolution is ok, be it some tea party members or black panther types. This should not be allowed in our society and we should shame those who would contribute to it. Not standing up to it doesnt end it. [/quote] No one is saying it shouldn't stop. Everyone is agreeing with you on that aspect. It is being made an issue now and was even said it may have been "the cause" because of this tragedy. No matter how you want to slant it, that is politicizing what happened. That's what you are doing. You are making IT the issue. You are acting like IT made this happen. That doesn't appear to be the case. From all accounts, this guy would have shot whoever was his Congresseman (woman) no matter what party they were from. And no matter what the other party had said. Like I said, I hope it ends the mudslinging from both sides. I hope we all come together. But making the mudslinging an issue now in a time of tragedy is uncalled for in my mind. No one is slinging any mud now. Mudslinging isn't what caused this. So don't point fingers. Don't grandstand. Just pray and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Tigers Johnson| Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1294621422' post='960496'] Are you telling me words dont have the power to motivate people to do bad things? [/quote] I am telling you that if a nutcase is going to kill he will find the words/actions he needs to motivate him or just make them up in his head.... Are you telling me we need to censure all speech because we might set someone off that is already on the fringe of society?(Hell we already try to do that with the ridiculous amount of political correctness in this country) Is that website by Palin in poor taste? Yes. Did it look bad after Giffords was shot? Yes...that is why they took it down. Do you really believe Palin was trying to get someone to kill everyone that was targeted on that map? Nut case's will always find motivation even if everyone in the world watches everything they say.... That is why they are nutcase's.... Was Palin's site in poor taste? Yes...but shame on anyone trying to get political gain from a terrible situation all around. I truly believe if this had been a Republican shot and a Democratic picture taken down we would not be talking about this right now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1294621718' post='960498'] No one is saying it shouldn't stop. Everyone is agreeing with you on that aspect. It is being made an issue now and was even said it may have been "the cause" because of this tragedy. No matter how you want to slant it, that is politicizing what happened. That's what you are doing. You are making IT the issue. You are acting like IT made this happen. That doesn't appear to be the case. From all accounts, this guy would have shot whoever was his Congresseman (woman) no matter what party they were from. And no matter what the other party had said. Like I said, I hope it ends the mudslinging from both sides. I hope we all come together. But making the mudslinging an issue now in a time of tragedy is uncalled for in my mind. No one is slinging any mud now. Mudslinging isn't what caused this. So don't point fingers. Don't grandstand. Just pray and move on. [/quote] I don't agree that I am politicizing it, rather I think I am calling attention to an environment that even if this wasnt politically motivated (and the facts are still out) in this instance has been politically motivated on this woman in the past, that it wasnt just this incident she had a brick thrown through her window after her healthcare vote. How many isolated incidents do we need before this stuff becomes a pattern? Was the person who threw a brick through her window just another isolated incident of a nutjob? So then when is it ok to call these people to task? How long do we have to wait until we do? Until the congresswoman (let alone the others who did RIP) is actually dead? Im sorry but I disagree with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='Tigers Johnson' timestamp='1294622053' post='960501'] I am telling you that if a nutcase is going to kill he will find the words/actions he needs to motivate him or just make them up in his head.... Are you telling me we need to censure all speech because we might set someone off that is already on the fringe of society?(Hell we already try to do that with the ridiculous amount of political correctness in this country) Is that website by Palin in poor taste? Yes. Did it look bad after Giffords was shot? Yes...that is why they took it down. Do you really believe Palin was trying to get someone to kill everyone that was targeted on that map? Nut case's will always find motivation even if everyone in the world watches everything they say.... That is why they are nutcase's.... Was Palin's site in poor taste? Yes...but shame on anyone trying to get political gain from a terrible situation all around. I truly believe if this had been a Republican shot and a Democratic picture taken down we would not be talking about this right now... [/quote] You would be wrong. I have said regardless of party several times. This stuff can not fly. No I dont think Palin was trying to get her killed, I dont think Palin is capeable of thinking, but thats another issue entirely. But with our rights we hold responsibility. How about I just let the Congresswoman herself say what I am saying, this was said moths ago... [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qs75zKxJxVY[/media] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1294622497' post='960505'] I don't agree that I am politicizing it, rather I think I am calling attention to an environment that even if this wasnt politically motivated (and the facts are still out) in this instance has been politically motivated on this woman in the past, that it wasnt just this incident she had a brick thrown through her window after her healthcare vote. How many isolated incidents do we need before this stuff becomes a pattern? Was the person who threw a brick through her window just another isolated incident of a nutjob? So then when is it ok to call these people to task? How long do we have to wait until we do? Until the congresswoman (let alone the others who did RIP) is actually dead? Im sorry but I disagree with that. [/quote] Of course you don't think it is politicizing this event. But why did you wait until now to say something about it? And why is it all you want to talk about considering the topic? Why did the Sherrif, who is a Democrat, wait til now to say something? Why did people wait til now to point out and make a big deal out of a map Palin had post last March? The area I live in is predominantly Democrat. The local Republican headquarters was vandalized and defaced several times the past 2 elections. It happens from both sides of the fence. It should stop from both sides. I have grown pretty sick and tired of all the in fighting and polarizing. That's all people want to do anymore is point out their differences. No one wants to build on what we have in common. All people want to do is point fingers at others, because it keeps everyone's eyes off them. Maybe this tragedy will get people to notice we are all humans that has similar goals and interests and stops all of the bullshit that has eroded the foundation of this Country for the past decade. I can only hope and pray. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1294622856' post='960506'] You would be wrong. I have said regardless of party several times. This stuff can not fly. No I dont think Palin was trying to get her killed, I dont think Palin is capeable of thinking, but thats another issue entirely. But with our rights we hold responsibility. How about I just let the Congresswoman herself say what I am saying, this was said moths ago... [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qs75zKxJxVY[/media] [/quote] Cause (an activity or event) to become political in character Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 [quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1294623091' post='960508'] Of course you don't think it is politicizing this event. But why did you wait until now to say something about it? And why is it all you want to talk about considering the topic? Why did the Sherrif, who is a Democrat, wait til now to say something? Why did people wait til now to point out and make a big deal out of a map Palin had post last March? The area I live in is predominantly Democrat. The local Republican headquarters was vandalized and defaced several times the past 2 elections. It happens from both sides of the fence. It should stop from both sides. I have grown pretty sick and tired of all the in fighting and polarizing. That's all people want to do anymore is point out their differences. No one wants to build on what we have in common. All people want to do is point fingers at others, because it keeps everyone's eyes off them. Maybe this tragedy will get people to notice we are all humans that has similar goals and interests and stops all of the bullshit that has eroded the foundation of this Country for the past decade. I can only hope and pray. [/quote] Why did I wait till now? Unless your not paying attention I have been screaming about this vitriol for a while. I never said it didnt happen on both sides of the fence, I even pointed to the black panther types as an example. Did you not read that? I dont have issue with pointing our differences, my issue is the vitriol that has created an environment where folks come to political rallies carrying not just handguns but large firearms, where political candidates are ok with saying if we dont get what we want that we will forgo our political process and use 2nd amendment remedies. Say what you will about political rhetoric, some of this needs to be called to task. We cant just waive it off as first amendment rights.[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1294623383' post='960510'] Cause (an activity or event) to become political in character [/quote] Then it became political when a political person was shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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