Dalton is the man?

[JBandJoeyV]

I just skimmed the article but it seemed like a good one. Dalton deserves blame but so do plenty others. Definitely worth looking at all options this offseason at QB but my guess is the best option will be to stick with dalton while also drafting a 2nd or 3rd rounder to either be a solid backup or overthrow dalton if dalton struggles in 2014.

[Jungle1]

Here ya go
 

 

Thanks.  I thought that was a fair article.  They are right about the AJ drop and Gio fumble too.  Both of those plays could have taken some pressure off and hopefully motivated the defense a little.

[B.A.B.]

Thanks.  I thought that was a fair article.  They are right about the AJ drop and Gio fumble too.  Both of those plays could have taken some pressure off and hopefully motivated the defense a little.

Yeah, very fair article I think. Kinda surprised it comes from ESPN(and not Harvey]

[Bgal]

I knew it had to be ESPN with the constant QBR referencing. Dumb. Good article otherwise.

[Big Alice]

This is true.  But, Brady Belichick managed the game and did not do things to lose.  

Fixed.

 

Tom Brady wasn't asked to become the focus of the Patriots offense until at least his 5th year in the league.  The Manning vs. Brady shit was overblown.  For years it was Manning vs. The Patriots D.

 

Dalton was asked to do too much. 

[|SF2|]

Are we going to draft the next Andy Luck.....no.

 

However, can we draft the next Russell Wilson or Colin Kaepernick?  Certainly.

 

The reality is teams need to decide what is the most important qualities for a QB, rank them, and pick based on that criteria.

 

In no particular order I would say:

 

Arm Strength

Accuracy

Athleticism

Intelligence

Experience (what type of offense in college, competition they faced, for FAs obviously their pro experience)

Attitude (do they get rattled?  Vocal Team leader or one of the guys? )

Upside

 

The one X factor of course is who will be training this guy?   Truth is if Brady had gone to Cleveland instead of New England, he would probably be selling insurance in Ann Arbor and married to Amy Average.

 

With that said, what was our rationale for choosing Andy over say Colin Kaepernick or Ryan Mallet?

 

Mallet, at 6-7 253 is a Ben Roethlisberger clone to include his off the field issues.  Cannon for an arm, played for a big time and successful SEC program at Arkansas.  Not athletic as a runner AT ALL and there were questions about his off the field behavior and character.  Was considered an excellent team leader.   A bit inconsistent.  Huge upside in right program but red flags no doubt.

 

Kaepernick, at 6-5 233 is another big AND very athletic QB with a cannon for an arm.  Played in the WAC which is a lower conference and didn't play in a pro style offense either.  Didn't line up under center in college, did everything from the Pistol.  Team leader, pretty accurate, can make plays with his legs.   Would need to be developed but big upside.  

 

Andy Dalton, at 6-2  215, Good arm strenth.  Played from the spread offense so he had same issue as Kaepernick about being under center.  Average speed, ran a 4.87 40 to Kaepernick's 4.53.   Played in Mountain West which is similar to WAC.  Some upside but most didn't see elite characteristics.   Intelligent and close to starter ready.

 

Basically, we played it safe choosing a guy who had the best chance of being a decent starting QB early over 1 guy who would need some development but had huge upside (although you never know on draft day) and another,  Mallet, who had some other issues to include being an arrogant SOB maybe lacking intelligence and possible drug use.  Mallet too was seen to have huge upside.

 

 

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/ryan-mallett-1.html

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/colin-kaepernick-1.html

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/andy-dalton-1.html

[Slag911]

Are we going to draft the next Andy Luck.....no.

 

However, can we draft the next Russell Wilson or Colin Kaepernick?  Certainly.

 

The reality is teams need to decide what is the most important qualities for a QB, rank them, and pick based on that criteria.

