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War in Iraq? Israel behind the scenes?


Guest steggyD

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Guest steggyD
Alright, it is a very long article, so I will post the link only. Maybe I will come back later and quote some important parts of it. Anyways, I know some of the people on this forum like to call Israel terrorists and such. And even I question the validity of us being in Iraq. I liked to always say that it was because of countries switching to the Euros from the US dollar. I found it to be more valid than for oil. I just don't buy the whole oil thing, it is too costly to go to war for oil. I'm looking for a deeper conspiracy than the simple dummies who say, "no blood for oil".

Well, here it is. The article goes to say that Israel has an entire strategy for the Middle East, plans to divide it by having the United States attack Iraq, etc.

[url="http://english.pravda.ru/mailbox/22/98/387/9770_moslem.html"]Behind the Scenes of the Iraq War[/url]
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Guest steggyD
OK, I'll quote the opener, a teaser, if you will...

[quote][b]Behind the Scenes of the Iraq War[/b]
04/17/2003 13:47
The plan for the Iraq war, which has erupted in the face of opposition from the entire world, was drawn up at least decades ago, by Israeli strategists
In its attempt to realize its strategy of destabilizing or dividing the Middle Eastern Arab states, Israel has Egypt, Syria, Iran and Saudi Arabia on its list of subsequent targets.

As these lines are being written, the United States of America has begun striking at Iraq. Despite the fact that most countries of the world, and even the majority of the USA's allies, opposed it, the US administration was determined for the strike to go ahead. When we look behind the scenes of this insistence, it seems that Israel and its powerful lobby in the US, have the greatest share in the make-up.

In fact, Israel's policy aimed at the fragmentation of Iraq has lengthy historical roots…[/quote]
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Guest bengalrick
[i]The first indication of this plan emerged in 1997. A group of pro-Israeli hawkish strategists in Washington D.C. began to put forward the scenario of the invasion of Iraq by manipulating the "neo-con" think-tank, called PNAC (Project for The New American Century). The most notable names in the PNAC were those of Donald Rumsfeld and Dick Cheney, who as defense secretary and vice-president would be the most influential figures in the George W. Bush administration.[/i]

very interesting... though imo, this article is only based off of assumuptions... but i did a google search on [url="http://www.newamericancentury.org/statementofprinciples.htm"]PNAC[/url] and i found an article.. sure as fuck, there is cheney and rummie's name on the bottom... but the talking points are no where near what they are seeming to suggest:

[b]Our aim is to remind Americans of these lessons and to draw their consequences for today. Here are four consequences:

• we need to increase defense spending significantly if we are to carry out our global responsibilities today and modernize our armed forces for the future;

• we need to strengthen our ties to democratic allies and to challenge regimes hostile to our interests and values;

• we need to promote the cause of political and economic freedom abroad;

• we need to accept responsibility for America's unique role in preserving and extending an international order friendly to our security, our prosperity, and our principles.[/b]

this is very "reagonish" but we have to remember that reagan had the most effective foreign policy tactics in my generation... why not use his strategy?? the key to all of this, is we should have been planning an attack on iraq and saddam... i mean, we was doing just about everything wrong and was a major hurdle in helping the iraqis... plus, as tough of words as clinton always used about saddam, he seemed like he didn't need any push to help him put pressure on iraq... going to war w/ him, was a different story... i don't know if we even had the military at that point to go to war... hence the bombing of useless buildings from thousands of miles away... "that will show them!!"... yeah right...


[i]Had Israel chosen a peaceful path to secure its existence, by building good relations with its Arab neighbors and refraining from aggression, Jews and Muslims could peacefully co-exist in the Middle East, as they have done before for centuries.[/i]

i almost burst out in laughter when i read this part... yeah, the jews and muslims have gotten along for centeries... [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/24.gif[/img] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/24.gif[/img] they have been fighting over the same plot of land since the begininning of time... sorry, but i don't buy it... i think that america can somewhat fix some of the mistakes we have made... israel has a snowballs chance in hell of ever being accepted by muslims... the poll i posted a few weeks ago w/ some countries that hated isreal was at 100%... there is no chance where there is noone in a whole country that likes jews...

