Jamie_B Posted June 27, 2012 Report Share Posted June 27, 2012 [quote name='T-Dub' timestamp='1340839655' post='1136978'] What confuses me is why, for so many people, the idea of welfare fraud is such a huge issue, yet corporate America can take enormous bailouts and defraud people on a colossal scale and it's more or less accepted as business as usual. It's ok for someone like GE to not pay taxes, the Republican presidential candidate can outsource jobs and have offshore tax shelters, but God forbid a single mother somewhere should get an extra $50 in food stamps! [i]Then[/i] it's time to get pissed! [/quote] Because we have this absurd notion that these people create jobs. They don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted June 27, 2012 Report Share Posted June 27, 2012 [quote name='T-Dub' timestamp='1340839655' post='1136978'] What confuses me is why, for so many people, the idea of welfare fraud is such a huge issue, yet corporate America can take enormous bailouts and defraud people on a colossal scale and it's more or less accepted as business as usual. It's ok for someone like GE to not pay taxes, the Republican presidential candidate can outsource jobs and have offshore tax shelters, but God forbid a single mother somewhere should get an extra $50 in food stamps! [i]Then[/i] it's time to get pissed! [/quote] A man steals your pension and he can get enough money to stay out of jail. You walk in and steal his office chair and you are going to jail. [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340840526' post='1136981'] Because we have this absurd notion that these people create jobs. They don't. [/quote] And that these people are what we should be trying to be. I cant tell you how many times lately I have heard that its not ok to question how someone makes their money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted June 27, 2012 Report Share Posted June 27, 2012 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1340840905' post='1136982'] And that these people are what we should be trying to be. [/quote] That too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 [quote name='Lucid' timestamp='1340751883' post='1136813'] The reality is, everyone is "socialist" to some degree or another.. I'm not sure why it has become such a dirty word.. Any program the government involves itself in in order to shape or benefit society is a "socialist" endeavor. Publicly funded police, fire, sewer, trash, schooling etc... Are all "socialist" concepts. The only difference is what programs does the individual think should be taken on as a public and shared burden in order for it be provided as a function of our society. Most people would agree the social services I listed are not only desirable but absolutely necessary.. But they weren't always so. There was a time where if you wanted them you had to pay for them. If you didn't have the loot.. Tough shit. [/quote] Also I would argue what folks think of as one of the hallmarks of socialism, taxing the rich a higher amount is actually from the father of Capitalism Adam Smith. [size=4][color=#333333]"It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more in proportion."[/color][/size] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enon Bengal Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340584069' post='1136583'] I would argue that China and Germany's trade policies are more like what ours used to be, and that if we could get back to doing what they are doing, or doing what we used to do, we could look at fixing the (x-m) part of that formula and perhaps we wouldnt need to increase the G. So when Clinton had a surplus and was paying down the debit that was just in my imagination? [/quote] We've had deficit spending every year since 1970 and you cherry pick one four year window. What exactly is your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 [quote name='Enon Bengal' timestamp='1340907850' post='1137091'] We've had deficit spending every year since 1970 and you cherry pick one four year window. What exactly is your point? [/quote] That when done properly you can get a surplus and pay down the debit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Lucid| Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340909222' post='1137092'] That when done properly you can get a surplus and pay down the debit. [/quote] Why do you continue to insist on writing "debit" for debt? I know you understand the difference in spelling, and I know it's not an accident because you never fail to spell it the same way. A "debit" is the application of a negative to an account - a withdrawl, etc that is a negative to the balance.. "Debt" is what happens when your debits > credits, and you end up with a negative on the ledger. Is it some form of rebellion, where you insist on doing it wrong because changing it would mean admission of being wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 [quote name='Lucid' timestamp='1340910858' post='1137096'] Why do you continue to insist on writing "debit" for debt? I know you understand the difference in spelling, and I know it's not an accident because you never fail to spell it the same way. A "debit" is the application of a negative to an account - a withdrawl, etc that is a negative to the balance.. "Debt" is what happens when your debits > credits, and you end up with a negative on the ledger. Is it some form of rebellion, where you insist on doing it wrong because changing it would mean admission of being wrong? [/quote] Fast typing, dont proofread, informal discussion, not worried about proofreading. I think most get the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sois Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340911283' post='1137097'] Fast typing, dont proofread, informal discussion, not worried about proofreading. I think most get the point. [/quote] haahah in this case, it's important to use the right word. You're still doing this? ahahahahhhaahah debit just write dett, it's rather see that than debit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Elflocko| Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340911283' post='1137097'] Fast typing, dont proofread, informal discussion, not worried about proofreading. I think most get the point. [/quote] I swear I'm going to put in a word filter for that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Elflocko' timestamp='1340929642' post='1137130'] I swear I'm going to put in a word filter for that... [/quote] Every time Jamie misspells a word, make it say "I love Jerome *fat fuck fat fuck* Bettis. He will love that. And secretly guys, just FYI....Jamie is a Steelers fan[color=#ff0000].[/color] He tries to hide behind his Washington DC shield, but I can smell the BO stench of a Steelers fan a mile away. Don't be fooled....he's been trolling us all this time. He wants to procreate with Big Ben. There's a medical procedure for that he's looking into. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Bunghole' timestamp='1340931149' post='1137132'] Every time Jamie misspells a word, make it say "I love Jerome *fat fuck fat fuck* Bettis. He will love that. And secretly guys, just FYI...