 

In no particular order I would say:

 

Arm Strength

Accuracy

Athleticism

Intelligence

Experience (what type of offense in college, competition they faced, for FAs obviously their pro experience)

Attitude (do they get rattled?  Vocal Team leader or one of the guys? )

 

The one X factor of course is who will be training this guy?   Truth is if Brady had gone to Cleveland instead of New England, he would probably be selling insurance in Ann Arbor and married to Amy Average.

 

With that said, what was our rationale for choosing Andy over say Colin Kaepernick of Ryan Mallet?

 

Mallet, at 6-7 253 is a Ben Roethlisberger clone to include his off the field issues.  Cannon for an arm, played for a big time and successful SEC program at Arkansas.  Not athletic as a runner AT ALL and there were questions about his off the field behavior and character.  Was considered an excellent team leader.   A bit inconsistent.  Huge upside in right program but red flags no doubt.

 

Kaepernick, at 6-5 233 is another big AND very athletic QB with a cannon for an arm.  Played in the WAC which is a lower conference and didn't play in a pro style offense either.  Didn't line up under center in college, did everything from the Pistol.  Team leader, pretty accurate, can make plays with his legs.   Would need to be developed but big upside.  

 

Andy Dalton, at 6-2  215, Good arm strenth.  Played from the spread offense so he had same issue as Kaepernick about being under center.  Average speed, ran a 4.87 40 to Kaepernick's 4.53.   Played in Mountain West which is similar to WAC.  Some upside but most didn't see elite characteristics.   Intelligent and close to starter ready.

 

Basically, we played it safe choosing a guy who had the best chance of being a decent starting QB early over 1 guys who would need some development but had huge upside and another,  Mallet, who had some other issues to include being an arrogant SOB maybe lacking intelligence and possible drug use. 

 

 

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/ryan-mallett-1.html

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/colin-kaepernick-1.html

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/andy-dalton-1.html

 

As with any position, you got to put some competition out there.  I think drafting QB in 1st or 2nd would serve as fair notice that Dalton needs to improve and make better decisions or face benching like Alex Smith did (and then went to the superbowl as a backup).  Unfortunately, it is necessary at this point and it would not hurt to have a QB that could hurt you with his feet like Kaepernick does.  I get sick ever time I see Andy trying to run the ball and it never turns out well.  He does not protect the ball well and usually does not get the yardage or first down anyway.  From an injury perspective, our QB has the biggest drop off in talent on the current roster and I would be a pretty happy fella if they do draft one and give them some options at QB. 

 

Always have a backup plan.

[Bgal]

 
As with any position, you got to put some competition out there.  I think drafting QB in 1st or 2nd would serve as fair notice that Dalton needs to improve and make better decisions or face benching like Alex Smith did (and then went to the superbowl as a backup).  Unfortunately, it is necessary at this point and it would not hurt to have a QB that could hurt you with his feet like Kaepernick does.  I get sick ever time I see Andy trying to run the ball and it never turns out well.  He does not protect the ball well and usually does not get the yardage or first down anyway.  From an injury perspective, our QB has the biggest drop off in talent on the current roster and I would be a pretty happy fella if they do draft one and give them some options at QB. 
 
Always have a backup plan.

I'd rather have Alex Smith than Kaep.

[Orange 'n Black]

 

As with any position, you got to put some competition out there.  I think drafting QB in 1st or 2nd would serve as fair notice that Dalton needs to improve and make better decisions or face benching like Alex Smith did (and then went to the superbowl as a backup).  Unfortunately, it is necessary at this point and it would not hurt to have a QB that could hurt you with his feet like Kaepernick does.  I get sick ever time I see Andy trying to run the ball and it never turns out well.  He does not protect the ball well and usually does not get the yardage or first down anyway.  From an injury perspective, our QB has the biggest drop off in talent on the current roster and I would be a pretty happy fella if they do draft one and give them some options at QB. 

 

Always have a backup plan.

 

If Dalton is their guy in 2014 they won't waste a pick that high on a QB. Not unless something ridiculous happens like Teddy Bridgewater or Johnny Football falling to #24. Much more like to take a 3rd-4th round guy with upside. 

