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Great Offseason for Bengals


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It's kind of flown under-the-radar because there weren't any real flashy additions, but the more I look at it, the Bengals had one hell of an offseason.

With the draft and free agency in the rearview mirror, I'm looking back at this offseason and really impressed with what the Bengals were able to do. Especially when you consider the expectations for this spring. It was supposed to be a year that would see the Bengals take a major step back with 10 starters (and/or backups who played starter # of snaps) all hitting FA at the same time. But when I look at the roster, I only see one position group (WR) that looks worse. And even that group looks like it has a chance to be almost as good if the rookies (Boyd and Core) come on quickly and/or if LaFell regains his 2014 form.

What's most impressive and exciting is that it actually looks like the Bengals improved overall and made some real upgrades at multiple position groups: 

1. Defensive Back. This was the scary position entering March and it was probable that we'd see a major dropoff there in talent and depth from 2015 to 2016. Surprisingly, we actually look like we could be improved at DB. Getting Dennard back from injury at CB is huge as he was playing well before he went down. Keeping Adam Jones was a major key. He has become a real leader in the secondary and he was a lockdown guy in 2015. His only TD against the entire season was a ridiculous catch by DeAndre Hopkins where Jones was in excellent position. Then you add William Jackson III to the group? Does anyone have a better/deeper top 5 at CB than the Bengals with Jones, Dennard, Jackson, Kirkpatrick and Shaw? Safety, we may take a small step back going from Nelson to Williams, but there's also a pretty good case that Williams will be better than Nelson (who turns 33 soon) in short order. The Bengals held back a little bit of cap space too and it sounds like getting Williams an extension is a top priority. With Iloka getting a long-term deal (at a surprisingly affordable cost), we could soon have a pair of 25-year old starting Safeties locked up for the rest of the decade. 

If Williams gets his extension as expected, the Bengals will have eight DBs locked up until 2019 (A. Jones, W. Jackson, Dennard, Iloka, S. Williams, Shaw, D. Smith, Fejedlem).

2. Linebacker. Linebacker all of a sudden looks like the deepest position on the roster. Being able to keep a key contributor in Vinny Rey was nice. Adding a top-notch veteran LB in Dansby who was amongst the top-rated coverage LBs in the league was a pleasant surprise. Nick Vigil sounds like he could be a potential steal in round 3 and at the very least adds quality depth. And to top it all off, it sounds like Dawson has had a nice offseason and done a better job of preparing. I don't know who will end up as the #6 LB amongst Burfict, Maualuga, Dansby, Vigil, Rey and Dawson. But whoever it is might be the best #6 LB in the NFL. Also worth noting that 5 of those top 6 are signed until at least 2018.  

3. Defensive Tackle. We've all been pining for a highly-rated DT in the draft to push Peko and join the rotation for a few years now. That guy has finally arrived in Andrew Billings. Hard not to be excited about him. On top of that, the Bengals were able to keep both Pat Sims and Brandon Thompson in FA. Again when you look at the depth chart, you see a big number of viable options and great depth: Atkins, Billings, Peko, Hardison, Sims, Thompson, Williams. Seven guys who could/should be at least solid players in the interior of the line. DT is now a position that could suffer an injury (to anyone but Atkins) and not skip a beat.

4. Offensive Line. This might be a slight stretch to include as an improved position group because there wasn't a whole lot of movement. But I think you can make a pretty good case. Andre Smith's play really fell off last season (as his small FA contract confirmed). Ogbuehi could end up being a major upgrade there if all the hype is even halfway accurate. Better play at RT would be key, especially when you consider some of the speed rushers our RT has to face against the top competitors in the AFC and in the division (Ware, Dumervil, Sheard, etc.). Fisher going into year two and Westerman through the draft give us better backup options than we have had as well. This is a deep and talented OL group.

 

Add it all up and I see 4 position groups that look improved. Only one where we are likely to see a step back. And then a bunch of other positions (RB, TE, maybe DE) where we are young enough that just bringing everyone back from last year should lead to slightly better play due to experience. 

