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Guns in America


MichaelWeston

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On 2/15/2018 at 9:39 PM, USN Bengal said:

I've seen "reports" that he was a white supremacist, an Antifa supporter, just a lone psycho...

 

WHO THE FUCK CARES?

 

Either way, something has to change.

 

I am a strong supporter of the Second Amendment, but that doesn't mean that this shit should EVER be allowed to happen.

 

1. Fuck the NRA and anyone who supports them

2. Aberrant mental health records need to be shared immediately and nationally

3. Military should be COMMANDED to send all offenses to national reporting network, so that outside sources are aware

4. Make background checks mean something... ENFORCE THIS SHIT

5. Anyone selling firearms have to pass a clearance check like I did when I had to get a TS in the military (VERY effective for those that don't know)

5. Anyone who wants to own or carry weapons (I am one of those) should be REQUIRED to show proficiency in use (at least every other year), mental stability, and demonstrate the absolute ability to be able to keep them secure

6. NATION COMMON SENSE GUN LAWS should be enacted

7. ALL SCHOOLS MUST HAVE ARMED GUARDS AND METAL DETECTORS

 

Don't disarm America, just make damn sure that those who do have weapons are responsible and sane.

 

My $.02...

I have a couple thoughts. I agree with a ton of what you say here and am only speaking to the things I don't or that I have been having thoughts about recently. I completely agree with the basic premise here. We don't need to get rid of all guns. We need to have way fewer guns and they need to be in the hands of people who are responsible with them.

 

1. Mental health is not a static, concrete thing. It is virtually impossible to have this happen nationally. If I get diagnosed with an anxiety disorder because my wife of 10 years sleeps with a republican do I not get a gun forever? 10 years? etc. (that is not true but you get the idea). We have (since Reagan) pushed the mentally ill out of facilities and on to the streets. We absolutely need to find a way to fix mental health but there will always be holes because of the nature of mental health. 

2. 22 vets kill themselves a day. That tells me that a large number of the people with the very best training are dealing with extreme mental health issues. I have had the opportunity to be around a lot of vets recently not in a mental health setting and I am a bit shocked by how prevalent the prepper/If someone comes into my house I am going to shoot them/ mentality is. I don't have an issue with someone protecting there home, its just how often and how this has come up in conversations. I do have to say that the people who say this are the loudest voices in the room and kind of consume the air, it is not like they are a monopoly of the voices. I am just surprised by how often it comes up. Like they constantly are trying to prove something. I am in a setting where they are a bit out of their comfort zone so I think/hope it's just a product of them feeling a bit weak so they are outwardly trying to project strength. It's just unsettling how prevalent it is. 

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On 2/16/2018 at 1:20 AM, BengalBacker said:

My NRA membership expired a couple of weeks ago. I just renewed for 5 more years.

 

Shall not be infringed,

 

Molon Labe.

 

And fuck anyone who blames the NRA for shit like this.

 

I won't debate this, it's not up for debate to me. Everyone has chosen their side. I seldom even read anything here anyway, so if you want to respond you'll be talking to each other, not me.

See ya.

It's clearly partially the NRA's fault and your inability to be balanced on the internet tells me I am not sure you should be a gun owner. 

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12 hours ago, USN Bengal said:

T-Dub... I don’t pretend to have the answers, but as long as ALL THE POLITICIANS eat out of the NRAs hands, this is all a moot point.

 

Instead of EVERYONE calmly getting together and attempting to truly address the problem in a COMMON SENSE manner... you see the bullshit start “he’s Antifa, he’s a white supremacist, he’s an alien”!!!!!!

 

It doesn’t fucking matter what ANY killer is... we have to stop it.

 

As far as the “hands off if you’re a white supremacist”, I would like to ask you this about our leaders;

 

Since the inception of the KNOWN hate group, the KKK, why has NO President called them a terrorist organization?

 

Not a damned one... fucking DHS has labeled BLM and Antifa as domestic terrorist organizations... but NOT the KKK?

 

WTF?

 

If you don’t think that the politicians LOVE all this chaos, you’re fooling yourself. Soros, Koch brothers, and the rest of the puppet masters have set this up with their political figureheads.

 

Go ahead and believe that I’m a “crazy conspiracy theorist”, but there isn’t anything else that makes sense to me.

 

If you want to go by statistics, it’s supposedly white male liberal democrats with mental health issues that commit most mass shootings.

 

We really don’t know the truth about their political leanings, because “facts” are made up by EVERY “news” organization that exists, and mental health reporting is “violating people’s privacy”... catch 22.

 

People were railing on Trump for repealing Obama’s attempt to have 75,000 senior citizens not allowed to have guns because they couldn’t manage their financial affairs. That law was a joke, Obama was a joke, and Trumpnis currently a joke.

