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2 hours ago, snarkster said:

People are like, we have two WR's (Higgins & Boyd), who needs the redundancy?  A lot of those must still be living in the era of the fullback.  These days, most teams start a slot (Boyd) & 2 wides (Higgins & ????).  We are talking a starting position here, not special teams chaff.

 

I have no problem with Sewell in General, but I don't get those with hard-ons for him & him alone.  There are gonna be many more viable OLine options for our second pick than WR's).   Some of them more suited to stating out their career at guard and then moving outside in the future if the powers-that-be decide they want vets (Williams & Reiff) protecting Joe's flanks with younger guys starting their career inside or in reserve.

 

In fact, the only way I'm that gung-ho about Sewell @ 5 is if they install him @LT and move Williams to LG or RT.  If you're talking LG, RG &/or RT.  I prefer a Rd 2 OL while super-charging the passing game at #5.

 

My real preference would be to drop down to the 7-9 slots, pick up a couple of xtra premium picks and sign either Turner or Warford.

 

I'd be good with

OC Hopkins/Price

LG Spain

RG (Turner/Warford)

LT Williams

RT Reiff

 

with Adeniji, Johnson and couple of rookie OL's drafted somewhere in Rd's 2-5 learning the ropes.  This OLine has too many problems to fix long-term  in one off season. 

 

Fill hole with solid temp option starters this tear with a couple more longer term fills working their way up at their own pace, the next season, sign Reiff for another year or replace him another FA or draft pick when the cap expands.

 

 

I feel like it's the Munoz comparison that was made that have people locked in on him.

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15 hours ago, membengal said:

Ed, he's literally the ONLY WR that might work at 38 and who will likely still be there. Everyone else in that area is a slot. If we draft Sewell, I am reduced to praying he is still there. Marshall and Bateman gonna be gone round 1 now.  At least Brown is an outside guy. 

 

But, that's the point. If we take Sewell. the options at WR in 2 are REALLY thin this year for what we need (unlike last year's WR class). The same exercise at o-line yields a LOT more options. 

 

 

So you (and others) say, but those options in 2 do not measure up for what we need. Look, at some point we're going to have to put a greater emphasis on upper tier offensive lineman, and we just can't keep dismissing them. Reiff is 32 and on a one yr deal...then he'll be gone. Jonah only has two years left, and who knows if they'll entertain paying him LT money on a new free agency deal???? After all, a case could be made that he hasn't been that great of an investment in the first place, as he's missed more time than he's played so far and hasn't yet completed a full season. Which brings up another point. What if that pattern holds true again, and he's unable to finish this season, or worse yet...we don't even know if he's 100% healed from his end of the year ACL tear.

 

An upper tier QB like Joe Burrow doesn't, nor shouldn't, need the absolute "best of the best" of weapons. Hasn't he shown all of you he is at that level...with the top QBs in the league? None of those guys need top 5 WRs, hell a lot of them don't even have 1st round WRs. That's why the pick at the bottom of the draft and go to the playoffs every year, too! Drafting that way is proven. There will always be "good enough" WRs for a QB with Burrow's skills to be adequate. This thinking that he needs 2 starting, great 2nd round WRs AND a top 5 pick is unreasonable and not a wise way to build a roster. It's not a successful way of building a roster.

 

I have always respected your opinion and often our thinking is aligned, but I am going to have to disagree with you on this subject, and especially with our need for a future LT. If all goes well and as planned, we won't have this option again for a long, long time. We KNOW the team won't provide it for us in free agency, so this is our best course of action....high in the draft. 

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6 minutes ago, bengaled said:

 

 

So you (and others) say, but those options in 2 do not measure up for what we need. Look, at some point we're going to have to put a greater emphasis on upper tier offensive lineman, and we just can't keep dismissing them. Reiff is 32 and on a one yr deal...then he'll be gone. Jonah only has two years left, and who knows if they'll entertain paying him LT money on a new free agency deal???? After all, a case could be made that he hasn't been that great of an investment in the first place, as he's missed more time than he's played so far and hasn't yet completed a full season. Which brings up another point. What if that pattern holds true again, and he's unable to finish this season, or worse yet...we don't even know if he's 100% healed from his end of the year ACL tear.

 

An upper tier QB like Joe Burrow doesn't, nor shouldn't, need the absolute "best of the best" of weapons. Hasn't he shown all of you he is at that level...with the top QBs in the league? None of those guys need top 5 WRs, hell a lot of them don't even have 1st round WRs. That's why the pick at the bottom of the draft and go to the playoffs every year, too! Drafting that way is proven. There will always be "good enough" WRs for a QB with Burrow's skills to be adequate. This thinking that he needs 2 starting, great 2nd round WRs AND a top 5 pick is unreasonable and not a wise way to build a roster. It's not a successful way of building a roster.

