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Bates to Falcons .... Bell to Panthers


Bell & Bates  

28 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you wish the Bengals had resigned Bell or Bates ?

    • Just Bell
      22
    • Just Bates
      0
    • Both
      5
    • Neither
      1
  2. 2. Of these 3 players, which was the most important to keep ?

    • Pratt
      13
    • Bell
      15
    • Bates
      0
  3. 3. If it came down to Pratt or Bell, which would you have wanted to keep?

    • Pratt, Bengals did right thing
      16
    • Bell, he was bigger priority
      12
  4. 4. Does this make S a major need now in the draft?

    • Yes, Rd 1 or 2
      3
    • Not really. BPA
      1
    • I prefer we go to free agency to fix the S issue
      24


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Bates to Falcons, 4 years - $64 million  deal 

 

Bell to Panthers, 3 years - $22.5 million deal

 

Bengals lose both their starting safeties on the same afternoon.

 

But they did resign Pratt to a 3 year, 21 million deal, which is a great contract for someone of his youth and talent level. 

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The Atlanta Falcons continued their free agent spending spree Monday, agreeing to terms with former Cincinnati Bengals safety Jessie Bates III, sources told ESPN.

 

The deal, a source told ESPN's Adam Schefter, is for four years and $64.02 million, including $23 million in the first year and $36 million over the first two years overall. It makes Bates the fourth highest paid safety in NFL history.

 

Bates, who has started 79 games over five seasons with the Bengals, registered a career-high four interceptions this past season while tallying eight pass deflections for one of the league's most effective pass defenses.

 

Cincinnati led the NFL in 2022 in opposing completion percentage and held quarterbacks to the third-lowest Total QBR in the league, according to ESPN Stats & Information research. When Bates was the nearest defender, per NFL Next Gen Stats, opponents were held to -8.7 completion percentage below expectation.

 

As the team approached the end of its season, the 2018 second-round pick out of Wake Forest said he knew he could be playing elsewhere in 2023.

 

"I've been emotional about it for a long time," Bates said Jan. 30. "Still numb to it. 'Gratitude' is the word that I can really describe about everything that happened here over my past five years being here."

 

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35852826/source-falcons-adding-jessie-bates-4-year-6402m-deal

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Falcons are paying Bates 16 per year (but 18 per year the first 2) ... while the Bengals are paying Pratt 7 a year ... to me there is no way Bates is worth 2.3 Pratts (he's not even worth 1 head up)  .... which makes the Bengals Pratt contract look even better and helps the sting of losing Bell a bit. 

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Just now, BlackJesus said:

Falcons are paying Bates 16 per year ... while the Bengals are paying Pratt 7 a year ... to me there is no way Bates is worth 2.3 Pratts (he's not even worth 1 head up)  .... which makes the Bengals Pratt contract look even better and helps the sting of losing Bell a bit. 

Bates is not worth was he was paid 4th highest ever for a safety 

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2 hours ago, New Jersey Bengal said:

Bates is not worth 4th highest ever for a safety 

 

I agree. Bates was not even the best safety on the Bengals. Bell was.

 

I am curious what the Panthers paid Bell (since updated). It would have been hilarious if it's more than Bates. 

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Also if you look at the DBs that the Bengals drafted last year ... Lou apparently wants guys with long arms, and 4.3 speed ... neither Bates or Bell fit that, and were more the traditional S who played with smarts to make up for their lack of top line speed and top athleticism.

 

So maybe the team was always ready for this evolution in the secondary, with Dax Hill, CTB, and maybe they draft another one high and then have S bookends for the next 4-5 years.

 

With Burrow, Chase, and Higgins about to get paid ... fans need to brace themselves for the player losses as they will certainly come over the next few years (can't pay them all). All the more reason to draft well and trust in Duke. 

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Another option is free agency, and offer the Eagle's Chauncey Gardner-Johnson something like a 3 year 21 million deal (same as Pratt) and see if he bites.

 

In that they would have gotten Pratt and CGJ for less than Bates (smart cap work). 

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Yeah, BJ…didn’t need them anyway amirite? 
 

(Love how the “poll” conveniently favors Pratt over everyone—after he signed)

 

Be fully aware of these really bad losses—if the constant reminder of “good teams lose players” doesn’t work—when the historic Bengals inability in failure to cover TE’s and slot receivers in open space only gets worse without even “OK” safeties on the field. 
 

