2022 Draft

[claptonrocks]

35 minutes ago, High School Harry said:

You're assuming Zion is there.

Some other OLine needy team drafting ahead of us

might see the same things in him.

Your right..

Nothing is certain.

Should be less cloudy after the first FA signing..or two...

 

 

[sparky151]

4 hours ago, claptonrocks said:

Its tough trying to upgrade from center to RT..

 

Maybe sign Jenson or Bozeman along with RT Moses..draft a guard in round 2 or 3....

 

I Cant seem to fit 3 players in those spots effectively or efficiently...

They arent signing 3 FA linemen ..

 

Try again. Any plan for fixing the O-line that involves a rookie should be rejected immediately. The team could very well sign 4 FA O-linemen. And should. They aren't going to sign Armstead but could get 2, maybe 3 decent players for the same money. They should be willing to spend a net of 30 mil of their cap space on the O-line this offseason.

 

That would preclude JC Jackson or keeping both Hill and Ogunjobi. But not re-signing say Uzomah and Apple. 

[Gremzz]

You'd like to do as much prior to the draft to allow some flexibility. I do think there's a reality in which all the round 1/ Early 2 OL prospects are gone by #31

 

Hopefully there's stability in signings beforehand.

[Gremzz]

3 hours ago, sparky151 said:

 

Try again. Any plan for fixing the O-line that involves a rookie should be rejected immediately. The team could very well sign 4 FA O-linemen. And should. They aren't going to sign Armstead but could get 2, maybe 3 decent players for the same money. They should be willing to spend a net of 30 mil of their cap space on the O-line this offseason.

 

That would preclude JC Jackson or keeping both Hill and Ogunjobi. But not re-signing say Uzomah and Apple. 

CJ's hype train speeches have been phenomenal. But if he's in that higher range of pay day we'd best let him walk.

 

It's hard to guess what Larry will be worth considering the Injury

 

Would love to retain BJ.

 

Apple should be cheap and have something to prove, don't see a reason to not bring him back

[|BlackJesus|]

17 hours ago, Le Tigre said:

BJ: have you found your favorite? I always look forward to these! 

 

DT Jordan Davis fits all the things I am usually looking for in an annual Dancing Bear crush ... though the Minnesota RT Daniel Faalele (380 lbs) also does. So I am still deciding. Ideal would be getting them both Rds 1 and 2... 720 lbs of jiggle power. 

[UncleEarl]

7 hours ago, Gremzz said:

CJ's hype train speeches have been phenomenal. But if he's in that higher range of pay day we'd best let him walk.

 

It's hard to guess what Larry will be worth considering the Injury

 

Would love to retain BJ.

 

Apple should be cheap and have something to prove, don't see a reason to not bring him back

If they don’t sign CJ then TE goes straight to the top of needs.  It changes how they draft and everything.  Uzomah is solid.  Sample is soft.  This team can’t ignore the OL in FA.  

[Jamie_B]

11 hours ago, sparky151 said:

 

Try again. Any plan for fixing the O-line that involves a rookie should be rejected immediately. The team could very well sign 4 FA O-linemen. And should. They aren't going to sign Armstead but could get 2, maybe 3 decent players for the same money. They should be willing to spend a net of 30 mil of their cap space on the O-line this offseason.

 

That would preclude JC Jackson or keeping both Hill and Ogunjobi. But not re-signing say Uzomah and Apple. 

 

This plan that involves signing 4 new Oline players while recognizing that the RT market is weak in FA especially for the types of younger players that the Bengals prefer while recognizing that they aren't going to pay big money to an Armstead. Doesnt connect with me. Like how do you get 4 new guys to include a new RT in a weak RT market? 

 

I suppose they could move Jonah to RT as it sounds like they are more open to moving him than they were last year, but then you are also acknowledging that they arent going to pay an Armsted at LT, so it's more likely that Jonah stays put. 

 

Your math just doesn't add up. Help me make it add up.

[sparky151]

1 hour ago, Jamie_B said:

 

This plan that involves signing 4 new Oline players while recognizing that the RT market is weak in FA especially for the types of younger players that the Bengals prefer while recognizing that they aren't going to pay big money to an Armstead. Doesnt connect with me. Like how do you get 4 new guys to include a new RT in a weak RT market? 

 

I suppose they could move Jonah to RT as it sounds like they are more open to moving him than they were last year, but then you are also acknowledging that they arent going to pay an Armsted at LT, so it's more likely that Jonah stays put. 

 

Your math just doesn't add up. Help me make it add up.

 

The math adds up easily enough. Bengals are in the position of being a desirable destination so it's just a matter of paying fair market value to get good veterans. Morgan Moses would be a fine example. He played well for the Jets at RT last year but they are planning to move Becton there so are letting Moses leave. He graded in the upper half of the league's tackles according to PFF. His price is thought to be about 8 mil per season. He's 31 so he's got several years left.

 

If he's not interested, Reiff may be the fallback. Supposedly he's considering retirement but he's expected to cost about the same as last year. After him are folks like Ifedi. If we drafted say Raimann or Kinnard or Green and put them at RT, we might as well just move Carman there. But the team thinks Prince is a better player at RT than Carman. 

