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Jerome Simpson says he met with Gruden and has new playbook in hand


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[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1297461787' post='970070']
Does that include you? Or just everyone else?


Here is what we do know. Or at least what has been reported by people that's
job is to find shit out.

People threw shit on his yard.

People booed him.

Bratkowski wasn't an issue with Carson.

People said shit that pissed his old lady off.

His old lady isn't happy in Cincy.

He is building their dream home in California.

He wants to be traded to a West Coast team.

He just had his 3rd child in a little over 2 years.



So knowing those "facts" it is safe to assume a few other things
until Carson comes out and says otherwise.

What do you want, people to not comment or assume shit on
a Bengals message board about the biggest offseason issue
this team faces?
[/quote]

Speculating is one thing.. Going off half cocked and calling his wife a bitch, or saying he has no balls is another... Speculation should involve at least some self doubt. otherwise it isn't speculation, it's acting like you know something you don't.
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[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1297461787' post='970070']
Does that include you? Or just everyone else?


Here is what we do know. Or at least what has been reported by people that's
job is to find shit out.

People threw shit on his yard.

People booed him.

Bratkowski wasn't an issue with Carson.

People said shit that pissed his old lady off.

His old lady isn't happy in Cincy.

He is building their dream home in California.

He wants to be traded to a West Coast team.

He just had his 3rd child in a little over 2 years.



So knowing those "facts" it is safe to assume a few other things
until Carson comes out and says otherwise.

What do you want, people to not comment or assume shit on
a Bengals message board about the biggest offseason issue
this team faces?
[/quote]


I said everyone didn't I?


Of course people will comment. Doesn't mean there's any merit to what they're saying, and any justification for some of the hate filled comments they're making about anyone and everyone involved.
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[quote name='Lucid' timestamp='1297449703' post='970004']
I love how fans get all personal like an athlete owes them something or is somehow betraying them when he decides to walk away.
[/quote]

So you don't think athletes that play professional sports owe fans anything?

Do you also love how fans get all personal and idolize some players, buy posters, jerseys and other
paraphernalia that pertains to said player? And a lot of fans invest a lot more than money into "their" team.

Of course some people feel betrayed. He made a promise to play for this team by signing a contract.
He is someone we have cheered for and wished success upon for almost a decade.
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[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1297462513' post='970075']
So you don't think athletes that play professional sports owe fans anything?

Do you also love how fans get all personal and idolize some players, buy posters, jerseys and other
paraphernalia that pertains to said player? And a lot of fans invest a lot more than money into "their" team.

Of course some people feel betrayed. He made a promise to play for this team by signing a contract.
He is someone we have cheered for and wished success upon for almost a decade.
[/quote]


Betrayed? Really?

Just because you bought his poster or jersey doesn't mean he owes you anything more than what he has already given you on the field.. The contract isn't a document that conveys ownership of a person... It is a deal that states that as long as he wishes to play football, and the Bengals wish for him to play for them, he will not play for any other team.

It's pretty simple.
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[quote name='Lucid' timestamp='1297462042' post='970071']
Speculating is one thing.. Going off half cocked and calling his wife a bitch, or saying he has no balls is another... Speculation should involve at least some self doubt. otherwise it isn't speculation, it's acting like you know something you don't.
[/quote]


I don't think saying that a guy has no balls, when he puts a lot of stock into what his wife thinks
in this situation is speculating. She has him by the balls. Is that better?

And let's get another thing straight, every woman is a bitch to someone.
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[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1297462962' post='970077']
I don't think saying that a guy has no balls, when he puts a lot of stock into what his wife thinks
in this situation is speculating. She has him by the balls. Is that better?

And let's get another thing straight, every woman is a bitch to someone.
[/quote]

Really? So if you value the opinions and feelings of the person you have decided to bind yourself to for life it means you have no balls?


OK.

Quite the catch.
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No idea what is going through his mind. But from my perspective...