 

Also, Alex Smith played awesome last year, and Kaepernick only started because Smith got hurt. IIRC in the game he got hurt he had a ridiculous statline like 23/24 then got a concussion and had to go out. 

[|SF2|]

I'd rather have Alex Smith than Kaep.

You would rather have a 29 year old with marginal playoff success to a 26 year old who is 3-1 in the playoffs, has won an NFC Championship by bringing his team back from a 17 point deficit on the road and almost brought his team back from a 22 point deficit in the Superbowl?  Dude was 5 yards away from the endzone at the end of the game to take the lead.

[Slag911]

 

If Dalton is their guy in 2014 they won't waste a pick that high on a QB. Not unless something ridiculous happens like Teddy Bridgewater or Johnny Football falling to #24. Much more like to take a 3rd-4th round guy with upside. 

 

Also, Alex Smith played awesome last year, and Kaepernick only started because Smith got hurt. IIRC in the game he got hurt he had a ridiculous statline like 23/24 then got a concussion and had to go out. 

 

You are not wrong but he was benched after they clearly realized what talent they had in Kaepernick.  It was the right call. 

 

http://www.usatoday.com/story/gameon/2012/11/29/nfl-49ers-smith-benched/1735885/

 

Andy is still the best available but you got to have a backup plan and I would have no issues if they grabbed another one early.  They will be available at 24 or in the second round. 

[75North]

Something I ran across thought it was funny...

disclaimer: by no means do I hold Dalton 100% responsible.

[Bgal]

You would rather have a 29 year old with marginal playoff success to a 26 year old who is 3-1 in the playoffs, has won an NFC Championship by bringing his team back from a 17 point deficit on the road and almost brought his team back from a 22 point deficit in the Superbowl?  Dude was 5 yards away from the endzone at the end of the game to take the lead.

I would. I honestly think Smith is the better player.

[Bengal27]

The Chargers hardly qualify as a good team.  And the Charger defense was criticized for not being able to produce any turnovers.  Yet, there was Dalton serving up turnovers on a silver platter for them.  If anything, the Chargers were far and away the worst playoff team...well, besides a Dalton led Bengals team.  This Chargers team struggled and needed a bad call to get past the KC reserves.  And in 2011, the Texans had a rookie 3rd string QB starting who had better numbers than Dalton.  Yet, somehow, that QB isn't even in the discussion as an option for a 2 win team.  Yet, Dalton is the Bengals franchise QB?  Don't even think of excusing Dalton's play with "those were tough teams".  Is that you, Marvin?
 
Even given his advanced age, is there a single Bengals fan that wouldn't trade Dalton for Peyton Manning right now?

Are you talking about the same Charger team that beat Denver in Denver? The one that beat KC in KC when the Chiefs had something to play for. Go ahead, list the Charger weaknesses, just don't forget to list their recent accomplishments and also the fact that Rivers has a QBR over 105 for the year.

[Bgal]

Are you talking about the same Charger team that beat Denver in Denver? The one that beat KC in KC when the Chiefs had something to play for. Go ahead, list the Charger weaknesses, just don't forget to list their recent accomplishments and also the fact that Rivers has a QBR over 105 for the year.

I wish QBR would go away.

[B.A.B.]

I would. I honestly think Smith is the better player.

Better QB? Maybe. Big maybe. Better football player? You're out of your mind. Kaep can win games with his arms or legs and has done both.

[oldschooler]

Would You Bet On Andy Dalton?

 

 

Mo Egger

 

As fans, we talk about Andy Dalton and talk about things like "having his back," supporting him, or whether it's okay to boo him.  Really though, the entire discussion about both the present and future of the Bengals quarterback is about none of those things.

 

It's about whether the Bengals will invest heavily in him.  And if you understand what an investment really is - in essence, a wager - the question is whether the Bengals should bet on Andy Dalton.