on a side note... even if i don't buy most of it, it does seem to have a ring of truth to some of it... i'm glad you posted it and i'm glad i read it... if we decided to break up iraq into 3 parts, THEN i'll really be worried... but that isn't what our plan is, and this article was written in 2003, so we would have probably known by now, if that plan was in the books... i personally don't think that we would have followed through w/ an attack on iraq, if 9/11 never happened... war is very costly and never popular... but we don't know what things would have been like w/out 9/11, so i'm only speculating... interesting read either way though...
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Guest BlackJesus
[img]http://www.gush-shalom.org/thewall/images/magendawall.gif[/img]


[img]http://www.sweetliberty.org/issues/israel/images/bush_candle.JPG[/img]
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Guest BlackJesus
[color="blue"][b]It is about Oil & Israel.....

= Isroil [/color][/b]


[img]http://www.nogw.com/images/israeli_pipelines_lg.jpg[/img]

[img]http://www.vialls.com/subliminalsuggestion/army4a.jpg[/img]
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Guest BlackJesus

[img]http://www.vialls.com/subliminalsuggestion/Army6.gif[/img][img]http://www.vialls.com/subliminalsuggestion/Army7.gif[/img][img]http://www.vialls.com/subliminalsuggestion/Army8.gif[/img]

[i]It isn't Anti - Semetic to Expect the Jews not to enact Concentration camps on others as was done to them in Nazi Germany....[/i] <_<

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Guest BlackJesus
[img]http://www.nicholsoncartoons.com.au/cartoons/new/2002-04-23%20April%20Bush%20middle-east%20scarecrow%20504.JPG[/img]


[img]http://www.vtjp.org/images/Jews-ONLY.jpg[/img]


[img]http://www.vtjp.org/images/cartoon12.jpg[/img]
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Guest bengaljet
Read it + this is what I got out of it.

It's all Israel's fault.They've had it planned and finally a President(for whatever reason-Stupidity?) bought the story. NOT W's fault(are you now thinking this is not the right place to be in Iraq?)-those damned Israelis.

Rumsfeld,Cheney + Rice are the brains of the administration.What is W in all this-a dumb puppet,leader or a gerbil? W got duped(Gomer Pyle "surprise,surprise,surprise").

Oil DOESN'T need disruption,BUT.....$60+/barrel,$2.30+/gal + RECORD PROFITS for ....WHO(oil co. HATE these figures)? How is oil going to pay for this war?---oh yes,we're paying$2.30+/gal.

What needs to be done in the face of this- How about the US stepping up and taking the RESPONSIBILITY(if you think this true)of its actions and NOT blaming someone other than the leader of this country. I guess blaming Clinton didn't work.

W seemed awfully friendly with the "new" Saudia Arabian king .Holding hands down in Crawford. Maybe W is duping him-ya think?
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Guest BlackJesus
We have already seen that Bush will place a facade on the truth

From his Ads claiming he had support for the War
<_< [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//30.gif[/img]

[img]http://nipez.lockergnome.net/_photos/bushaddoctor.jpg[/img]


[b]Then again they are .....[/b]

[img]http://www.seedsofdoubt.com/daoud/images/FraudSquad.jpg[/img]
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Guest bengalrick

i'm glad jet and bj read this w/ some objectivity :blink: #22 did... sounds like i have to start paying more attention to what he has to say... though i rarely agree w/ him, at least he can see through the bullshit and see that this article is so biased, its not even funny...

get over it... its the same weak ass arguements over and over and over again... you do realize that if you repeat yourself constantly, you don't change minds... today its israel, tommorrow its oil, then its haliburton, then rove's evil plan, etc.... you guys have no objectivity... if you read that article, and was argreeing w/ everything it said, than YOU are puppets... who the fuck do you think is behind that article... how about a muslim... guess what... muslim's HATE jews... always have and always will (unfortinately)... how come he uses a pin name?? what a crock of shit...