I would quit a job I wasn't happy in as long as the following were true:
1) I could still pay my bills..
2) I could provide for my family going forward (kids futures, etc)
3) I knew I could get another job if necessary for 1 and 2

Things that might make me try to stick it out a little while:
4) Great co-workers
5) Great working conditions/perks
6) Great boss
7) Location/where I worked vs where I lived if convenient for me and extended family

So if I were Carson...

1)...YUP
2)...YUP
3)...Likely (doesn't have to be football, but could still be in that arena)

4) Some I'm sure that he will miss if he leaves
5) Nope...
6) Questionable
7) Nope...

SO...in summary, I think he's likely already tried to stick it out a while due to his loyalty to the team, his love of his team and players, pride, etc.
Now he's tired of getting hurt. He's getting older. He likely wants a chance to win big before he retires (if possible, and if not, would rather retire than risk getting hurt and messin up the other areas of his life - watching and enjoying/participating in his kids lives). He has family pressure (and honestly, his family has needs too, and his wife shouldn't have to give up all her wants if she wants to move, especially if he's miserable at home and it affects their happiness.

I don't blame him one bit. And I don't care how he played or didn't play. This to me...is a life decision and I don't want to judge. It's not my life.

Do I think it will hurt us? Maybe...maybe not. I know he has potential, but with the current management, I don't have faith because I think it was partly him and partly his surroundings that created his bad years. New OC...gives me some hope, but if he's as handcuffed as previous likely were...I predict one good year. Either way, this is bigger than any of us, and I wish him well whatever happens.

He's not the greatest, and he's not the worst, and with the right coaching, we can have another good QB lead us to a better year and chance at playoffs. Without the right coaching (including management/scouting/etc)...well I guess it doesn't matter does it?
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[quote name='Lucid' timestamp='1297462757' post='970076']
Betrayed? Really?

Just because you bought his poster or jersey doesn't mean he owes you anything more than what he has already given you on the field.. The contract isn't a document that conveys ownership of a person... It is a deal that states that as long as he wishes to play football, and the Bengals wish for him to play for them, he will not play for any other team.

It's pretty simple.
[/quote]



Yes betrayed.

He owes me more on the field.

Obviously you don't invest a whole lot of emotion and passion into this team.
I do. I root for players and wish them success because of the uniform they wear.
I "go to battle" with them. When they turn their back then yes, it is like being betrayed.

When they go to another team, they become the enemy.

That's how simple it really is.
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[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1297463283' post='970080']
Yes betrayed.

He owes me more on the field.

Obviously you don't invest a whole lot of emotion and passion into this team.
I do. I root for players and wish them success because of the uniform they wear.
[b]I "go to battle" with them.[/b] When they turn their back then yes, it is like being betrayed.

When they go to another team, they become the enemy.

That's how simple it really is.
[/quote]

Really? That is pretty delusional.
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[quote name='Lucid' timestamp='1297463078' post='970078']
Really? So if you value the opinions and feelings of the person you have decided to bind yourself to for life it means you have no balls?


OK.

Quite the catch.
[/quote]


I guess you missed where I amended it by saying "by the balls."
You want to dispute that?

There is a difference between valuing and letting them call the shots.
Obviously her thoughts have a lot of value in this situation or her
name wouldn't be mentioned over and over in reports.

I didn't make these reports, just commented on them.

And yeah, marriages are for life. WTF world do you live in?
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[size="5"][b]Simpson books back[/b]
[/size]By GEOFF HOBSON

Posted 23 minutes ago

[url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/jerome-simpson/6b6ae446-ba34-42a3-91aa-e7dda3c9255a/"][color="#f04e23"]Jerome Simpson[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/color][/url] couldn't wait for Bengals offensive coordinator Jay Gruden to churn out the entire new playbook, so he changed his flight home from the Super Bowl to Cincinnati and got some coming attractions for his efforts this week.

