claptonrocks Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 8 hours ago, T-Dub said: Once again our defense has no answer for Lamar Jackson. Getting beat by a wing option is.. Lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tibor75 Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 6 hours ago, SF2 said: Just a below average roster with 1 guy (Bates) with pro bowl talent. Yeah, everyone wants to include Burrow but is he better than Jackson, Mahomes, Watson or Allen in the AFC? Nah. Better than Andy though. Burrow is better than Lamar Jackson. He just doesn't have the benefit of playing against the Bengals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 32 minutes ago, tibor75 said: Burrow is better than Lamar Jackson. He just doesn't have the benefit of playing against the Bengals. LOL, Burrow is not currently better than the reigning MVP. In 3 years Jackson is 30-7, has over 10,000 yards of offense, 87 TDs, and a 102+ passer rating. Jackson is also YOUNGER than Burrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmoothD Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 If this performance doesn't get Zac and Lou fired, nothing will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea Ray Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 13 hours ago, SF2 said: LOL, Burrow is not currently better than the reigning MVP. In 3 years Jackson is 30-7, has over 10,000 yards of offense, 87 TDs, and a 102+ passer rating. Jackson is also YOUNGER than Burrow. I think Burrow's game will play in the post season. To this point Lamar Jackson's does not. I think his game has a ceiling and good teams will be able to exploit it. We saw that happen in the post season of his MVP yr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UncleEarl Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 9 minutes ago, Sea Ray said: I think Burrow's game will play in the post season. To this point Lamar Jackson's does not. I think his game has a ceiling and good teams will be able to exploit it. We saw that happen in the post season of his MVP yr Good defenses can exploit it. Tennessee will get pumped next week by Baltimore. You have to have a talented and disciplined DL to contain Jackson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spicoli Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 13 hours ago, SF2 said: LOL, Burrow is not currently better than the reigning MVP Is he supposed to be? He’s played 10 games so far. Certainly not enough to be better than a reigning MVP but also not enough for you to say he never will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_C_Deadpeople Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 His stats are better than Mahomes after his first 10 games in the league!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalFanInTO Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 22 hours ago, SF2 said: Just a below average roster with 1 guy (Bates) with pro bowl talent. Yeah, everyone wants to include Burrow but is he better than Jackson, Mahomes, Watson or Allen in the AFC? Nah. Better than Andy though. LOL...what a hilarious take. So, Burrow isn't better after 10 games of playing on the Bengals than 4 QBs with 3+ years experience?!? Good call. I would take Joe all day long over Jackson. All. Day. Long. Watson? I'd still roll with Burrow. Mahomes is on another planet than almost any QB in the league. I might give you Allen but, he sucked a bag of dicks in his first year and was average last year. Give JB three years and let's talk. Currently, your statement is just silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 31 minutes ago, BengalFanInTO said: LOL...what a hilarious take. So, Burrow isn't better after 10 games of playing on the Bengals than 4 QBs with 3+ years experience?!? Good call. I would take Joe all day long over Jackson. All. Day. Long. Watson? I'd still roll with Burrow. Mahomes is on another planet than almost any QB in the league. I might give you Allen but, he sucked a bag of dicks in his first year and was average last year. Give JB three years and let's talk. Currently, your statement is just silly. No, I responded to someone who said Burrow is better than Jackson. That is a silly statement to make today. Sure, he may be soon but there is no way you can say that today. I plan to give JB 4 years like his salary dictates. I have high hopes for him but I did for Carson too. Carson was 46-51 here with only 2 playoff appearances and was beaten to near death. You could easily say Herbert is better just by looking at stats but Herbert could have just as easily been killed behind this crap oline. BTW, in 3 years Jackson will still be younger than Burrow, whether or not he can still run is a different question. He will get blowed up sooner or later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UncleEarl Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 9 minutes ago, SF2 said: No, I responded to someone who said Burrow is better than Jackson. That is a silly statement to make today. Sure, he may be soon but there is no way you can say that today. I plan to give JB 4 years like his salary dictates. I have high hopes for him but I did for Carson too. Carson was 46-51 here with only 2 playoff appearances and was beaten to near death. You could easily say Herbert is better just by looking at stats but Herbert could have just as easily been killed behind this crap oline. BTW, in 3 years Jackson will still be younger than Burrow, whether or not he can still run is a different question. He will get blowed up sooner or later. Football age has more to do with how much you have played. Burrow sat around for three years at OSU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky151 Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 22 hours ago, CincyInDC said: only because you can't have a negative passer rating? Yes, Allen is grateful for the zero bound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 1 minute ago, UncleEarl said: Football age has more to do