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What Would it Take for You to Believe in God?


Enon Bengal

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All it takes is to feel the presence of God. Once you feel it, you still may be a rotten little shit head, but you'll know.

Go to church, start reading the Bible, feed the hungry, pray, ask for forgiveness, help people... you'll feel it.

It's crazy as shit.

 

Funny how that works as reading the bible is what made me an atheist...

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It takes nothing more than living for me to believe in God. 

 

Now what God? I have no idea. It could be a God we don't even know about or worship for all I know.

 

But in my personal opinion, things are set up too perfectly for us here for it to just be a coincidence.

 

 

We need Sunlight to live and so do most of the things we eat. We have a protective shield from the harmful parts of the Sun.

Earth is the only known planet where fire can burn. Everywhere else: Not enough oxygen. We need Water to survive. 

Over 70 percent of our Planet is covered by water. Fire also makes water. I don't think this all just happened. 

 

Also, I think Human life is greater than that of let's say an insect's or dog's life. I think we serve a greater purpose. 

I think there is more to "life" than just living here on this Planet. 

 

Like I have said before, I was raised in a Pentecostal Church. I questioned it. I think the Bible wreaks of bullshit.

I mean, from what it says in the Bible, when my Brother died, since he never Fathered a Son, I was supposed to

move his Wife and Daughter in with me, and have sex with her (his Wife) until she had a Son. There is really too much bullshit

to even expound on.Some people say "Well that's the Old Testament." Isn't the Old Testament part of the Bible? Isn't that

"God's word" too?  But that doesn't mean I have denounced God. Just the Bible. 

 

 I asked my Dad once "What if Atheists are right? What is people that  worship a different God are right?" He said,

"Well, then I lived a good life. I lived a life that followed doing to others the way you would want to be treated. I wouldn't

regret one thing about how my religion led me to live. I know some people don't live it the way I have and use it to justify War

and hate. But people that don't share my religion also do these things (start wars and hate)." I sat and thought of what he said

and before I could say a word he said "Let me ask you something. What if Atheists are wrong? Would you rather be in my shoes

then or their's?"  

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It takes nothing more than living for me to believe in God. 

 

Now what God? I have no idea. It could be a God we don't even know about or worship for all I know.

 

But in my personal opinion, things are set up too perfectly for us here for it to just be a coincidence.

 

 

We need Sunlight to live and so do most of the things we eat. We have a protective shield from the harmful parts of the Sun.

Earth is the only known planet where fire can burn. Everywhere else: Not enough oxygen. We need Water to survive. 

Over 70 percent of our Planet is covered by water. Fire also makes water. I don't think this all just happened. 

Conversely if you were to start from scratch where we only have one external energy source (the sun) and your medium (the planet) is covered in 78% of a certain substance...wouldn't life be expected to evolve to use the energy source and thrive on the medium?  

 

Many things seem like such perfect relationships that they have to have been designed that way.  The foundation of evolutionary biology is that they should look that way, you cannot evolve completely independent of your environment.  The sun was the only energy source pumping into our atmosphere, how could life have evolved to use anything else?  Secondly, that which looks perfect usually isn't.  The Sun is great, but why do we get skin cancer?  Why are their differences in our ability to metabolize Vitamin D or break down folic acid in the presence of sunlight depending on skin color?  

 

When one doesn't care to dive any further into the real relationship between organisms and their environment, the world certainly appears neatly and efficiently crafted.  But when you do, there is no doubt whatsoever that all these processes are natural, they happen as our understanding of the world expects them too, and their resulting appearance of harmony is a bi-product, not the smoking gun.

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Conversely if you were to start from scratch where we only have one external energy source (the sun) and your medium (the planet) is covered in 78% of a certain substance...wouldn't life be expected to evolve to use the energy source and thrive on the medium?  

 

Many things seem like such perfect relationships that they have to have been designed that way.  The foundation of evolutionary biology is that they should look that way, you cannot evolve completely independent of your environment.  The sun was the only energy source pumping into our atmosphere, how could life have evolved to use anything else?  Secondly, that which looks perfect usually isn't.  The Sun is great, but why do we get skin cancer?  Why are their differences in our ability to metabolize Vitamin D or break down folic acid in the presence of sunlight depending on skin color?  