 

Regarding the math, if we sign Moses for 8 mil, Laken Tomlinson for 10 mil, Ben Jones for 8 mil, and Austin Corbett for 9 mil, that adds up to 35 mil. We are currently 35 mil under the cap after tagging Bates. But we can gain about 17 mil by releasing Waynes and Hopkins. So we'd have fixed the O-line and have 17 mil left for other signings, the rookie draft pool, and injury reserve. We could of course increase that amount as needed with restructurings by players who are sure to make the roster, ie Mixon, Boyd, or Hendrickson. 

[Jamie_B]

1 minute ago, sparky151 said:

 

The math adds up easily enough. Bengals are in the position of being a desirable destination so it's just a matter of paying fair market value to get good veterans. Morgan Moses would be a fine example. He played well for the Jets at RT last year but they are planning to move Becton there so are letting Moses leave. He graded in the upper half of the league's tackles according to PFF. His price is thought to be about 8 mil per season. He's 31 so he's got several years left.

 

If he's not interested, Reiff may be the fallback. Supposedly he's considering retirement but he's expected to cost about the same as last year. After him are folks like Ifedi. If we drafted say Raimann or Kinnard or Green and put them at RT, we might as well just move Carman there. But the team thinks Prince is a better player at RT than Carman. 

 

Regarding the math, if we sign Moses for 8 mil, Laken Tomlinson for 10 mil, Ben Jones for 8 mil, and Austin Corbett for 9 mil, that adds up to 35 mil. We are currently 35 mil under the cap after tagging Bates. But we can gain about 17 mil by releasing Waynes and Hopkins. So we'd have fixed the O-line and have 17 mil left for other signings, the rookie draft pool, and injury reserve. We could of course increase that amount as needed with restructurings by players who are sure to make the roster, ie Mixon, Boyd, or Hendrickson. 

 

I'm not even talking about the money, (at least not as far as not signing high priced LTs), I'm talking about getting young talent at the positions as that's typically what they prefer.

 

Again though the Bengals prefer to go younger in FA than older, even under Taylor, look at their FA signings with Taylor I'm fairly sure none of them were above 30, Reiff has been the one exception and they only signed him for a year. So you can forget Moses who is 31 (even if that's not super old for a lineman, you have to look at what they have done under Taylor, not what you would like them to do). It's also why I don't think Reiff comes back. Or that Tomlison (also 30) or Ben Jones (32), 

 

Ifedi is under 30 and had a 61.8 PFF score, is that high enough that they would want him? No idea. I kind of doubt it though as Reiff's score was a 67.3 so it's not really an upgrade.

 

Now they may buck their recent trends and add guys that are older than 30 for more than one year, but I'd be surprised.

 

I think they do upgrade the entire interior of the line, but I just don't see a young RT in FA that is worth signing. 

 

 

 

[sparky151]

So you think it will be the Whitworth error redux?

[Jamie_B]

6 minutes ago, sparky151 said:

So you think it will be the Whitworth error redux?

 

 

No.  I think they can get younger and better in the middle of the line where the biggest problem was last year. It's solely the RT position that I think young talent just isn't there in FA. 

 

It's entirely possible they do get a older RT as well, but it wont be for anything longer than a year, and I also think they like D'Ante Smith who wont be a rookie which is your big concern.

 

I just don't think they replace 4 spots with guys that are not currently on the team.  

 

[Jason]

On 3/9/2022 at 7:56 AM, Le Tigre said:

BJ: have you found your favorite? I always look forward to these! 

So you know who not to guess in my contest?  

[Jungletiger]

 

[snarkster]

On 3/9/2022 at 9:33 PM, sparky151 said:

 

Try again. Any plan for fixing the O-line that involves a rookie should be rejected immediately. The team could very well sign 4 FA O-linemen. And should. They aren't going to sign Armstead but could get 2, maybe 3 decent players for the same money. They should be willing to spend a net of 30 mil of their cap space on the O-line this offseason.

 

That would preclude JC Jackson or keeping both Hill and Ogunjobi. But not re-signing say Uzomah and Apple. 

If they adequately address the other 4 spots, I would consider Johnson or Green at a guard spot if they're available.  If they add two vet guards I'd also consider starting Linderbaum if he's the pick at 31.  No rooks or 2nd year guys on the edge though.  I want a vet tackle to pair with Jonah (even if it's Reiff).

[claptonrocks]

1 hour ago, snarkster said:

If they adequately address the other 4 spots, I would consider Johnson or Green at a guard spot if they're available.  If they add two vet guards I'd also consider starting Linderbaum if he's the pick at 31.  No rooks or 2nd year guys on the edge though.  I want a vet tackle to pair with Jonah (even if it's Reiff).

Good ideas ...

 

Trade for Collins..

Sign.. C Jenson or Bozeman..

Sign...G Austin Corbett..

Something of that nature..

 

That opens the draft up to them to upgrade elsewhere..

 

CB Kaiir Elam would be an A pick..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[happyrid]

I'm working on the assumption they mostly fix OL in free agency, since I don't think they want to have to trust a rookie after Price and Carman (both picked in this same general range) crapped the bed as rookies.

