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Trayvon Martin Thread


MichaelWeston

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[quote name='The PatternMaster' timestamp='1333033330' post='1113466']

You realize Zimmerman was NOT officially apart of the neighborhood watch in his community. He was the SELF APPOINTED captain of the watch. No neighborhood watch association in the country is supposed to carry firearms, I know this because I'm apart of one in my subdivision. There role is to WATCH, which is why they are called the neighborhood watch, and then alert the authorities if they see suspicious activity. This is taken from the National Neighborhood Watch Institue's homepage:



[url="http://www.nnwi.org/"]http://www.nnwi.org/[/url]

The fact that Zimmerman purposely followed Martin and at some point got of his car with the intention of confronting Martin after being told not to do so should prove to anyone without bias that he was the institigator in this situation. Just because you pick a fight with someone and you get beat up, doesn't give you the justification to shoot that person. It's not self defense, it's murder. Common sense will tell you that.
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You have no idea if he had the intention of confronting Martin.
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[quote name='Tigers Johnson' timestamp='1333035760' post='1113478']
IMO....

The fact of the matter is Treyvon was no saint, but Zimmerman caused the situation by even getting out of his car...

I am being honest... Do neighborhood watches teach people to confront those who are suspicious? My guess would be no....

Zimmerman was trying to play cop and it ended horribly...
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Should not have followed him in his car, should not have had a gun, should not have gotten out of the car. I think it might end up being something closer to negligence then murder. I agree that if he admits that if he got out to confront him then the self defense stance gets weaker. However I don't think he will ever admit that. My guess is he got out to see where he went and got jumped. Afterall the police that he called were coming.
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[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1333036239' post='1113484']
My guess is he got out to see where he went and got jumped. Afterall the police that he called were coming.
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My guess is he got out and attempted to hold him until the police got there.

Either way he was being followed by someone he didn't know in a car who then got out the car and approached him. At this point he has a right to protect himself from this unknown person.
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[quote name='The PatternMaster' timestamp='1333033330' post='1113466']
You realize Zimmerman was NOT officially apart of the neighborhood watch in his community. He was the SELF APPOINTED captain of the watch.
[/quote]

Nope. I didn't realize that. I appreciate the information. I'll have to look further into that.
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[quote name='Vol_Bengal' timestamp='1333038439' post='1113498']

Nope. I didn't realize that. I appreciate the information. I'll have to look further into that.
[/quote]


I am pretty sure he was a member of the neighborhood watch but as a member appointed himself as the captain.
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I just read the complete transcript of the 911 call... there was a lot made out that he chased the kid "after the dispatcher told him not too..." and that isn't accurate at all. He intended to follow the kid because "these assholes they always get away..." but when the dispatcher tells him to stop following he does stop.

And, based on the training he, and 3 other folks received for the neighborhood watch program, from the Sanford PD... even though he had a carry permit he should not have had the gun on him or left the vehicle. Still have no idea how the confrontation occurred... only thing you know is that he got out of the car, intending to follow the kid, loses the kid, dispatcher tells him not to, he stops, and sets up where to meet the police when they arrive.

Everything after that is witness testimony.
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[quote name='gatorclaws' timestamp='1333040815' post='1113517']

How do you come to that conclusion?
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He would have been home. He was only there because he was suspended. And I really don't mean to blame the kid based on that. But it seems that its fair game to blame Zimmerman for making bad choices.
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[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1333041017' post='1113519']

He would have been home. He was only there because he was suspended. And I really don't mean to blame the kid based on that. But it seems that its fair game to blame Zimmerman for making bad choices.
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It happened at 7:00-7:30pm, a time where many kids are outside. Sure, he may not have been in that neighborhood but let's not act like he was out at 3:00am getting into trouble because he didn't have school the next day.
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[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1333041017' post='1113519']

He would have been home. He was only there because he was suspended. And I really don't mean to blame the kid based on that. But it seems that its fair game to blame Zimmerman for making bad choices.
[/quote]

You do realize that it is better to be assumed to be a fool, than to post and remove all doubt.
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[quote name='kennethmw' timestamp='1333041655' post='1113525']

You do realize that it is better to be assumed to be a fool, than to post and remove all doubt.
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The board is much better with this troll on ignore, after reading his post here and when he suggested we trade for Santana Moss because he's about to get cut, :facepalm: , I'm convinced this character is trolling because no one can be this stupid and still operate a computer.