with how much you have played. Burrow sat around for three years at OSU. At every position other than QB. Experience is way more important at the QB position. Guys are playing at a high level into their late 30s early 40s today. Steve Young didn’t become a starter in SF until he turned 30. Only started 1 year in Tampa. I am not worried about Burrow, I worry about the Front office and coaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_C_Deadpeople Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 1 hour ago, SF2 said: I am not worried about Burrow, I worry about the Front office and coaching. I am not worried about the front office or coaching - I already know they will continue to fail. Nothing to worry about. Once Mikey strokes out then I will worry that Pumpkin WON"T change direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|High School Harry| Posted January 4, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 2 hours ago, I_C_Deadpeople said: I am not worried about the front office or coaching - I already know they will continue to fail. Nothing to worry about. Once Mikey strokes out then I will worry that Pumpkin WON"T change direction. Let's leave my Pumpkin out of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky151 Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 Yes, my hope is that once Mike Brown dies, his kids will be willing to hire professionals to run the team so they can go on ski trips during trade deadline week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 4 hours ago, SF2 said: No, I responded to someone who said Burrow is better than Jackson. That is a silly statement to make today. Sure, he may be soon but there is no way you can say that today. I plan to give JB 4 years like his salary dictates. I have high hopes for him but I did for Carson too. Carson was 46-51 here with only 2 playoff appearances and was beaten to near death. You could easily say Herbert is better just by looking at stats but Herbert could have just as easily been killed behind this crap oline. BTW, in 3 years Jackson will still be younger than Burrow, whether or not he can still run is a different question. He will get blowed up sooner or later. What we've seen from JB was enough to make you believe that he can turn this team around...With Protection.. I think Jackson is one of the electrifying runners I've ever watched..Its fun to watch him in the option.. Ben is done...ranked in bottom 5 QBs the past 5 weeks.. Mayfield has been Blessed this season with one if not the very best Oline in the league.. We can take over this division with a solid foundation... Amen.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_C_Deadpeople Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 30 minutes ago, claptonrocks said: What we've seen from JB was enough to make you believe that he can turn this team around...With Protection.. I think Jackson is one of the electrifying runners I've ever watched..Its fun to watch him in the option.. Ben is done...ranked in bottom 5 QBs the past 5 weeks.. Mayfield has been Blessed this season with one if not the very best Oline in the league.. We can take over this division with a solid foundation... Amen.. Problem is, there are a lot of good young QBs in the league so the teams with the best coaches and other players will win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UncleEarl Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 5 hours ago, SF2 said: At every position other than QB. Experience is way more important at the QB position. Guys are playing at a high level into their late 30s early 40s today. Steve Young didn’t become a starter in SF until he turned 30. Only started 1 year in Tampa. I am not worried about Burrow, I worry about the Front office and coaching. Much like Steve Young, Jackson plays a different kind of game. He will take more shots running the ball. On the other hand, if what you say is true about QBs that negates your original point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 14 minutes ago, I_C_Deadpeople said: Problem is, there are a lot of good young QBs in the league so the teams with the best coaches and other players will win Yeah, crazy how that works. Same salary cap but the same organizations always seem to stand out long term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 27 minutes ago, UncleEarl said: Much like Steve Young, Jackson plays a different kind of game. He will take more shots running the ball. On the other hand, if what you say is true about QBs that negates your original point. No it doesn’t, Jackson has almost 2 more years of experience than Burrow, is younger, and has one less major knee surgery. Experience is why a guy like Fitzpatrick can outplay almost every backup in the league and a few starters. Since 2015 Jackson has started 84 games in college and the Pros. Burrow has only started 48 games in those 6 years. That is 36 more games. People seem to forget Jackson won a Heisman playing for fucking Louisville. How high and when they both plateau is yet to be seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HavePityPlease Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 1 hour ago, SF2 said: No it doesn’t, Jackson has almost 2 more years of experience than Burrow, is younger, and has one less major knee surgery. Experience is why a guy like Fitzpatrick can outplay almost every backup in the league and a few starters. Since 2015 Jackson has started 84 games in college and the Pros. Burrow has only started 48 games in those 6 years. That is 36 more games. People seem to forget Jackson won a Heisman playing for fucking Louisville. How high and when they both plateau is yet to be seen. Despite his 84 games, Jackson can only dream of being in the same ballpark as Joe when it comes to passing the ball and reading defenses. It's not close. That's not me being a homer, that's simple facts. There's a reason Jackson runs for more yards than his RBs and throws for less than most starters. There's a reason the Ravens