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MichaelWeston

Do we draft well anymore?

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Copy and past sucks but take a look. Last 4 years of drafting

 

2016

1)      CB-William Jackson: Injury DNP

2)      WR-Tyler Boyd: 50-539-10.8-1, 3-43-14.3-0

3)      LB-Nick Vigil: 13 tackles

4)      NT-Andrew Billings: Injury DNP

5)      OL-Christian Westerman: Has not played a snap

6)      WR-Cody Core: 5-79-15-8-0

7)      S-Clayton Fejedelem:  10 tackles

U)  WR-Alex Erickson: 5-66-13.2-0, 21pr-8.5avg, 24kr-28.7avg

W) QB-Jeff Driskel: Has not played a snap

W) CB-KeiVarae Russell: 1 tackle

 

2015

1)      T-Cedric Ogbuehi: 11 starts, benched

2)      T-Jake Fisher: 1 start

3)A TE-Tyler Kroft: 10-92-9.2-0

3)B LB-PJ Dawson: On the Practice Squad

4)A CB-Josh Shaw: 51 tackles, 1int, 3 Passes defensed

4)B DT-Marcus Hardison: Injury DNP

5)   TE-CJ Uzomah: 17-193-11.4-0

6)   S- Derron Smith:  7 tackles, 1 PD

7)   WR-Mario Alford: BROWNS

U)  DT-DeShawn Williams: 2 tackles, .5 sacks

 

2014

1)      CB-Darqueze Dennard: 42 tackles, 1 pass defensed

2)      RB-Jeremy Hill: 215-831-3.9-9td, 21-174-8.3-0

3)      DE-Will Clarke: 13 tackles, 3 sacks

4)      C-Russell Bodine: 14 starts

5)      QB-AJ McCarron: Has not played a snap

6)      LB-Marquis Flowers: 7 tackles

7)A WR-James Wright: 12-98-8.2-0, 10 tackles

7)B CB-LaVelle Westbrooks: ALOUETTES

U)   TE-Ryan Hewitt: 1-5-5.0-0, 3 tackles

 

2013

1)      TE-Tyler Eifert: 29-394-13.6-5

2)A RB-Gio Bernard: 91-337-3.7-2, 39-336-8.6-1

2)B DE-Margus Hunt: 16 tackles, 2 passes defensed

3)   S-Shawn Williams: 71 tackles, 1 sack, 4 pass break ups, 2 int

4)  LB-Sean Porter: JAGUARS

4)      G-Tanner Hawkinson: RETIRED

5)      RB-Rex Burkhead: 35-183-5.2-0, 11-95-8.6-0

6)      WR-Cobi Hamilton: Stealers

7)      T-Reid Fragel: NO TEAM, last with KC during training camp 2016

7)      C-TJ Johnson:  0 starts, limited playing time

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Who would have guessed dennard would be this bad. He only played 5 snaps yesterday and gave up a huge play to a TE. Hopefully Ced turns the corner, but that 2015 draft is garbage.


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I used to think the better drafting was due to Tobin, it's starting to look more like Zimmer and Gruden were the ones that made the difference 

 

Still laugh at the people who want Marvin to move to the front office because he has an eye for talent lol

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22 minutes ago, Storm said:

I used to think the better drafting was due to Tobin, it's starting to look more like Zimmer and Gruden were the ones that made the difference 

 

Still laugh at the people who want Marvin to move to the front office because he has an eye for talent lol

 

I actually used to think that...

Now I fucking laugh/cry at everything involved with Marvin having anything involved with this teams future......  

 

Please make it stop....

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22 minutes ago, Storm said:

 

 

Still laugh at the people who want Marvin to move to the front office because he has an eye for talent lol

Sorry I can only give one +1

Marvy should only move to the front office if its to empty the trash cans after work.

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I think Marvin would make a great COO or whatever.. for some other team.  Bengals need a culture change, not just a coaching change.  I feel like he got us partway out of the hole but was still saddled with a whole lot of baggage.  The NFL has us pegged as this self-defeating loser franchise and what's worse, we act like we believe it, too.  That's a hard thing to overcome. I don't know that hiring a new HC is gonna do it, particularly not if he too is hamstrung with inherited tenured coaches & players or a "we're going to be competitive" philosophy.

 

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I used to think the better drafting was due to Tobin, it's starting to look more like Zimmer and Gruden were the ones that made the difference 
 
Still laugh at the people who want Marvin to move to the front office because he has an eye for talent lol

I often wonder if luck plays a major role. teams sometimes get lucky with a pick like geno Atkins but it can be a crap shoot for the most part.

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I think what stands out the most for me in the drafts listed is the lack of impact players selected in the first three rounds:

William Jackson
Tyler Boyd
Nick Vigil
Cedric Ogbuehi
Jake Fisher
Tyler Kroft
Paul Dawson
Darqueze Dennard
Jeremy Hill
Will Clarke
Tyler Eifert
Gio Bernard
Margus Hunt
Shawn Williams

Now, it may be too early to write some of these guys off just yet but, that's a pretty unimpressive group. At most you can say that Bernard, Hill and Eifert have provided some value. Aside from those three there is only one other "starter" from that entire group which is the very below average Shawn Williams. At the moment Kroft, Dawson, Dennard, Clarke, Hunt and Williams appear to be terrible picks.

