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schotzee

Fire Marvin Lewis crowd should be mindful of history

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He'll win a superbowl and I don't think it will be that far out...If Dalton fails we'll get a top pick in the draft and get a qb.

 

Really unfortunate we didn't get luck and just suck for him....Would be insane if we had luck on this team.

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Who knows?   The inaction after 2013 haunts us.   Zimmer.  Bridgewater.   2014 was a tough coaching year injuries and all. 

 

 

We could easyily be looking at 2011-2015 as the most successful regular season era in franchise history and not even get a Conference Championship appearance.

 

 

Holy fuck! 

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You know I'm feeling somewhat charitable today....somewhat

 

I'd take luck 11 times out of 10 over Andy

 

 

But Luck wouldn't have gotten to the QB in that playoff game

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I refuse to be scared by the boogeyman of the pre-Marvin years to mean that we cannot do better than Marvin now. 

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I refuse to be scared by the boogeyman of the pre-Marvin years to mean that we cannot do better than Marvin now. 

 

True.      Are we going to fire Marvin and....

 

1. Move out of PBS and into a stadium and sign a lease with half the revenue?

2. Change out the training equipment and program with the Excerise for Dummies book from the 70s?

3. Put Pete Brown and Lippy back in charge of scouting and shit can Tobin and the rest? 

4. Hire a "yes" man to replace and force them to play younger players based on salary?

 

 

If that's the case, then I'm against firing Marvin.    Although I believe Marvin was a good change but 1 of many that have occurred since 2002 and I'm not convinced firing him reverses all of that.

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I hate the 'don't fire him because it could be worse' argument. In Atlanta they say that about Mark Richt all the time (not a uga fan).

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True.      Are we going to fire Marvin and....

 

1. Move out of PBS and into a stadium and sign a lease with half the revenue?

2. Change out the training equipment and program with the Excerise for Dummies book from the 70s?

3. Put Pete Brown and Lippy back in charge of scouting and shit can Tobin and the rest? 

4. Hire a "yes" man to replace and force them to play younger players based on salary?

 

 

If that's the case, then I'm against firing Marvin.    Although I believe Marvin was a good change but 1 of many that have occurred since 2002 and I'm not convinced firing him reverses all of that.

 

 

True.      Are we going to fire Marvin and....

 

1. Move out of PBS and into a stadium and sign a lease with half the revenue?

2. Change out the training equipment and program with the Excerise for Dummies book from the 70s?

3. Put Pete Brown and Lippy back in charge of scouting and shit can Tobin and the rest? 

4. Hire a "yes" man to replace and force them to play younger players based on salary?

 

 

If that's the case, then I'm against firing Marvin.    Although I believe Marvin was a good change but 1 of many that have occurred since 2002 and I'm not convinced firing him reverses all of that.

I agree.  The Bengals, as an organization, have transcended their status as one of the dregs of professional sports.

 

A new head coach wouldn't even be able to relate to the goat fuck that Marvin Lewis took over.  At this point Mike Brown has been as loyal as anyone could ever have been to a head coach.  And, frankly, Marvin Lewis has reached a point where there'd be no dishonor in parting ways with the Bengals.  That should mean that the time is right for Brown and Lewis to call it a day.  

 

Howevah... it doesn't look likely.  And while a new head coach might come in here and light the world on fire, there's at least as much chance that there wouldn't be a positive impact.  That's why a coaching change falls into Mike Brown's category of "change for the sake of change."  He won't pull the trigger.  

 

Is there any reason to feel good about that?

 

In my mind, yes, but only because there aren't any realistic options out there that actually KNOW how to be the head coach of a Super Bowl champion.  Anybody the Bengals bring in is going to be making it up as they go along just like Lewis was when he was hired.  Lewis has made every mistake there is to make.  At some point, he's going to get it right.  And by getting it wrong in so many different ways over the past 12 years, the odds are in his favor that he'll crack the code soon. 

 

Head coaches don't run the 40 or bench press 225.  There's no tape on them.  Success somewhere else at whatever level does not translate well.  The list of coaches that have had REAL success at multiple NFL stops is very, very short.  So the notion that you can simply plug in any random guy in to the head coach's seat and count on a certain result is nonsense.  There's far too much psychology involved.  What works to motivate one player doesn't necessarily work for another.  Predicting the net benefit or harm when you factor that out 53 times is futile.  Then consider the internal politics of the front office.  Sound relationships there are critical.  Marvin, for all of his failings, has been the architect of the Bengals infrastructure, and the results have been awesome.  That's not debatable.  Does anyone truly believe that Mike Brown is willing to allow anyone else to come in and have as much authority as he's ceded to Marvin?

