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Mother of Slain Soldier Protests outside


Guest BlackJesus

She will wait till Bush talks to her, should he ?  

25 members have voted

  1. 1. She will wait till Bush talks to her, should he ?

    • Yes, he should look her in the eye and tell her the reason her kid was overthere to begin with - Manup Bushie
      8
    • No, it is tragic but he doesn't have to personally answer to every parent
      17


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Guest BlackJesus
[quote]I grew up with my Father in the air force, my sister, step sister, and step brother all served in Iraq, so it isn't as if I am gun ho with nothing at risk either."[/quote]

[i][b]also this quote about me is true.... and it was only post election when I really talked to my sister about her stint in Iraq, and how she didn't have any supplies, her fellow units didn;t have body armor etc etc etc

I love how people think that over a 10 month span people have to keep the exact same belief, even if what they did believe was wrong. I am sure some guy on Columbuses ship that thought they were going to sail off the world, had to re-evaluate his beliefs when they landed on Cuba.[/b][/i]
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Guest bengaljet

[quote name='BlackJesus' date='Aug 7 2005, 05:31 PM'][i][b]Also recent numbers from today show that 61 % of Americans now disapprove of Bush, so taking the fact that recieved 51 % of the vote in Nov, that would mean that 1 out of every 5 Bush supporters who did support him before, now don't.  ==== A president that doesn;t have to be re-elected then becomes who he really is, and the "I don't need to be re-elected" version of Bush is terrible.  At least the false one before put on nice rhetoric rallies, hid the bible bangers, and lied about being a compassionate conservative.[/b][/i]

[i]also even pre election I spoke about how they were both members of skull and bones, and how because of that Kerry could not be seen as a better alternative.  They were both yuppie pussys, Kerry even more so, (Bush at least wears a cowboy costume and fakes like he isn't a prep school conneticut ex cheerleader)[/i]
[right][post="126410"][/post][/right][/quote]

Now BJ you know that polls don't mean anything to sheep unless it's an electric fence. :headbang: (attached to electric fence?)

My take on W talking to this Mom. If he knew what to believe in(they'd have to wire him to give directions),knew what to say("War is hard" is not going to get it). Then not knowing what to say or knowing what to believe(without help)-he won't talk to her. If he knew what to say or do he should talk to her,but he'd have to have a brain-leaves W out.
I feel sorry for the soldier and his Mom. She wants to vent her anger. Not in front of the press W owes her at least that.

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[quote name='BengalBacker' date='Aug 7 2005, 03:54 PM']When you had your brain washed, did you have it waxed too?

edit:

Sorry. That's a line that one of the liberals in another forum I go to always uses about conservatives. :D
[right][post="126373"][/post][/right][/quote]


Since you are king here I will not verbally retaliate. However, I ask you, why do most republican, conservative, right wing, anti-black people, anti-womens rights, self proclaiming "christian" people react to opposition with their views with such harshness and zeal?? Its actually amazing, when they are confronted with people who actually "think outside the box" their first reaction is one of anger and hatred. We are often belittled and antagonized. You become the "Dixie Chicks" to them. It sounds an awful lot like fascism to me.

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[quote name='oldschooler' date='Aug 7 2005, 05:42 PM']Unprovoked ?
Bush lied ?
[img]http://www.imagemagician.com/images/nebsmak/emotes/nut.gif[/img]

The only thing you said that I agree with is that Iraq
had nothing to do with 9/11.
BUT not letting Saddam do what the fuck he wanted
anymore had alot to do with 9/11....
[right][post="126421"][/post][/right][/quote]

ok maybe I missed something? When did Iraq attack the U.S?
and
what was the truth did Bush tell about the reason we invaded Iraq?
please educate and inform me. :huh:

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Guest steggyD
Now, now, some of those comments are blown out of proportion. One can be anti affirmative action without being anti-black. The way I look at it is that it points out the fact that one is black and gives that person an "edge". If color should not exist in laws, then why would there be a law that states that there are different colors, and some colors get a few extra benefits. The way I look at it, affirmative action is anti-minority. It makes victims out of people. It tells the minority that since they cannot succeed on their own without hard work and determination, then there is a loophole in the system that will help them get by. And don't use this blacks don't go to as good of schools, because I went to schools that were about 40% black, and I'm trying to make a name for myself. It's not like all white people are born with trust funds...