 

When one doesn't care to dive any further into the real relationship between organisms and their environment, the world certainly appears neatly and efficiently crafted.  But when you do, there is no doubt whatsoever that all these processes are natural, they happen as our understanding of the world expects them too, and their resulting appearance of harmony is a bi-product, not the smoking gun.

 

 

 

Why here? Why this Planet? Why not Mercury. Mars, Jupiter or any of our neighbors?

 

And why does fire give us warmth and help us make our food safer and more tasty, but can also burn us or kill us? 

Water gives us life, but can also kill us too. Animals and plants help us live, but they can kill us too. 

 

Also, our Planet formed an atmosphere for life? It did it on it's own? 

 

If we evolved from monkeys, then why are the things we evolved from still here? 

 

 

We can go back and forth with this all day. 

 

I didn't post my beliefs for debate. I posted them because that is what I believe. 

Just like what you are saying is nothing more than what you believe. Because really,

the only people that truly know are dead. And they're not talking. 

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My favorite author...

 

 

“My most recent faith struggle is not one of intellect. I don’t really
do that anymore. Sooner or later you just figure out there are some guys
who don’t believe in God and they can prove He doesn't exist, and there
are some other guys who do believe in God and they can prove He does
exist, and the argument stopped being about God a long time ago and now
it’s about who is smarter, and honestly I don’t care.” - Donald Miller

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some sort of proof...

just because science hasnt found an answer to every question doesnt mean one doesnt exist. a fish in a pond a has no idea there are better ponds, bigger ponds, more fish just like him, millions of them everywhere, because he doesnt have the means to get there..

there could easily be 60 million earths out there somewhere.. the inability to travel there is the only thing blocking that answer.

religion is full of questions without answers. a person can only deal with so much "have faith" in life... bad things happen, good things happen, no bigger reason, only results both good and bad from previous actions..

i have an even harder time with those 9again not making a personal comment towards anyone) who buy into "yea, there is a god because of X, but the rest of those stories are probably BS.."

so either there were talking bushes, magical pregnancies, magical trees, cursing animals, killing animals to make skin, creating light before creating the things that create light, needing a day to rest, lol..

sounds more like the original politicians to me..

my kids think santa clause is real until they catch on to all those amazon boxes showing up the first 3 weeks in december. as well as the tooth fairy, easter bunny, etc... its all real until proven impossible... however religion cant be proven impossible, its based on beleiving even in the face of evidence against it.. aka "faith"..

the ability to pin all good things as blessings and all wrong doing as the work of the devil is sure convenient for those lacking accountability for their own actions,..

i wont get into the part about religion being used to fuel had and discriminate against others.. which is the ultimate contradiction..

also there are 2.1 billion "christians" in the world, and 7 billion people... buncha idiots AMIRIGHT?!?! #burnsinners #'merica!

 

And just because science can explain it doesn't mean God didn't do it.  Newton and Galileo were Christians.

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Why here? Why this Planet? Why not Mercury. Mars, Jupiter or any of our neighbors?

 

And why does fire give us warmth and help us make our food safer and more tasty, but can also burn us or kill us? 

Water gives us life, but can also kill us too. Animals and plants help us live, but they can kill us too. 

 

Also, our Planet formed an atmosphere for life? It did it on it's own? 

 

If we evolved from monkeys, then why are the things we evolved from still here? 

 

 

We can go back and forth with this all day. 

 

I didn't post my beliefs for debate. I posted them because that is what I believe. 

Just like what you are saying is nothing more than what you believe. Because really,

the only people that truly know are dead. And they're not talking. 

