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*UPDATED THREAD TITLE* Free Agency thread


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[quote name='texbengal' timestamp='1331512990' post='1104399']
I'm sure they've reached out to him before, and given the lack of good safeties in FA left (Landry, who will be expensive, has injury issues, and gets hurt a lot besides; and Dwight Lowery is pretty good, but Reggie is better) and the relative lack of good safeties coming out (you have Barron and Smith, and not a lot else), Reggie and his agent probably figure they have a big payday coming.

The Bengals have a feel for what Reggie is looking for, and obviously this is a last attempt to ink him before FA starts. If their offer is not enough, he will test the market and (maybe) they'll continue to talk. One thing we know about the Bengals is they have a sense for what they'll pay and if it's out of whack vs what the player is looking for, they won't play. I think their logic is, OK, safety class is weak, but we aren't gonna overpay you because of it, and besides, you aren't that much better than the young guys we have. So Reggie, go for it, and if you get tha huge payday, have at it. And if not, come back and we wil talk some more. And I'm sure that's the same approach they've taken with the others that they want to retain but haven't signed. Some will sign, and others won't... and they seem to be OK with that.

I like Reggie and think he's an above average safety, but I wouldn't break the bank for him. I don't see him as a "must sign" like I did JJoe last year, and because I don't see the practices, the other guys may be more ready than I think.
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Two things...

Break the bank - we're 60 million under with no starting safety on our roster. You can count Crocker but if he's starting again, we may be in trouble. I can't understand the money issue many of you keep talking about. The cap will go up also in the forthcoming years because of the television revenue (from my understanding).

Young guys - yes, I sure hope like heck they looked good.
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[quote name='Tigris' timestamp='1331513251' post='1104401']
Two things...

Break the bank - we're 60 million under with no starting safety on our roster. You can count Crocker but if he's starting again, we may be in trouble. I can't understand the money issue many of you keep talking about. The cap will go up also in the forthcoming years because of the television revenue (from my understanding).

Young guys - yes, I sure hope like heck they looked good.
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You dont break the bank on a mediocre player...Hell for all we know right now we are offering 5, but he wants 6 a year. Maybe he goes into FA and the best offer he gets is 3 mil a year and we get him back for less then our original offer.

I want Nelson back too, but at the right price. There will be ways to fill that FS spot if we have to.
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[quote name='JBandJoeyV' timestamp='1331513943' post='1104403']


You dont break the bank on a mediocre player...Hell for all we know right now we are offering 5, but he wants 6 a year. Maybe he goes into FA and the best offer he gets is 3 mil a year and we get him back for less then our original offer.

I want Nelson back too, but at the right price. There will be ways to fill that FS spot if we have to.
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But there is no bank to be broken! We're in a position to spend lavishly. In my opinion, if you have to overpay for a guy who tremendously helped take your team to the playoffs, you overpay him... especially with our payroll situation.

This isn't even mentioning other factors like who's left on our team if he leaves.
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[quote name='JBandJoeyV' timestamp='1331513943' post='1104403']


You dont break the bank on a mediocre player...Hell for all we know right now we are offering 5, but he wants 6 a year. Maybe he goes into FA and the best offer he gets is 3 mil a year and we get him back for less then our original offer.

I want Nelson back too, but at the right price. There will be ways to fill that FS spot if we have to.




[/quote]


Why did hell didn't we tag him for 6 mil then.
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[quote name='SocalBengalEd' timestamp='1331514476' post='1104410']
Why did hell didn't we tag him for 6 mil then.
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Maybe the Bengals wanted to pay using escalators and incentives instead of guaranteed money? He might get just as much money with this type of contract as he would have in a Franchise tag, BUT he has to earn it.
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The team seems to be lowballing Nelson since they are waiting til the day before free agency to negotiate. I wouldn't be surprised if he goes to the Dolphins, especially if they don't get Manning. Our backup free safety is Jeromy Miles who is mainly a special teamer. We really need to re-sign Nelson and upgrade from Crocker. If Nelson leaves, I'd expect Clements to move to FS, assuming Hall is healthy for the start of the season.
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[quote name='SocalBengalEd' timestamp='1331514476' post='1104410']
Why did hell didn't we tag him for 6 mil then.
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Maybe cause we knew at the end of the day we would be able to sign him to a longer term deal for a couple mil less then 6? I dont know for sure, but I'll let it play out before I start accusing this team of doing something stupid.
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[quote name='sparky151' timestamp='1331514580' post='1104412']
The team seems to be lowballing Nelson since they are waiting til the day before free agency to negotiate. I wouldn't be surprised if he goes to the Dolphins, especially if they don't get Manning. Our backup free safety is Jeromy Miles who is mainly a special teamer. We really need to re-sign Nelson and upgrade from Crocker. If Nelson leaves, I'd expect Clements to move to FS, assuming Hall is healthy for the start of the season.
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No one said they waited till Monday to negotiate, all it says is that they are going to offer him a deal tomorrow. It doesnt mean they havent been talking/negotiating this whole time.
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[quote name='SocalBengalEd' timestamp='1331514729' post='1104415']
Nelson the best out there, he had a heck of a year for us and there is no one at there in free agency or the draft to replace him with. And don't say Crocker ,Mays or Sands because right now they are all downgrades from Nelson.
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Once again, let me preface this by saying I like reggie and want to bring him back.

But to say he had a heck of a year or is irreplaceable, I just dont really agree with. He doesnt offer much in run D IMO. He is decent in coverage and is the best FS we have for sure.

