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jhowdy54

Draft well and keep your own FA.....BS

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What a F'n Joke. Sanu, Marvin Jones, Reggie Nelson, and now Kevin Zeitler. Also possibly Dre Kirkpatrick. I guarentee they offer a contract to Domato Peko and keep Adam Jones when they would save 7 million cutting him. Dont worry we'll get that 3rd rd compensation.

 

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What a F'n Joke. Sanu, Marvin Jones, Reggie Nelson, and now Kevin Zeitler. Also possibly Dre Kirkpatrick. I guarentee they offer a contract to Domato Peko and keep Adam Jones when they would save 7 million cutting him. Dont worry we'll get that 3rd rd compensation.
 
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Jones was offered the same amount. Sanu There's no way you're offering a guy just over 6 million a year who averages around 30 yards a game. Nelson was age and we'll probably resign z, Whit, and Dre k. I think we should resign peko one more year as a backup role.

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1 hour ago, jhowdy54 said:

 

What a F'n Joke. Sanu, Marvin Jones, Reggie Nelson, and now Kevin Zeitler. Also possibly Dre Kirkpatrick. I guarentee they offer a contract to Domato Peko and keep Adam Jones when they would save 7 million cutting him. Dont worry we'll get that 3rd rd compensation.

 

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The Bengals have historically paid their own upper tier players. In the Dalton era alone, we've retained Whitworth (multiple times), Geno, Dunlap, Bernard, Green, Burfict, Dalton, and Boling. I'm sure there are a couple more I'm forgetting as well, and that's only mentioning the past few seasons. How many great players that we drafted or developed have gone to other teams?

Sanu was the 5th receiving option here, at best. There's no way you pay him what the Falcons did. Anyone that thought we should or could retain Sanu were dreaming. The FO made the right choice not paying Dalton's 5th option that kind of money.

I'm bummed that we didn't pay Reggie, but we got a lot of mileage from the guy. You act like Reggie was a guy we drafted and then let walk after his rookie contract. He played here for years until the FO THOUGHT they had an up and coming youngster that could be starting caliber in Shawn Williams. You'd be yelling at the Bengals if they paid Reggie and let Williams walk for the same exact reason you listed Nelson here. You want them to retain their own? They did exactly that with Williams, who looked great in a small sample size the year before his newest contract. Hindsight is 20/20 with some people. It was a reasonable business decision by the FO that didn't pan out.

I'm bummed about MLJ, but it is what it is. I loved watching Tyler Boyd @ PITT and I think he has star potential in the league, so we'll see. We wouldn't have him on the roster (most likely) if we retained MLJ, so that draft pick lessened the blow for me. I don't mind having a "value #2" like LaFell around either, I'd like to see him re-signed to a 2-3 year deal.

Zeitler will hurt to watch leave, but you can't pay everybody what they want and expect to keep every single great player on your team. Our OL was shaky last year so you'd hope they'd put some money into it, but I think the Bengals are expecting someone to way overpay for Zeitler. I'll be pissed right with you if he signs for a reasonable contract outside of Cincinnati, but until then, I'm not going to preemptively bitch about the FO's decision with him. We don't even know what's going to happen yet.

Same with Dre Kirk, I'll be right there complaining if they let him walk for a decent deal. He pretty much needs to be back here next year if we want to compete.

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6 minutes ago, SocalBengalEd said:

Takeo spikes, Johnathan Joseph,  Steinbach and Zeitler call bull shit. 

There are 8 upper tier players that the Bengals have extended and kept around in the Dalton era alone. How many upper tier players have they lost?

Honestly, I feel like some people just want to complain about stuff whether it has any merit or not. You can't pay every great player, it doesn't happen with any organization. Zeitler isn't gone yet, so if all you have is 3 examples over a 15 year period, I'm pretty sure that would rank the Bengals as one of the best teams in the league at retaining their talented players.

There are things that I'm very critical of the Bengals FO for, but you're just whining for the sake of whining if you think they refuse to pay their homegrown talent. The real complaint would be that the Bengals are too shy and conservative about paying OUTSIDE free agents and won't take risks with players that come from other teams.

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If we dont have the money we dont have the money I understand that. The problem is we do have the money. I also have a problem keeping guys like Peko, Maualuga, and MJ. Guys make 3-5 million a year when We could get the same production from a rookie.

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Where did Zeitler sign?

 

oh, wait, he's still a Bengal?

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We had a string of really good drafts which led to a bunch of guys hitting FA around the same time and not being able to afford extensions for them all. We ended up carrying forward like $5M from last season. That wasn't enough to sign Sanu, Nelson, or any of those guys. It would be one thing if we had a bunch of cap space going unused like some teams do, but we've basically been right up against the cap in recent years and are likely to be again this year.

On the "bright side," we've had some mediocre drafts in recent years so we aren't going to have to worry too much about losing our own in FA the next couple offseason after this one. 

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I don't agree with the original post. But it truly doesn't make sense to value the guard position so much that you take a guard in the first round and then value it so low you refuse to pay that guy when he turns out being great. I get not paying him. I don't get drafting him. 

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1 hour ago, Le Tigre said:

Was he the Quitter pick that year, or was that Dre? 

Dre

And Gio

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13 minutes ago, Le Tigre said:

Thanks.

Guess they start looking for a guard then. FA? Draft? Already on roster?

 

Why not Alexander himself? If they played Dennis Roland based on technique, I can only imagine a career OL coach must have near-perfect form.

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31 minutes ago, Le Tigre said:

Thanks.

