Jump to content

US sending warship to within striking distance of Syria....


Numbers

Should we be involved militarily ?  

18 members have voted

  1. 1. Should we be involved militarily ?

    • Yes
      0
    • No
    • Contingent upon further evidence ( Please explain what evidence )


Recommended Posts

I would be happy if we pulled all of our military efforts away from all other countries, except for a few forward ready bases just in case shit really hit the fan. But no more involvement in anyone else's issues. Let them sort it out.. Let them kill each other as long as they want. They've been doing it for thousands of years and don't want to become civilized now. Stop forcing civilization on them. No more American lives, no more American dollars. Just like the world and reasonable Americans want.

Id also pull all aid unless it was going directly to kids/farming etc. no more blind $500m aid gift transfers to other countries bank accounts. We don't have the money, and you shitballs don't deserve it.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

While I am in favor of less military spending overall, that cat is already out of the bag. We have bases everywhere. Hardware to kill millions a million times over. We supposedly wear the white hat and as long as we are committed to that course of action things will remain as they are. I would love to spend less on our military and stop giving countries like Egypt, Pakistan and even Israel billions of dollars in support. That said...how do we ensure a country like India or Pakistan maintains government control of nuclear weapons? Fuck chemical weapons...NUCLEAR weapons. They have them and particularly in the case of Pakistan, their government isn't a model of stability and there are parts of their own country that they do not/will not or cannot control. That's not good.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

My question is, why does that always mean us?  I'm not overly fond of this "Team America World Police" foreign policy. 

 

As long as the US is a unipolar superpower, that's just the way it is. We're the guarantor of security for the entire developed world. Any major conflict is going to involve us in some way. And it IS very much in the best interest of the US and the world to maintain a stable Middle East, which is why we're slowly getting dragged into the Syria conflict even though we absolutely do not want it. 

 

Sadly for the people of Syria, the best case scenario for the US is for all the groups fighting over there to kill each other. It is literally a country full of our enemies fighting our enemies. Small positive to that - just about 0% chance US boots will ever touch Syrian ground. Everyone is an enemy and there's no real objective. We will shoot some cruise missiles at Assad to keep him from gassing his people and not much more than that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

As long as the US is a unipolar superpower, that's just the way it is. We're the guarantor of security for the entire developed world.

 

The same world that sits back and criticizes us for our warlike ways.  See, screw "that's just the way it is."  Let the UN do what it's supposed to do. Let the EU that's actually really dependent on the Middle East get their hands dirty.  A few volleys of cruise missiles aren't going to stop him from doing anything.  The best case scenario is that it accomplishes nothing, as far as I can tell, because the more likely outcome is escalation.  If there was ever an opportunity for us to help establish a relatively-moderate government we let it slip away ~2 years ago before al-Nusra consolidated power.  I'm not sure if I really care if Syria has a democratic government anyway.  At this point we'd be blowing shit up just to prove all the talk about a "red line" wasn't bullshit.  If the international community isn't going to get off their collective asses I don't see much reason for us to continue playing lightning rod for everyone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 
The same world that sits back and criticizes us for our warlike ways.  See, screw "that's just the way it is."  Let the UN do what it's supposed to do. Let the EU that's actually really dependent on the Middle East get their hands dirty.  A few volleys of cruise missiles aren't going to stop him from doing anything.  The best case scenario is that it accomplishes nothing, as far as I can tell, because the more likely outcome is escalation.  If there was ever an opportunity for us to help establish a relatively-moderate government we let it slip away ~2 years ago before al-Nusra consolidated power.  I'm not sure if I really care if Syria has a democratic government anyway.  At this point we'd be blowing shit up just to prove all the talk about a "red line" wasn't bullshit.  If the international community isn't going to get off their collective asses I don't see much reason for us to continue playing lightning rod for everyone.