Anti-women's rights, I suppose you are talking about abortions. Even though I am totally against an abortion and I would not recommend it for anyone, the law itself is totally bogus. It is unconstitutional, thus needs to be left up to the individual states to decide. I think it's ok for it to be legal, but there should be better education to females, and males, of what is actually happening in an abortion.

Oh yeah, and instead of calling it anti-women's rights, why don't they call it anti-unborn child's rights?
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[quote name='steggyD' date='Aug 7 2005, 06:32 PM']Now, now, some of those comments are blown out of proportion. One can be anti affirmative action without being anti-black. The way I look at it is that it points out the fact that one is black and gives that person an "edge". If color should not exist in laws, then why would there be a law that states that there are different colors, and some colors get a few extra benefits. The way I look at it, affirmative action is anti-minority. It makes victims out of people. It tells the minority that since they cannot succeed on their own without hard work and determination, then there is a loophole in the system that will help them get by. And don't use this blacks don't go to as good of schools, because I went to schools that were about 40% black, and I'm trying to make a name for myself. It's not like all white people are born with trust funds...

Anti-women's rights, I suppose you are talking about abortions. Even though I am totally against an abortion and I would not recommend it for anyone, the law itself is totally bogus. It is unconstitutional, thus needs to be left up to the individual states to decide. I think it's ok for it to be legal, but there should be better education to females, and males, of what is actually happening in an abortion.

Oh yeah, and instead of calling it anti-women's rights, why don't they call it anti-unborn child's rights?
[right][post="126440"][/post][/right][/quote]


Opponents of affirmitive action always use the "it tells minorites that they are not good enough" routine as if they give a rats ass what minorities think or feel for that matter. I went to public schools too. In a classroom theres about 25 kids, 5 kids are straight A students, 5 kids are D-F students, and the rest are averege C+, B-. Opponents of affirmitive action always say well "if you are the brightest and best, that color shouldnt matter and we dont need it" Ideally that is true. Realistically in this country that is garbage. A black C student would be hard pressed to become a manager at McDonalds, while a white C student just happens to be the President of the United States. Another example, look at DIV I college football. 117 schools, 40% of the asst coaches are black, 75% of the players are black but theres only 2 black head coaches. Willingham got fired after two years at Notre Dame (2 bowl appearances) and Croom is the first ever black coach in the SEC. 2 coaches, 117 teams.......no need for affirmitive action. So from about 1700 to 1964 an entire race of people were treated like 2nd class citizens and not even like human beings. But now minorities are on an equal playing field, no such thing as racism that stuff does not exist anymore right? :rolleyes:

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Guest BengalBacker

[quote name='sneaky' date='Aug 7 2005, 06:13 PM']Since you are king here I will not verbally retaliate. However, I ask you, why do most republican, conservative, right wing, anti-black people, anti-womens rights, self proclaiming "christian" people react to opposition with their views with such harshness and zeal?? Its  actually amazing, when  they are confronted with people who actually "think outside the box" their first reaction is one of anger and hatred. We are often belittled and antagonized. You become the "Dixie Chicks" to them. It sounds an awful lot like fascism to me.
[right][post="126436"][/post][/right][/quote]


First of all, it was a joke. I even spelled that out with an explanation and a smiley. :D

Secondly, I'm not king of anything. :unsure:

And lastly, why do you assume that all of this: [b]why do most republican, conservative, right wing, anti-black people, anti-womens rights, self proclaiming "christian" people react to opposition with their views with such harshness and zeal??[/b] applies to anyone who doesn't hate Bush? Sounds like you're the one who can't think outside the box to me. Also sounds like you're the one filled with anger and hatred, and a good dose of self righteousness. You obviously don't know my views on any of those things that you just attributed to me.