 

So people can say that it’s one party or the others fault... but let’s look at reality, shall we?

 

The strictest guns laws have not worked in the big cities and states they have been enacted. Why is this?

These are democratically controlled cities and states... so neither party is making ANYTHING work against gun violence.

 

I have been mugged twice, and there was a home invasion with fatalities a quarter of a mile away from where I live 6 months ago (thank you opioid epidemic). I feel that I have the right to defend myself and family from any of that happening again, so I have my concealed carry. I have been trained in small arms for the past 35 years, having to show proficiency EVERY YEAR.

 

I live in the boonies of Virginia, not in a city... so those that love to say shit like “move if you aren’t safe”... I say fuck off. There is NOWHERE safe anymore... unless you’re a politician or a 1%er who has armed security.

 

Now, that being said, I grew up poor as hell and if we wanted to eat meat... we shot it. I’ve been heavy my whole life, so not only were we good hunters, we only needed shotguns.

 

There is no need for an AR-15, a bump stock, or any other weapon besides a shotgun for hunting. Now shooting at ranges, that’s a different story.

 

I like to shoot, so I go to ranges to shoot the rifles I do own. I’m not a threat to anyone, so why should my guns be taken away?

 

I don’t NEED the M1 Garand and Carbine I own, but they were my grandfathers from WW2. I have been shooting them for over 40 years, haven’t killed anyone yet... so why should I even think about giving up any weapon I own?

 

That being said... if I knew that me giving up my rifles could save one life, I’d do it in a heartbeat.

 

The mentally ill and criminal element will not give a rats ass about ANY law, and if they want to kill they will find a way.

 

So when I say “common sense” gun laws, I mean NOT disarming America like some want to do. I also mean doing SMART things like armed guards and metal detectors at ALL schools.

 

Schools have been made soft targets by the completely asinine “gun free zones” that the dumbfucks enacted. I mean seriously... our children are sent somewhere where criminals and psychos KNOW  there are no threats to them. How fucking ignorant is that?

 

Since there is no utopia, I should be able to exercise my second amendment rights to defend myself and my family against criminals AND the possibility of a tyrannical government.

 

Get rid of AR-15s, large capacity magazines, and other “assault style weapons “...but don’t take away my defenses.

 

I’m sorry that you feel “common sense” is a nebulous term meant to quash debate, but I feel you ASSUMING that is what I meant is the bigger threat to any debate, and a microcosm of where we are as a nation.

 

Everyone assumes I am an NRA supporter because I carry a weapon... been called a Nazi, deplorable, misogynist, homophobe, and a racist... BECAUSE I CARRY A GUN!

 

I have also been called a tree hugging liberal commie because I don’t support the NRA, believe gay people should have the same rights as heterosexuals, and that racism is a systemic and socioeconomic problem that he’s been passed down from generation to generation and accepted by most because “it’s too hard to stand up against the lemmings “.

 

People don’t even TRY to debate, they just go on assumptions given to them by the group mindfuck that currently rules our country.

 

I’m done rambling... I need a drink, some aleve, and about 36 hours of sleep.

Great post. I don't agree with all of it but it's well reasoned. 

 

Couple thoughts. 

1. It matters a bit where they come from because we need to be able to sniff out threats. 

2. Gun laws don't work in some areas because we have no borders. Chicago has no border. Guns can get in easily. Would they work? No idea. I really don't know if that's the real solution but it's not not the solution because of the borders. 

3. I don't mind people having AR-15s but it's on them to give the rest of society a reasonable plan to keep them out of the hands of people who are threats. 

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37 minutes ago, MichaelWeston said:

It's clearly partially the NRA's fault and your inability to be balanced on the internet tells me I am not sure you should be a gun owner. 

 

 

You're talking to yourself, literally and figuratively.

He said as much in his post you quoted and the fact he sent me a message a year ago

telling me he wasn't my friend anymore because it was "time to choose sides"

and I am on the other side. Basically his enemy on the subject, which makes me

not worthy of anything but disdain on all subjects, especially this one.

 

He sent me that message right in the middle of one of the worst times of my life.

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13 minutes ago, oldschooler said:

 

 

You're talking to yourself, literally and figuratively.

He said as much in his post you quoted and the fact he sent me a message a year ago

telling me he wasn't my friend anymore because it was "time to choose sides"

and I am on the other side. Basically his enemy on the subject, which makes me

not worthy of anything but disdain on all subjects, especially this one.

 

He sent me that message right in the middle of one of the worst times of my life.

These are the people we are worried about having guns. Maybe that's why they have a kung fu grip. 

