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33 minutes ago, Catfish Bob said:

With the recent free agent signings can we afford to pay 3 first rounders?  

 

Would be hard to pass up. 

 

If they move/cut Dalton & DreK that's almost $30 million off this year's cap.   Unfortunately some of the other obvious dead weight like Hart, Price or Ross have dead money & we know how reluctant they are to cut anyone they still owe.

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4 hours ago, T-Dub said:

 

If they move/cut Dalton & DreK that's almost $30 million off this year's cap.   Unfortunately some of the other obvious dead weight like Hart, Price or Ross have dead money & we know how reluctant they are to cut anyone they still owe.

It is what it is. 

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3 hours ago, PatternMaster said:

Quality over quantity, a once in a generation player like Burrow is worth more than the 3rd best LB/WR/OT in draft. 

We have no idea if he is a once in a generation player. People thought Andrew Luck was and he wasn’t, it was the 3rd rounder Wilson who is the great one from that draft.  9 teams including the Bengals passed on Mahomes. Everyone of them regret it especially Chicago who drafted Trubisky. 

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6 minutes ago, SF2 said:

We have no idea if he is a once in a generation player. People thought Andrew Luck was and he wasn’t, it was the 3rd rounder Wilson who is the great one from that draft.  9 teams including the Bengals passed on Mahomes. Everyone of them regret it especially Chicago who drafted Trubisky. 

 

He's the best QB prospect in this draft, nothing more or less.  Trading down & taking the best QB prospect in next year's draft plus top prospects at 3 other positions is not the worst idea.

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4 minutes ago, T-Dub said:

 

He's the best QB prospect in this draft, nothing more or less.  Trading down & taking the best QB prospect in next year's draft plus top prospects at 3 other positions is not the worst idea.

I fully expect the Bengals to pick Burrow which they should, just seen this show before when they drafted Palmer.  Hope he is the next Goat.  Would like to see a playoff win before I die. 

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Well I'd imagine if we did trade down for the 3 first rounders that would mean we're rolling the dice with Dalton one more time. 

 

I'm perfectly fine with that. History always seems to repeat itself. As in the #1 prospect not panning out so great. 

But I'm not from Ohio either. If I was I'd probably want the home town kid more than anyone else. 

 

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14 hours ago, PatternMaster said:

Quality over quantity, a once in a generation player like Burrow is worth more than the 3rd best LB/WR/OT in draft. 

There’s also something to be said for putting all of your eggs in one basket.  If JB busts, it sets you back another few years.  There’s a better chance to hit on one of three picks than hit on only one pick.  QB is the most important position in sports so if JB is great that’s a franchise turning move.  I guess being conservative you take the trade, being aggressive you just take JB.  

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16 minutes ago, WRAPradio said:

There’s also something to be said for putting all of your eggs in one basket.  If JB busts, it sets you back another few years.  There’s a better chance to hit on one of three picks than hit on only one pick.  QB is the most important position in sports so if JB is great that’s a franchise turning move.  I guess being conservative you take the trade, being aggressive you just take JB.  

I don't follow your logic, I don't know how trading the number one overall pick is conservative..if anything it's risky. 

 

The way the draft works is the best talent, the players with the highest probability of success are chosen first. Trading out of that pick and hoping to get a comparable talent isn't conservative, it's extremely risky. 

 

If the best player, with the highest chance of success, at most important position on the field is available then passing on him favor of getting multiple less talented players is risky. 

 

Having the most picks in the draft, doesn't increase your likely of success, it's the location of those picks that matter. Last year the Bengals had 11 picks in the draft and got  basically nothing out all of them except for one and that was late in the season.

 

I'll say it again, quality over quantity. 

 

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28 minutes ago, PatternMaster said:

I don't follow your logic, I don't know how trading the number one overall pick is conservative..if anything it's risky. 

 

The way the draft works is the best talent, the players with the highest probability of success are chosen first. Trading out of that pick and hoping to get a comparable talent isn't conservative, it's extremely risky. 

 

If the best player, with the highest chance of success, at most important position on the field is available then passing on him favor of getting multiple less talented players is risky. 

 

Having the most picks in the draft, doesn't increase your likely of success, it's the location of those picks that matter. Last year the Bengals had 11 picks in the draft and got  basically nothing out all of them except for one and that was late in the season.

 

I'll say it again, quality over quantity. 