The expected responses of “Dax/Tycen/Draft/FA” are now just hopeful fixes for a problem that never needed to happen. Because of the pathological lust to make the QB “the highest paid player”

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5 minutes ago, Le Tigre said:

Because of the pathological lust to make the QB “the highest paid player”


JB being the highest paid player in the league has absolutely nothing to do with us, it’s simply the nature of the beast. 
 

It is what it is. 

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11 minutes ago, spicoli said:


JB being the highest paid player in the league has absolutely nothing to do with us, it’s simply the nature of the beast. 
 

It is what it is. 

It is the Number One excuse for not getting anyone of quality in FA. And that includes the Chicken/Egg conundrum: no linemen to protect that investment. Or, to keep him fresh as a daisy by wearing opposing offenses down (a viable pass-defeating defense). 

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22 minutes ago, Le Tigre said:

Yeah, BJ…didn’t need them anyway amirite? 
 

(Love how the “poll” conveniently favors Pratt over everyone—after he signed)

 

Be fully aware of these really bad losses—if the constant reminder of “good teams lose players” doesn’t work—when the historic Bengals inability in failure to cover TE’s and slot receivers in open space only gets worse without even “OK” safeties on the field. 
 

The expected responses of “Dax/Tycen/Draft/FA” are now just hopeful fixes for a problem that never needed to happen. Because of the pathological lust to make the QB “the highest paid player”

Maybe they can trade JB for draft picks 

to fill out the roster efficiently..

I mean what's a great QB when you have other needs right??

 

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Anyone paying attention knew Bates was as good as gone.  The Bengals have tried to sign him for two years and the Falcons just gave him a huge contract that I don’t blame us for not offering.  They also drafted his replacement in the first round last year.  Literally everyone saw this coming.  
 

It is surprising to also lose Bell and it does create a new problem that now needs to be addressed.  I have to think a veteran is going to make the most sense given the lack of experience we currently have at the position.  I liked Bell, but he was never more than a solid starter.  Great tackler and leader, but he could be a liability in coverage.  I’m waiting to see what Carolina paid before rendering judgment on the deal and I won’t be surprised if whoever we sign is actually an upgrade against the pass.  

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1 hour ago, BlackJesus said:

Another option is free agency, and offer the Eagle's Chauncey Gardner-Johnson something like a 3 year 21 million deal (same as Pratt) and see if he bites.

 

In that they would have gotten Pratt and CGJ for less than Bates (smart cap work). 

 

CGJ will want a lot more than 7 mil per year. He led the league in interceptions last season and will probably want something close to what Bates got. He might settle for 12 mil after a week or so if he's still unsigned. 

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Losing Bell isn't that big of a deal, he was good but not irreplaceable by any stretch. We have replacement options on the roster and it's only the first day of FA. 

 

Until Burrow is extended I don't expect to see much as far as big names are concerned. Week 2 is when I expect to see the Bengals be more active with free agents.

 

 

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49 minutes ago, sparky151 said:

CGJ will want a lot more than 7 mil per year. He led the league in interceptions last season 

 

But he's a "1 year wonder" that was given away by the Saints to the eagles for nothing the year before. I think he might take a solid 7-8 per year (like what Bell got from Carolina).

 

The Bates deal is just absurd and now skews other S deals. Atlanta as a poverty franchise that nobody wants to play for - had to overpay. 

 

But believe me, when Bates is 4-12 next year watching Shiesty and the boys hoist Lombardi, he will feel a little regret ... not enough to forgo all those millions of course, but at some point the extra 00s you will never spend in your lifetime are just numbers, and you play on a losing team every year. 

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17 minutes ago, Le Tigre said:

I know you are going to say Dax Hill, but you wouldn’t actually say Tycen Anderson as another? 
 

One was erratic as hell in spot duty, and the other was a late round MAC player, who never played. 

 

"Erratic as hell in spot duty" is pretty much ideal for a rookie safety isn't it? That's a position with a steep learning curve in the pros, so long as he doesn't keep making the same mistakes or getting beat athletically he's on the right track. That being said a veteran to pair with him has to be a priority now.