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Guest BlackJesus

[quote]get over it... its the same weak ass arguements over and over and over again...[/quote]

[i][b]Could it be because that is the Argument and the real reason ??? Columbus kept saying the world was round too. <_< [/b][/i]


[quote]today its israel, tommorrow its oil, then its haliburton, then rove's evil plan, etc....[/quote]

[i][b]These are not mutually exclusive.... Isreal wants oil, Cheneys ex company that he still has share in and deferments wants to drill it for their cut, Rove is Bushs brain and thus he tells Bush to go for it. [/b][/i]



[quote]if you read that article, and was argreeing w/ everything it said, than YOU are puppets...[/quote]

[i][b]As opposed to believing the ex coke monkey lunatic that insists we are bringing freedom to the middle East and oops there were no WMD's , but that wasn't the real reason anyway even though he said over 100 times -_- [/b][/i]


[quote]guess what... muslim's HATE jews...[/quote]

[i][b]Justifiably... If I was a Palestinian I would really hate Jews.... they invaded my country, used a fake biblical book to claim it was theirs, took my home, stuck me on a reservation, give me no rights, and keep me in bondage....

(sounds eerily like the US and Native Americans too huh)[/b][/i]

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[quote]Justifiably... If I was a Palestinian I would really hate Jews....[u] they invaded my country[/u], used a fake biblical book to claim it was theirs, took my home, stuck me on a reservation, give me no rights, and keep me in bondage....[/quote]
The name Palestine refers to a region of the eastern Mediterranean coast from the sea to the Jordan valley and from the southern Negev desert to the Galilee lake region in the north. The word itself derives from "Plesheth", a name that appears frequently in the Bible and has come into English as "Philistine". Plesheth, (root palash) was a general term meaning rolling or migratory. This referred to the Philistine's invasion and conquest of the coast from the sea. The Philistines were not Arabs nor even Semites, they were most closely related to the Greeks originating from Asia Minor and Greek localities. They did not speak Arabic. They had no connection, ethnic, linguistic or historical with Arabia or Arabs.

The Philistines reached the southern coast of Israel in several waves. One group arrived in the pre-patriarchal period and settled south of Beersheba in Gerar where they came into conflict with [u][b]Abraham, Isaac and Ishmael[/b][/u]. Another group, coming from Crete after being repulsed from an attempted invasion of Egypt by Rameses III in 1194 BCE, seized the southern coastal area, where they founded five settlements (Gaza, Ascalon, Ashdod, Ekron and Gat). In the Persian and Greek periods, foreign settlers - chiefly from the Mediterranean islands - overran the Philistine districts.

It appears to me, unless all this shit I found is made up; the tribes of Isreal were there first!
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Guest BlackJesus
[i][b]Lawman what shitty christian site did you cut and paste that from ??? [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/30.gif[/img]

The same one that probably believes that a carpenter fatherless man god got pegged to some wood, saved the world and then flew into the clouds [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/30.gif[/img]


The Palestinians were there after WWII when the Jews forcibly kicked them out of their homes, and migrated there.... You should read up on the history of how the state of Israel was created.. and the tactics the Israelis used to get it (ironically the Jews used a suicide bombing on the british who were at a hotel to spark their independence) the Palestinians seeing that it worked for them have been trying it ever since.... (but unfortunatley they are too brown, poor, and they are not endorsed by the King James Bullshit manual.) Most Palestinians still have the keys to their homes, and when they were forced out many still had food cooking on the stove. Israel is a Terrorist, Illegal state, that has enacted Apartheid on the Palestinians. No different than what was in S Africa, and in some cases worse.

The US is their puppet, and the dozens of vetoes on the UN security council show how we veto the resolutions that 90 % of the world sets on Israel for being a terrorists state. [/b][/i]
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Guest bengalrick
very intersting post lawman... don't try to change bj's mind... if it doesn;t bash america or religion, you are talking to a wall... but just for all of us to check out ourselves, what link did you use?
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Guest BlackJesus
[color="red"][i][b]Another little tidbit that Israelis don't talk about is that Palestinians don't even want control of Israel militarily... they just want 1 vote per person, and since Palestinians outnumber Jews they would elect their own leaders and vote out all the Israeli candidates.... Jews know this and so the Palestinians are not allowed the right to vote.... One of my professors is an Israeli who lives their most of the year but is in the small majority who wants to open up the vote out of principal, but that belief is very small and considered suicidal and radical. Just like in S Africa the whites knew that once the vote is opened up Bartholemews cozy govt job is gone in favor of Mbutu mkawa etc. That's what makes Bushs cries of Democracy such Bullshit !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He doesn't want democracy...... if so why isn't it in Israel. Israelis are the ones that want a 2 state solution, the PLO will be happy with a 1 state solution but an equal vote like they should have. [/b][/i][/color]
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The "Sea Peoples" came from the Aegean and were remnants of Minoan and Mycenean culture (although some think the Sea Peoples came from Norse origins.) The Habiru came from the desert--a nomadic set of tribes. Both ended up in Phoenicia (named after the Plesheth, who were one strain of the Sea Peoples.)