You facist Dixie Chick lover. :D (<------ note the smiley)

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Guest steggyD

[quote name='sneaky' date='Aug 7 2005, 07:58 PM']Opponents  of affirmitive action  always use the  "it tells minorites that they are not good enough" routine as if they give a rats ass what minorities think or feel for that matter. I went to public schools too. In a classroom theres about 25 kids, 5 kids are straight A students, 5 kids are D-F students, and the rest are averege C+, B-. Opponents of affirmitive action always say well "if you are the brightest and best, that color shouldnt matter and we dont need it" Ideally that is true. Realistically in this country that is garbage. A black C student would be hard pressed to become a manager at McDonalds, while a white C student just happens to be the President of the United States. Another example, look at DIV I college football. 117 schools, 40% of the asst coaches are black, 75% of the players are black but  theres only 2 black head coaches. Willingham got fired after two years at Notre Dame (2 bowl appearances) and Croom is the first ever black coach in the SEC. 2 coaches, 117 teams.......no need for affirmitive action. So from about 1700 to 1964 an entire race of people were treated like 2nd class citizens and not even like human beings. But now minorities are on an equal playing field, no such thing as racism that stuff does not exist anymore right?  :rolleyes:
[right][post="126457"][/post][/right][/quote]
Why can't I use that excuse, but you can say that I am anti-black because I disagree with it? It's used too often, so don't use it, ok? A C student that becomes president is not president because he is white. He is president because he is rich and comes from a rich and powerful family. I am white, I have no riches or power. And not to sound racist, but just because a player is good at playing the sport, that does not mean that player is good at coaching it. The Pistons fired their head coach after 2 years. He won one title and almost another. But he is white, so I guess that is not racist. Just because someone is fired or not working somewhere, that does not mean that it's racist.

Also, you contradicted yourself. If affirmative action is needed, but it exists right now, then it's not working according to your argument. If there are only two black head coaches, then maybe a new system is needed. Maybe no affirmative action. That will teach people to work hard at what they do, and if they want to be a head coach, then one day they can. Surely there are racists out there, but to call someone racist because they think outside of some PC bullshit affirmative action is plain wrong. I suppose you want me to say that my best friend is black or something to that effect, but I won't humor you.

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[quote name='steggyD' date='Aug 7 2005, 07:11 PM']Why can't I use that excuse, but you can say that I am anti-black because I disagree with it? It's used too often, so don't use it, ok? A C student that becomes president is not president because he is white. He is president because he is rich and comes from a rich and powerful family. I am white, I have no riches or power. And not to sound racist, but just because a player is good at playing the sport, that does not mean that player is good at coaching it. The Pistons fired their head coach after 2 years. He won one title and almost another. But he is white, so I guess that is not racist. Just because someone is fired or not working somewhere, that does not mean that it's racist.

Also, you contradicted yourself. If affirmative action is needed, but it exists right now, then it's not working according to your argument. If there are only two black head coaches, then maybe a new system is needed. Maybe no affirmative action. That will teach people to work hard at what they do, and if they want to be a head coach, then one day they can. Surely there are racists out there, but to call someone racist because they think outside of some PC bullshit affirmative action is plain wrong. I suppose you want me to say that my best friend is black or something to that effect, but I won't humor you.
[right][post="126464"][/post][/right][/quote]

1. C'mon man....could a black family ever achieve the wealth and prominence to have a member of the family be elected in the white house.......in your lifetime?

2. Larry Brown got fired cause during the Pistions playoff run, he was contacting Cleveland and New York about better higher paying jobs than the one he had.
He was going to quit anyway..........like he always does. (3rd or 4th NBA team now)

3. I did not contradict myself, the stats I gave just supported it. The NFL has a policy that forces the owners to interview minority canidates. Now there is 6 black head coaches in the NFL today, the most ever in the league at any time. Marvin Lewis was the first black man to ever interview for the Bengals job. Conversely, there isn't a rule like that in the NCAA thus 2 of 117 coaches are black.

4. Yes, you telling me that one of your best friends is black,would have humored me, and I would have found that quite amusing.

