UncleEarl Posted April 18, 2020 Report Share Posted April 18, 2020 1 hour ago, SF2 said: The Bengals are required to spend to the 95% threshold during ever 5 year cycle. It is simply not true that they don't spend to the cap EVERY year. This rule is why Cleveland paid Brock Osweiler over $16mil in 2018 to never take a snap. You have to pay at least 89% to the cap EVERY YEAR but 95% or more over a 5 year period under the OLD rules. Not sure if they changed this in the new CBA. Every team has to spend their cap money or the owners will simply force the owners to sell. Since when have the Bengals made player decisions based upon the cap? As you point out they will spend what they have to spend and little more. I have a hard time remembering a player the Bengals cut due to cap considerations. Now, if the guy was making more money than he was worth, that's a different story. The Brown family may not produce a winning football team, but they know their numbers and how much it costs the family is way more important than the cap. You think Brown is worried about the cap implications of Dalton's $17M? No, he's worried that he'll have to pay a backup QB $17M dollars which he could spend elsewhere or put in his pocket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted April 18, 2020 Report Share Posted April 18, 2020 1 hour ago, bfine said: Bottom line is folks are running out of reasons to part ways with Andy Dalton It started with "we can get at least a 2nd rounder for him" that didn't pan out Then it went to "we can get a valuable draft pick for him" that didn't pan out Then it went to "We can cut him and use the money to improve the team" that didn't pan out as the Bengals were one of the biggest players in FA Then it went to "We can't afford him" that's been shown to not be true Then it went to "He'll cause issues in the locker room" the interview in the OP dismisses that I said from jump if we don't get a second or better for him out best option is to keep him. The current environment is making this more of a sound decision. Looks like there will be a truncated preseason; if one and all. We might need Andy to hold it down for a couple games at the beginning of the season and then trade him to a desperate Philly team when Wentz gets hurt again From a pure strategy stand point you are correct about keeping him. The issue is simply one of locker room and fan dynamics. It is easy to buy a new lawn mower and keep the old one just in case. The other tools in the shed are not going to complain or side with the old mower. This is a Kitna comparison. Kitna never accomplished shit here. Nobody cared that he was being replaced. I had season tickets in 2003, almost every game people were screaming for Palmer. Kitna started off the season 1-4 before the bye. Marvin sticks with him. I remember the home opener against Denver, Kitna was terrible with 2 picks and a fumble. The fumble was in the 4th quarter with the Bengals down 30-3, everyone was booing and screaming for Palmer. Zac Taylor doesn't need that shit. Kitna goes on a run which prevented Palmer from playing all season. Sticking with Kitna accomplished nothing, he choked the last two games and Palmer never took a snap. It was a stupid decision and set Palmer back half a season. Playing the last half of the season would have been huge for his development. Palmer started off 2005 2-5 until he finally got comfortable and started playing better. Still, another wasted season at 8-8. Ask yourself if Dalton starts the season and they go out 3-1, 4-2 etc. does Boy Wonder replace him? The last time Dalton had a decent offensive line and healthy receivers he started the season 10-3 before he got hurt. That would be the worst thing that could happen,. It is not an Alex Smith v Mahomes situation either. Smith was an all pro and Mahomes was not the Heisman winning National Champion poster boy when he arrived in Kansas City to save a 2-14 team, he was drafted by a 12-4 team led by a 12-4 all-pro QB. Many were stunned when KC traded Smith to Washington but obviously Mahomes was being Mahomes in practice. They didn't keep Smith around, Andy Reid understands locker room dynamics. The Giants wasted 2 years keeping Eli Manning around because their owner couldn't run the organization like a business. Just release the guy. Keeping Dalton would be like you going out with your friends with your current girlfriend but your old girlfriend continues to be part of the group as well, its just awkward. Just release the guy and let him sign a backup contract somewhere else. Don't need the drama in the stadium, locker room or in the stands. I don't want to hear any reporter asking questions about who the starter is going to be and hearing more fucking boos in the stands. I forgot who said it but I remember a coach once saying that you want your backup QB to be the least known player on the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyInDC Posted April 18, 2020 Report Share Posted April 18, 2020 54 minutes ago, SF2 said: Ask yourself if Dalton starts the season and they go out 3-1, 4-2 etc. does Boy Wonder replace him? The last time Dalton had a decent offensive line and healthy receivers he started the season 10-3 before he got hurt. That would be the worst thing that could happen,. does a quarterback controversy put butts in seats? serious question -- I don't know the answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted April 18, 2020 Report Share Posted April 18, 2020 36 minutes ago, CincyInDC said: does a quarterback controversy put butts in seats? serious question -- I don't know the answer. Andy Dalton starting doesn't, the Bengals were dead last in stadium attendance percentage by a wide margin last year. They only SOLD 72% of their tickets last year. The attendance was far less than 72%. Keep in mind I would love to have an Andy Dalton type veteran backup/ bridge QB on the team, I just don't want it to be Andy Dalton. Burrow needs to be ready to take over this team day one, he doesn't need the old guy in the locker room. Atkins, Dunlap and Green are not the future of the team either to be perfectly blunt, that 2015 season was when they had their chance. Time is not kind to NFL players. I still think someone will sign Jameis Winston but probably not us. Winston got