almost hit .500, and it's because they had him trying to read and progress and it didn't work well. Now, the run option game? He's in another stratosphere from any other QB anywhere. The winning? That's because he has a fantastic coaching staff who have the brains to use him to his strengths (and they are beyond elite strengths - and when they don't use them, it reinforces that they had it right the first time). Now, why would such great coaches *ever* try to test him as a traditional passer? Because that offense with Jackson as a primary runner has a short shelf life, and it's low-percentage in the playoffs and in bad weather. Look at the past two playoffs, they looked BAD, a shadow (and recall they tried the pass-first thing last year and they were embarrassed - he threw it 59 times!). They have to figure out how to let him "just ball" and still do it with just his arm when necessary. So far, no dice. None of this matters if you're happy with regular season dominance and having all your eggs in one special offense that requires a lot of specialist backups. If they finally figured out how to make it work in the playoffs, maybe they'll do something this year. But they can't force Jackson to be a pass-first QB - because he'll never succeed at it - and until something drastic changes in the NFL Joe Burrow has a much higher chance to be a winning QB in the playoffs. Now, that's just probability/chance/stats. It still requires *at least* competent coaching, and *at least* competent players elsewhere on the team. Considering Joe is way behind Jackson in that particular category-he-can't-control, it's telling that in his rookie year and only playing 10 games he still ended up with only 70 some-odd yards less than Jackson did in a full season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UncleEarl Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 1 hour ago, SF2 said: No it doesn’t, Jackson has almost 2 more years of experience than Burrow, is younger, and has one less major knee surgery. Experience is why a guy like Fitzpatrick can outplay almost every backup in the league and a few starters. Since 2015 Jackson has started 84 games in college and the Pros. Burrow has only started 48 games in those 6 years. That is 36 more games. People seem to forget Jackson won a Heisman playing for fucking Louisville. How high and when they both plateau is yet to be seen. WTF was your original point then? You keep saying “Jackson is 3 years younger.” By your own comments it really doesn’t matter for QBs because they play so long. You are talking in circles. None the less, Jackson’s playing style will likely shorten his career. Burrow playing behind a garbage OL will do the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|SF2| Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 2 hours ago, HavePityPlease said: Despite his 84 games, Jackson can only dream of being in the same ballpark as Joe when it comes to passing the ball and reading defenses. It's not close. That's not me being a homer, that's simple facts. There's a reason Jackson runs for more yards than his RBs and throws for less than most starters. There's a reason the Ravens almost hit .500, and it's because they had him trying to read and progress and it didn't work well. Now, the run option game? He's in another stratosphere from any other QB anywhere. The winning? That's because he has a fantastic coaching staff who have the brains to use him to his strengths (and they are beyond elite strengths - and when they don't use them, it reinforces that they had it right the first time). Now, why would such great coaches *ever* try to test him as a traditional passer? Because that offense with Jackson as a primary runner has a short shelf life, and it's low-percentage in the playoffs and in bad weather. Look at the past two playoffs, they looked BAD, a shadow (and recall they tried the pass-first thing last year and they were embarrassed - he threw it 59 times!). They have to figure out how to let him "just ball" and still do it with just his arm when necessary. So far, no dice. None of this matters if you're happy with regular season dominance and having all your eggs in one special offense that requires a lot of specialist backups. If they finally figured out how to make it work in the playoffs, maybe they'll do something this year. But they can't force Jackson to be a pass-first QB - because he'll never succeed at it - and until something drastic changes in the NFL Joe Burrow has a much higher chance to be a winning QB in the playoffs. Now, that's just probability/chance/stats. It still requires *at least* competent coaching, and *at least* competent players elsewhere on the team. Considering Joe is way behind Jackson in that particular category-he-can't-control, it's telling that in his rookie year and only playing 10 games he still ended up with only 70 some-odd yards less than Jackson did in a full season. I agree with all of this. The greatest combination of pure playing ability at QB was Young. He rushed for 4239 yards, most of it AFTER he turned 30. One year he threw for 4170 yards and rushed for 454. He was 37. One can only imagine the numbers he would have put up if he had NOT gone to the USFL for his first two years, spent he next two at a horrible Tampa Bay team then backed up Joe Montana for 4 years. 8 years wasted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spicoli Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 7 minutes ago, SF2 said: One can only imagine the numbers he would have put up if he gone NOT gone to the USFL for his first two years, spent he next two at a horrible Tampa Bay team then backed up Joe Montana for 4 years. 8 years wasted. That's a great point. Honestly I'd take a Steve Young in his prime as my QB ahead of pretty much anyone that's ever played the game. There's nothing on the football field that cat couldn't do and I respect the hell out of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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