 

I just thought I'd give you the chance to educate yourself...the bold lets me know exactly what you don't understand.  That's fine, we don't have to have an argument.  What you've said is based entirely on earth-life being the only source of life in the universe.  You do realize that the discovery of a single extra terrestrial organism shoots down your entire hypothesis correct?  That if life is elsewhere, in the absence of our abundant water supply, and our precious atmosphere that everything you currently believe (as stated) about the universe is wrong.  I'm not sure I'd want to take such a hard-line stance on a very fluid and complicated issue.

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I just thought I'd give you the chance to educate yourself...the bold lets me know exactly what you don't understand.  That's fine, we don't have to have an argument.  What you've said is based entirely on earth-life being the only source of life in the universe.  You do realize that the discovery of a single extra terrestrial organism shoots down your entire hypothesis correct?  That if life is elsewhere, in the absence of our abundant water supply, and our precious atmosphere that everything you currently believe (as stated) about the universe is wrong.  I'm not sure I'd want to take such a hard-line stance on a very fluid and complicated issue.

 

He's merely asking a question, not putting all his eggs in that particular basket. 

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And just because science can explain it doesn't mean God didn't do it.  Newton and Galileo were Christians.

And the beauty of science is that what Newton and Galileo accomplished, created, or "did," exists completely independently of their religion, sexual preference, or the fuzzy feelings they got admiring their favorite work of art.  It is a set of principles and rules that were and are remarkably consistent with the observable world.  

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I didn't post my beliefs for debate. I posted them because that is what I believe. 

Just like what you are saying is nothing more than what you believe. Because really,

the only people that truly know are dead. And they're not talking. 

 

Doesn't sound like much of a question to me.  There were rhetorical questions in the post, but I thought it was pretty clear his mind is made up.

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The monkey thing doesn't make any sense. There is no reason you can't evovled from something and the other thing still exist. If there are enough resources and you are not fighting for a few scarce resources it could certainly happen.


That isnt point, we didn't evolve from monkeys, we share a common ancestor with chimps, gorillas, orangutans, new world monkeys, old world monkeys, and prosimians.
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That isnt point, we didn't evolve from monkeys, we share a common ancestor with chimps, gorillas, orangutans, new world monkeys, old world monkeys, and prosimians.

 

 

But us evolving from monkeys isn't impossible, I mean that in just because one thing evolves from another doesn't make that other thing cease to exist.

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But us evolving from monkeys isn't impossible, I mean that in just because one thing evolves from another doesn't make that other thing cease to exist.

Yes and no.  For one species to evolve into another there has to be some sort of selective pressure.  Radical climate change, sudden loss of food supply, ravaging disease, something that now amplifies the fitness or reproductive success of (initially) a small percentage of the population (due to natural variation within species i.e. people are 4ft-7ft tall) and usually (but not always) negatively affects the rest of the population.  So yes for a period of time both species will still be there, but after a length of time (the kind of length necessary for real evolutionary change, like thousands of years) we would not expect the original species to continue on with success. 

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I just thought I'd give you the chance to educate yourself...the bold lets me know exactly what you don't understand.  

 

 

 

Please do not act like you have all the answers and have everything figured out. It makes you look arrogant.

Again, this is about beliefs. You don't know anymore about where we came from and if there is an afterlife

than anyone else. It is what you believe to be true. Period. Notice how I have never said you were wrong,

or that you don't understand anything? 

 

 

And no, other forms of life on other Planets doesn't mean anything more than God allowed other life to form 

on other Planets. 

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Conversely if you were to start from scratch where we only have one external energy source (the sun) and your medium (the planet) is covered in 78% of a certain substance...wouldn't life be expected to evolve to use the energy source and thrive on the medium?  

I simply asked a little thought experiment and then attempted to explain why I think its a question worth considering.

 

Why here? Why this Planet? Why not Mercury. Mars, Jupiter or any of our neighbors?

 

And why does fire give us warmth and help us make our food safer and more tasty, but can also burn us or kill us? 

Water gives us life, but can also kill us too. Animals and plants help us live, but they can kill us too. 

 

Also, our Planet formed an atmosphere for life? It did it on it's own? 

 

If we evolved from monkeys, then why are the things we evolved from still here? 

 

 

We can go back and forth with this all day. 