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They've done a fantastic job in a lot of areas.

I'm concerned about the lack of a 3rd DE for pass rushing purposes. And then the complete lack of a stretch the defense WR besides AJ Green. I do feel like these were 2 of the top 5 concerns entering the offseason and for the most part they ignored them other than trying to sign Marvin Jones.

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They've done a fantastic job in a lot of areas.

I'm concerned about the lack of a 3rd DE for pass rushing purposes. And then the complete lack of a stretch the defense WR besides AJ Green. I do feel like these were 2 of the top 5 concerns entering the offseason and for the most part they ignored them other than trying to sign Marvin Jones.

I know he's only small, but Alford is the only guy that may be able to do this.  Hope he starts to show up during preseason.  Also, Tyler Boyd may be better at stretching the field (a la Keenan Allen) than people might think.  If you look at the vids, his long speed isn't that great but he seems to get up to speed quickly from a standing start, and seems to generally play faster than he times.

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They've done a fantastic job in a lot of areas.

I'm concerned about the lack of a 3rd DE for pass rushing purposes. And then the complete lack of a stretch the defense WR besides AJ Green. I do feel like these were 2 of the top 5 concerns entering the offseason and for the most part they ignored them other than trying to sign Marvin Jones.

Yeah, you aren't going to be able to hit every need. Especially without any comp. picks to work with. I do think if you were making a way-too-early mock draft for 2017, those are two positions that could be hit in round 1.

As far as the WR, I'm bullish on Cody Core. He has the size (6'3, 205) and speed (4.47) to be that guy. It's probably pure homerism to expect an early impact from a 6th rounder, but we'll see. Just a gut feeling on this one. I think he will start the year as the 4th WR and really push LaFell for playing time outside and may even be that big complement across from AJ that keeps defenses honest and opens up the middle of the field for Boyd and Eifert. 

On the DE, that speed edge rusher does seem to be the one missing piece that could really take the defense to a next level. A Noah Spence or someone like that as a pass-rush specialist would have been nice. But the Bengals had the #2 scoring defense in the league without anyone in that role last year. So hard to say it's a "need." More of a "want" if that makes sense. And maybe a contract year and new DL coach sparks something in Margus Hunt?

Great stuff happy! I vote you for Bengal's new beat writer! :)

Thanks man, much appreciated. Love going back and forth with everyone about the Bengals each offseason. 

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Yeah, you aren't going to be able to hit every need. Especially without any comp. picks to work with. I do think if you were making a way-too-early mock draft for 2017, those are two positions that could be hit in round 1.

As far as the WR, I'm bullish on Cody Core. He has the size (6'3, 205) and speed (4.47) to be that guy. It's probably pure homerism to expect an early impact from a 6th rounder, but we'll see. Just a gut feeling on this one. I think he will start the year as the 4th WR and really push LaFell for playing time outside and may even be that big complement across from AJ that keeps defenses honest and opens up the middle of the field for Boyd and Eifert. 

On the DE, that speed edge rusher does seem to be the one missing piece that could really take the defense to a next level. A Noah Spence or someone like that as a pass-rush specialist would have been nice. But the Bengals had the #2 scoring defense in the league without anyone in that role last year. So hard to say it's a "need." More of a "want" if that makes sense. And maybe a contract year and new DL coach sparks something in Margus Hunt?

Thanks man, much appreciated. Love going back and forth with everyone about the Bengals each offseason. 

I'm pretty epxcited about Core, too. Granted, it's still underwear Olympics but I was impressed that he ran away from WJ3 at practice last week. He's got a lot to like - size and speed, and toughness. Whether, or when he puts it together is anyone's guess but I don't expect a lot from him this fall. Maybe it's cliche but a lot of rookie WRs don't do a lot, and he's still pretty new to the position.

