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Boycott Both Bengals vs. Browns Games


Rick

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Lol, SF2. And then you doubled down in your edit, adding everything after the bit I quoted above.

 

Here's the deal. This whole "warrior-hero" bullshit is completely out of control. It's sick and bad for our society. I'd suggest that we rather focus on the concept of the "citizen-soldier."

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6 hours ago, SF2 said:

If they are black men FIRST, they shouldn't be serving. Of course no REAL man black or white would let some whiny crying bitch like you speak for them.  Hey, get that Brigadier General on the site.  I want to hear him say he is a BLACK MAN first, a General in the United States Armed Forces second. 

 

Only an arrogant bitch would proclaim he speaks for any man.  HOWEVER, if that is actually the case in your family, your family is full of pussies. My guess is you are full of shit 

Don't you have popcorn to pop, while the grownups are having a discussion?  We all realize that you don't have the intellectual acumen to understand or conceptualize things that require an IQ over 70. Go on back to the kiddies table.

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6 hours ago, Homer_Rice said:

Shame on you. Kenneth's meaning was crystal clear in his post. 

 

 

FWIW I took that to mean, to put it somewhat crudely, the uniform comes off but skin color doesn't.  Nothing else.  It's the same distinction that seems entirely lost on the "Blue Lives Matter" crowd - that blue is a uniform you choose to wear and can take off at the end of the day.  

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15 hours ago, kennethmw said:

USN, I respect the fact that you and Rick served.  I didn't.  But my Father did, my father in law did.  My brother did, multiple cousins did.  I've got soldiers, airmen and officers in my family including a Brigadier General whose currently serving.  But you know what?  They are all black men first, and when they Don't have on that uniform, they often have found that they get the same respect other black men get, which is little to none.  So until you have walked in our shoes, let's stop telling us how we should protest the injustice that are a Daily concern in our lives, regardless of our service to country or economic status.

Kenneth, you obviously didn't read anything else I wrote, and my post to Toast was not about color at all... it was about service men and women of ALL color. I SUPPORT the protest, and your assumption, without reading anything prior is an insult.

 

Below this is what I wrote on the first page... that's where I stand with people of color, and people of the human race for that matter.

 

"

 

Rick, as a disabled retired veteran of the US Navy, I understand your point of view.

 

However, let me interject something...

 

Many people are upset that NFL players (amongst other sports athletes) are not standing during the national anthem. They say that it's a sign of major disrespect to veterans, especially the ones who paid the ultimate sacrifice for our country.

 

Indulge me if you please...

 

The "Golden Generation", the ones everyone refers to as the saviors of the American way, did indeed fight against the tyrants attempts at world oppression from Germany, Japan, Italy, and a small smattering of others. When the U.S. entered World War II, Jim Crow segregation had permeated every aspect of American society. When black men volunteered for duty or were drafted, they were assigned to segregated divisions and often given combat support roles, such as cook, quartermaster and grave-digging duty. According to British personnel in the BEF, meals in the US Army were served with the white servicemen being served in one line and the black servicemen and officers in another. Because of black protests against the Army's treatment of its black soldiers, military leadership began to attempt to address the issue beginning in 1943, but segregation in the armed forces remained official policy until 1948.

With the exception of 18 female African-American nurses who had served in World War I, the Army Nurses Corp, established in 1901, remained white until 1941, when pressure from the National Association of Colored Graduate Nurses, and Eleanor Roosevelt , caused the Army to admit black nurses. A quota of 48 nurses was set, and the women were segregated from white nurses and white soldiers for much of the war. Eventually more black nurses enlisted. They were assigned to care for black soldiers, and served in the China-Burma-India theater, Australia, New Guinea, Liberia, England and the Philippines.

 

So, besides the history lesson, my point is this;

 

Black men and women volunteered to serve to fight world oppression when they couldn't escape racial oppression back home. You and I fought for the rights of ALL citizens to protest, and these black men and women, and ANYONE else who cares about people of color has the right and should be supported for doing so.

 

I stand with them now, although I didn't at first, because I didn't take the time to walk in their shoes.

 

It's not about respect for our vets and America, it's about the lack of respect and equality for people who volunteered to defend this country that won't treat them as equals.