"I'm not going to give it all away," said Simpson after his first session, which he characterized as an informal meeting with receivers coach Mike Sheppard. "The only thing I'm going to give away is it's going to be wide open. We're going to use the personnel and the talent we have. I can see it already and we haven't run a play yet. It's getting set up that we're going to use everybody on this team at every position. From tight ends to wide receivers to running backs."

Simpson displaying his unique brand of pre-Ocho enthusiasm is one of the few constants for the Bengals this offseason. The [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/carson-palmer/b2e2fb04-af84-4af9-9491-5c1dd3354623/"][color="#f04e23"]Carson Palmer[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/color][/url] Saga, or this week's episode known as "House," hangs over everything. Indications are the Bengals are taking Palmer's trade-or-retire threat that emanated apparently from people close to him quite seriously. But they also seem to be sticking by president Mike Brown's adamant declaration of last month that they have no plans to trade him or accept trade proposals. And with no CBA in place, they can't do either starting March 4. Plus, they continue to hope he'll be here as the centerpiece of the new offense.

So does Simpson.

"He's my quarterback. He's my bro. I'll support him and I hope he's our quarterback this year," said Simpson, who still plans to go to California at some point and throw with Palmer. "Everyone wants to throw with Carson. He's one of the elite quarterbacks and I'm going to take advantage of that."

One coaching situation is brewing with assistant secondary coach Louie Cioffi interviewing in Arizona for the secondary job and an announcement could come as soon as Monday with Cioffi seemingly the leading candidate. The Bengals would then be looking for a guy on defense to replace Cioffi's computer wizardry with the game plan as well as assist secondary coach Kevin Coyle.

Meanwhile, Gruden may not know who his quarterback is, but he knows what he wants to run and it looks like he has started with the passing game with the running game to follow next week. When he arrived for work this past Monday, Gruden said he wanted to get the book in his players' hands before a potential March 4 lockout, when all communication between players and teams ceases.

With the Bengals coaching staff headed to the NFL scouting combine Feb. 23, he no doubt would like to get a good portion of it done by then. Simpson liked the looks of what he says is already in a small binder.

"I just got it and, shoot, I was in there less than 40 minutes and I was catching on to it. It's simple, but it's still complex. It's not a kindergarten playbook," he said.

There is concern that a new system is going to cause problems for young receivers like Simpson and rookie tight end [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/jermaine-gresham/66ed6d24-c4c8-45c3-83d8-438594e91723/"][color="#f04e23"]Jermaine Gresham[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/color][/url] and rookie wide receiver [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/jordan-shipley/0f74ae94-e07a-4266-9bf9-c62ea5d54e9c/"][color="#f04e23"]Jordan Shipley[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/color][/url]. It took Simpson three seasons to get used to offensive coordinator Bob Bratkowski's scheme, but when he did and he got the chance to play in it the last three games, he wowed them.

In the win over the Saints, his second NFL start, he racked up his first 100-yard game (124) and his first two touchdowns. The next week in the finale in Baltimore, he did it again (123) on 12 catches that marked the second most receptions in club history. Another TD was the Bengals only score. With every indication wide receivers [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/chad-ochocinco/09ddc7d1-e507-4a75-ab2b-f6f17723cbf8/"][color="#f04e23"]Chad Ochocinco[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/color][/url] and [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/terrell-owens/8f8b4954-cbbc-4bab-a18d-eafc0f2e5086/"][color="#f04e23"]Terrell Owens[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/color][/url] aren't coming back, Simpson is a very big piece of what has suddenly become a roster puzzle. He's confident his tutorial sessions the last few seasons with offensive assistant Dave Lippincott are helping him pick up this system.

"I know if I keep my same regimen with learning, I'll be fine," Simpson said. "I'm catching on with this offense all ready. That's what excites me because it's easy and the way that I've been learning, I'm just going to go out and execute. With Shep and Dave to help me out and staying on my pattern of learning, it comes easy to me now."