I hope they get it done though, but once again im not breaking any bank or paying him a lot more then he deserves because it could hamper you in future years.
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[quote name='B.A.B.' timestamp='1331511443' post='1104388']
Just the vibe the whole situation is giving me. Its happened in the past. I forget who, but I remember a FA was really just disgusted at the offer we gave em.The fact that we haven't had any real conversations over it makes it seem like we're not really seeing it as a priority when [b]he really is our top FA.[/b]
[/quote]


people say that, but I don't really see it as true. Nelson's talent has very much gotten overblown lately.

I'd much rather have collins or sims back over nelson if I had to choose.
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[quote name='Tigris' timestamp='1331514152' post='1104404']
[b]But there is no bank to be broken! We're in a position to spend lavishly. [/b]In my opinion, if you have to overpay for a guy who tremendously helped take your team to the playoffs, you overpay him... especially with our payroll situation.

This isn't even mentioning other factors like who's left on our team if he leaves.
[/quote]


that's a horrible way to view it. Just because you have the money to spend doesn't mean you frivolously overpay for average things.


His backups are certainly unproven, but people really need to get it out of their head that Reggie Nelson is the type of player a team can't recover from losing. He's a slightly above average safety. He wouldn't look nearly as good to fans if what he had replaced had not been utter crap.
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[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1331515206' post='1104419']


people say that, but I don't really see it as true. Nelson's talent has very much gotten overblown lately.

I'd much rather have collins or sims back over nelson if I had to choose.
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I think hes our top FA. But once again, he isnt irreplaceable. If some team wants to pay him 7 mil a year, fuck it, let him go. I dont think we have to match whatever he gets just because we have the money.
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[url="http://forum.go-bengals.com/index.php?app=forums&module=forums&section=findpost&pid=1104426"][img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_images/GoBengals_3_2/snapback.png[/img][/url]Bengals1181, on 11 March 2012 - 09:26 PM, said:



quality player who can play both tackle spots if needed and if was willing could probably be a good guard? Gee, what was I thinking.


Tigris is right. Collins is more easily replaceable than Nelson or Sims. Sims is more replaceable than Nelson. We could get some other team's former starting tackle to replace Collins and be fine. Tony Ugoh frex.
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[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1331515606' post='1104426']



quality player who can play both tackle spots if needed and if was willing could probably be a good guard? Gee, what was I thinking.
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You are gonna lose this argument. Nelson was a starter and the best player in the secondary. Collins started what one game . Sims was a quality back up but nothing more.
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[quote name='SocalBengalEd' timestamp='1331517771' post='1104436']
You are gonna lose this argument. Nelson was a starter and the best player in the secondary. Collins started what one game . Sims was a quality back up but nothing more.
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maybe collins, but you'd be hardpressed to make a winning argument of nelson vs sims.


People are seriously over-valuing Nelson. Nice player, but not one to lose sleep over.
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[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1331515606' post='1104426']

quality player who can play both tackle spots if needed and if was willing could probably be a good guard? Gee, what was I thinking.
[/quote]

But he's not willing to olay guard or can't play guard because if he could, he would have, and there is a chance he doesn't see more than 4-5 snaps a game all season.

You're telling me you'd rather have that guy instead of a defensive starter who played nearly every snap?

Okay.
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[quote name='Tigris' timestamp='1331519419' post='1104439']
But he's not willing to olay guard or can't play guard because if he could, he would have, and there is a chance he doesn't see more than 4-5 snaps a game all season.

You're telling me you'd rather have that guy instead of a defensive starter who played nearly every snap?

Okay.
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I'd rather have both.


judging by the fact that the Bengals have 2 starting olinemen and 2 top backups as free agents, yes I'd very much like to have collins back. It saves you a draft pick, and also provides you with a lot of insurance considering andre smith is entering a contract year.

Nelson is a nice safety, but he's not anything special and is going to be overpaid for his services as it is, whether its here or somewhere else. For every interception against seattle, there was a TD or other big play given up against jacksonville. Let's stop treating nelson like Ed Reed just because he's better than the ohalete, hebert, crocker, and kaesviharn's of the world.
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[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1331517912' post='1104437']

maybe collins, but you'd be hardpressed to make a winning argument of nelson vs sims.


People are seriously over-valuing Nelson. Nice player, but not one to lose sleep over.
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The thing is, who the fuck would we replace him with who wouldn't be worse than Crocker? He's not over-valued. There are no good safeties out there. Not even in the draft. We need to keep him because if we don't, we'll have someone considerably worse STARTING at his position. The other guys are back-ups.
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And in a defense that is losing people already, where we have weak links at the LB and CB, we do not need another spot where we have to worry about getting a replacement. That would be dumb. Our backups can gtfo. And signing any of them shouldn't impact what we do with Nelson.
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[quote name='B.A.B.' timestamp='1331522491' post='1104447']
The thing is, who the fuck would we replace him with who wouldn't be worse than Crocker? He's not over-valued. There are no good safeties out there. Not even in the draft. We need to keep him because if we don't, we'll have someone considerably worse STARTING at his position. The other guys are back-ups.[/quote]

Landry wouldn't be worse than crocker if he can stay on the field but he'd more than likely be overpaid
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[quote name='unleashed' timestamp='1331522593' post='1104450']
Landry wouldn't be worse than crocker if he can stay on the field but he'd more than likely be overpaid
[/quote]
I'd have to hear something about a workout from him or something. Those pics that came out of him a few weeks back were retarded. He got way too big
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