 

Have to mention Taylor-Britt here because I'd honestly forgotten he was the 2nd rounder and not Hill. Thought he looked damned good for missing the first month of the season. Might have a steal there.

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4 hours ago, Le Tigre said:

Yeah, BJ…didn’t need them anyway amirite? 
 

(Love how the “poll” conveniently favors Pratt over everyone—after he signed)

 

Be fully aware of these really bad losses—if the constant reminder of “good teams lose players” doesn’t work—when the historic Bengals inability in failure to cover TE’s and slot receivers in open space only gets worse without even “OK” safeties on the field. 
 

The expected responses of “Dax/Tycen/Draft/FA” are now just hopeful fixes for a problem that never needed to happen. Because of the pathological lust to make the QB “the highest paid player”

I get your point LT, but what's the alternative? Locking in Burrow for several years seems like something we have to do, and should do.

 

Unless Burrow is one of those rare breeds who understands that once you reach a certain level of wealth, winning becomes the most important thing, and he works with the team to keep, and get the players that make winning happen. Otherwise burying him in money is just how the insanity of the business side of football works.

 

Is he over-hyped? Not really worth betting the house on? I still think he has a little maturing to do, but honestly there's no other QB out there that I would take over him.

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6 hours ago, BengalBacker said:

I get your point LT, but what's the alternative? Locking in Burrow for several years seems like something we have to do, and should do.

 

Unless Burrow is one of those rare breeds who understands that once you reach a certain level of wealth, winning becomes the most important thing, and he works with the team to keep, and get the players that make winning happen. Otherwise burying him in money is just how the insanity of the business side of football works.

 

Is he over-hyped? Not really worth betting the house on? I still think he has a little maturing to do, but honestly there's no other QB out there that I would take over him.

Yours are fine points, my friend. It is truly an insane world with the amounts spent on simple mortals playing a game. Here we are now entertain us, I reckon. 
 

It has been a good long while since I have participated in NFL player worship; so as close as I can get to doing so, is to simply agree with your last paragraph.
 

 

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10 hours ago, BlackJesus said:

 

But he's a "1 year wonder" that was given away by the Saints to the eagles for nothing the year before. I think he might take a solid 7-8 per year (like what Bell got from Carolina).

 

The Bates deal is just absurd and now skews other S deals. Atlanta as a poverty franchise that nobody wants to play for - had to overpay. 

 

But believe me, when Bates is 4-12 next year watching Shiesty and the boys hoist Lombardi, he will feel a little regret ... not enough to forgo all those millions of course, but at some point the extra 00s you will never spend in your lifetime are just numbers, and you play on a losing team every year. 

 

You've got it wrong, he's considered one of the best players at his position...he's not taking a mid level deal. 

 

He wants Bates money or better, thinking you're going get him for 7 million a year is like thinking you could bang insert favorite porn/movie star...it ain't happening. 

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The main crime of this…is that it now pushes safety (double) into the “need factor” on Draft Day. 
 

Which will definitely impact the heretofore “need at the utmost factor” on the OL. 
 

And, it’s a shit year for safeties in the Draft as well. 

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13 hours ago, BlackJesus said:

 

But he's a "1 year wonder" that was given away by the Saints to the eagles for nothing the year before. I think he might take a solid 7-8 per year (like what Bell got from Carolina).

 

The Bates deal is just absurd and now skews other S deals. Atlanta as a poverty franchise that nobody wants to play for - had to overpay. 

 

But believe me, when Bates is 4-12 next year watching Shiesty and the boys hoist Lombardi, he will feel a little regret ... not enough to forgo all those millions of course, but at some point the extra 00s you will never spend in your lifetime are just numbers, and you play on a losing team every year. 

 

There's no such thing in the NFL as more money than they can spend. NFL players frequently miss on the adage "it's not how much you make, it's how much you keep". 

 

13 hours ago, Montana Bengal said:


 

 

It's not remotely close to true that the Bengals don't guarantee money after year 1. Burrow will certainly get some. First round rookies have their 4 year deals guaranteed and Jonah Williams 12.604 mil for 2023 was guaranteed back last spring. So Dax Hill has guaranteed money in 2025 but Bell can't have it at a reasonable price? Stupid move by Tobin. Reminiscent of picking Ogbuehi or Ross over Mahomes. 

 

 

 

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