 

Just my $.02, and I'll move this thread to J & D."

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3 hours ago, westside bengal said:

As a teen in high school during the late 60's and then in college in the early 70's the whole Kaepernick protest thing is pretty tame (but no less important) compared to what went on back then.

 

It's really interesting to me how we've generally been conditioned since then to view protest as a waste of time, with the "get a job" insults & all that.  Then, at the same time, protesters are a dire threat and need to be met with riot police.  So which is it? Like it's pointless anyway so don't bother, until someone breaks a window at a Starbuck's and then it's terrorism and release the hounds. 

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1 hour ago, T-Dub said:

 

It's really interesting to me how we've generally been conditioned since then to view protest as a waste of time, with the "get a job" insults & all that.  Then, at the same time, protesters are a dire threat and need to be met with riot police.  So which is it? Like it's pointless anyway so don't bother, until someone breaks a window at a Starbuck's and then it's terrorism and release the hounds. 

Sadly, with the all the money and power more consolidated than ever before, protesting probably is a waste of time.

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5 minutes ago, westside bengal said:

Sadly, with the all the money and power more consolidated than ever before, protesting probably is a waste of time.

 

Nah, if it was a waste of time there wouldn't be scores of riot cops turning out & the whole "Soros is paying protesters" conspiracy theory.  Clearly someone feels threatened by it. 

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2 minutes ago, T-Dub said:

 

Nah, if it was a waste of time there wouldn't be scores of riot cops turning out & the whole "Soros is paying protesters" conspiracy theory.  Clearly someone feels threatened by it. 

You are probably right, although I have wondered if it is just an excuse to dust off and play with all the stuff the police have bought over the last 20 years.

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1 minute ago, westside bengal said:

You are probably right, although I have wondered if it is just an excuse to dust off and play with all the stuff the police have bought over the last 20 years.

 

Yeah, I do think the Tacticool cosplay also factors into it.   I'm a little surprised there hasn't already been a massacre, what with all the Pigdick County Sheriff's Deputies turning out with their AR's and Mossy Oak.  Kudos for showing some restraint, I guess.

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2 hours ago, USN Bengal said:

Kenneth, you obviously didn't read anything else I wrote, and my post to Toast was not about color at all... it was about service men and women of ALL color. I SUPPORT the protest, and your assumption, without reading anything prior is an insult.

 

Below this is what I wrote on the first page... that's where I stand with people of color, and people of the human race for that matter.

 

"

 

Rick, as a disabled retired veteran of the US Navy, I understand your point of view.

 

However, let me interject something...

 

Many people are upset that NFL players (amongst other sports athletes) are not standing during the national anthem. They say that it's a sign of major disrespect to veterans, especially the ones who paid the ultimate sacrifice for our country.

 

Indulge me if you please...

 

The "Golden Generation", the ones everyone refers to as the saviors of the American way, did indeed fight against the tyrants attempts at world oppression from Germany, Japan, Italy, and a small smattering of others. When the U.S. entered World War II, Jim Crow segregation had permeated every aspect of American society. When black men volunteered for duty or were drafted, they were assigned to segregated divisions and often given combat support roles, such as cook, quartermaster and grave-digging duty. According to British personnel in the BEF, meals in the US Army were served with the white servicemen being served in one line and the black servicemen and officers in another. Because of black protests against the Army's treatment of its black soldiers, military leadership began to attempt to address the issue beginning in 1943, but segregation in the armed forces remained official policy until 1948.

With the exception of 18 female African-American nurses who had served in World War I, the Army Nurses Corp, established in 1901, remained white until 1941, when pressure from the National Association of Colored Graduate Nurses, and Eleanor Roosevelt , caused the Army to admit black nurses. A quota of 48 nurses was set, and the women were segregated from white nurses and white soldiers for much of the war. Eventually more black nurses enlisted. They were assigned to care for black soldiers, and served in the China-Burma-India theater, Australia, New Guinea, Liberia, England and the Philippines.

 

So, besides the history lesson, my point is this;

 

Black men and women volunteered to serve to fight world oppression when they couldn't escape racial oppression back home. You and I fought for the rights of ALL citizens to protest, and these black men and women, and ANYONE else who cares about people of color has the right and should be supported for doing so.