 

Would you?

 

The reason why this season was so important, other than for the obvious mechanics of finally winning a postseason game while continuing to repair the franchise's relationship with the public, was that it would help shape the future of the Bengals.  Franchise-shaping decisions for the next decade were going to be made based in part on what happened and how much success the Bengals and their most important players and their coach had this season.

 

And with it now in the rear-view mirror, the Bengals are, at least with their quarterback, stuck.

 

If you pay him the going rate for a perennial playoff quarterback this offseason, you've decided that the franchise will revolve around a guy who has more questions hovering over him than ever before.  And you have to deal with the inevitable roster and payroll ramifications that will come with throwing so much money at him.

 

If you don't pay him while staying relatively pat at his position, in a way you put the entire organization at the mercy of Andy Dalton.  Andy could holdout this summer, and pretty much wish the team best of luck with Josh Johnson or Zac Robinson running the team.  And if could pull a Joe Flacco and have a breakout 2014, raising his price tag and putting the Bengals in jeopardy of potentially losing him.  And again, you'd have to figure out how to keep a ton of other soon-to-be free agents while now drastically overpaying to keep your QB

 

So what do you do?

 

You've got to add to the position.  They've built up great depth at most of the other positions, so why not do the same at the most important position?  Why not have another quarterback you could at least put in the game?  What's wrong with a little competition for the incumbent?  And if you're not totally willing to bet on the guy you already have, don't you have to hedge that decision with a workable plan B? 

 

And would there be anything wrong with having a valuable trading chip if Andy does break through next season?

 

That's the question facing the Bengals at this very moment.  You and I can make it about everything else.  For the Bengals it's about whether or not they like Andy Dalton enough right now to bet on him.

 

 

2)  Marvin Lewis.  Marvin's somewhat testy press conference wasn't very revealing.  They never are and that's fine.  The one thing that did stand out what this...

"We need to continue to do things to make his job just easier and easier to do."

How much easier can they make it?  Rig the radio in his helmet so you can talk to him during the play and tell him where to throw the ball?  Allow him an extra down per drive?  Use a smaller ball?  Didn't they make it easier for him this past offseason? 

They've assembled a good core of skill players, invested in a decent offensive line, added a new dynamic to the running game, and built one of the NFL's best defenses.  Can improvements be made?   Sure.  But at some point you have to tell the quarterback to take advantage of what he has.

And Andy Dalton has a lot.

Read more: http://www.espn1530.com/pages/mo.html?article=11951339#ixzz2pjgHO2ry

[B.A.B.]

Are you talking about the same Charger team that beat Denver in Denver? The one that beat KC in KC when the Chiefs had something to play for. Go ahead, list the Charger weaknesses, just don't forget to list their recent accomplishments and also the fact that Rivers has a QBR over 105 for the year.

Yeah, the same Chargers team we beat in their own fucking stadium. You people are insufferable.

[Bengal27]

In 1981, Kenny Anderson threw 3 interceptions in the first half in a game against the Seattle Seahawks.  Do you think head coach Forest Gregg told him that's OK, Kenny, you're still our guy?
 
Hell no, he BENCHED his ass and let the backup QB play the entire second half.
 
Guess what--that benching lit a fire under Anderson's ass and he responded by winning the MVP and taking us all the way to the Superbowl.
 
There is no way Marvin would ever do that--he's too soft.  But I have NO DOUBT that if Zimmer were named head coach he would bench Andy's ass if/when he continues to fuck up.

Anderson was also coming off a terrible 4-12 season in 1980. Completely different circumstances not to mention Anderson was a long term veteran at the time. People thought his good years were behind him.

[B.A.B.]

Would You Bet On Andy Dalton?

 

 

Mo Egger

 

As fans, we talk about Andy Dalton and talk about things like "having his back," supporting him, or whether it's okay to boo him.  Really though, the entire discussion about both the present and future of the Bengals quarterback is about none of those things.