:D

5. How did we get on this topic? I should have started a post about this.....dammit [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//23.gif[/img] (it would of generated some cool debates)

6. I am a christian, I am black, and God loves you and so do I. so there take that!!!!!!!!

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Guest steggyD

[quote name='sneaky' date='Aug 7 2005, 08:37 PM']1.  C'mon man....could a black family ever achieve the wealth and prominence to have a member of the family be elected in the white house.......in your lifetime?[/quote]
Michael Jordan, to start with.

[quote]2. Larry Brown got fired cause during the Pistions playoff run, he was contacting Cleveland and New York about  better higher paying jobs than the one he had. 
He was going to quit anyway..........like he always does. (3rd or 4th  NBA team now)[/quote]
So, what's the reason this other coach was fired that you mentioned? You mentioned that he was coach, black and fired, therefore it is racist.

[quote]3. I did not contradict myself, the stats I gave just supported it. The NFL  has a policy that forces the owners to interview minority canidates. Now there is 6 black head coaches in the NFL today, the most ever in the league at any time. Marvin Lewis was the first black man to ever interview for the Bengals job. Conversely, there isn't a rule like that in the NCAA thus 2 of 117 coaches are black.[/quote]
So, you're saying that the only way Marvin Lewis can make it as a head coach is by making it in under a system that forces him to be accepted.

[quote]4. Yes, you telling me that one of your best friends is black,would have humored me, and I would have found that quite amusing.[/quote]
He's Mexican... ;)

[quote]5. How did we get on this topic? I should have started a post about this.....dammit [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//23.gif[/img]   (it would of generated some cool debates)[/quote]
Because you mentioned it, when it had nothing to do with the topic at hand. And I find it very offensive when those who oppose affirmative action are called racist.

[quote]6. I am a christian, I am black,  and God loves you and so do I. so there take that!!!!!!!!
[right][post="126465"][/post][/right][/quote]
I'm white, non-Christian, but spiritual. Of course god loves me, we're all part of god. And I have no money to get me ahead, I worked for everything I have, and being white didn't change a thing in my opinion, it was my good looks. -_-

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[quote name='steggyD' date='Aug 7 2005, 08:16 PM']Michael Jordan, to start with.
  [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//24.gif[/img] , Micheal Jordan and his children can be the next Kennedey's or Bush's .......in your lifetime.........mmmh.......... [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//24.gif[/img]  
Im just gonna leave that alone. I quit.

So, what's the reason this other coach was fired that you mentioned? You mentioned that he was coach, black and fired, therefore it is racist.

Tyrone Willingham was the first and only black coach at Notre Dame. He was fired after only 2 years, both years the Irish went to a bowl game. He wasnt given a chance to recruit his players for at least 4 years. His first 2 years were better than the guy he replaced (Bob Davey) last 2 years. Willlingham previously coached at Stanford and was immediatley hired at the University of Washington. His replacement, Charlie Weiss, the former off cord. with the Patrriots has no previous college, or pro head coaching exp.  Does the fact I mention that sound racist to you?

So, you're saying that the only way Marvin Lewis can make it as a head coach is by making it in under a system that forces him to be accepted.

Im saying, if it wasnt for people (black and white) who were leaders that stood  up against racism ala Jakie Robinson, MLK, RFK, JFK, and many more back in the day, and supported civil rights and change to repair some of the damage years of racism caused ......there would be no "coach" Lewis.  Even after Marvin Lweis coached one of best defenses in NFL history and helped the Ravens to a world championship, he was still passed over for the Tampa Bay job,(they hired Gruden, after firing Dungy) and the  Bills job (they hired Greg Williams at the time). As a matter of fact, that was the catalyst that prompted the NFL to adopt the new minority hiring policy. Luckily for Bengal fans we landed him. :headbang:  
 

He's Mexican...  ;)  
Because you mentioned it, when it had nothing to do with the topic at hand. And I find it very offensive when those who oppose affirmative action are called racist.
I'm white, non-Christian, but spiritual. Of course god loves me, we're all part of god. And I have no money to get me ahead, I worked for everything I have, and being white didn't change a thing in my opinion, it was my good looks.  -_-
[right][post="126474"][/post][/right][/quote]