With the Bengals "sign your own approach" the lack off success makes the recent fall from grace for this team understandable. As players from the past five playoff seasons have aged to the point of needing to be upgraded and/or departing players have left gaps, the draft has not been able to replace them. You can't keep moving forward without putting new, impactful players on the field.

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9 minutes ago, Randle P McMurphy said:

McCarron started the last 3 games last season and the playoff game. 

You have him listed as not playing a single snap.  

I believe the OP was listing the draft picks' contribution to the current season only.

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3 hours ago, EnglishBengal said:

^^This

 

+2

We need an overhaul from the top down. It was, for awhile, that we had totally reversed the culture of the franchise. But, my, how quickly it has reverted. A soft approach from the ringmaster seems to have translated to a soft approach from the coordinators and position coaches. Especially this year, the times it looked like Guenther was taking the bull by the horns, he was pistol whipped by Marv, ironically showing more fire in shoving his DC away from the sideline than he has shown at ant singular, shitty call against his team in the last three years. 

The team lacks an motivated, angular, identity...they are adrift in a very competitive league. I agree...some of it might be drafting, but some of it also is poor/inconsistent coaching. 

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Yes, but we don't allow them to grow and learn as a young player.  We stick them behind lesser veterans and use the excuse " learn to be professionals".  

Best example of this is PJ. Two of the three LBs above him are lesser players.  If he knew the team actually depended on him to be a pro, that may be a better motivation for him to be a pro than letting him believe nothing he can do is worth it.

 

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On 12/19/2016 at 6:19 PM, Enon Bengal said:

Wow -  three starters...

 

Eifert

Hill / Bernard

Bodine

...and meaningful playing time from a handful of others?

Two.   Bodine is just out there until they actually find a Center

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4 hours ago, cincity said:

Yes, but we don't allow them to grow and learn as a young player.  We stick them behind lesser veterans and use the excuse " learn to be professionals".  

Best example of this is PJ. Two of the three LBs above him are lesser players.  If he knew the team actually depended on him to be a pro, that may be a better motivation for him to be a pro than letting him believe nothing he can do is worth it.

 

I think there's some definite merit to this statement. I think many of the players on the OP's list are pretty good/decent (or injured, like our first round corner and Billings) and still have a chance to make a case that they are above average contributors. Nick Vigil played really well in the last game, Erickson is coming along, we have no idea what we have yet in Billings or William Jackson.

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13 hours ago, Bunghole said:

I think there's some definite merit to this statement. I think many of the players on the OP's list are pretty good/decent (or injured, like our first round corner and Billings) and still have a chance to make a case that they are above average contributors. Nick Vigil played really well in the last game, Erickson is coming along, we have no idea what we have yet in Billings or William Jackson.

At some positions it's less coaching then that there is a stud player eating minutes above them. I do think that at many positions its the coaches not even trying to get these guys on the field in any situation. It also hurts that we NEVER seem to blow anyone out. 

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Is it that we don't draft well or that because we have been drafting at the bottom of the draft where playoff teams draft for so long that our talent has gotten diluted?

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That 2013 draft is fine. Pretty good actually. 

2014 was mediocre but not a killer. 

2016, too soon to tell. 

 

It's that 2015 draft that has absolutely killed us. That was the draft that should have set us up for a while on the OL. Instead, it's led to the one spot that's been a glaring weakness this season. Having all the extra mid-round picks and only hitting on one (Shaw) is also a huge setback. 

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A better question would be do the Bengals develop and coach their players well anymore? It's proven time and time again that you can get undrafted free agents and turn them into Pro Bowl, All Pro, MVP, even HOF'ers with the right coaching.

All Time Undrafted Team This team would be hard pressed to be beaten vs. any group of players that ever played in the NFL. Coaching makes the biggest difference in the NFL where the talent level is pretty much even and the salary cap ensures all teams are working with the same amount of money needed to compete. The franchises that are able to land a good coaching staff that can find and develop players that fit their coaching style and system are successful, the ones that don't... get fired. 

 

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On 12/22/2016 at 8:02 PM, happyrid said:

That 2013 draft is fine. Pretty good actually. 

2014 was mediocre but not a killer. 

2016, too soon to tell. 

 

It's that 2015 draft that has absolutely killed us. That was the draft that should have set us up for a while on the OL. Instead, it's led to the one spot that's been a glaring weakness this season. Having all the extra mid-round picks and only hitting on one (Shaw) is also a huge setback. 

The 2013 draft was not good at all.  The first round pick has missed 27 games.

The 2nd round pick is an average running back who was so well thought of they drafted ANOTHER RB  in the 2ND round the next year.

The other 2nd rounder Hunt barely plays.

3rd rounder bust.

4th rounder Williams not bad for spot chosen.  

After that Buckhead only player with very limited playing time.

 

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