 

It's about whether the Bengals will invest heavily in him.  And if you understand what an investment really is - in essence, a wager - the question is whether the Bengals should bet on Andy Dalton.

 

Would you?

 

The reason why this season was so important, other than for the obvious mechanics of finally winning a postseason game while continuing to repair the franchise's relationship with the public, was that it would help shape the future of the Bengals.  Franchise-shaping decisions for the next decade were going to be made based in part on what happened and how much success the Bengals and their most important players and their coach had this season.

 

And with it now in the rear-view mirror, the Bengals are, at least with their quarterback, stuck.

 

If you pay him the going rate for a perennial playoff quarterback this offseason, you've decided that the franchise will revolve around a guy who has more questions hovering over him than ever before.  And you have to deal with the inevitable roster and payroll ramifications that will come with throwing so much money at him.

 

If you don't pay him while staying relatively pat at his position, in a way you put the entire organization at the mercy of Andy Dalton.  Andy could holdout this summer, and pretty much wish the team best of luck with Josh Johnson or Zac Robinson running the team.  And if could pull a Joe Flacco and have a breakout 2014, raising his price tag and putting the Bengals in jeopardy of potentially losing him.  And again, you'd have to figure out how to keep a ton of other soon-to-be free agents while now drastically overpaying to keep your QB

 

So what do you do?

 

You've got to add to the position.  They've built up great depth at most of the other positions, so why not do the same at the most important position?  Why not have another quarterback you could at least put in the game?  What's wrong with a little competition for the incumbent?  And if you're not totally willing to bet on the guy you already have, don't you have to hedge that decision with a workable plan B? 

 

And would there be anything wrong with having a valuable trading chip if Andy does break through next season?

 

That's the question facing the Bengals at this very moment.  You and I can make it about everything else.  For the Bengals it's about whether or not they like Andy Dalton enough right now to bet on him.

 

 

2)  Marvin Lewis.  Marvin's somewhat testy press conference wasn't very revealing.  They never are and that's fine.  The one thing that did stand out what this...

"We need to continue to do things to make his job just easier and easier to do."

How much easier can they make it?  Rig the radio in his helmet so you can talk to him during the play and tell him where to throw the ball?  Allow him an extra down per drive?  Use a smaller ball?  Didn't they make it easier for him this past offseason? 

They've assembled a good core of skill players, invested in a decent offensive line, added a new dynamic to the running game, and built one of the NFL's best defenses.  Can improvements be made?   Sure.  But at some point you have to tell the quarterback to take advantage of what he has.

And Andy Dalton has a lot.

Read more: http://www.espn1530.com/pages/mo.html?article=11951339#ixzz2pjgHO2ry

 

They ALL said that it was this year. No excuses this year. How the fuck are you going to make it that much easier for him besides getting rid of Gruden who doesn't know how to gameplan for goddamn shit. But the Bengals would keep him anyways if he didn't get hired as a HC, so what the fuck are you going to make easier for him, Marvin? How many weapons does this guy need to be successful? Its all just ridiculous.

[Bengal27]

Yeah, the same Chargers team we beat in their own fucking stadium. You people are insufferable.

No, you're someone that should take your education a little more serious because you come off very ignorant. What happened to you leaving the site? Your words mean zip.

[oldschooler]

[Dautcom08]

No clue where Boyd is projected, but I think he'd be good to bring in for competition.

[Bengals1181]

No clue where Boyd is projected, but I think he'd be good to bring in for competition.

 

 

I like Boyd as well.

[B.A.B.]

No, you're someone that should take your education a little more serious because you come off very ignorant. What happened to you leaving the site? Your words mean zip.

Then ignore me, you fucking moron. The option has always been there. If you choose not to, then get the fuck over it. Attack my intelligence and not my obviously fucking valid point that Marvin got shitted on by a rookie HC in the playoffs? LOL. Very nice. Who are you gonna deflect the blame to next? Running out of excuses, motherfucker.