And I find it offensive, how can anybody justify (for example) with a straight face that there being just 2 black head coaches out of 117 possible jobs is just a coincidence. That theres only 2 capable black men in the entire country to be a division I head coach. I find it offensive when people ignore and refuse to admit the obvious discrepencies in our country when opportunities are concerned. Without programs or inititives like affirmative action qualified minorities and women will be overlooked, and passed over and fall victim to the "good ole boy" network. Barry Alveraz will be stepping down as head coach from Wisconsin after this year. He has already named his successor ( a white guy). When Lou Holtz retired from South Carolina, his buddy Steve Spurrier (a white guy) took over. See a pattern here? Did any minorities have a chance or interview at these positions?.......No. Are there qualified minority head coaches who can coach these programs?.....Yes. So how does a minority get this opportunity? .......still thinking :unsure:

Your comment about your good looks was just as humorous and amusing as if you have told me you had a black friend. :D

:

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Guest steggyD
Like you said, you are looking at it from a minority perspective. Well, guess what. I'm looking at it from an oppressor perspective. If you don't want to hear my words, then don't read them anymore. From the get go, you say that I cannot use my argument. So what do you want me to do? Make something up. You are closing your mind, instead of listening.
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We are being lied to....

[img]http://img190.exs.cx/img190/7596/africa0080uc.jpg[/img]

This is pre-election BJ, he was taken by left wing aliens and replaced with a robot version just like in The Last Starfighter...

[img]http://www.reelclothes.com/LastStarfighterPost.jpg[/img]

[img]http://www.act1theater.com/Mortimer%20Tied%20Up%20Fade.jpg[/img]
(Actual Pic of BJ being taken)

[img]http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/8425/bj6ad.jpg[/img]
(New Robot BJ)
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Guest bengalrick
sneaky, do you think people in the 60's (white or black) would have expected to see a black man as secretary of state (powell)?? how about a black woman who is currently the secretary of state, and doing a damn good job on top of it (rice)?? how about a black man that is part of the most powerful branch of gov't currently (clarence thomas)? in the 60's, were any of these things even imaginable... the whole point is these 3 people (and many, many more in politics, sports, business, etc) worked their ass off, and are now recieving the benefits... they didn't get where they were b/c of affirmative action... they set their goals high, and are kicking ass now and DO have power and DO have money... they are who we should all strive to be more like...


btw, if condi or colon ran for president, i almost guarentee they'd win... i'll even throw in a democrat that probably will eventually win...at least a vice presidenicy in the near future... barrack obama... do i expect to see a black president in my lifetime... actually, i expect to see a few... don't be surprised when it happens...

btw, notice the three powerful people that i mentioned were all given their power by republicans... just food for thought...

i read this article on [url="http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1090910,00.html"]condalezza rice[/url] that deserves to be read... its pretty damn long though...

like i said, this is someone that should be looked up to... fuck michael moore...
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[quote name='bengalrick' date='Aug 7 2005, 11:20 PM']sneaky, do you think people in the 60's (white or black) would have expected to see a black man as secretary of state (powell)?? how about a black woman who is currently the secretary of state, and doing a damn good job on top of it (rice)?? how about a black man that is part of the most powerful branch of gov't currently (clarence thomas)? in the 60's, were any of these things even imaginable...[/quote]
Thurgood Marshall?
[right][post="126538"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right]
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Guest oldschooler

[quote name='sneaky' date='Aug 7 2005, 05:26 PM']ok maybe I missed something? When did Iraq attack the U.S?
and
what was the truth did Bush tell about the reason we invaded Iraq?
please educate and inform me. :huh:
[right][post="126438"][/post][/right][/quote]



The only war we have ever been in that we were
attacked first was WW2. Even then Germany and
Italy didn`t attack us...only Japan did.

Anyway...Saddam DID have WMD`s. He used them
against Iran and against the Kurds in the North of Iraq.
Maybe they were moved to Syria before our troops got there ?
IF Saddam would have done what he was SUPPOSED TO DO...
then we wouldn`t have had to go to Iraq.