 

I didn't post my beliefs for debate. I posted them because that is what I believe. 

Just like what you are saying is nothing more than what you believe. Because really,

the only people that truly know are dead. And they're not talking. 

I don't think you addressed my question, then you confounded the issue by bouncing in and out between questions with real legitimate scientific answers and others who can only be answered philosophically.  You can have your belief that we didn't evolve (and your ignorant form of phrasing it..sorry man but ignorant is the correct term) but you're dead wrong.  Some here have decided to no longer stand idly by in the face of someones incorrect opinion of a factual matter to save their feelings.  I have no problem making that stand for science.  You're wrong.  If you refuse to question the merits of the scientific method in technology, medicine, engineering, physics, and chemistry (hint, you do it every minute of your life) you don't get to just "Have an opinion" on Biology, embryology, genetics, geology, archeaology, or astronomy.  You're not going to question the reasoning of our cardiologist as he explains your CT scan results, but a paleoarcheologist "that asshole doesn't know shit, my dad told me..."

 

After this post I'm left confused as to what exactly you were getting, so I'm still hung up on the monkeys comment.

I just thought I'd give you the chance to educate yourself...the bold lets me know exactly what you don't understand.  That's fine, we don't have to have an argument.  What you've said is based entirely on earth-life being the only source of life in the universe.  You do realize that the discovery of a single extra terrestrial organism shoots down your entire hypothesis correct?  That if life is elsewhere, in the absence of our abundant water supply, and our precious atmosphere that everything you currently believe (as stated) about the universe is wrong.  I'm not sure I'd want to take such a hard-line stance on a very fluid and complicated issue.

I don't think my assessment is incorrect.  You used Earth's perfect relationship with the sun and us as a reason to believe its more than coincidence.  If life exists outside this scenario then its clear that none of the earth or the atmosphere is necessary for life, therefore everything you said is no longer a sound reason for believing life is more than coincidence.  Unless you change the frame of reference for the discussion...

 

Again, this is about beliefs. You don't know anymore about where we came from and if there is an afterlife

than anyone else. It is what you believe to be true. Period. Notice how I have never said you were wrong,

or that you don't understand anything? 

 

 

And no, other forms of life on other Planets doesn't mean anything more than God allowed other life to form 

on other Planets

...like the bold.  Suddenly its not that important that everything here is perfect cause god can do anything.  Also I'm pretty sure I said nothing about the afterlife.  Some of it is my beliefs and some of it is the truth.  I don't want to come across arrogant so I apologize  But if you're offended that I'm stating you are wrong about evolution, than never mind.  

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I just thought I'd give you the chance to educate yourself...the bold lets me know exactly what you don't understand.  That's fine, we don't have to have an argument.  What you've said is based entirely on earth-life being the only source of life in the universe.  You do realize that the discovery of a single extra terrestrial organism shoots down your entire hypothesis correct?  That if life is elsewhere, in the absence of our abundant water supply, and our precious atmosphere that everything you currently believe (as stated) about the universe is wrong.  I'm not sure I'd want to take such a hard-line stance on a very fluid and complicated issue.


At this point, Old's hypothesis is more proven since we have not found life, and more importantly, life from elsewhere has not found us. At this point, there is zero fluidity.
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I simply asked a little thought experiment and then attempted to explain why I think its a question worth considering.
 
I don't think you addressed my question, then you confounded the issue by bouncing in and out between questions with real legitimate scientific answers and others who can only be answered philosophically.  You can have your belief that we didn't evolve (and your ignorant form of phrasing it..sorry man but ignorant is the correct term) but you're dead wrong.  Some here have decided to no longer stand idly by in the face of someones incorrect opinion of a factual matter to save their feelings.  I have no problem making that stand for science.  You're wrong.  If you refuse to question the merits of the scientific method in technology, medicine, engineering, physics, and chemistry (hint, you do it every minute of your life) you don't get to just "Have an opinion" on Biology, embryology, genetics, geology, archeaology, or astronomy.  You're not going to question the reasoning of our cardiologist as he explains your CT scan results, but a paleoarcheologist "that asshole doesn't know shit, my dad told me..."
 