 

I have always respected your opinion and often our thinking is aligned, but I am going to have to disagree with you on this subject, and especially with our need for a future LT. If all goes well and as planned, we won't have this option again for a long, long time. We KNOW the team won't provide it for us in free agency, so this is our best course of action....high in the draft. 

 

 

At least we are finally saying it. Folks dont trust Williams.

 

That is a better opinion than we have to have Sewell, or that Chase isnt the better option.

 

I am of the opinion that using his rookie year where he got a freak injury is a little unfair and that he should be judged on this year where he actually played.

 

II thought he was the best option on that line to be honest.

 

Now are we to believe the coaches who say he would have come back had the team had something to play for rather than them shutting him down? Can't say, I can only go by what we were told.

 

 

However let's ask this. What if Williams pans out? What do we do with WIllams and Sewell?  If he pans out would not having a player like Chase and a right tackle in the 2nd be a better option?

 

I have no problem with whatever the Bengals do I'm just saying some folks have dug in their heels.

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22 minutes ago, Jamie_B said:

 

 

So you want to go BPA in the 2nd but not take Chase in the 1st, even though he is BPA? (And I recognize Sewell is a great player)

 

I am not saying that Chase is BPA.

 

I am saying BPA is not a realistic way to do things and the people who are pretending it is are doing so dishonestly, probably to themselves, because they just really really really want Chase. 

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3 minutes ago, MichaelWeston said:

 

I am not saying that Chase is BPA.

 

I am saying BPA is not a realistic way to do things and the people who are pretending it is are doing so dishonestly, probably to themselves, because they just really really really want Chase. 

 

How many big boards have Sewell rated over Chase?

 

BPA is not the best way to do things?

 

I mean did you not watch this team draft in the 90s reaching for positions of need with guys that were not that talented?

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Joe Burrow was able to throw the ball like a mofo to Higgins, Boyd, Green, Bernard and Sample last season. 


Are people saying he wouldn’t be able to do the same this season in Year Two with Higgins, Boyd, Bernard, Mixon, Uzimah and a few new mid to late round receivers? That simply doesn’t make sense.

 

The sad reality is the Bengals are very, very likely going to select Chase and some people are going to use the decision of one of the worst run sports teams on the planet to think they were right.

 

The Bengals desperately need offensive line and defensive line help and after that, need WR and CB help. It’s not Sewell > Chase, it’s similar level prospects where you take the higher need. They won’t and most fans will be thrilled.

 

Either way, I made it through the 90s and will continue to cheer for this sad sack franchise and whoever they select.

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8 minutes ago, MichaelWeston said:

 

I am not saying that Chase is BPA.

 

I am saying BPA is not a realistic way to do things and the people who are pretending it is are doing so dishonestly, probably to themselves, because they just really really really want Chase. 


This is correct 

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5 minutes ago, Jamie_B said:

 

How many big boards have Sewell rated over Chase?

 

BPA is not the best way to do things?

 

I mean did you not watch this team draft in the 90s reaching for positions of need with guys that were not that talented?


Maybe they do and maybe they don’t and you simply have no clue nor do I. Don’t profess to know differently.

 

I know you’re super excited about Chase and you’re likely going to be happy in the end. But if you have two players ranked 1A and 1B or remotely close and you don’t consider need, you’re probably the Bengals 

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3 minutes ago, BengalFanInTO said:


Maybe they do and maybe they don’t and you simply have no clue nor do I. Don’t profess to know differently.

 

I know you’re super excited about Chase and you’re likely going to be happy in the end. But if you have two players ranked 1A and 1B or remotely close and you don’t consider need, you’re probably the Bengals 

 

 

I wasn't suggesting I know the Bengals big board, I was asking how many of these mock draft and analysts guys have Sewell rated higher than Chase?

 

Once again I do not care about either guy, I am suggesting that we take what the best VALUE is, do not try to pidgin hold me here. I will be happy with either guy.

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2 minutes ago, Jamie_B said:

 

 

I wasn't suggesting I know the Bengals big board, I was asking how many of these mock draft and analysts guys have Sewell rated higher than Chase?

 

Once again I do not care about either guy, I am suggesting that we take what the best VALUE is, do not try to pidgin hold me here. I will be happy with either guy.

 

 

Most boards and analysts have consistently ranked Sewell higher than Chase, but admittedly it is only slightly higher. There are outliers, however.

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4 minutes ago, bengaled said:

 

 

Most boards and analysts have consistently ranked Sewell higher than Chase, but admittedly it is only slightly higher. There are outliers, however.