We invaded Iraq because we had a war with them in 1991.
Saddam surrendered...the terms of his surrender was that
he totally dis-arm and abide by resolutions placed against him.
He didn`t...we placed MORE resolutions and sanctions against him.
After Spetember 11th 2001...he had been shooting at our pilots that
were patrolling the NO FLY ZONES and he kicked out weapons inspectors.
We gave him a FINAL LAST CHANCE TO COMPLY. It was U.N. resolution 1441.
EVERY NATION IN THE U.N. SIGNED IT... He didn`t comply.
Bush gave him an ultimatum AFTER THAT "final last chance".
Saddam took it as an empty threat...he was wrong.


Anyway here is an article about Resolution 1441.
It was a FULL YEAR AFTER 9/11 and 11 YEARS
after Saddam surrendered the first Gulf War that is was passed...

[url="http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/11/08/resolution.text/"]http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/11/08/resolution.text/[/url]


Glad I could educate you... [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//15.gif[/img]

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[quote name='steggyD' date='Aug 7 2005, 10:05 PM']Like you said, you are looking at it from a minority perspective. Well, guess what. I'm looking at it from an oppressor perspective. If you don't want to hear my words, then don't read them anymore. From the get go, you say that I cannot use my argument. So what do you want me to do? Make something up. You are closing your mind, instead of listening.
[right][post="126507"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote]


How do you figure I don't want to hear you? I am listening to you. I believe dialogue is healthy, are you listening to me?You can think however you want, use any argument you want, its a free country. This is a sensitive issue, you have the come in with an open mind. Luckily for me and the people who think like I do, equal opportunity programs have been established and will stay despite its detractors. Obviously, you are taking this way too personal. We will agree to disagree I don't want to talk about this anymore [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/37.gif[/img]
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[quote name='bengalrick' date='Aug 7 2005, 11:20 PM']sneaky, do you think people in the 60's (white or black) would have expected to see a black man as secretary of state (powell)?? how about a black woman who is currently the secretary of state, and doing a damn good job on top of it (rice)?? how about a black man that is part of the most powerful branch of gov't currently (clarence thomas)? in the 60's, were any of these things even imaginable... the whole point is these 3 people (and many, many more in politics, sports, business, etc) worked their ass off, and are now recieving the benefits... they didn't get where they were b/c of affirmative action... they set their goals high, and are kicking ass now and DO have power and DO have money... they are who we should all strive to be more like...
btw, if condi or colon ran for president, i almost guarentee they'd win... i'll even throw in a democrat that probably will eventually win...at least a vice presidenicy in the near future... barrack obama... do i expect to see a black president in my lifetime... actually, i expect to see a few... don't be surprised when it happens...

btw, notice the three powerful people that i mentioned were all given their power by republicans... just food for thought...

i read this article on [url="http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1090910,00.html"]condalezza rice[/url] that deserves to be read... its pretty damn long though...

like i said, this is someone that should be looked up to... fuck michael moore...
[right][post="126538"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote]

I am coming from the context of the past. I am talking about pre-civil rights movement. My mom is 65, she is from Georgia, as a child she remebers signs on buildings and in restaurants that read "WHITES ONLY", or "NO COLOREDS ALLOWED". In those times it didn't matter how smart a person was, or how hard a person worked, if you were a certain color, you were going to hit a glass ceiling. And the ceiling was pretty low. Hell back in the day, many blacks were being murdered and there weren't any arrests, no investigatons, no convictions. At that time in our country the potential for a person of color to reach the success of a Condaleeza Rice, or a Clarence Thomas did not exist considering they weren't even allowed to eat or take a leak in public facilities. It was because of the civil rights movement and its leaders (both black and white), that America's landscape starting to change, people started to change. To imply Clarence Thomas or Condaleeza Rice would have been just as successful in their careers without the Civil Rights Act, equal opportunity laws based on how life before it, is absolutely absurd. A lot of people who oppose affirmative action programs are under the perception that minorities who are not qualified are just given jobs. The purpose of these programs is to give minorities and women who were qualified a chance. For example, Marvin Lewis didn't even get a chance to interview for some teams after the Ravens won the Super Bowl. The NFL started a policy to mandate owners to interview minority canidates. Lewis was the first black man ever to interview for head coach of the Cincinnati Bengals in 2003. The Bengals have been around since 1968, so from 1968 to 2003, no person of color was ever given a interview, opportunity, or nothing. We all know from 1968 to 2003 there have been plenty of qualified minority coaches, but it doesn't matter when they don't get a chance. Judge Thomas and Ms. Rice are not products of affirmative action, they are products of opportunity, a fair chance, something they would not have gotten back in the past. Times have changed things are a lot better now as far as equality is concerned. Its not where it should be but its getting there.
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[quote name='Homer_Rice' date='Aug 8 2005, 12:30 AM']Thurgood Marshall?
[right][post="126538"][/post][/right]
[right][post="126567"][/post][/right][/quote]