Gruden runs a version of the West Coast scheme, which uses words to call pass plays instead of the route running number tree. The one drawback would seem to be that when a play was called in the tree system, every receivers' numbered route was part of the play call. In a lot of versions of the West Coast, the call is for the primary receiver, so the other receivers have to know what they're doing on that play. The upside, it would seem, is that the West Coast routes are pretty standard, while in the number tree there are different versions of each.

But there are different West Coast styles and this is going to have its own stamp. But however it turns out; most West Coast aficionados seem to think receivers won't have problems making a drastic switch. Simpson won't give up the kind of routes Gruden is drawing up, but the M.O. is quick passes that take advantage of yards after catch in the middle of the field. That should help guys with the speed of Simpson and wide receiver [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/andre-caldwell/60736524-1999-49db-b9d2-bb925291219b/"][color="#f04e23"]Andre Caldwell[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/color][/url], as well as the jukes of Gresham.

Simpson says Gruden hasn't mentioned the last two games to him, which is fine. He's starting from scratch.

"(Gruden) is easy to talk to," Simpson said. "I like the fire in him. I love that. I want to build off last year and win a lot more games. It's been in my mind to get this offense in my head. Being at the Super Bowl got me going. I want to be in that position. That's where I want to represent my team and family and make the city of Cincinnati proud."

Simpson likes Gruden's fire because it matches the flame inside him. Once he heard the Bengals were getting a new system, he said he couldn't think of much else. He said he walked out of that first meeting with Sheppard sweating a little bit with excitement.

"I'm ready," he said. "I can't wait to get out there."

Simpson has plans to work out at the API complex in Arizona starting in mid-March, where he says he'll get the full complement of workouts in the gym and on the field catching balls and running routes. Until then he's throwing the ball around with his brother in North Carolina.

"And I'm running to keep my wind up," he said. "I hate feeling out of shape."

Now he's got some reading, too.





[url="http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Simpson-books-back/b6a11dd2-98e7-4b54-b665-78f034a92a36"]http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Simpson-books-back/b6a11dd2-98e7-4b54-b665-78f034a92a36[/url]
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[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1297463830' post='970083']
I guess you missed where I amended it by saying "by the balls."
You want to dispute that?

There is a difference between valuing and letting them call the shots.
Obviously her thoughts have a lot of value in this situation or her
name wouldn't be mentioned over and over in reports.

I didn't make these reports, just commented on them.

And yeah, marriages are for life. WTF world do you live in?
[/quote]


[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1297463925' post='970084']
Why do you keep saying really? Do you think I am saying shit for the fun of it?

It was a metaphor. Notice the quotes around the words? Yeah. Really.
[/quote]


I use the word to convey astonishment... As in "Did I really just read that insane bullshit?"

And I don't recall questioning the length of marriage.. In fact I believe I stated it as fact, so I guess the answer would be; an earily similar world to the one you live in (minus the delusions).

And I don't recall reading anywhere that Carson loves it here but his "bitch of a wife" is making him quit... All I have seen is assertion that his wife is tired of living here, which is then speculated to mean she would also like him to not be here as well...

But I guess in your world the opinion and happiness of your wife/family should be kept seperate from any decision making process or else you might as well just chop 'em off and hand them over?

Not that I am disputing your right to feel this way, just intrigued.
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[quote]"I'm not going to give it all away," said Simpson after his first session, which he characterized as an informal meeting with receivers coach Mike Sheppard. "The only thing I'm going to give away is it's going to be wide open. We're going to use the personnel and the talent we have. I can see it already and we haven't run a play yet. It's getting set up that we're going to use everybody on this team at every position. From tight ends to wide receivers to running backs."[/quote]

:bengalscheer:

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[quote name='scharm' timestamp='1297431581' post='969911']
LOL, Carson gets hit in the NFL. Shocker! Poor guy.
[/quote]


exactly. i cant stand him, but no qb was sacked more on a per game basis than ben roethlisberger. didnt seem to effect him. he pulls his ass up off the carpet and wins games. spare on the fact that he is a different type of qb or that they lost the super bowl(nothing made me happier), he gets it done. carson does not. thats a fact.
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[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1297464296' post='970086']
nope.
[/quote]


So Pro athletes owe fans nothing?