 

There is undoubtedly SOMEBODY out there that could have guided this Bengals team to a Conference Championship at least once in the last 4 years.  The problem is twofold... NO ONE will ever know who those guys are.  AND, there are is a looooong list of head coaches who could not have gotten the Bengals into the postseason in each of the past 4 years.  If you want your mind blown, consider for a second that somebody might actually be on both of those lists.

 

For better or for worse, Mike Brown's not firing Marvin Lewis this year.  However, I'm not yet 100% certain that Marvin'g not going to walk away.

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I agree.  The Bengals, as an organization, have transcended their status as one of the dregs of professional sports.
 
A new head coach wouldn't even be able to relate to the goat fuck that Marvin Lewis took over.  At this point Mike Brown has been as loyal as anyone could ever have been to a head coach.  And, frankly, Marvin Lewis has reached a point where there'd be no dishonor in parting ways with the Bengals.  That should mean that the time is right for Brown and Lewis to call it a day.  
 
Howevah... it doesn't look likely.  And while a new head coach might come in here and light the world on fire, there's at least as much chance that there wouldn't be a positive impact.  That's why a coaching change falls into Mike Brown's category of "change for the sake of change."  He won't pull the trigger.  
 
Is there any reason to feel good about that?
 
In my mind, yes, but only because there aren't any realistic options out there that actually KNOW how to be the head coach of a Super Bowl champion.  Anybody the Bengals bring in is going to be making it up as they go along just like Lewis was when he was hired.  Lewis has made every mistake there is to make.  At some point, he's going to get it right.  And by getting it wrong in so many different ways over the past 12 years, the odds are in his favor that he'll crack the code soon. 
 
Head coaches don't run the 40 or bench press 225.  There's no tape on them.  Success somewhere else at whatever level does not translate well.  The list of coaches that have had REAL success at multiple NFL stops is very, very short.  So the notion that you can simply plug in any random guy in to the head coach's seat and count on a certain result is nonsense.  There's far too much psychology involved.  What works to motivate one player doesn't necessarily work for another.  Predicting the net benefit or harm when you factor that out 53 times is futile.  Then consider the internal politics of the front office.  Sound relationships there are critical.  Marvin, for all of his failings, has been the architect of the Bengals infrastructure, and the results have been awesome.  That's not debatable.  Does anyone truly believe that Mike Brown is willing to allow anyone else to come in and have as much authority as he's ceded to Marvin?
 
There is undoubtedly SOMEBODY out there that could have guided this Bengals team to a Conference Championship at least once in the last 4 years.  The problem is twofold... NO ONE will ever know who those guys are.  AND, there are is a looooong list of head coaches who could not have gotten the Bengals into the postseason in each of the past 4 years.  If you want your mind blown, consider for a second that somebody might actually be on both of those lists.
 
For better or for worse, Mike Brown's not firing Marvin Lewis this year.  However, I'm not yet 100% certain that Marvin'g not going to walk away.



Nice post. Are saying you're not 100% sure Marvin won't walk away this year?

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Is it Mike being too loyal, or does he honestly believe in his heart that there is no one better suited to bring a championship than Lewis at this point?

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I refuse to be scared by the boogeyman of the pre-Marvin years to mean that we cannot do better than Marvin now. 

 

 

SO.MUCH.THIS.

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Is it Mike being too loyal, or does he honestly believe in his heart that there is no one better suited to bring a championship than Lewis at this point?

 

When directly asked he always goes back to when his Dad was fired and how it effects those families.   How he lived through it. 

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Is it Mike being too loyal, or does he honestly believe in his heart that there is no one better suited to bring a championship than Lewis at this point?

 

I think at this point it's more about comfort level than anything. Mike is very old and there may be nothing old people hate more than change.

 

Until Mike is in no way making decisions, I don't see Marvin going anywhere. Hell I wouldn't even be surprised at another extension before next season starts.

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When directly asked he always goes back to when his Dad was fired and how it effects those families.   How he lived through it. 


I see, but don't you think he had a way out to part ways w/o firing a couple years back? Ie. he could've chosen not to resign him.

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When directly asked he always goes back to when his Dad was fired and how it effects those families.   How he lived through it. 

 

I think that's a cop out. Back then I'm sure it had a huge effect, but not now days. The times have changed, especially for head coaches.

 

Marvin has been here 12 years and made tens of millions of dollars.

 

Mike could fire him tomorrow and he would ride off into the sunset to his Arizona mansion and never work another day in his life.