After this post I'm left confused as to what exactly you were getting, so I'm still hung up on the monkeys comment.
I don't think my assessment is incorrect.  You used Earth's perfect relationship with the sun and us as a reason to believe its more than coincidence.  If life exists outside this scenario then its clear that none of the earth or the atmosphere is necessary for life, therefore everything you said is no longer a sound reason for believing life is more than coincidence.  Unless you change the frame of reference for the discussion...
 
...like the bold.  Suddenly its not that important that everything here is perfect cause god can do anything.  Also I'm pretty sure I said nothing about the afterlife.  Some of it is my beliefs and some of it is the truth.  I don't want to come across arrogant so I apologize  But if you're offended that I'm stating you are wrong about evolution, than never mind.

 

 

 

 

You know what I hate? I hate it when all I do is state my opinion and some a-hole talks down to
me, insults me and acts like I am a fucking idiot. Yeah, I really hate that.


The monkey statement was rhetorical. I know according to your THEORY
that we weren't supposed to have evolved directly from monkeys. They are supposed to
basically be our "cousins". That is why there is a MISSING FUCKING LINK. But really though,
evolution says we all came from the same organism at one point, so technically ... oh fuck it.


Seriously though, what YOU BELIEVE states that life spontaneously arose out of the
chemicals of the Earth. The thing is though, it's just a theory. Look up the definition
of theory, go ahead I''l wait. See where it says "ideas intended to explain something"?
Yeah, well you see, that does not make it a fucking fact. So please quit talking to me
like what you BELIEVE is a fucking fact and I am just ignorant, uneducated idiot. Can you
do that for me? I would really appreciate it.


When I go get a CT scan, the Doc has something physical he is holding in his hands and
that can be read. It isn't some theory to try and explain away something else.

I used the way things are and said "I don't think it was just a "coincidence".
I guess you missed that part. Because you see, I believe we came from a higher power.
You believe we just happened. That is really the only difference in our beliefs. Period.

I jumped into this thread to state MY beliefs. I didn't try and ram them down anyone's throat.
I didn't call anyone that doesn't believe the same way as I do any names or tell them they
are uneducated. You chose to respond to what I said that way. A lot of people hate religious
people because they do exactly what you have displayed here. Your parents must be so proud.

Look, in my original post I said "I believe in God." Then I followed it up with "Maybe it is
a God we don't know of and worship." And I also said "I think the Bible is bullshit." I also
stated that "I think we serve a greater purpose than a fucking insect or a dog." And I concluded
with "I'd rather live my life believing there is a God and be wrong than live it being an Atheist
and be wrong." It's that simple really. Why you felt the need to "educate me" call me "ignorant"
and try and force your bullshit beliefs down my throat is on you. Period.


By the way, my Dad died a couple of years ago. So needless to say the "my dad told me" line
has struck a nerve.


Look, like I said, I was RAISED in a Church. I witness my Mamaw, Aunts, Uncles and other family
members being hit by the power of God and they spoke in "tongues". I heard it so much I remember
some of the words they said, which were not English. And we are talking about people that were
as hick as they come, straight out of the hills of Eastern Kentucky. I witnessed my Great Aunt
driving down I-75 get hit with the power of God. She pulled over on the side of the highway and
strating "shouting" and speaking in "tongues". I witnessed a blind woman stand up one time and
in a voice that was deeper than mine and definitely not her own said "I AM THE LORD THY GOD, I
AM COMING SOON." And she said  other things, started "shouting" and speaking in "tongues". I witnessed
a 40 something year old man, that was by no means an athlete, get hit by the power of God and
he started "shouting". He then commenced to running and literally "hurdled" a 8 foot wall that
was built at the end of the pulpit.

Now you can dismiss that shit all you want. I can't. I won't. My beliefs are just as strong,
just as founded and just as viable as your's are. Again though, if I am wrong we end up in
the same place. If you are wrong though ...