a 27 on his Wonderlic, not a 13 like the Alabama dumbass Tua. Dude had terrible coaches his 3 of his first 4 years at Tampa. Year 1 was Lovie Smith then 3 years of Dirk Koetter with Todd Monken as the OC? Winston can absolutely sling the ball. Arians shows up last year and Winston throws a bunch of picks trying to make up for a shit defense. Tampa is going to regret signing their man crush noodle armed Tom Brady. Pure desperation and this rarely every works out. People think Bellicheat and Kraft would let Brady go if he thought he could still win him a championship? LOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted April 18, 2020 Report Share Posted April 18, 2020 lol - there would be no controversy. What the actual fuck is that nonsense. Dalton if he is back said he would accept a backup role. Holy hell, some of you are insane. Everyone knows this is Burrow’s job from day 1. Jeebus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tibor75 Posted April 18, 2020 Report Share Posted April 18, 2020 The notion about QB controversy is dumb. 90% of it is media inspired. I doubt the team cares. Cut him to use the money for more productive players who don't suck. Good riddance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyInDC Posted April 18, 2020 Report Share Posted April 18, 2020 I can easily imagine the media calling it that if Dalton is still on the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfine Posted April 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2020 3 hours ago, membengal said: lol - there would be no controversy. What the actual fuck is that nonsense. Dalton if he is back said he would accept a backup role. Holy hell, some of you are insane. Everyone knows this is Burrow’s job from day 1. Jeebus. Some folks buy into a narrative and no facts will change that. The article in the OP clearly states Andy would accept the role. I cannot believe some folks have such little faith in Andy's character. He knows there are things far bigger than football. Does he want to start? Yes, But as I've asked provide me with a list of NFL QBs that do not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 14 hours ago, bfine said: Some folks buy into a narrative and no facts will change that. The article in the OP clearly states Andy would accept the role. I cannot believe some folks have such little faith in Andy's character. He knows there are things far bigger than football. Does he want to start? Yes, But as I've asked provide me with a list of NFL QBs that do not. I think Dalton would do everything in his power to be the best teammate possible. I also think he would do everything possible to remain the starting QB for the team like just you said. He has been a starting QB and a star for 20+ years, I doubt he thinks he is done. Let him go and possibly find another home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfine Posted April 19, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 11 hours ago, SF2 said: I think Dalton would do everything in his power to be the best teammate possible. I also think he would do everything possible to remain the starting QB for the team like just you said. He has been a starting QB and a star for 20+ years, I doubt he thinks he is done. Let him go and possibly find another home. The Cincinnati Bengals' mission should be do what is best to win football games not what is best for Andy Dalton. It's a business Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|kennethmw| Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 My guess is that unless Cincy gets Jacksonville's 3rd or one of New England's 3 3rds, the Bengals will add a Year to Andy's deal with about 7 mill added. That would put him at a high backup/very low starter number, which would allow us to keep him as a backup at least through the trade deadline and possibly through the season. It would also provide some cap relief and sage backup experience in the room for Burrow. We would definitely have the top backup QB in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfine Posted April 19, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 1 hour ago, kennethmw said: My guess is that unless Cincy gets Jacksonville's 3rd or one of New England's 3 3rds, the Bengals will add a Year to Andy's deal with about 7 mill added. That would put him at a high backup/very low starter number, which would allow us to keep him as a backup at least through the trade deadline and possibly through the season. It would also provide some cap relief and sage backup experience in the room for Burrow. We would definitely have the top backup QB in the league. The Jags still take a cap hit of $18.7 MIL for Foles, now THEY are an example of a team that cannot afford Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tibor75 Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 One option to keep him is that team hopes that another team has an injury in preseason to their starting QB. Then trading a 3rd round pick for a fading player like Dullton makes sense. Especially if your starter is only going to be out for 4-6 weeks. Then again Scam Newton and Winston are still available Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thezerawkid Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 2 hours ago, kennethmw said: My guess is that unless Cincy gets Jacksonville's 3rd or one of New England's 3 3rds, the Bengals will add a Year to Andy's deal with about 7 mill added. That would put him at a high backup/very low starter number, which would allow us to keep him as a backup at least through the trade deadline and possibly through the season. It would also provide some cap relief and sage backup experience in the room for Burrow. We would definitely have the top backup QB in the league. He’d have to sign it. If being a starter is his priority, he’ll force his release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 46 minutes ago, thezerawkid said: He’d have to sign it. If being a starter is his priority, he’ll force his release. I'm not so sure. Andy's not a dumb guy, so understand that first and foremost. There are NOT any starter's jobs out there available, nor will there be until the bullets start flying. He got screwed by all the QBs who were available this year and likely realizes his