I read stuff from folks comparing Boyd to Sanu but I don't see a lot of similarity... Other than the fact that they have similar size, are both versatile/caught a lot of footballs, and played for a large mid-Atlantic school. I think Boyd is quicker and faster - he is more Marv Jones-like with the ball in his hands. I think Keenan Allen is a more accurate comparison. I do think he can make some noise in the slot this fall.

On D, I agree that they did a great job this spring. I'm still hopeful that a healthy Quez can be a real asset - I love the feistiness he plays, and his ability to make big plays - hits, PBUs, etc. And while I wasn't a big fan of Shawn Williams when he was drafted, it's hard to take issue with his play last fall. And in Shaw and Derron Smith, they've got some young depth.

I was hoping that Clarke or Hunt was gonna show up last fall - didn't happen. Maybe Jacob Burney will be the cattle prod to get the potential out of these guys. So while I was surprised that the DE position wasn't addressed this offseason, maybe Marvin and crew felt that the new coach was the more critical addition than getting additional players.  

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I know he's only small, but Alford is the only guy that may be able to do this.  Hope he starts to show up during preseason.  Also, Tyler Boyd may be better at stretching the field (a la Keenan Allen) than people might think.  If you look at the vids, his long speed isn't that great but he seems to get up to speed quickly from a standing start, and seems to generally play faster than he times.

See the feel I got for him (Alford) was Hue loved him and the other coaches not so much. Including going into this offseason/season he's kind of been an after thought of coaches remarks. I don't think he's gonna make the team.

I really like Boyd and I think he's more than just a slot guy like some are saying, but I think it would take a season or two to really have any stretch the field impact on a defense though.

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Yeah, you aren't going to be able to hit every need. Especially without any comp. picks to work with. I do think if you were making a way-too-early mock draft for 2017, those are two positions that could be hit in round 1.

As far as the WR, I'm bullish on Cody Core. He has the size (6'3, 205) and speed (4.47) to be that guy. It's probably pure homerism to expect an early impact from a 6th rounder, but we'll see. Just a gut feeling on this one. I think he will start the year as the 4th WR and really push LaFell for playing time outside and may even be that big complement across from AJ that keeps defenses honest and opens up the middle of the field for Boyd and Eifert. 

On the DE, that speed edge rusher does seem to be the one missing piece that could really take the defense to a next level. A Noah Spence or someone like that as a pass-rush specialist would have been nice. But the Bengals had the #2 scoring defense in the league without anyone in that role last year. So hard to say it's a "need." More of a "want" if that makes sense. And maybe a contract year and new DL coach sparks something in Margus Hunt?

Thanks man, much appreciated. Love going back and forth with everyone about the Bengals each offseason. 

I love Core. I think they got him as a steal. I hope they let him play and don't just sit him cuz he's a backend rookie. I understand why we are where we are at WR and I'm not complaining about it as much this year as the lack of preparation the last 2 years.

DE though is an area I felt they ignored that they truly needed to make a must move. Whether it be draft or a Tier 3/4 free agent I don't care but a better body needs to be brought in. You can't intelligently toss out Clarke/Hunt and expect them to provide shit. They've shown nothing so far. I hold out a little hope for Clarke but more in a Robert Geathers early down run stopping DE. Hunt is a lost cause unless Burney is a God. That role last year they had Gilberry. Gilberry wasn't great last year but he was still light years ahead of Clarke/Hunt so they definitely downgrade it. Plus they trusted Gilberry to not overpursue or get blown way out of a play and you can't really trust Hunt or Clarke. If MJ or Dunlap went down Gilberry could probably mask it enough to get you by a couple weeks. They don't have that luxury at all now. 3rd DE is the biggest glaring hole on this current roster and pass rush is insanely important in this passing league.

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See the feel I got for him (Alford) was Hue loved him and the other coaches not so much. Including going into this offseason/season he's kind of been an after thought of coaches remarks. I don't think he's gonna make the team.

I really like Boyd and I think he's more than just a slot guy like some are saying, but I think it would take a season or two to really have any stretch the field impact on a defense though.