As for who got there first, the answer is only tangentially relevant, as these precursors to the Philistines and the Hebrews were significantly different from the folks we know now. However, I wish that people who go this far back into history to "demonstrate" the fundamental antagonisms of today would cite the fact that Hiram of Tyre and Solomon worked very well together.

The fulcrum of modern antagonism is the Sykes/Picot treaty of early last century.
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[quote name='bengalrick' date='Aug 4 2005, 11:23 AM']very intersting post lawman... don't try to change bj's mind... if it doesn;t bash america or religion, you are talking to a wall... but just for all of us to check out ourselves, what link did you use?
[right][post="124356"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote]

bengalrick,
[url="http://www.palestinefacts.org/"]http://www.palestinefacts.org/[/url]

I was looking for a unbias site that focused on facts contrary to bj's belief.

[quote]Lawman what shitty christian site did you cut and paste that from[/quote]
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[quote]However, I wish that people who go this far back into history to "demonstrate" the fundamental antagonisms of today would cite the fact that [u]Hiram of Tyre and Solomon worked very well together[/u].[/quote]

Was there not a Peace Treaty signed 1994, I believe in Oslo Norway, if both (Arafat) parties did what they agreed upon, things could of worked out. A few months later wasn't there a bombing in Isreal.
I believe he (Arafat) was a awarded the Nobel Peace Prize.
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[quote name='Lawman' date='Aug 4 2005, 10:50 AM']Was there not a Peace Treaty signed 1994, I believe in Oslo Norway, if both (Arafat) parties did what they agreed upon, things could of worked out. A few months later wasn't there a bombing in Isreal.
I believe he (Arafat) was a awarded the Nobel Peace Prize.
[right][post="124368"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote]

Yeah, sadly, Rabin--a hard-liner who saw the light, got murdered by the nut cases in his own country. That blew up Oslo. If I remember correctly, both he and Arafat got the Peace Prize that year.

Later, when both sides were close again, Sharon paid a casual visit to the Temple Mount (with a small army) and this provoked the Intifada. Barak fell, Sharon was rewarded with the head job. Peace won't be possible there until the saboteurs on both sides get marginalized.
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Guest BlackJesus
[quote].....where the nation of Isreal does not exist.[/quote]

[color="blue"][i][b]
if you allow 1 vote per person there isn't a state of Israel that is the fucking point !!!!

You have a small minority ruling a population and not allowing them to vote or have equal rights.... "Democracy equates to Jews losing all power in Israel"[/b][/i][/color]


[i][b]off subject but ironic to think about ......

Before the Jews decided on Israel they thought about making Uganda in Africa their new homeland..... [/b][/i]
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[quote]Later, when both sides were close again, Sharon paid a casual visit to the Temple Mount (with a small army) and this provoked the Intifada. Barak fell, Sharon was rewarded with the head job. Peace won't be possible there until the saboteurs on both sides get marginalized.[/quote]

I Agree, both Arafat and Sharon have created a mess. However, from what I have read, when Isreal were making concessions on the Oslo Accords, Palestine (Arafat) failed to make good on any of the Five points requested from Isreal.

In an earlier post, I was trying to illustrate that the Palestinians [u]may not [/u]of been originially Arabic or Muslim. In my Opinion, the Arab countries in that region use the Palestinians to antagoize Isreal as a means of indirect threat. What have the surrounding really done to help the Palestinians other than supply them with more weapons to kill Isreali's.
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