Then why do athletes thank their fans? And do charity work ect?

I would think everyone would agree that pro athletes owe the fans something.
Whether it be loyalty, to carry themselves like a professional, something.

Why do people get upset when players get arrested, won't sign autographs, won't
interact with the "common man" and stuff like that?

[quote name='Lucid' timestamp='1297464476' post='970087']
I use the word to convey astonishment... As in "Did I really just read that insane bullshit?"

And I don't recall questioning the length of marriage.. In fact I believe I stated it as fact, so I guess the answer would be; an earily similar world to the one you live in (minus the delusions).

And I don't recall reading anywhere that Carson loves it here but his "bitch of a wife" is making him quit... All I have seen is assertion that his wife is tired of living here, which is then speculated to mean she would also like him to not be here as well...

But I guess in your world the opinion and happiness of your wife/family should be kept seperate from any decision making process or else you might as well just chop 'em off and hand them over?

Not that I am disputing your right to feel this way, just intrigued.
[/quote]


You're not disputing it, you're just labeling it as insane. Ummmm, thanks.

I guess in your World, no guy is pussy whipped, has someone that has them
by the balls or anything like that. Because just the thought of that is insane.

You said "bind yourself to for life". That sir, is putting a length to it and is indeed not a fact.
And you have the audacity to call me delusional, more than once even. lol


Actually Mr Lucid, in my case experience trumps assumptions. You have taken what I have said
as an attack on Mr Palmer and his lovely wife. The fact is, I too am being held by the balls.
I don't have $50 million on the table over the next 4 years though. Just live in a place I hate
to stay with the person I love and my kids away from a place I love and other people I love.

Again, if her opinion and feelings didn't matter much, her name and her opinion and feelings
wouldn't have been mentioned. So people mentioning her in posts and having Carson by
the balls seems to have merit. And even if it has no merit, it by no means is insane to think
and state as much.
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[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1297514747' post='970162']
So Pro athletes owe fans nothing?

Then why do athletes thank their fans? And do charity work ect?

I would think everyone would agree that pro athletes owe the fans something.
Whether it be loyalty, to carry themselves like a professional, something.


[/quote]


because they choose to and are probably decent people.


That doesn't mean they have to do it. Many don't, and I'm sure you couldn't name the ones who don't, because its not a big deal.


They don't owe fans anything. the fans don't pay them, the fans aren't their bosses. Sure its great that they thank fans for the support every now and then, but its not because they owe it to them. Carson only owes anything to his family, the organization, and his teammates.


Just read some of the crap in any of these threads said about Palmer and ask yourself why Carson should owe those people anything?



[quote]Why do people get upset when players get arrested, won't sign autographs, won't
interact with the "common man" and stuff like that? [/quote]



not quite sure why this is part of your argument.


Just because fans have an attachment to players and care about what they do on and off the field does not create any obligation by the player to owe fans anything.


I'm willing to bet the one thing players hate most about the job (outside of practice) is the unwanted celebrity status. Most would probably just love to play the game, have fun, and get paid and not worry about the media/fans, etc...
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[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1297520289' post='970175']
because they choose to and are probably decent people.

That doesn't mean they have to do it. Many don't, and I'm sure you couldn't name the ones who don't, because its not a big deal.


They don't owe fans anything. the fans don't pay them, the fans aren't their bosses. Sure its great that they thank fans for the support every now and then, but its not because they owe it to them. Carson only owes anything to his family, the organization, and his teammates.


Just read some of the crap in any of these threads said about Palmer and ask yourself why Carson should owe those people anything?

not quite sure why this is part of your argument.


Just because fans have an attachment to players and care about what they do on and off the field does not create any obligation by the player to owe fans anything.


I'm willing to bet the one thing players hate most about the job (outside of practice) is the unwanted celebrity status. Most would probably just love to play the game, have fun, and get paid and not worry about the media/fans, etc...
[/quote]

You sound like Barry Bonds.