Honestly, screw world opinion. The US is better off as a hegemon than it is in any other geopolitical hierarchy. There's a very strong argument that the world as a whole is better off with a hegemon too. Lets be real, the historical eras were called "Pax Romana" and "Pax Britannica" for a reason. Multipolarity gave us two World Wars and bipolarity almost nuked the whole world several times during the Cold War. I'll take being the big dog on the block.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Western intelligence agencies cause the strife that goes on in many of these countries.....then the world sits back and says "OMG, how uncivilized are they?".  Stop meddling in peoples affairs for geo-political gain, as well as other gains.......wake the fuck up as to what our governments are doing. 

 

But it seems the US is hellbent on taking Assad out of power.....I wonder what he refused to 'roll over' for, what command he refused from his International "bosses" that he finds himself in this situation.  He didn't gas his own people.....there is no evidence of it.  No real evidence that is....but there is a media campaign to vilify Assad....  (I am no Assad supporter by any means, don't like him one bit)

 

Order out of chaos.  Guess who created the chaos and now gets to do the 'order'ing'? 

 

I hate our "leaders". 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So you're willing to further bankrupt the country in order to win a pointless pissing contest?


1, "bankrupt" is total bullshit. We spend a smaller percentage of GDP on defense than at any point in history and its the only sector of spending that has shrunk as a percentage of GDP across the past few decades.

2, definitely is not pointless considering stability of the Middle East is essentially paramount to stability of the energy trade, upon which the world economy is built. Why do you think the US gets involved in so many conflicts over there? It's not because Bush wants to defend his daddy's honor.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1, "bankrupt" is total bullshit. We spend a smaller percentage of GDP on defense than at any point in history and its the only sector of spending that has shrunk as a percentage of GDP across the past few decades.

The debt we've racked up in Afghanistan & Iraq is staggering & hardly measured in defense spending alone. What about all the no-bid contracts to rebuild all the infrastructure we demolished? The money spent propping up their corrupt government agencies, to private security firms, and on and on. The defense budget doesn't begin to cover it so let's not use that as a reference.
 

2, definitely is not pointless considering stability of the Middle East is essentially paramount to stability of the energy trade, upon which the world economy is built. Why do you think the US gets involved in so many conflicts over there? It's not because Bush wants to defend his daddy's honor.


Would you call the Mideast anything like stable? I sure as shit wouldn't, and have no illusions about achieving that goal any time soon, either - particularly not by force on our part. Correct me if I'm wrong but my understanding is it's Europe that's dependent on oil from the region. Like you said though, it's a global market so a shortage in Europe drives up the price for everyone. At this point, however, I think I'd prefer $5/gallon gas over endless unwinnable wars in regions where we aren't welcome, let alone appreciated. This shit's clearly not sustainable anyway so why fuck ourselves over in the long run trying to wring the last penny out of a situation that only benefits the oligarchy?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

Why is an axe murder considered worse than a shooting?  There's a degree of cruelty that people find more offensive. Likewise with chemical weapons vs. a plain old bomb.  There's also the indiscriminate nature of using nerve gas - with conventional weapons they can at least claim civilian casualties are accidental.  When you start using gas it shows you DGAF who you kill or how many because you're obviously trying to exterminate everyone in the area.  There's a huge difference between bombing a town and gassing it.

 

Yes, the situation there was already horrific but using chemical weapons magnifies that tremendously.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I assure you, the US does NOT want stability in the Middle East.  There are so many things going on over there that if put together, analyzed in context, will give you a clue into what's really going on.  Suaz Canal, Strait of Hormuz are key components.  Jerusalem plays into all this as well....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2, definitely is not pointless considering stability of the Middle East is essentially paramount to stability of the energy trade, upon which the world economy is built. Why do you think the US gets involved in so many conflicts over there? It's not because Bush wants to defend his daddy's honor.