[color=#ff0000].Jamie is a Steelers fan[/color]. He tries to hide behind his Washington DC shield, but I can smell the BO stench of a Steelers fan a mile away. Don't be fooled....he's been trolling us all this time. He wants to procreate with Big Ben. There's a medical procedure for that he's looking into. [/quote] Well now thats just gone too far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|OneHeartBeat| Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340909222' post='1137092'] That when done properly you can get a surplus and pay down the debit. [/quote] Why don't you run for office? You have all the answers and could eliminate our national debt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vol_Bengal Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340909222' post='1137092'] That when done properly you can get a surplus and pay down the debit. [/quote] Not to belabor the point... but Clinton did benefit from a economic boom via the internet and internet start ups that any president would LOVE to have. And, I guess your version of done right involves 90% of cuts in military spending, which equated to a 1/3 of the military being lopped off. All that said... with the spending like drunken sailors of the last 8-10 years I yearn for the Clinton days. Just an aside for folks that understand the government budget / spending process and terminology... Clinton had surpluses (98-2001) and was decreasing public debt, but gross federal debt was still increasing... how is that possible? Is that factoring trade agreements (where we imported more than exported) and such? Just wasn't sure how you'd have those two conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='OneHeartBeat' timestamp='1340971978' post='1137180'] Why don't you run for office? You have all the answers and could eliminate our national debt. [/quote] Because people like you would never vote for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Vol_Bengal' timestamp='1340974120' post='1137185'] Not to belabor the point... but Clinton did benefit from a economic boom via the internet and internet start ups that any president would LOVE to have. And, I guess your version of done right involves 90% of cuts in military spending, which equated to a 1/3 of the military being lopped off. All that said... with the spending like drunken sailors of the last 8-10 years I yearn for the Clinton days. Just an aside for folks that understand the government budget / spending process and terminology... Clinton had surpluses (98-2001) and was decreasing public debt, but gross federal debt was still increasing... how is that possible? Is that factoring trade agreements (where we imported more than exported) and such? Just wasn't sure how you'd have those two conditions. [/quote] Curious, who created the internet? Because that's kind of my point regarding government investment in ourselves that sparks the private sector to create jobs, and thus a boom in the economy that allows us to pay that investment back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vol_Bengal Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340974219' post='1137187'] Curious, who created the internet? Because that's kind of my point regarding government investment in ourselves that sparks the private sector to create jobs, and thus a boom in the economy that allows us to pay that investment back. [/quote] Uh... it was essentially crafted / pieced together by military / defense agencies for the purpose of sharing information (DARPA). The same area that held 90% of the cuts during Clinton's time... Any insight into the simultaneous public surplus, federal deficit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer_Rice Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Vol_Bengal' timestamp='1340974418' post='1137190'] Any insight into the simultaneous public surplus, federal deficit? [/quote] Can you point to some specific source? I'm not sure I understand your meaning here. The first thought I had was related to debt service but I'm not sure that I have your idea correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Vol_Bengal' timestamp='1340974418' post='1137190'] Uh... it was essentially crafted / pieced together by military / defense agencies for the purpose of sharing information (DARPA). The same area that held 90% of the cuts during Clinton's time... Any insight into the simultaneous public surplus, federal deficit? [/quote] I didnt differentiate between the military and the government, they are the same. Which continues to prove my point about government investment creating private sector jobs and economic boom. I'd have to look into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340935966' post='1137147'] Well now thats just gone too far. [/quote] That's what she said to Ben! But did that stop him? No! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Bunghole' timestamp='1340975145' post='1137199'] That's what she said to Ben! But did that stop him? No! [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vol_Bengal Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Homer_Rice' timestamp='1340974832' post='1137195'] Can you point to some specific source? I'm not sure I understand your meaning here. The first thought I had was related to debt service but I'm not sure that I have your idea correctly. [/quote] [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidency_of_Bill_Clinton"]http://en.wikipedia....of_Bill_Clinton[/url] [quote]The administration had a mixed record on taxes but produced the first federal budget surpluses since 1969, for fiscal years 1998, 1999, 2000, and 2001,[sup][url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidency_of_Bill_Clinton#cite_note-CBOSurpluses-0"][1][/url][/sup] leading to a decrease in the public debt (though the gross federal debt continued to increase)[/quote] What is the difference between the two? So... overall debt increased, public debt decreased... what is to stop a president from doing "funny accounting" (similar to the Enron's of the world) and move money around to make the public debt "drop" and the federal debt increase? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vol_Bengal Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340974847' post='1137196'] I didnt differentiate between the military and the government, they are the same. Which continues to prove my point about government investment creating private sector jobs and economic boom. [/quote] I think its funny you don't differentiate between the two when we're talking about spending more but are more than happy to point specifically at the military when cuts are discussed. As opposed to being open to cuts in the government as in across the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Vol_Bengal' timestamp='1340983383' post='1137225'] I think its funny you don't differentiate between the two when we're talking about spending more but are more than happy to point specifically at the military when cuts are discussed. As opposed to being open to cuts in the government as in across the board. [/quote] When talking about the military cuts, I'm generally talking about spending money on killing brown people who did nothing to us. I think this quip I saw on the net recently best states my case on this . "Let's invade the U.S. and win the hearts and minds so that we can rebuild America's infrastructure." I'm more than willing to hear you pontificate on how war itself creates the kind of investments needed to spur economic development, outside of just getting cheap oil. I mean I suppose one could argue it creates jobs for those in the war industry, which they in turn spend on other industries, and that's entirely true, but speaking from a moral perspective, I'm not sure I could support killing innocents for that purpose. Now that's not to say I oppose all war, I dont, but the current ones waged by both Bush and Obama, I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Lucid| Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 [quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1340911283' post='1137097'] Fast typing, dont proofread, informal discussion, not worried about proofreading. I think most get the point. [/quote] Don't believe it. You can't claim typo when you spell it that way 100% of the time. I think you spell "debit" correctly more than any other word you have typed on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.