You're probably right, but I hope you're wrong about Alford.

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I know he's only small, but Alford is the only guy that may be able to do this.  Hope he starts to show up during preseason.  Also, Tyler Boyd may be better at stretching the field (a la Keenan Allen) than people might think.  If you look at the vids, his long speed isn't that great but he seems to get up to speed quickly from a standing start, and seems to generally play faster than he times.

So in a way, Boyd could be similar to the GOAT as far as WRs go in that respect--after all everyone knocks on Jerry Rice not having that 4.3 speed.  But he didn't need it because time and again he routinely ran away from his opponents (something like 15 yrds and further you wont catch him, or something like that).

Definitely intriguing...

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I'm pretty epxcited about Core, too. Granted, it's still underwear Olympics but I was impressed that he ran away from WJ3 at practice last week. He's got a lot to like - size and speed, and toughness. Whether, or when he puts it together is anyone's guess but I don't expect a lot from him this fall. Maybe it's cliche but a lot of rookie WRs don't do a lot, and he's still pretty new to the position.

I read stuff from folks comparing Boyd to Sanu but I don't see a lot of similarity... Other than the fact that they have similar size, are both versatile/caught a lot of footballs, and played for a large mid-Atlantic school. I think Boyd is quicker and faster - he is more Marv Jones-like with the ball in his hands. I think Keenan Allen is a more accurate comparison. I do think he can make some noise in the slot this fall.

On D, I agree that they did a great job this spring. I'm still hopeful that a healthy Quez can be a real asset - I love the feistiness he plays, and his ability to make big plays - hits, PBUs, etc. And while I wasn't a big fan of Shawn Williams when he was drafted, it's hard to take issue with his play last fall. And in Shaw and Derron Smith, they've got some young depth.

I was hoping that Clarke or Hunt was gonna show up last fall - didn't happen. Maybe Jacob Burney will be the cattle prod to get the potential out of these guys. So while I was surprised that the DE position wasn't addressed this offseason, maybe Marvin and crew felt that the new coach was the more critical addition than getting additional players.  

I love Core. I think they got him as a steal. I hope they let him play and don't just sit him cuz he's a backend rookie. I understand why we are where we are at WR and I'm not complaining about it as much this year as the lack of preparation the last 2 years.

DE though is an area I felt they ignored that they truly needed to make a must move. Whether it be draft or a Tier 3/4 free agent I don't care but a better body needs to be brought in. You can't intelligently toss out Clarke/Hunt and expect them to provide shit. They've shown nothing so far. I hold out a little hope for Clarke but more in a Robert Geathers early down run stopping DE. Hunt is a lost cause unless Burney is a God. That role last year they had Gilberry. Gilberry wasn't great last year but he was still light years ahead of Clarke/Hunt so they definitely downgrade it. Plus they trusted Gilberry to not overpursue or get blown way out of a play and you can't really trust Hunt or Clarke. If MJ or Dunlap went down Gilberry could probably mask it enough to get you by a couple weeks. They don't have that luxury at all now. 3rd DE is the biggest glaring hole on this current roster and pass rush is insanely important in this passing league.

The need vs. want argument is always a little weird, but I still feel like you are overstating how badly they needed to make a move at DE. Clarke and Hunt played less than 200 snaps combined last year. 

The Bengals had 1,032 snaps on defense. Dunlap played 964 of them. MJ played 920 of them. 

The Bengals led the league in fewest touchdowns allowed. Were 3rd in interceptions. Gave up just 5.8 yards per passing attempt against (4th best). 

So the defense (and pass defense specifically) was fantastic with our two starting DEs playing 90% or more of the snaps. Backup DE just isn't a hugely important position and while it would be nice to have a better #3 option there, it's not like we can't again have one of the league's best defenses with Dunlap and MJ playing most of the game. And if Hunt and Clarke are each playing 6 snaps per game, it's not going to kill the defense.