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[quote name='gatorclaws' timestamp='1333041456' post='1113522']

It happened at 7:00-7:30pm, a time where many kids are outside. Sure, he may not have been in that neighborhood but let's not act like he was out at 3:00am getting into trouble because he didn't have school the next day.
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I am pretty sure he didnt even live in that city. He was there because he was suspended.

[quote name='kennethmw' timestamp='1333041655' post='1113525']

You do realize that it is better to be assumed to be a fool, than to post and remove all doubt.
[/quote]

Adults are talking

[quote name='The PatternMaster' timestamp='1333042364' post='1113528']

The board is much better with this troll on ignore, after reading his post here and when he suggested we trade for Santana Moss because he's about to get cut, :facepalm: , I'm convinced this character is trolling because no one can be this stupid and still operate a computer.
[/quote]

You keep posting your opinions stated as facts and getting the facts wrong.

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Considering Zimmerman's previous arrests--2 of the 3 involved violence--I think it fair to hypothesize that he's probably a troublemaker. Thankfully, this time his Daddy won't be able to quash it.

As a matter of societal structure: Create a "wild west" environment and get tragic results all the way around.
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[quote name='Homer_Rice' timestamp='1333043696' post='1113541']
Considering Zimmerman's previous arrests--2 of the 3 involved violence--I think it fair to hypothesize that he's probably a troublemaker. Thankfully, this time his Daddy won't be able to quash it.

As a matter of societal structure: Create a "wild west" environment and get tragic results all the way around.
[/quote]

How often would this happen if eveyrone was armed?
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[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1333043049' post='1113532']

I am pretty sure he didnt even live in that city. He was there because he was suspended.

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the only way the suspension should be used is if you are trying to make a point on Trayvon's character. so he was in the wrong place at the wrong time, it's pretty weak to make that arguement. You're getting into some butterfly effect shit

maybe the clerk where he bought the skittles took too long to ring him up. If he worked a little faster, Trayvon wouldn't have been seen by Zimmerman. I blame the clerk.

The reason why Trayvon was there, whether Zimmerman was part of the neighborhood watch, the rules of the neighborhood watch, the botched police investigation, etc have no bearing on the case in my mind. All that matters is what happened during the altercation. If Zimmerman wasn't defending himself from percieved imminent death after he was attacked, he is a murderer. So far nothing shows Zimmerman needed to use deadly force.
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[quote name='gatorclaws' timestamp='1333044158' post='1113545']

the only way the suspension should be used is if you are trying to make a point on Trayvon's character. so he was in the wrong place at the wrong time, it's pretty weak to make that arguement. You're getting into some butterfly effect shit

maybe the clerk where he bought the skittles took too long to ring him up. If he worked a little faster, Trayvon wouldn't have been seen by Zimmerman. I blame the clerk.

The reason why Trayvon was there, whether Zimmerman was part of the neighborhood watch, the rules of the neighborhood watch, the botched police investigation, etc have no bearing on the case in my mind. All that matters is what happened during the altercation. If Zimmerman wasn't defending himself from percieved imminent death after he was attacked, he is a murderer. So far nothing shows Zimmerman needed to use deadly force.
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"percieved imminent death"

Is all that is going to matter. It would be tought to prove his mindset.

If you see someone in your neighborhood who looks suspicious. Maybe they are looking into your neighbors windows or something, and you approach them, and they attack you....what are your rights? Me approaching someone does not give them the right to attack me.