 

 

This is exactly why we need to be restructuring our own economy for not just alternative fuels but eliminating the massive wage gap. THIS is what will bring us to our knees as a superpower. The blowback that will come of it is inevitable, and its a no win situation nobody in this is a winning side for us. Further our boys in uniform don't deserve to be treated like chattle over it, its immoral.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

All "terrorists" are controlled by intelligence agencies.....even the Boston "bombers" were.  When will people wake up?  Oh....and this might be a little concerning:

 

http://www.eutimes.net/2013/08/putin-orders-massive-strike-against-saudi-arabia-if-west-attacks-syria/

 

Putin Orders Massive Strike Against Saudi Arabia If West Attacks Syria

Posted by EU Times on Aug 27th, 2013 // 635 Comments

 
 

odiogo_listen_now_77x18.gif


wwz1.jpg

A grim “urgent action memorandum” issued today from the office of President Putin to the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation is ordering a “massive military strike” against Saudi Arabia in the event that the West attacks Syria.

According to Kremlin sources familiar with this extraordinary “war order,” Putin became “enraged” after his early August meeting with Saudi Prince Bandar bin Sultan who warned that if Russia did not accept the defeat of Syria, Saudi Arabia would unleash Chechen terrorists under their control to cause mass death and chaos during the Winter Olympics scheduled to be held 7-23 February 2014 in Sochi, Russia.

Lebanese newspaper As-Safir confirmed this amazing threat against Russia saying that Prince Bandar pledged to safeguard Russia’s naval base in Syria if the Assad regime is toppled, but he also hinted at Chechen terrorist attacks on Russia’s Winter Olympics in Sochi if there is no accord by stating: “I can give you a guarantee to protect the Winter Olympics next year. The Chechen groups that threaten the security of the games are controlled by us.”

wwz2.jpg

Prince Bandar went on to say that Chechens operating in Syria were a pressure tool that could be switched on an off. “These groups do not scare us. We use them in the face of the Syrian regime but they will have no role in Syria’s political future.”

London’s The Telegraph News Service further reported today that Saudi Arabia has secretly offered Russia a sweeping deal to control the global oil market and safeguard Russia’s gas contracts, if the Kremlin backs away from the Assad regime in Syria, an offer Putin replied to by saying “Our stance on Assad will never change. We believe that the Syrian regime is the best speaker on behalf of the Syrian people, and not those liver eaters” [Putin said referring to footage showing a Jihadist rebel eating the heart and liver of a Syrian soldier HERE], and which Prince Bandar in turn warned that there can be “no escape from the military option” if Russia declines the olive branch.

wwz3.jpg

Critical to note, and as we had previously reported on in our 28 January 2013 report “Obama Plan For World War III Stuns Russia,” the Federal Security Services (FSB) confirmed the validity of the released hacked emails of the British based defence company, Britam Defence that stunningly warned the Obama regime was preparing to unleash a series of attacks against both Syria and Iran in a move Russian intelligence experts warned could very well cause World War III.

According to this FSB report, Britam Defence, one of the largest private mercenary forces in the world, was the target of a “massive hack” of its computer files by an “unknown state sponsored entity” this past January who then released a number of critical emails between its top two executives, founder Philip Doughty and his Business Development Director David Goulding.

The two most concerning emails between Doughty and Goulding, this report says, states that the Obama regime has approved a “false flag” attack in Syria using chemical weapons, and that Britam has been approved to participate in the West’s warn on Iran, and as we can read:

Email 1: Phil, We’ve got a new offer. It’s about Syria again. Qataris propose an attractive deal and swear that the idea is approved by Washington. We’ll have to deliver a CW (chemical weapon) to Homs (Syria), a Soviet origin g-shell from Libya similar to those that Assad should have. They want us to deploy our Ukrainian personnel that should speak Russian and make a video record. Frankly, I don’t think it’s a good idea but the sums proposed are enormous. Your opinion? Kind regards David

Email 2: Phil, Please see attached details of preparatory measures concerning the Iranian issue. Participation of Britam in the operation is confirmed by the Saudis.