 

 

I’m thinking about it like this.  Taking JB is aggressive because you’re putting all of you eggs in one basket.  If he gets hurt like our past six #1s, now what?  It’s being aggressive b/c QB is the most important position in sports and if you get a great QB you change your franchise for the next 10-15 years hopefully, but if he fails, you’re in a bad spot.

 

Trading the pick to me is more conservative because if one of those 1st rounders get hurt, you still have two more.  

 

I do agree it’s about quality over quantity, but not trading for multiple #1s, you’re putting all of your eggs in one basket and as Joe goes, so goes the franchise.  It’s probably twisted logic, just the way I see it.

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40 minutes ago, WRAPradio said:

 

I’m thinking about it like this.  Taking JB is aggressive because you’re putting all of you eggs in one basket.  If he gets hurt like our past six #1s, now what?  It’s being aggressive b/c QB is the most important position in sports and if you get a great QB you change your franchise for the next 10-15 years hopefully, but if he fails, you’re in a bad spot.

 

Trading the pick to me is more conservative because if one of those 1st rounders get hurt, you still have two more.  

 

I do agree it’s about quality over quantity, but not trading for multiple #1s, you’re putting all of your eggs in one basket and as Joe goes, so goes the franchise.  It’s probably twisted logic, just the way I see it.

But if you trade down and pick another QB along the way that QB has even a greater chance of failing. And if this offseason has shown anything it is that good players can be signed if your own picks don't work out so having more quantity over quality does not really compute.

 

We have had, I believe, 11 picks in each of the last 3 drafts and yet we are the worst team in the league. Elite QB's are the hardest player to find so at least get the highest ranked one. 

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/nfl-draft-2020-quarterback-rankings-breaking-down-the-top-qbs-skills-from-decision-making-to-accuracy/

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2 hours ago, membengal said:

lol on trading back. I am betting on this kid - watch the Orlovsky video - think about what we’ve had in dalton and what me will have in Burrow in terms of pressure and “hidden yards”. I am not trading for anything...

 

 

If anyone watched any significant CFB games this year then it's obvious why Burrow is the only choice for the #1 overall pick. 

 

He wasn't any on any Heisman watchlists, he had zero hype coming into the season but it did the hardest thing to do in sports. He changed the minds and opinions of scouts and analyst that had him pegged as a certain type of player and put up a historically great season that made his talent undeniable. 

 

There are no sure things in any draft but Burrow is as close as it gets, I can't remember a player that performed better than him in college. If you think you are going to trade back and draft anyone anywhere close to the talent level of Burrow then that is a huge mistake and extremely unnecessary risk to take, imo.

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2 hours ago, PatternMaster said:

I don't follow your logic, I don't know how trading the number one overall pick is conservative..if anything it's risky. 

 

The way the draft works is the best talent, the players with the highest probability of success are chosen first. Trading out of that pick and hoping to get a comparable talent isn't conservative, it's extremely risky. 

 

If the best player, with the highest chance of success, at most important position on the field is available then passing on him favor of getting multiple less talented players is risky. 

 

Having the most picks in the draft, doesn't increase your likely of success, it's the location of those picks that matter. Last year the Bengals had 11 picks in the draft and got  basically nothing out all of them except for one and that was late in the season.

 

I'll say it again, quality over quantity. 

 

Actually, the one position where draft position is the least reliable indicator is at the QB spot.  Here are the number 1 QB picks since 2000.  Most of them are average at best.   QB is the biggest crap shoot position in all of football.  Locker, Ponder and Gabbert were all drafted WAY ahead of Dalton.  Locker and Ponder are already out of the league having barely played at all.   Gabbert is marginal backup with a lifetime 13-35 record and a 71 QB rating.

 

https://tinyurl.com/v2lcwfd

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The 33rd pick is the one we should trade to acquire more picks. Given this WR class I could see a team like the Texans trading 40 and 57 for 33.  Especially since they don't have a first. This class is loaded at WR and a first rd talent is going to fall. I can see a few teams wanting that pick.

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1 hour ago, bfine said:

The 33rd pick is the one we should trade to acquire more picks. Given this WR class I could see a team like the Texans trading 40 and 57 for 33.  Especially since they don't have a first. This class is loaded at WR and a first rd talent is going to fall. I can see a few teams wanting that pick.

 

So long as it's not dropping out of the top half of the 2nd I'd be ok with that but I'm not sure how much extra mid round picks will help us.  The coach-as-scouts model is fundamentally flawed and it's obvious that Tobin can't make up for it.  Turner is picking whichever OL breaks the ketchup bottle and mugs someone with it.