Thurgood Marshall....... His presentation of the argument against the "separate but equal" doctrine achieved its greatest impact with the landmark decision handed down in Brown v. Board of Education of Topeka (1954). His appointment to the U.S. Court of Appeals in 1961 was opposed by some Southern senators and was not confirmed until 1962. President Lyndon B. Johnson appointed him to the Supreme Court two years later; he was the first black to sit on the high court, where he consistently supported the position taken by those challenging discrimination based on race or sex, opposed the death penalty, and supported the rights of criminal defendants. His support for affirmative action led to his strong dissent in Regents of the University of California v. Bakke (1978). As appointments by Presidents Nixon and Reagan changed the outlook of the Court, Marshall found himself increasingly in the minority; in retirement he was outspoken in his criticism of the court...........................................................................
..........
so your point is??????? :blink:

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[quote name='oldschooler' date='Aug 8 2005, 08:12 AM']The only war we have ever been in that we were
attacked first was WW2. Even then Germany and
Italy didn`t attack us...only Japan did.

Anyway...Saddam DID have WMD`s. He used them
against Iran and against the Kurds in the North of Iraq.
Maybe they were moved to Syria before our troops got there ?
IF Saddam would have done what he was SUPPOSED TO DO...
then we wouldn`t have had to go to Iraq.
We invaded Iraq because we had a war with them in 1991.
Saddam surrendered...the terms of his surrender was that
he totally dis-arm and abide by resolutions placed against him.
He didn`t...we placed MORE resolutions and sanctions against him.
After Spetember 11th 2001...he had been shooting at our pilots that
were patrolling the NO FLY ZONES and he kicked out weapons inspectors.
We gave him a FINAL LAST CHANCE TO COMPLY. It was U.N. resolution 1441.
EVERY NATION IN THE U.N. SIGNED IT...  He didn`t comply.
Bush gave him an ultimatum AFTER THAT "final last chance".
Saddam took it as an empty threat...he was wrong.
Anyway here is an article about Resolution 1441.
It was a FULL YEAR AFTER 9/11 and 11 YEARS
after Saddam surrendered the first Gulf War that is was passed...

[url="http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/11/08/resolution.text/"]http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/11/08/resolution.text/[/url]
Glad I could educate you... [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//15.gif[/img]
[right][post="126649"][/post][/right][/quote]

1. As I said before, Iraq never attacked us.
2. If Saddam did have weapons of mass destructions, Im sure the US would have known because the Reagan administation supplied him with it during the Iran-Iraq war.
3.Where is the proof of these weapons of mass destruction, dont remember us finding any, please explain. ("maybe they were moved to Syria?" doesn't cut it)
4. He surrendered under the terms of the "U.N. resolutions", this was not a "U.N supported or sanctioned" attack
5.What is the exit plan? Are we going to be in Iraq forever?
6. Thanks for educating me :D , I have learned alot......... :rolleyes:

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[quote name='Beaker' date='Aug 7 2005, 11:38 PM']sneaky, there's no black head coaches in the NHL either. Is that a case of racism too?