 

I'm also assuming that they are going to be able to sign a starting DT or a starting CB in free agency, but probably not both. Whichever of those two spots doesn't get addressed with a clear starting caliber guy in FA would then be the favorite for first pick in the draft. 

[claptonrocks]

9 minutes ago, happyrid said:

I'm working on the assumption they mostly fix OL in free agency, since I don't think they want to have to trust a rookie after Price and Carman (both picked in this same general range) crapped the bed as rookies.

 

I'm also assuming that they are going to be able to sign a starting DT or a starting CB in free agency, but probably not both. Whichever of those two spots doesn't get addressed with a clear starting caliber guy in FA would then be the favorite for first pick in the draft. 

Starting DT signed should be BJ Hill

 

Bengals currently have no 3techs ..

 

They got a steal in him so why have him stolen?..

 

 

[I_C_Deadpeople]

15 hours ago, happyrid said:

I'm working on the assumption they mostly fix OL in free agency, since I don't think they want to have to trust a rookie after Price and Carman (both picked in this same general range) crapped the bed as rookies.

 

I'm also assuming that they are going to be able to sign a starting DT or a starting CB in free agency, but probably not both. Whichever of those two spots doesn't get addressed with a clear starting caliber guy in FA would then be the favorite for first pick in the draft. 

I was thinking the same. We have to see how FA settles out before seeing how the team would 'lean' in the draft. If they can get a few OL, one DT and a CB (And I am fine with Apple at least to strat the FA period then add later or with draft) - then to me that opens the draft up to all kinds of BPA and trade down scenarios. Last year we traded down because they knew the OL prospects were deep, perhaps this year same as DL pool is deep (especially edge guys). 

 

Also, we may still get the 4th round comp pick, that would be a nice pickup.

[happyrid]

23 hours ago, claptonrocks said:

Starting DT signed should be BJ Hill

 

Bengals currently have no 3techs ..

 

They got a steal in him so why have him stolen?..

 

 

 

I like both Hill and Ogunjobi. Will probably be tough to sign both and still fix the OL. So I'm just expecting one of the two to stay, which would still be huge to have 4 proven starters back along the DL. 

 

Those top rookie DTs aren't going to fall to 31 after running so fast at the combine, so that also makes me think it's more likely we fill starting DT in free agency and then #31 is our starting CB. 

 

 

 

[claptonrocks]

4 hours ago, happyrid said:

 

I like both Hill and Ogunjobi. Will probably be tough to sign both and still fix the OL. So I'm just expecting one of the two to stay, which would still be huge to have 4 proven starters back along the DL. 

 

Those top rookie DTs aren't going to fall to 31 after running so fast at the combine, so that also makes me think it's more likely we fill starting DT in free agency and then #31 is our starting CB. 

 

 

 

Hoping they take care of the 3tect by signing both of them.

 

Im sure they know its a priority.

These two rotate at a high level..

 

 

 

[UncleEarl]

7 hours ago, claptonrocks said:

Hoping they take care of the 3tect by signing both of them.

 

Im sure they know its a priority.

These two rotate at a high level..

 

 

 

 

If everything is a priority, nothing is a priority.  OL is the priority. 

 

Sign one, find a second in FA or draft and move on.

[Jamie_B]

6 minutes ago, UncleEarl said:

 

If everything is a priority, nothing is a priority.  OL is the priority. 

 

Sign one, find a second in FA or draft and move on.

 

 

You can chew gum and walk at the same time. There is no reason not to address both.

[sparky151]

O-line should be the priority. Re-signing Hill or Ogunjobi, Uzomah, or Apple takes a back seat to that. IMO we should be able to add 4 new starting O-linemen, re-sign one of Hill or Ogunjobi and keep at least 1 of Uzomah or Apple. 

[UncleEarl]

1 hour ago, Jamie_B said:

 

 

You can chew gum and walk at the same time. There is no reason not to address both.

 

Semantics.  I do not believe signing both is a priority.  OL is the priority. 

 

Signing both would be nice, probably isn't going to happen because both will want starter money.  Giving both starter money would be foolish.  There is a salary cap and while we expect the Brown family to spend more, you know they aren't going to spend to the cap.  When you have a good team you are going to have to let some players walk due to money.  The key decisions become who you let go.  NE doesn't want to let Jackson go, they need to so they can spend money elsewhere.  Time will tell if it's a mistake.

[Jamie_B]

1 minute ago, UncleEarl said:

 

Semantics.  I do not believe signing both is a priority.  OL is the priority. 

 

Signing both would be nice, probably isn't going to happen because both will want starter money.  Giving both starter money would be foolish.  There is a salary cap and while we expect the Brown family to spend more, you know they aren't going to spend to the cap.  When you have a good team you are going to have to let some players walk due to money.  The key decisions become who you let go.  NE doesn't want to let Gilmore go, they need to so they can spend money elsewhere.  Time will tell if it's a mistake.

 

The priority is getting the best players. I want to address oline as well and I think we do, but I'm not just throwing any old linemen in front of Joe either.