 

 

Ive actually seen the opposite. I think it was Daniel Jeremiah (though don't quote me on that) had Sewell rated 12

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3 minutes ago, Jamie_B said:

 

 

Ive actually seen the opposite. I think it was Daniel Jeremiah (though don't quote me on that) had Sewell rated 12


Zero analysts have Trey Lance, Justin Fields or Mac Jones rated above Sewell or Chase but, let me tell you, the Niners didn’t move up to take the latter two guys. Value is great but need must be a prevailing factor.

 

NFL.com doesn’t even have Chase rated  as their #1 WR. What does that mean?!? Nothing.

 

Sewell, Chase, Slater, Smith...they’re all very close to each other so let’s not act like one guy is projected 3rd and another 47th. The value proposition between the top of the draft is minuscule at best.

 

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1 minute ago, BengalFanInTO said:


Zero analysts have Trey Lance, Justin Fields or Mac Jones rated above Sewell or Chase but, let me tell you, the Niners didn’t move up to take the latter two guys. Value is great but need must be a prevailing factor.

 

NFL.com doesn’t even have Chase rated  as their #1 WR. What does that mean?!? Nothing.

 

Sewell, Chase, Slater, Smith...they’re all very close to each other so let’s not act like one guy is projected 3rd and another 47th. The value proposition between the top of the draft is minuscule at best.

 

 

 

This is silly, Quarterbacks will always go above every other position.

 

If we are going to have these discussions can we at least not be disingenuous?

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Just now, High School Harry said:

Pitts is being left out of the equation as best player available.

But, yeah, I can see that and why.


I was beating the drum hard prior to free agency saying TE was a strong need and an addition of one would help Burrow more than a speed WR. People told me I was wrong and that it was a frill.

 

I agree. Kyle Pitts would be a HUGE weapon for the Bengals and a higher area of need than WR, in my opinion 

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Just now, I_C_Deadpeople said:

Under the assumption that Sewell and Chase (that kind of sounds like a 70's TV cop show) are graded the same or near same by the Bengals - this rules out BPA and it then goes to need - I have a real hard time thinking a WR right now is a bigger need than an OL. 


Correct. 100% correct. 

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1 minute ago, BengalFanInTO said:


Correct. 100% correct. 

Having said what I did above, a lot of our thinking (mine included) is biased in the sense that we don't 'trust' the team to pick good OL outside of the top 15 picks or so. The teams dreadful draft record of OL of late creates that bias. 

 

I will email the team and let them know the fan base is split on the pick at 5, so they best trade down (maybe even twice) and just load up at various positions. Done. 

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2 minutes ago, Jamie_B said:

 

 

This is silly, Quarterbacks will always go above every other position.

 

If we are going to have these discussions can we at least not be disingenuous?


But why not?!? It’s about value isn’t it? That’s what you said.
 

The point is a team’s need will supersede Daniel Jeremiah’s big board every single time. Quite simply big boards are cute but literally zero teams in the league will go straight BPA in the first round while ignoring need. It won’t happen...except in Cincinnati.

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Just now, I_C_Deadpeople said:

Having said what I did above, a lot of our thinking (mine included) is biased in the sense that we don't 'trust' the team to pick good OL outside of the top 15 picks or so. The teams dreadful draft record of OL of late creates that bias. 

 

I will email the team and let them know the fan base is split on the pick at 5, so they best trade down (maybe even twice) and just load up at various positions. Done. 


I 100% don’t trust the team to do so, so I appreciate you sending the email

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3 minutes ago, BengalFanInTO said:


But why not?!? It’s about value isn’t it? That’s what you said.
 

The point is a team’s need will supersede Daniel Jeremiah’s big board every single time. Quite simply big boards are cute but literally zero teams in the league will go straight BPA in the first round while ignoring need. It won’t happen...except in Cincinnati.

 

 

So your not interested in honest conversation.

 

Got it.

 

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24 minutes ago, BengalFanInTO said:


But why not?!? It’s about value isn’t it? That’s what you said.
 

The point is a team’s need will supersede Daniel Jeremiah’s big board every single time. Quite simply big boards are cute but literally zero teams in the league will go straight BPA in the first round while ignoring need. It won’t happen...except in Cincinnati.

Last week on Sirius Charlie Wiess said that 'NO team drafts for need' because everyone knows how foolish it is to reach. What teams do though is move up and down the board to target players in need positions. So if you need an WR and you are ten picks away and your board has a WR that is sitting there right now as BPA - you try and trade up to get him. Went on to say that ever team board is different so what 'appears' like a reach probably is not in that teams mind. 

 

We drafted Sample in round 2 - a lot of people consider this a reach, obviously the team did not. We even had bigger needs at that time. 

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1 hour ago, Jamie_B said:

 

How many big boards have Sewell rated over Chase?

 

BPA is not the best way to do things?

 

I mean did you not watch this team draft in the 90s reaching for positions of need with guys that were not that talented?

Uhh, why go back to the 90s when you can go back to 2018 and Billy Price?

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