 

 

By the way, I am not a very religious person. I don't follow a certain sect of religion.

I just believe in God. And I follow him according to my own beliefs. Not what someone

else tells me to do, feel or think. 


Anyway, in the future, learn some tact. Thanks and have a great day.

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At this point, Old's hypothesis is more proven since we have not found life, and more importantly, life from elsewhere has not found us. At this point, there is zero fluidity.

 

There's fairly strong evidence of microbes having existed on Mars at some point, based on organic matter found in Martian meteorites. 

 

Aside from that, there's a difference IMHO between spiritual beliefs and the more general definition. The existence of God is a philosphical question. Science is not. You can "believe" the Earth is flat, but to act as though someone is just spitballing when they point out all the evidence to the contrary is a bit ridiculous.

 

Theories are supported or refuted by experimentation and the collection of evidence.  Evolution is supported by a verifiable record of increasingly-advanced hominids. Monkeys are simians.  Our closest hominid ancestors are, in fact, very much extinct. (outside of, perhaps, Pittsburgh).

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I was in Cincy this week to celebrate the life of my late friend, so this topic's question has been on my mind. In my opinion, oldschooler's "tone" is right. And Squirrelnutz's devotion to furthering our understanding is right, too, even though he and I have gone around previously on what I think are some seriously flawed elements with his particular approach.

 

The thought that I keep coming back to is this: However we describe or approach the concept of God, our responsibility as humans remains more or less the same. Whether one believes that God created man from Adam's rib or if one believes that our place in the universe is the product of an elaborate construction of causes and effects that can be described, or of some mixture between these poles, here is the bottom line: our orientation toward the divine and the sublime demand that we humans act as co-participants in creation.

 

Simply stated, "We should be Good."

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You know what I hate? I hate it when all I do is state my opinion and some a-hole talks down to
me, insults me and acts like I am a fucking idiot. Yeah, I really hate that.


The monkey statement was rhetorical. I know according to your THEORY
that we weren't supposed to have evolved directly from monkeys. They are supposed to
basically be our "cousins". That is why there is a MISSING FUCKING LINK. But really though,
evolution says we all came from the same organism at one point, so technically ... oh fuck it.


Seriously though, what YOU BELIEVE states that life spontaneously arose out of the
chemicals of the Earth. The thing is though, it's just a theory. Look up the definition
of theory, go ahead I''l wait. See where it says "ideas intended to explain something"?
Yeah, well you see, that does not make it a fucking fact. So please quit talking to me
like what you BELIEVE is a fucking fact and I am just ignorant, uneducated idiot. Can you
do that for me? I would really appreciate it.


When I go get a CT scan, the Doc has something physical he is holding in his hands and
that can be read. It isn't some theory to try and explain away something else.

I used the way things are and said "I don't think it was just a "coincidence".
I guess you missed that part. Because you see, I believe we came from a higher power.
You believe we just happened. That is really the only difference in our beliefs. Period.

I jumped into this thread to state MY beliefs. I didn't try and ram them down anyone's throat.
I didn't call anyone that doesn't believe the same way as I do any names or tell them they
are uneducated. You chose to respond to what I said that way. A lot of people hate religious
people because they do exactly what you have displayed here. Your parents must be so proud.

Look, in my original post I said "I believe in God." Then I followed it up with "Maybe it is
a God we don't know of and worship." And I also said "I think the Bible is bullshit." I also
stated that "I think we serve a greater purpose than a fucking insect or a dog." And I concluded
with "I'd rather live my life believing there is a God and be wrong than live it being an Atheist
and be wrong." It's that simple really. Why you felt the need to "educate me" call me "ignorant"
and try and force your bullshit beliefs down my throat is on you. Period.


By the way, my Dad died a couple of years ago. So needless to say the "my dad told me" line
has struck a nerve.