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The need vs. want argument is always a little weird, but I still feel like you are overstating how badly they needed to make a move at DE. Clarke and Hunt played less than 200 snaps combined last year. 

The Bengals had 1,032 snaps on defense. Dunlap played 964 of them. MJ played 920 of them. 

The Bengals led the league in fewest touchdowns allowed. Were 3rd in interceptions. Gave up just 5.8 yards per passing attempt against (4th best). 

So the defense (and pass defense specifically) was fantastic with our two starting DEs playing 90% or more of the snaps. Backup DE just isn't a hugely important position and while it would be nice to have a better #3 option there, it's not like we can't again have one of the league's best defenses with Dunlap and MJ playing most of the game. And if Hunt and Clarke are each playing 6 snaps per game, it's not going to kill the defense.

Last year you saw Dunlap and MJ really start to decline as the season went on. Also you can't expect them to continue to play 900+ snaps multiple years in a row, get older and not start to break down, lose a step or have an injury. We are banking on 2 guys being our horses with absolutely no safety valve in place. Gilberry provided somewhat of that the last few seasons. Hunt is absolute trash and Clarke is ok for run stopping but shitty for pass rushing. They need to reduce the workload on MJ/Dunlap, not increase/keep it the same. It is a major position of need.

Also the passing D could use some assistance coming into this year. Leon Hall the last couple years hasn't been very good when lined up on the outside, but when lined up in the slot he was one of the best CBs in the NFL at defending the slot. We are going very green in the slot now. Pacman and Dre pretty much stay outside. Dennard most likely is going to take over the slot but he's very inexperienced and has yet to stay healthy to gain much experience. At the very least there will be growing pains, if not major difficulties at that spot. Improving our rush would provide major assistance to that. If we are targeting 3rd DE and 3rd/4th option WR then obviously the team is in a great position, but going into the offseason a couple of the biggest needs were minorly addressed or not addressed at all. If Dunlap or MJ go down though, there will be absolutely no pass rush at all and considering how important the pass rush is in the NFL I'm truly amazed 3rd DE wasn't addressed. They must have REALLY high hopes for Hardison slimming down and taking over the Gilberry role or they still blindly love Hunt/Clarke who have showed nothing at all, not even glimpses.

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So in a way, Boyd could be similar to the GOAT as far as WRs go in that respect--after all everyone knocks on Jerry Rice not having that 4.3 speed.  But he didn't need it because time and again he routinely ran away from his opponents (something like 15 yrds and further you wont catch him, or something like that).

Definitely intriguing...

Jerry Rice could cut in and out of breaks sharper than than knife.  Boyd is already very refined in his routes, not a bad place to start imo.

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On 5/16/2016 at 0:41 PM, happyrid said:

 

 

 

So the defense (and pass defense specifically) was fantastic with our two starting DEs playing 90% or more of the snaps. Backup DE just isn't a hugely important position and while it would be nice to have a better #3 option there, it's not like we can't again have one of the league's best defenses with Dunlap and MJ playing most of the game. And if Hunt and Clarke are each playing 6 snaps per game, it's not going to kill the defense.

But wouldn't it be great to bring in a proven sub here? Even for a fresh body it would be great, but in case of injury I'm worried.

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23 minutes ago, Jupiter Fan said:

But wouldn't it be great to bring in a proven sub here? Even for a fresh body it would be great, but in case of injury I'm worried.

Yeah, it would have been nice. I'm not arguing in the least that it would be better to have a really good backup DE than to not have one. I wish we had 53 Pro Bowl caliber players on the roster. 

All I'm saying is that it's not the type of glaring need that I am going to kill the Bengals for not filling when money and draft picks are limited. I mean just the fact that we're most concerned about the backups at a certain position is pretty telling on how well the Bengals filled the major needs.

There's not a single team in the NFL that has top-notch backup options at every single position. 

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1 hour ago, MichaelWeston said:

Brian Hartline was cut. Might be a nice addition. 