 

I stand with them now, although I didn't at first, because I didn't take the time to walk in their shoes.

 

It's not about respect for our vets and America, it's about the lack of respect and equality for people who volunteered to defend this country that won't treat them as equals.

 

Just my $.02, and I'll move this thread to J & D."

USN, you are absolutely right, I did not go back through the thread to look at what you posted earlier.  I reacted to your post that i quoted, which seemed to imply that because Rick served, his opinion was more valid, and that his service entitled him to a pass from being criticized on his views.  I don't think his service entitles him to that, not do I think that Fred deserved being berated for saying what he said.  Just my two cents.

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52 minutes ago, kennethmw said:

USN, you are absolutely right, I did not go back through the thread to look at what you posted earlier.  I reacted to your post that i quoted, which seemed to imply that because Rick served, his opinion was more valid, and that his service entitled him to a pass from being criticized on his views.  I don't think his service entitles him to that, not do I think that Fred deserved being berated for saying what he said.  Just my two cents.

I have no idea how you can glean that from what I posted, as my post was a direct response to what Toast stated about military members... period.

 

As I stated my personal feelings about the protest elsewhere, in case you wonder how I feel about anything, just ask me... I will tell you unequivocally. There is no need to assume anything.

 

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FWIW. The protestors on both sides are not always peaceful. See Berkley and Seattle for reference. Allowing oneself to become allied with a violent or destructive side is shameful. I will not support any side that allies themselves with violence and destruction. Personally, I've seen enough to last a lifetime and my heart rips apart every time the hatred spills over and hurts the innocents.

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3 hours ago, Numbers said:

FWIW. The protestors on both sides are not always peaceful

5e8de1614e335a61d39f51ccd2116231.jpg

 

So pick one.  

 

You know what I find shameful?  This "both sides" prevaricating that only legitimizes white supremacists and neo-Nazis.  Their entire purpose is genocide.  The history of the organizations that turned out in Charlottesville is one of repeated, planned violence and terrorism against minorities. Yes, it sucks that there is violence in the world, but it absolutely must be confronted. To try and portray those doing so as "just as bad" is utter nonsense.  Don't let these ignorant fucks put you on the defensive by pointing fingers.  It's cry-bullying.  They showed up in VA to spread fear and intimidate, period. They were armed & armored for just that purpose. Failing that, they drove a car into a crowd and killed a young woman. Now they've been exposed and are scrambling to make themselves look like equal victims.  They are not.  They planned and instigated this, any violence that occurred there is 100% their fault.  These were not peaceful protesters set upon by those mean antifascists.  These are literal, self-avowed Nazis, waving Nazi flags and chanting Nazi slogans on American streets.  Fuck them and everything they stand for, period.  There is no reasoning with their bullshit & I refuse to give their ideas credibility by entering into a debate with them.  They arrived looking for violence & the only reason they are crying now is because a group of people refused to be scared of them. 

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There's no beating around the bush here. No prevarication.

The staff at Berkeley is requesting funding to escape these type of protestors. Both types. Both sides cause harm to innocent people and their property. To say otherwise is living under a rock.

If you want to support Antifa go right ahead. I'll lump everyone in the same basket that was weaved with violence and destruction.

If you want to support peacefully the cause against police violence and black lives matter then I'll join you.

Nazi ideology and their like deserve to be labeled a terrorist organization and treated accordingly. Antifa is already labeled as such by DHS New Jersey. Why hasn't the KKK or the Nazi groups ? That's a great question to ask your congressman.

To sum it all up, violence is not the answer.

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1 hour ago, Numbers said:

There's no beating around the bush here. No prevarication.

The staff at Berkeley is requesting funding to escape these type of protestors. Both types. Both sides cause harm to innocent people and their property. To say otherwise is living under a rock.

If you want to support Antifa go right ahead. I'll lump everyone in the same basket that was weaved with violence and destruction.
 

 

I could buy into all that if we were talking about someone other than neo-Nazis and the KKK.  These are not non-violent groups by any stretch of the imagination.  What you're suggesting sounds to me like "ignore them and hope they go away."  Well, they aren't.  You're not going to just "hug it out" with these people.  I don't want to argue with them, you understand? I want them back under whatever rock they crawled out from. How do you suggest we counter this rising wave of white nationalism? A drum circle? 