With the events now spiraling out of control in Syria, and London’s Independent News Service now reporting that Prince Bandar is “pushing for war,” Russian foreign ministry spokesman Alexander Lukashevich further warned the West today by stating, “Attempts to bypass the Security Council, once again to create artificial groundless excuses for a military intervention in the region are fraught with new suffering in Syria and catastrophic consequences for other countries of the Middle East and North Africa.

Heedless of Russian warnings which have fallen on deaf ears, however, British Prime Minister David Cameron this morning recalled the British Parliament to vote on attacking Syria as the Obama regime abruptly cancelled their meeting with Russia scheduled for tomorrow on finding a path to peace for Syria, and the West begins its plans to attack the Syrian nation “within days.”

As Syria itself has warned that should it be attacked by the West there will be “global chaos,” the Western peoples themselves have not been told of the fact that on 17 May 2013, Putin ordered Russian military forces to “immediately move” from Local War to Regional War operational status and to be “fully prepared” to expand to Large-Scale War should either the US or EU enter into the Syrian Civil War, a situation they are still in at this very hour.

With Putin’s previous order, and as we had reported on in our 17 May report “Russia Issues “All-Out War” Alert Over Syria,” and now combined with his new ordering of massive retaliatory strikes against Saudi Arabia, any attack on Syria is viewed by Russia as being an attack on itself.

And as we had previously explained in great detail, the fight over Syria, being led by Saudi Arabia and Qatar and their lap-dog Western allies, has but one single objective: To break Russia’s hold on the European Union natural gas market which a pipeline through Syria would accomplish, and as reported by London’s Financial Times News Service this past June:

“The tiny gas-rich state of Qatar has spent as much as $3bn over the past two years supporting the rebellion in Syria, far exceeding any other government, but is now being nudged aside by Saudi Arabia as the prime source of arms to rebels.

The cost of Qatar’s intervention, its latest push to back an Arab revolt, amounts to a fraction of its international investment portfolio. But its financial support for the revolution that has turned into a vicious civil war dramatically overshadows western backing for the opposition.

Qatar [also] has proposed a gas pipeline from the Gulf to Turkey in a sign the emirate is considering a further expansion of exports from the world’s biggest gasfield after it finishes an ambitious programme to more than double its capacity to produce liquefied natural gas (LNG).”

And in what is, perhaps, the most unimaginable cause to start World War III over Syria was noted by Russian Foreign Ministry spokesman, Aleksandr Lukashevich who said this past week: “We’re getting more new evidence that this criminal act was of a provocative nature,” he stressed. “In particular, there are reports circulating on the Internet, in particular that the materials of the incident and accusations against government troops had been posted for several hours before the so-called attack. Thus, it was a pre-planned action.”

For the West to have so sloppily engineered yet another “false flag” attack to justify a war where they posted the videos of this so-called chemical weapons attack a full day before it was said to occur is the height of arrogance and disdain, but which their sleep-walking citizens, yet again, will fall for as they have done so many times in the past.

Breaking News – Saudis Go On Full Alert As Putin War Threat Stuns Muslim World (CLICK HERE TO READ MORE)
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

A grim “urgent action memorandum” issued today from the office of President Putin to the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation is ordering a “massive military strike” against Saudi Arabia in the event that the West attacks Syria.

 

Anyone that lives near a military base knows what all of this means as of today.  Prayers for peace.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Anyone that lives near a military base knows what all of this means as of today.  Prayers for peace.

 

If Medina or Mecca especially, which is the golden ratio point of the planet Earth, is harmed.....good God, I don't even want to think about that possibility.  Russia I would imagine would act more responsibly.  But the cart before the horse here....there is ZERO justification to attack Syria.  Assad has even asked, if there are accusations, where is the proof?  There seems to be proof to the contrary, that the 'rebels' used chemical weapons.  If Syria is attacked under false pretense....where does that leave us?  In terms of this administration and government in general?  We will have seen the last 2 administrations use the military with lies being used as the justification.   Grim reality indeed.  Continuous prayers for peace....Syrians have suffered enough, let the lesson be learned from their suffering. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...