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I think that's a cop out. Back then I'm sure it had a huge effect, but not now days. The times have changed, especially for head coaches.
 
Marvin has been here 12 years and made tens of millions of dollars.
 
Mike could fire him tomorrow and he would ride off into the sunset to his Arizona mansion and never work another day in his life.


Not only that, but I honestly believe he would have other suitors to have him for a head coach.

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I see, but don't you think he had a way out to part ways w/o firing a couple years back? Ie. he could've chosen not to resign him.

 

After 2010?  Yeah that would be great to get those details in a book.        

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I think that's a cop out. Back then I'm sure it had a huge effect, but not now days. The times have changed, especially for head coaches.

 

Marvin has been here 12 years and made tens of millions of dollars.

 

Mike could fire him tomorrow and he would ride off into the sunset to his Arizona mansion and never work another day in his life.

 

I agree.   That's just what he says on the issue.

 

IMO, is he's found someone that can get decent results that's willing to work within the way they choose to do business.

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I agree.  The Bengals, as an organization, have transcended their status as one of the dregs of professional sports.

 

A new head coach wouldn't even be able to relate to the goat fuck that Marvin Lewis took over.  At this point Mike Brown has been as loyal as anyone could ever have been to a head coach.  And, frankly, Marvin Lewis has reached a point where there'd be no dishonor in parting ways with the Bengals.  That should mean that the time is right for Brown and Lewis to call it a day.  

 

Howevah... it doesn't look likely.  And while a new head coach might come in here and light the world on fire, there's at least as much chance that there wouldn't be a positive impact.  That's why a coaching change falls into Mike Brown's category of "change for the sake of change."  He won't pull the trigger.  

 

Is there any reason to feel good about that?

 

In my mind, yes, but only because there aren't any realistic options out there that actually KNOW how to be the head coach of a Super Bowl champion.  Anybody the Bengals bring in is going to be making it up as they go along just like Lewis was when he was hired.  Lewis has made every mistake there is to make.  At some point, he's going to get it right.  And by getting it wrong in so many different ways over the past 12 years, the odds are in his favor that he'll crack the code soon. 

 

Head coaches don't run the 40 or bench press 225.  There's no tape on them.  Success somewhere else at whatever level does not translate well.  The list of coaches that have had REAL success at multiple NFL stops is very, very short.  So the notion that you can simply plug in any random guy in to the head coach's seat and count on a certain result is nonsense.  There's far too much psychology involved.  What works to motivate one player doesn't necessarily work for another.  Predicting the net benefit or harm when you factor that out 53 times is futile.  Then consider the internal politics of the front office.  Sound relationships there are critical.  Marvin, for all of his failings, has been the architect of the Bengals infrastructure, and the results have been awesome.  That's not debatable.  Does anyone truly believe that Mike Brown is willing to allow anyone else to come in and have as much authority as he's ceded to Marvin?

 

There is undoubtedly SOMEBODY out there that could have guided this Bengals team to a Conference Championship at least once in the last 4 years.  The problem is twofold... NO ONE will ever know who those guys are.  AND, there are is a looooong list of head coaches who could not have gotten the Bengals into the postseason in each of the past 4 years.  If you want your mind blown, consider for a second that somebody might actually be on both of those lists.

 

For better or for worse, Mike Brown's not firing Marvin Lewis this year.  However, I'm not yet 100% certain that Marvin'g not going to walk away.

 

Or he may never crack the code, ala Marty Shottenheimer.  You very well may be right, and Marvin might finally catch lightening in a bottle for one season postseason, and that's really all you need, no?  I'll sit here patiently and await the crow that I'm hoping comes my way, but I fear that I will remain hungry in the near future.

 

Great post overall though... 

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Not only that, but I honestly believe he would have other suitors to have him for a head coach.


If Marvin was fired tomorrow, he could be back to work by Monday.

Two things... I don't think he's feels close to being done. And I think he would (will) be very picky about his next job.

By the time he signed in Cincinnati, he'd become desperate for a chance. At this point, his track record would allow him to call his shot.

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If Marvin was fired tomorrow, he could be back to work by Monday.

Two things... I don't think he's feels close to being done. And I think he would (will) be very picky about his next job.

By the time he signed in Cincinnati, he'd become desperate for a chance. At this point, his track record would allow him to call his shot.

 

 No team is hiring Marvin Lewis to be the guy to take a playoff team to the next level.     

 

That's the issue here.

 

He'd get chances like Marty Schottenhiemer to rebuild losing teams.  Probably like Marty be replaced when he flatlined again.

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