best legitimate chance at a stating job is staying here and waiting in the wings until an opening happens due to injury, OR playing the waiting game until next year's draft. It's a bad set of circumstances for him, because he's worthy of a starting job in this league, but it's just the way it worked out this year. I am sure he's working on Plan B, because of that and I would bet he realizes his best options are to just sit tight for a while. I am guessing here, but I'd also imagine doing so involves him realizing he has to accept a major paycut to do so. His being a free agent and out on the market at this time really doesn't benefit him as much as staying put in a backup role here in a place where he's well respected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tibor75 Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 3 minutes ago, bengaled said: He got screwed by all the QBs who were available this year He got screwed because he was the worst non-rookie QB in the NFL this year who started on week 1 He sucked and now he's paying the price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 Just now, tibor75 said: He got screwed because he was the worst non-rookie QB in the NFL this year who started on week 1 He sucked and now he's paying the price. That's just typical Tibor talk, or in essence... Bullshit. You suck, so you swallow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tibor75 Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 11 minutes ago, bengaled said: That's just typical Tibor talk, In other words, the truth. Amusing how Bengal fans can't figure out why teams don't want Dullton . He was garbage. Name one veteran starter in 2019 who was worse than him. Maybe Foles but he got hurt in week 1 and came back later in the season and sucked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 1 minute ago, tibor75 said: In other words, the truth. Amusing how Bengal fans can't figure out why teams don't want Dullton . He was garbage. You're entertaining, if nothing else. Oh, and you still swallow, so you have that going for you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfine Posted April 19, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 23 minutes ago, tibor75 said: He got screwed because he was the worst non-rookie QB in the NFL this year who started on week 1 He sucked and now he's paying the price. Actually he was worse that all rookie starts that threw enough passes to qualify for a passer rating. He got screwed when we traded Denver our second rounder last year and took the wrong Drew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 Dalton hasn’t been signed because he isn’t an FA. He and his agent can’t negotiate anything. No team is going to take his salary and give up decent picks. If the Bengals release Dalton quite a few teams would probably approach him to be a backup or bridge QB but certainly NOT at $17 mil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cricket Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 26 minutes ago, SF2 said: ...He [Dalton] and his agent can’t negotiate anything... They don’t HAVE to negotiate anything, but they certainly CAN. The Bengals had reportedly given Dalton and his agent permission to negotiate a contract with Chicago several weeks ago. I would hope that the Bengals would allow him to do so with other teams, as well. In return for a team to not needing to compete with other teams for Andy’s services (either as a starter or as a backup), I think that the best we can hope for is a 7th-round pick...maybe a 6th. We we really don’t have much leverage at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 8 hours ago, bengaled said: I'm not so sure. Andy's not a dumb guy, so understand that first and foremost. There are NOT any starter's jobs out there available, nor will there be until the bullets start flying. He got screwed by all the QBs who were available this year and likely realizes his best legitimate chance at a stating job is staying here and waiting in the wings until an opening happens due to injury, OR playing the waiting game until next year's draft. It's a bad set of circumstances for him, because he's worthy of a starting job in this league, but it's just the way it worked out this year. I am sure he's working on Plan B, because of that and I would bet he realizes his best options are to just sit tight for a while. I am guessing here, but I'd also imagine doing so involves him realizing he has to accept a major paycut to do so. His being a free agent and out on the market at this time really doesn't benefit him as much as staying put in a backup role here in a place where he's well respected. Agree ...Hes going to be surorised at how low they offer him..(maybe not)... Hed be a fine mentor/backup but there are bigger needs with that money.. 7mil?..1yr?...lets do it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 8 minutes ago, Cricket said: They don’t HAVE to negotiate anything, but they certainly CAN. The Bengals had reportedly given Dalton and his agent permission to negotiate a contract with Chicago several weeks ago. I would hope that the Bengals would allow him to do so with other teams, as well. In return for a team to not needing to compete with other teams for Andy’s services (either as a starter or as a backup), I think that the best we can hope for is a 7th-round pick...maybe a 6th. We we really don’t have much leverage at all. They are basically negotiating on behalf of the Bengals and Dalton and his agent can not magically make his CURRENT $17mil contract go away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 21 minutes ago, SF2 said: They are basically negotiating on behalf of the Bengals and Dalton and his agent can not magically make his CURRENT $17mil contract go away. Andys made a zillion bucks throwing here.. Maybe he can backup for a few years at 7 mil or so .. Maybe this whole thing is a marketing rouge to rid his salary for something... Katy and Zach have talked about this Im sure.. Like I said dumping Williams and Bernard plus our 3rd pick for Thuney would be tremendous for JB... Daltons contract would go to signing valuable vets ie Jackson and Mixon.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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