Youre not thinking outside the box...youre just in a different box.
[right][post="126545"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote]

Are there any qualified black coaches in the NHL? Are there any black hockey players in the NHL? I don't know. I think the reason there are no black head coaches in the NHL have nothing to do with racism, but that hockey is a "suck ass"sport and most minorities are generally uninterested.
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Guest bengalrick
[quote name='sneaky' date='Aug 8 2005, 09:38 AM']I am coming from the context of the past. I am talking about pre-civil rights movement. My mom is 65, she is from Georgia, as a child she remebers signs on buildings and in restaurants that read "WHITES ONLY", or "NO COLOREDS ALLOWED". In those times it didn't matter how smart a person was, or how hard a person worked, if you were a certain color, you were going to hit a glass ceiling. And the ceiling was pretty low. Hell back in the day, many blacks were being murdered and there weren't any arrests, no investigatons, no convictions. At that time in our country the potential for a person of color to reach the success of a Condaleeza Rice, or a Clarence Thomas did not exist considering they weren't even allowed to eat or take a leak in public facilities. It was because of the civil rights movement and its leaders (both black and white), that America's landscape starting to change, people started to change. To imply Clarence Thomas or Condaleeza Rice would have been just as successful in their careers without the Civil Rights Act, equal opportunity laws based on how life before it, is absolutely absurd. A lot of people who oppose affirmative action programs are under the perception that minorities who are not qualified are just given jobs. The purpose of these programs is to give minorities and women who were qualified a chance. For example, Marvin Lewis didn't even get a chance to interview for some teams after the Ravens won the Super Bowl. The NFL started a policy to mandate owners to interview minority canidates. Lewis was the first black man ever to interview for head coach of the Cincinnati Bengals in 2003. The Bengals have been around since 1968, so from 1968 to 2003, no person of color was ever given a interview, opportunity, or nothing. We all know from 1968 to 2003 there have been plenty of qualified minority coaches, but it doesn't matter when they don't get a chance. Judge Thomas and Ms. Rice are not products of affirmative action, they are products of opportunity, a fair chance, something they would not have gotten back in the past. Times have changed things are a lot better now as far as equality is concerned. Its not where it should be but its getting there.
[right][post="126680"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote]

i didn't know we were talking about the civil rights movement... that was obviously a good and very necessary movement... i thought we were talking about current affairs and affirmative action in particular... to be honest, affirmative action was necessary when it was first passed b/c of the racism that existed (not to say that racism doesn't still exist, but nothing like before the 60's and what your grandmother had to go through)... it is now hurting african americans IMO, instead of helping them...

how can there be racism in a business nowadays, when there is a very good percentage of managers and decision makers that are minorities?? like i said, it was necessary in its hay day, but not as much nowadays...

just to tell you where i;m coming from, i'll explain a little about my sister... my sister had some serious problems when she was a young girl... i won't get into the specifics, but it was very, very bad and very hurtful to everyone in the family... your probably getting a decent picture now... anyway, since she had something to blame things on for everything that goes wrong, she used it... most importantly, my mom babied her to death, and let her get away w/ murder... if my sister needed money, she would ask mom... needs new clothes, ask mom... she would start cheerleading, then quit adn nobody would push her for fear she couldn't take it...

to this day, she is struggling to get a job as a waitress, b/c she is always late to work, and doesnt' try that hard, and if a manager says something that hurts her feelings, she'll just quit... you can say my mom didn't do a great job, but i feel that i turned out pretty good, since i haven't quit a thing in my life, and just bought a house w/ MY credit and MY money...

she was handed a crutch (not the awful thing that happened to her, but my mom using that as an excuse for her)... it has hurt her in everything in life... if you are given things in your life b/c of who you are, what you look like, or what you have endured, then it hurts you... i have seen it first hand, and that is why i think that if you get a job (nowadays) b/c of the color of your skin, then you didn't EARN it necessarily... and in the long run, i don't see how it will really help... i would argue that it will do the opposite for most people and hurt them instead...

that is my take and why i feel that way...
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[quote name='sneaky' date='Aug 8 2005, 03:12 PM']Are there any qualified black coaches in the NHL? Are there any black hockey players in the NHL? I don't know. I think the  reason there are no black head coaches in the NHL have nothing to do with racism, but that hockey is a "suck ass"sport and most minorities are generally uninterested.
[right][post="126687"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote]

Youre a sad bitter little man. But I guess thats what the victim mentality does to one. Shame.
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