 

Sorry to hear rough times man. Glad to have you back. You are a part of the fabric of this place. 

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One of the first things Trump did to Make America Great was this ...

 

Trump Signs Bill Revoking Obama-Era Gun Checks for People With Mental Illnesses

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/trump-signs-bill-revoking-obama-era-gun-checks-people-mental-n727221

 

 

Then after the Vegas shooting, he said it wasn't a gun issue and talked about mental illness and evil. After Parkland he talked about mental illness, evil

and making schools safer. 

 

His new budget actually cuts funding to help the mentally ill and making schools safer.  

 

Budget undercuts Trump focus on mental health, school safety

https://www.yahoo.com/news/budget-undercuts-trump-focus-mental-053727242.html

 

 

I guess he just wants Mike Pence and the evangelicals to fix the "evil problem" ...

 

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Old... you will ALWAYS be a friend, first and foremost.

 

Obamas gun check that was overturned was a fucking joke and was there to pay lip service to gun control. It affected ONLY about 75,000 senior citizens who had supposedly shown mental incapacity to handle their financial affairs, so he wanted to check their mental health and take away their gun rights.

 

While I agree that gun laws and usage HAS to change... did you know there was already a machine gun in use at the time the second amendment was being written?

 

Seriously, it was invented by a Brit in the early 1700s and had already been shipped around the world. Capable of shooting between 9-12 rounds a minute. Fast when compared to a muzzle loader.

 

I didn’t realize the NRA was around back then! 

 

LMAO 

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2 hours ago, USN Bengal said:

Old... you will ALWAYS be a friend, first and foremost.

 

Thanks man. Great to know. One of the saddest things about the world these days 

is Americans failing to see other Americans are not their enemy.

 

You think ISIS, a mass shooter, a Russian troll, a North Korean bomb or anything like that

cares if we're a Liberal, Conservative, Gun hater, Gun Lover, Trump Supporter, Trump hater ect?

 

We might not all agree, but we are all on the same team.

 

Quote

 

Obamas gun check that was overturned was a fucking joke and was there to pay lip service to gun control. It affected ONLY about 75,000 senior citizens who had supposedly shown mental incapacity to handle their financial affairs, so he wanted to check their mental health and take away their gun rights.

 

 

75,000 people that can't can't work because of mental illness, or be trusted to handle their own money, but can handle their own gun.

I don't see that as a joke. 

 

For someone to be unable to buy a gun because of mental illness, is for law enforcement to take them

to a mental hospital against his or her will for an initial evaluation. If after 72 hours the doctors observing

the individual want to continue that treatment, then they can petition a court for permission, even against

the patient's wishes.

 

The other way to wind up in the database that could cause an individual to fail a background check for mental illness

is if a court or government body were to rule that due to his mental health, a person is a danger to himself or others

or is unable to manage his own affairs.

 

But Trump weakened that when he overturned Obama's gun check. And federal law does not require states to make 

mental health records as part of the background checks anyway. And you can buy guns from online classified ads, 

a yard sale, gun show or anyone that is not a licensed gun shop without any background check at all.

 

 

Quote

 

While I agree that gun laws and usage HAS to change... did you know there was already a machine gun in use at the time the second amendment was being written?

 

Seriously, it was invented by a Brit in the early 1700s and had already been shipped around the world. Capable of shooting between 9-12 rounds a minute. Fast when compared to a muzzle loader.

 

I didn’t realize the NRA was around back then! 

 

LMAO 

 

Did you know the people that wrote the Constitution were for gun registration?

Did you know they disarmed the civilian population during the Revolution?

Did you know they made laws against storing guns loaded?

Did you know they thought you had the duty to retreat and deadly force was justified only if no other alternative was possible?

Did you know the notion that the 2nd Amendment was made to protect

a right to take up arms against the government is absurd? 

the Constitution itself defines such an act as treason.

 

 

 

I am not against people owning guns. But I against the wrong people owning guns.

I don't think you being born gives you a right to own a guy. Rights are laws.

Laws are made and some times amended. People that talk about "Shall not be infringed upon" are idiots.

If you actually believe that, then you believe everyone has the "right" to a gun, PERIOD. NO EXCEPTIONS.

 

All I know is we have a major problem in this country. And it's not getting any better or going to fix itself.

 

I get why the NRA has their stance and positions. They're a mouth piece for gun manufacturers. Their job is

to make as much $$$ as possible. They think any "ban", law or regulation is a product or customer lost.

It's the dumbass citizens in this country that watch other Americans, especially kids get gunned down and

act like the 2nd amendment is written in stone and poses an obstacle to enacting

sensible gun laws, that's the problem. The failure to do so is not the Constitution's fault ... it is all of ours.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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