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51 minutes ago, T-Dub said:

 

So long as it's not dropping out of the top half of the 2nd I'd be ok with that but I'm not sure how much extra mid round picks will help us.  The coach-as-scouts model is fundamentally flawed and it's obvious that Tobin can't make up for it.  Turner is picking whichever OL breaks the ketchup bottle and mugs someone with it.

Historically we've done well in the 2nd RD. For every Sample there's a Dillon

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1 hour ago, SF2 said:

Actually, the one position where draft position is the least reliable indicator is at the QB spot.  Here are the number 1 QB picks since 2000.  Most of them are average at best.   QB is the biggest crap shoot position in all of football.  Locker, Ponder and Gabbert were all drafted WAY ahead of Dalton.  Locker and Ponder are already out of the league having barely played at all.   Gabbert is marginal backup with a lifetime 13-35 record and a 71 QB rating.

 

https://tinyurl.com/v2lcwfd

I disagree with that, of 32 teams in the league about 75% of them have QB's that were drafted in the first round. This year the Bengals have the first overall pick while the best player in the draft is a QB and it just so happens the Bengals could use an upgrade at that position...so why would you trade for a lesser player? 

 

The Bengals have 3 realistic options for a QB in 2020 if they trade the pick: Tua, Herbert, and Dalton.

 

Herbert is closer to Blaine Gabbert than Joe Burrow, he's a great athlete that is a mediocre QB. Dalton just lead his team to a 2-14 season, got benched for a 4th round rookie, and currently has zero trade interest in the open market. Tua is fragile and all ready broken up, if he can't last 12 to 13 games a season in the SEC without a major injury how can he survive the NFL?

 

Outside of those 3 options I don't think you can make a realistic case for any other QB to start for the Bengals in 2020.

 

There really aren't too many viable options outside of taking Burrow if you're the Bengals, everything else is a huge gamble.

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1 hour ago, PatternMaster said:

I disagree with that, of 32 teams in the league about 75% of them have QB's that were drafted in the first round. This year the Bengals have the first overall pick while the best player in the draft is a QB and it just so happens the Bengals could use an upgrade at that position...so why would you trade for a lesser player? 

 

The Bengals have 3 realistic options for a QB in 2020 if they trade the pick: Tua, Herbert, and Dalton.

 

Herbert is closer to Blaine Gabbert than Joe Burrow, he's a great athlete that is a mediocre QB. Dalton just lead his team to a 2-14 season, got benched for a 4th round rookie, and currently has zero trade interest in the open market. Tua is fragile and all ready broken up, if he can't last 12 to 13 games a season in the SEC without a major injury how can he survive the NFL?

 

Outside of those 3 options I don't think you can make a realistic case for any other QB to start for the Bengals in 2020.

 

There really aren't too many viable options outside of taking Burrow if you're the Bengals, everything else is a huge gamble.

Dalton played for a team thats first round OT pick was out for the season and the rest of the O line is bad, young or had a concussion.  Oh, and the last 3 high round Olinemen picked were utter shit.   Add in his #1 and #2 receivers were out most of the year and the team couldn't run the ball.  I do agree Dalton's horrible play on the defensive side of the ball is why they were the 29th ranked defense last year. 

Dalton has no trade interest because every team knows the Bengals are drafting Burrow.  Why take on a $17 mil contract when you can sign the guy for single digits after he is released?  Dalton is an a middle of the pack QB, has been most of his career, most teams are looking for the next Pat Mahomes but many will offer him a back up role once he is released. 

 

The best player in the draft is NOT a QB, but the best QB in the draft is Joe Burrow.  There is a difference. 

 

Lastly, our coaching staff sucks.  If you don't actually realize that I can't help you.  It took them half a season to figure out Joe Mixon is on the team.  Their hybrid 2 linebacker whatever was a disaster.   OJT is fine with guys with a real pedigree in major positions like OC and DC at the PRO level, Taylor was  QB coach.  

 

I do hope they draft Burrow and hopefully they surround him with the talent he needs.  I hope Green returns to form and John Ross actually stays healthy and lives up to his draft slot.  I hope Jonah Williams is actually good.  I hope the FAs they picked up were let go for cap reasons, not something else like Glenn. 

 

Until they win a playoff game, I won't buy in.  This is year 2.  Zac Taylor better do something and 6-10 aint it.  I simply am not giving Taylor a chance.  I have been asked to do this for 30 years and it never pans out. 

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