Andrew Hawkins might not be too far behind him. He's a guy who I could see back in Cincy since he already has a rapport with Dalton, knows Zampese, friends with AJ, etc.

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Looking a little closer at the Browns depth chart, they have:

Corey Coleman (1st round)

Ricardo Louis (4th round)

Jordan Payton (5th round)

Rashard Higgins (5th round)

Terrelle Pryor (reportedly having a good camp)

Andrew Hawkins

Taylor Gabriel

Marlon Moore

And a few others...

They front-loaded Hawkins' contract though so he's only making $1M this year. could see them keeping him around just to have a veteran presence. But with them probably keeping all 4 rookies, spots are pretty tight.

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WR group looks thin as hell.  

15 Alford, Mario WR 5-9 180 24 2 West Virginia
80 Bennett, Michael WR 6-2 200 24 1 Georgia
83 Boyd, Tyler WR 6-1 197   R Pittsburgh
16 Core, Cody WR 6-3 205   R Mississippi
12 Erickson, Alex WR 6-0 195 23 R Wisconsin
82 Grant, Antwane WR 6-0 202 23 R Western Kentucky
18 Green, A.J. WR 6-4 207 27 6 Georgia
84 Kumerow, Jake WR 6-5 206 24 1 Wis.-Whitewater
11 LaFell, Brandon WR 6-3 210 29 7 LSU
17 Russell, Alonzo WR 6-4 206 23 R Toledo
19 Tate, Brandon WR 6-1 195 28 8 North Carolina
86 Wright, James WR 6-1 201 24 3 Louisiana State

 

These are the WRs on the Bengals roster right now.  I think there are only two WRs that are stone-cold locks to make the opening day roster.  AJ Green and Tyler Boyd.

Brandon LeFell will probably make the team and be the #2 at least initially.    

I think Tate will also make it because the Bengals only trust Tate and Adam Jones with KR/PR duties.   

So that leaves two spots left.  Its probably a scrum between Kumerow, Core, Alford and Russell.  James Wright starts the season on PUP.  I would put my money on Kumerow taking one of the two spots because the beat writers say that he is awesome in practice.

 

Would not mind adding Hartline to this group.  

 

 

 

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6 hours ago, BlackBengal said:

WR group looks thin as hell.  

15 Alford, Mario WR 5-9 180 24 2 West Virginia
80 Bennett, Michael WR 6-2 200 24 1 Georgia
83 Boyd, Tyler WR 6-1 197   R Pittsburgh
16 Core, Cody WR 6-3 205   R Mississippi
12 Erickson, Alex WR 6-0 195 23 R Wisconsin
82 Grant, Antwane WR 6-0 202 23 R Western Kentucky
18 Green, A.J. WR 6-4 207 27 6 Georgia
84 Kumerow, Jake WR 6-5 206 24 1 Wis.-Whitewater
11 LaFell, Brandon WR 6-3 210 29 7 LSU
17 Russell, Alonzo WR 6-4 206 23 R Toledo
19 Tate, Brandon WR 6-1 195 28 8 North Carolina
86 Wright, James WR 6-1 201 24 3 Louisiana State

 

These are the WRs on the Bengals roster right now.  I think there are only two WRs that are stone-cold locks to make the opening day roster.  AJ Green and Tyler Boyd.

Brandon LeFell will probably make the team and be the #2 at least initially.    

I think Tate will also make it because the Bengals only trust Tate and Adam Jones with KR/PR duties.   

So that leaves two spots left.  Its probably a scrum between Kumerow, Core, Alford and Russell.  James Wright starts the season on PUP.  I would put my money on Kumerow taking one of the two spots because the beat writers say that he is awesome in practice.

 

Would not mind adding Hartline to this group.  

 

 

 

Could keep 6 with

Boyd-Lafell-Green

Core or Wright

Tate or Alford

6th guy. 

I think that could be Hartline. He isn't great but he is solid. Plays mostly on the outside. 

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