Look, like I said, I was RAISED in a Church. I witness my Mamaw, Aunts, Uncles and other family
members being hit by the power of God and they spoke in "tongues". I heard it so much I remember
some of the words they said, which were not English. And we are talking about people that were
as hick as they come, straight out of the hills of Eastern Kentucky. I witnessed my Great Aunt
driving down I-75 get hit with the power of God. She pulled over on the side of the highway and
strating "shouting" and speaking in "tongues". I witnessed a blind woman stand up one time and
in a voice that was deeper than mine and definitely not her own said "I AM THE LORD THY GOD, I
AM COMING SOON." And she said  other things, started "shouting" and speaking in "tongues". I witnessed
a 40 something year old man, that was by no means an athlete, get hit by the power of God and
he started "shouting". He then commenced to running and literally "hurdled" a 8 foot wall that
was built at the end of the pulpit.

Now you can dismiss that shit all you want. I can't. I won't. My beliefs are just as strong,
just as founded and just as viable as your's are. Again though, if I am wrong we end up in
the same place. If you are wrong though ...

 

 

By the way, I am not a very religious person. I don't follow a certain sect of religion.

I just believe in God. And I follow him according to my own beliefs. Not what someone

else tells me to do, feel or think. 


Anyway, in the future, learn some tact. Thanks and have a great day.

 

 

I should have known better.   You can believe angels hold up the wings of an airplane as it flies over the midwest.  You would be patently wrong.  This extends to evolution.  You clearly don't understand it and I don't feel bad telling you that, you are ignorant.  I did not address you as ignorant at first, I asked a reasonable question.  You responded with nonsense so don't get pissy when someone calls you on bullshit and hide behind "i just came to state my beliefs."  You responded, and therefore engaged (not just stated) and openly divulged how much you don't know.  I'm willing to talk about what I believe, I haven't really done much of that in this thread, despite what you've assumed-gotten angry about-and subsequently ranted about.  There's room for a higher power in my view of the universe, though I believe it operates just fine without one.

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I should have known better.   You can believe angels hold up the wings of an airplane as it flies over the midwest.  You would be patently wrong.  This extends to evolution.  You clearly don't understand it and I don't feel bad telling you that, you are ignorant. 

 

Yes you should have. 

 

By the way, thanks for telling me what I can believe. What a relief. 

 

Anyway, to answer your question that you posed to me earlier, Yes, I think it makes sense 

and is plausible that life would be expected to thrive and evolve under the medium. 

 

But considering that 1) I have witnessed Family members and others being touched by the power 

of God first hand. 2) I choose to believe in a higher power rather than to say "It just happened."

3) I would rather be called ignorant, uneducated or whatever insults you or  whoever wants to throw at me

than be wrong about a God, that is just as plausible and feasible as your THEORY.

 

You see, I never said you were wrong. Never insulted your intelligence, hell, I didn't even address you at all until

you felt the need to address me after my initial post. When I responded I asked rhetorical questions and said

"we can go back and forth like this all day." 

 

Just because we don't share the same views does not make me ignorant. I think you are ignorant

for thinking so. I guess I hit a nerve with "what my Dad told me." I really don't care. I didn't share my

views as a shot towards anyone. And I sure as hell ain't going to sit here and take anyone's shots

because of it.  Believe that. 

 

Believe what you want. It makes no difference to me. I just shared my views. Never once did I mention

Jesus, Angels or anything of the like. So who's ignorant? That's right, you are. You made an argument

out of nothing. I swear I hate this fucking board sometimes. 

 

 

When you want to share your undeniable, indisputable proof, the rest of the World will be indebted to you.

Until then, eat shit, fuck off, suck a dick and Fuck you. 

 

Seriously. I'm not kidding, 

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http://youtu.be/NZbQBajYnEc

 

Are there documented cases where the language has been identified as one unknown to the speaker? It doesn't take much to flop around going "deeba dabba dooba dabba" so the connection to divine influence seems like a stretch. What purpose would God have in making someone spout gibberish? Why not make them recite scripture in Aramaic or the like? And why does this only seem to happen to members of churches where this sort of thing is not only accepted but encouraged? Point being, it'd be a lot more interesting if the hand of God had reached down and made Obama do this during the State of the Union Address.

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