Guess they start looking for a guard then. FA? Draft? Already on roster?

If I had to bet my house on what's going to unfold with the o-line and had to make that prediction right now, I'd say we draft an RG within the first couple of rounds of the draft and he starts this year. Could be totally wrong though, o-line is going to be the big story to watch as Bengals fans. There's a lot up in the air and a lot of variables when it comes to the line this offseason.

If I had to make a random prediction of something a little more unexpected, I'd say we re-sign Andre Smith at RT and move someone like Jake Fisher inside. For some reason that seems like a really Bengals-ish thing to do.

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I was thinking of the same scenario. 

I am reminded of Numbers' favorite, Mr. Christian Westerman. Any shot for him? He had very little PT last season, so not sure what to make of him. 

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13 hours ago, MichaelWeston said:

I don't agree with the original post. But it truly doesn't make sense to value the guard position so much that you take a guard in the first round and then value it so low you refuse to pay that guy when he turns out being great. I get not paying him. I don't get drafting him. 

Eh, they traded down to the late first and picked up an extra 3rd rounder. And they got 5 good years at ~$3M a year average out of Zeitler. Still a good use of a late 1st. (and they'll get a 3rd round comp back too). So for their 21st pick, they got two 3rd rounders and 5 good years of a cheap guard. Not bad. 

I also think that they really planned on keeping Zeitler but that Ogbuehi being a bust forced a change of plans. When they went OT/OT in the first two rounds of the 2015 draft, they surely weren't doing it thinking they'd be paying Whitworth $9-10M in 2017. I think they'd have been fine with paying Zeitler $10M a year with both tackles on rookie deals. But with Cedric busting, it forces an either/or on Whit/Zeitler because they don't really have the cap space to throw over $20M a year at 2 guys on the OL.  

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3 hours ago, omgdrdoom said:

If I had to bet my house on what's going to unfold with the o-line and had to make that prediction right now, I'd say we draft an RG within the first couple of rounds of the draft and he starts this year. Could be totally wrong though, o-line is going to be the big story to watch as Bengals fans. There's a lot up in the air and a lot of variables when it comes to the line this offseason.

If I had to make a random prediction of something a little more unexpected, I'd say we re-sign Andre Smith at RT and move someone like Jake Fisher inside. For some reason that seems like a really Bengals-ish thing to do.

I agree with this. Though ideally they draft an OL that's versatile enough to play either RG or RT. We still don't know what to expect from Fisher so they need as many options as possible. 

TJ Johnson is also worth remembering. He played pretty well down the stretch in 2016. Started the Week 17 Baltimore game, which was arguably the best OL game of the season. 

Between Fisher, Johnson, Westerman, maybe a veteran, and a rookie (or two) you would think they'd be able to find a couple solid starters on the right side.

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Maybe we should give Ced one healthy offseason before labeling him a bust?

No? Torches and pitchforks it is, then.

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7 minutes ago, T-Dub said:

Maybe we should give Ced one healthy offseason before labeling him a bust?

No? Torches and pitchforks it is, then.

His rookie contract is for 4 years and then he's a FA. He's already halfway through it. 

By all accounts the Bengals #1 priority is bringing Whitworth back to play LT for 2017 and possibly 2018. 

Cedric has come out and said he's basically given up on RT and wants to concentrate on LT, which shows that both he and the Bengals are planning for him to be the backup LT in his third season. 

 

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22 minutes ago, T-Dub said:

Maybe we should give Ced one healthy offseason before labeling him a bust?

No? Torches and pitchforks it is, then.

How frequently do you see an oft injured, human turnstile on the field NFL tackle turn into a capable starter the next season?

I'm all for giving guys a shot, especially ones that show SOME promise, but what have we seen from Ogbuehi other than some of the worst tackle play in recent memory?

I'd also have a better feeling about his development if he was under a different position coach.

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5 minutes ago, omgdrdoom said:

How frequently do you see an oft injured, human turnstile on the field NFL tackle turn into a capable starter the next season?

 

I'm hoping the "oft-injured" part explains the rest of it.

 

Quote

I'd also have a better feeling about his development if he was under a different position coach.

 

No question.  I'd like to think McNally was brought here as an eventual replacement but they're not going to fire anyone to make that happen.

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Well, you can't keep them all.

But, what you do is build a bona fide winning culture, guys are more inclined to stick around when the locker room is stable and they all feel like they will win in the post season. I think for a short while, Marvin's approach to letting the inmates run things was appealing to some guys. Some of the dudes we have lost, we didn't necessarily get grossly outbid, or even outbid at all...some of these dudes left because there was something not right or lacking with the culture of this franchise, as far as it's come.

This isn't quantifiable or provable, save direct commentary from the players who have left, but I think it's a huge part of our lack of getting over the hump.

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11 hours ago, thezerawkid said:

This isn't quantifiable or provable, save direct commentary from the players who have left, but I think it's a huge part of our lack of getting over the hump.

 

No denying it IMO.  ML's lifetime contract & MB"s "Redeemer" bullshit demonstrate a lack of accountability. The PeeWee soccer-ish plan of alternating series between competing players at a position, sticking with players like Nugent that are clearly costing them games, Marvin bending over for lopsided officiating that lets his players get targeted for injury.. Add to all that playing in a conservative-minded media backwater where half the "fans" seem to hate the team or at best expect them to lose.. Why would anyone want to play here, honestly?

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On 2/10/2017 at 9:55 AM, Le Tigre said:

Thanks.

Guess they start looking for a guard then. FA? Draft? Already on roster?

Westerberg.

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