Some people are reading this as if I am saying Zimmerman is innocent. In fact I am saying I have no idea either way. And neither do you.

[quote name='Homer_Rice' timestamp='1333044341' post='1113547']
More often than if no one were armed.
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They are trying to pass conceal carry for bars. I can't imagine a worse idea.
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[quote name='gatorclaws' timestamp='1333044158' post='1113545']
the only way the suspension should be used is if you are trying to make a point on Trayvon's character. so he was in the wrong place at the wrong time, it's pretty weak to make that arguement. You're getting into some butterfly effect shit
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Well... technically speaking... he went to school in Miami, FL. The only reason he was in Sanford, Fl, which is north of Orlando was him being either at his aunt's or his father's... and it occurred I believe more around the 10:30-11:00 timeframe on a school night.

No suspension and he's in Miami... only trying to clear that up. In no way am I trying to pass judgement one way or the other.

[quote name='Ron~Popeil' timestamp='1333045117' post='1113555']
I will withhold judgement either way until all the facts are in. There are a lot of people in the media and politics that should do the same.
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x1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
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[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1333044919' post='1113554']

"percieved imminent death"

Is all that is going to matter. It would be tought to prove his mindset.

If you see someone in your neighborhood who looks suspicious. Maybe they are looking into your neighbors windows or something, and you approach them, and they attack you....what are your rights? Me approaching someone does not give them the right to attack me.

Some people are reading this as if I am saying Zimmerman is innocent. In fact I am saying I have no idea either way. And neither do you.



They are trying to pass conceal carry for bars. I can't imagine a worse idea.
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i agree it's impossible to prove a mindset which is why no charges have been filed. As the person with the gun I think Zimmerman needs to be held to a higher standard and should be able to prove self defense is reasonable. His injuries do not suggest he was in danger. If Trayvon was going for his gun, that tells me Zimmerman pulled the gun first and Trayvon was the one acting under self defense. If the weapon was concealed, Trayvon wouldn't have known it was there and wouldn't have gone after it.

in your scenario, i think it matters a lot if you had a gun drawn. Do we know if Zimmerman did? If a non police officer approaches you with a gun aimed at you in the dark, I think you have the right to protect yourself.
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[quote name='gatorclaws' timestamp='1333045511' post='1113564']

i agree it's impossible to prove a mindset which is why no charges have been filed. As the person with the gun I think Zimmerman needs to be held to a higher standard and should be able to prove self defense is reasonable. His injuries do not suggest he was in danger. If Trayvon was going for his gun, that tells me Zimmerman pulled the gun first and Trayvon was the one acting under self defense. If the weapon was concealed, Trayvon wouldn't have known it was there and wouldn't have gone after it.

in your scenario, i think it matters a lot if you had a gun drawn. Do we know if Zimmerman did? If a non police officer approaches you with a gun aimed at you in the dark, I think you have the right to protect yourself.
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Absolutely. But it would be much smarter to run. If I go home tonight and there is a kid behind my house and I ask him what he is doing and he attacks me what do I do? Or your my neighbor and I see some guy in your back yard and ask him what he is doing or even follow him. Zimmerman is not guilty just because he got out of his car, he is not even guilty just because he approached the guy.
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[quote name='Vol_Bengal' timestamp='1333045443' post='1113560']

Well... technically speaking... he went to school in Miami, FL. The only reason he was in Sanford, Fl, which is north of Orlando was him being either at his aunt's or his father's... and it occurred I believe more around the 10:30-11:00 timeframe on a school night.

No suspension and he's in Miami... only trying to clear that up. In no way am I trying to pass judgement one way or the other.

x1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
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I've read he was declared dead at 7:30pm. I just don't see how the city matters. This could have happened in any city. If his dad bought skittles on the last grocery trip he wouldn't have been outside either. There's a billion different would have/could haves that would put Trayvon or Zimmerman in a different place that night.
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