How in the hell do you think the NFL has the money to pay players like Palmer?
It's because of the fans. Watching on TV, attending games, buying merchandise ect.
Without the fans, the money they are given wouldn't exsist. They wouldn't be getting paid.
Fans make professional sports possible. That's why a lot of pros do the things they do.
Because they realize who really butters their bread.

Whatever though. I am thankful that a lot of athletes don't share your views.
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[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1297521693' post='970183']
You sound like Barry Bonds.

How in the hell do you think the NFL has the money to pay players like Palmer?
It's because of the fans. Watching on TV, attending games, buying merchandise ect.
Without the fans, the money they are given wouldn't exsist. They wouldn't be getting paid.
Fans make professional sports possible. That's why a lot of pros do the things they do.
Because they realize who really butters their bread.

Whatever though. I am thankful that a lot of athletes don't share your views.
[/quote]


the players don't get their money from the fans.


I'm thankful that they're thankful too. That means they're good dudes. They don't owe me or you anything though, especially considering the way most of them get treated by the fans and media.
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[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1297521843' post='970185']
the players don't get their money from the fans.


I'm thankful that they're thankful too. That means they're good dudes. They don't owe me or you anything though, especially considering the way most of them get treated by the fans and media.
[/quote]



The money they get is from fans. Do you think MB paid Carson from his own money?
No, he paid him with revenue. Revenue is generated from fans.Even TV revenue is
generated from fans. If people aren't watching, revenue would be low. It is really
simple to comprehend.

Most are treated great by fans and media. Carson has had people name their kids after him.
Never had anything really bad said about him by fans, or the media. Hell, some people used
to call him Superman and say he was made of teflon. And his family is set for life.

Whoa, how horrible.

And are you saying you're not a good dude? Because you don't think athletes owe fans anything.
Most athletes know they do. The one's that aren't "good dudes" don't.
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[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1297522300' post='970188']
Most are treated great by fans and media. Carson has had people name their kids after him.
[b]Never had anything really bad said about him by fans, or the media. [/b]Hell, some people used
to call him Superman and say he was made of teflon. And his family is set for life.

Whoa, how horrible.

[/quote]

have you not been reading the boards over the last month? :lol:


[quote]

And are you saying you're not a good dude? Because you don't think athletes owe fans anything.
Most athletes know they do. The one's that aren't "good dudes" don't.
[/quote]


what does me being a good dude have to do with anything?


The players don't owe me anything. They are pieces in a form of entertainment.


I don't go through life acting as if people owe me something.


This discussion isn't going to go anywhere.

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[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1297522597' post='970191']
have you not been reading the boards over the last month? :lol:

what does me being a good dude have to do with anything?


The players don't owe me anything. They are pieces in a form of entertainment.


I don't go through life acting as if people owe me something.


This discussion isn't going to go anywhere.
[/quote]



Of course I have been reading the board. That is coming from fans that idolized
Carson and shit. They feel betrayed. But I haven't seen the media say anything
bad about him really. Quite the contrary actually.

Because you keep saying the players that act like they owe fans something are
good dudes.

I don't go through life acting like people owe me anything either. I think you
have entitlement confused with expectations.

I admit I was disappointed when I went to Georgetown and some players
never bothered to take the time to interact with fans. Most players get it though.
If I owned a team, I would make it mandatory that all players "get it".


Do any discussions here go anywhere when two people disagree?

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[quote name='Lucid' timestamp='1297449703' post='970004']
:shrug:

Maybe he would like to see his children graduate before hip replacement surgery, or give his grand kids "horsey" rides......

I love how fans get all personal like an athlete owes them something or is somehow betraying them when he decides to walk away.
[/quote]


just walking away signifies retirement, which should be any athlete's decision. just walking away to another team takes on a whole different meaning, and it's bullshit to equate the two with the same argument. i don't blame mike for not tolerating that request.

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