 

Quote

If you want to support peacefully the cause against police violence and black lives matter then I'll join you.

 

This is exactly what I'm talking about; comparing BLM with all this as if they are two equally valid opposing viewpoints.  They are not.  

 

Quote

Nazi ideology and their like deserve to be labeled a terrorist organization and treated accordingly. Antifa is already labeled as such by DHS New Jersey. Why hasn't the KKK or the Nazi groups ? That's a great question to ask your congressman.

 

I've been asking that question for years.  I'm no longer comfortable with that. They've had close to 150 years to address this and have failed. Congress isn't going to fix it, hell many of them are supported by these same pieces of shit.  

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Let's just deal with facts ok?

 

1. Nazi's, White Supremacists, or whatever you want to classify them as are pure filth and should be labeled as a domestic terror group.

2. With the tactics that Antifa and others have been using, so should they.

3. Knowing two police officers who were there, the white trash Nazis were NOT armed , did NOT have caches of arms stashed anywhere, AND did not have the police outgunned. The police WERE instructed to stand back and not get involved unless things "got out of hand". Amazing that no one got shot by the police from the side that is the the most terroristic huh?

Until you realize that they were all white and then it makes sense...

 

4. Our "law of the land" has decided for us that these hate spewing maggots have the right to spread their filth publicly, and approve them to do so. Why? fucking bullshit interpretation of Freedom of Speech. Spewing hate, prejudice, and genocide should NEVER be allowed.

 

I agree with protesting unjust actions, laws, and inequalities... I do NOT agree with the tactics of blocking streets so innocent people cannot get through, ANY violence, ANY destruction of property, and ANY intolerance when the side you identify with is SCREECHING intolerance with their actions.... while complaining that the other side isn't tolerant at all.

 

This country has gone to shit... when you allow the dregs of society to spew their disgusting hate and then pull a man off a telecast because his name is Robert Lee... Rome is burning while everyone treats the current president as Nero.

He's as much responsible for the current state of affairs as is Obama, Bush, Clinton...etc. When people need to come together the most, the MEDIA feeds the hysteria and calls for civil disobedience, whose members take it upon themselves to use violence.

 

Who wins?

 

Nobody...

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1 hour ago, USN Bengal said:

 

3. Knowing two police officers who were there, the white trash Nazis were NOT armed

 

That's simply not true, as a quick image search or any footage of the event can prove:

 

 

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GettyImages_830775518.jpg

 

 

 

Hard to say if they had caches of weapons in their vehicles, not sure how the cops would know that either but if they're carrying rifles openly I'd be real surprised if they didn't have more elsewhere.  

 

I suppose they didn't necessarily have the police "out-gunned" but considering the firepower they DID have, if things had gone sideways it obviously would've been difficult to contain.

 

Imagine if BLM turned out armed like that? The NRA would be screaming for an assault rifle ban. 

 

(also I can't help but point out the "these colors don't run - never have, never will" Confederate flag t-shirt.  For all their talk of preserving history they sure are ignorant of it.)

 

One last thing; people seem to get real hung up on the whole "blocking streets" thing.  Um..  Do you think they took a really wide sidewalk to Selma?

 

selma-montgomery-march-AB.jpeg

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I'm quite well aware of how the march to Selma occurred... and so what?

 

All people have to RIGHT to get to work, hospitals, and wherever else they are wanting  to go without being impeded by ILLEGAL protest actions.

 

I'm not "hung up on it", I'm pointing out that it's needless bullshit. The March to D.C. Will be passing the town I live in this Friday, and accommodations are supposed to be taking place so that others are not impeded.

 

Anything wrong with that?

 

Protest as you want, but if you illegally block the street and get hit by a car... tough shit, I don't care who and what you are protesting, use common sense.

 

 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, USN Bengal said:

I'm saying that if you jump out in front of a car in the name of protest, it's just like any pedestrian that would do the same.

 

Interesting that you would like take it to vehicular homicide immediately...

 


It was a question.  There's a huge difference between accidentally hitting someone that "jumps out in front of car" and deliberately running into a crowd because they're making you late for something.  Your previous comment seemed to be tending towards the latter - that's why I asked. 

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