I was wrong about Iosivas... excited to see him play.

[MichaelWeston]

3 minutes ago, GoBengals said:

 

yes there is. he turns 25 in a few weeks. he started his career in the prime of his career. tee higgins is like 6 months older than him. jamarr chase is younger than him. justin jefferson is like 4 months older than him, when his rookie deal is up he will be 27. his prime is right now.

 

im not saying he cannot do it, im just saying its VERY unlikely he grows into more than a #3 guy. and there is nothing wrong with that, he can make 50mil in his career doing that. 

 

 

is there a lot of examples of guys sprouting out and making huge talent gains after the age of 25 who got opportunities to be in those bigger roles in their second year?

 

his life gets a lot easier when Tee gets back. he should do better all around. which solidifies my point, i suppose.

 

 

it was a PHENOMENAL catch and toe tap. and his IQ to break off the route for the other TD was top of the line as well. 

 

He's starting after his 2nd year playing the position full time in his entire life. Your negativity outweighs your reason here. 

[-GoBengals-]

10 minutes ago, MichaelWeston said:

 

He's starting after his 2nd year playing the position full time in his entire life. Your negativity outweighs your reason here. 

 

 

there is no negativity, there is only reason.

 

what have i stated that is negativity, and what have a stated isnt reason?

 

Reason and logic:

 

1. he is starting his career at his prime age physically, which is late to the nfl. thats not ideal part of player development is physical growth if he needs 3 years of that, he will be on the decline byt he time he gets there, historically speaking.

2. rookie year, he had 1 more receiving yard than Irv Smith, who was a laughing stock and run out of town immediately. Tee missed 5 games, jamarr missed 1, Hudson missed 5, Irwin missed one, he was active for 16 games, got about a catch a game. he was 10th in receptions, fine, rookie whatever. higgins as a rookie had over 100 targets and 900 yards with aj green and boyd on the field. and was 3-4 years younger than Iosivas is right now.

3. he was drafted that late for a reason, he is a long shot to be productive in the NFL, he is beating those odds right now. he is already over achieving. 

4. he never even had 1,000 yards in college, in one of the worst football power conferences there is. he only passed 750 yards once his senior year.

5. he played zero competition in college, he had 4 100 yard games, Penn ivy league held him to 31 yards, Brown, held him to 39 yards, Columbia held him to 59 yards.

6. with chase getting doubled, and then having to acount for geisecki, with higgins out, he managed 2 catches for 7 yards. great touchdowns both of them amazing, 10/10 plays by him.

 

but everything good he is doing now IS him overachieving, it IS him maxing out his talent, there may not be a better opportunity than what he has had for two weeks so far in the NFL for a guy in his spot.  

 

none of that can be disputed. guys like him are typically special teams guys. i dont know why people act like im talking shit about the guy. he is doing great for what he is as a player.  His ceiling is fairly clear in all likelihood though, right?

 

what reason and logic is there that a 26 year old pops off the field and takes over a vital #2 role? as close to zero as it gets? there are 20 more talented WRs in each draft, if tee is gone we draft more WR's 100%.

 

i like the kid, he is fun to watch and has a great attitude and personality, i hope he excels as far as possible. but there is nothing showing he is a viable true #2 option in this offense. and no one has presented one in this thread anywhere.

[UncleEarl]

21 hours ago, GoBengals said:

 

 

who said he was no good?

 

charlie jones isnt playing at all on offense let alone over iosivas, what are we talking about here?

 

Iosivas had 7 yards on 2 catches. both being touchdowns is awesome, and be made GREAT plays on both. but being an endzone specialist doesnt even get you a #3 WR spot. makes you a red zone package guy.

 

so your description of him is a lower value than mine.

 

there is nothing wrong with being a long career #3 receiver who is good in the red zone.

 

but catching 2 passes for 7 yards with the #2 out of the game seems to support the idea that he is maybe a #3 at best WR in the nfl.

 

no one is talking shit about him. he just isnt even close to being a #2 or #1 anywhere in the nfl.

 

Maybe I extrapolated a bit, but the overall tenor of the conversation this week about Iosivas was negative.  The guy is a work in progress.  No, he isn't a good #2 receiver yet, and who said he was?  Maybe he will be, maybe he won't, but considering how the first two games have gone for the WRs I don't think we should jump to any conclusions.  KC bracketed our outside guys and it didn't seem like either Chase or Iosivas were going over the middle much.  Hopefully Higgins is back on Monday night and we can see what Iosivas can do over the middle.

[UncleEarl]

2 hours ago, GoBengals said:

 

yes there is. he turns 25 in a few weeks. he started his career in the prime of his career. tee higgins is like 6 months older than him. jamarr chase is younger than him. justin jefferson is like 4 months older than him, when his rookie deal is up he will be 27. his prime is right now.

 

im not saying he cannot do it, im just saying its VERY unlikely he grows into more than a #3 guy. and there is nothing wrong with that, he can make 50mil in his career doing that. 

 

 

is there a lot of examples of guys sprouting out and making huge talent gains after the age of 25 who got opportunities to be in those bigger roles in their second year?

 

his life gets a lot easier when Tee gets back. he should do better all around. which solidifies my point, i suppose.

 

 

it was a PHENOMENAL catch and toe tap. and his IQ to break off the route for the other TD was top of the line as well. 

 

Yeah, guys at 25 who have played in pro style offenses for years in college and after.   Iosivas played Ivy League football for crying out loud.  On one hand he probably doesn't have nearly the miles on him as someone from say the SEC.  He's also drinking from a firehose as compared to a player coming from a high end football program.  Poor comparison.

[|High School Harry|]

Any thoughts to Burton surpassing Yoshi?

Perhaps sooner than expected?  If expected?

[claptonrocks]

9 minutes ago, High School Harry said:

Any thoughts to Burton surpassing Yoshi?

Perhaps sooner than expected?  If expected?

I think Burton stays at wide out.

Iosivas will be inserted in the slot.

I have high hopes for both

 

[-GoBengals-]

On 9/19/2024 at 4:14 PM, UncleEarl said:

 

Maybe I extrapolated a bit, but the overall tenor of the conversation this week about Iosivas was negative.  The guy is a work in progress.  No, he isn't a good #2 receiver yet, and who said he was?  Maybe he will be, maybe he won't, but considering how the first two games have gone for the WRs I don't think we should jump to any conclusions.  KC bracketed our outside guys and it didn't seem like either Chase or Iosivas were going over the middle much.  Hopefully Higgins is back on Monday night and we can see what Iosivas can do over the middle.

 

i 100% understand this, which is why i keep trying to emphasis im not being negative. i think i started by stating this dude doesnt have a top 2 WR skillset, then i saw his raw athleticism and thought, hell maybe im wrong, then i got to see him in nfl competition, and i went back to thinking that its not enough.

 

Iosivas is the caliber of WR who could only be a #2 and compete against the worst secondaries in the league. 

 

Red zone - whole different world, he is smart, smart in space, athletic, all things magnified in the red zone.

 

with Higgins back, Iosivas is back to a #3-at-best option, where he belongs. which was the point of the topic redirection that everyone got mad about. lol

 

so if he balls out, i would be proven correct, or at least more evidence to the fact i could be right, that he is a #3 talent.

 

 

On 9/19/2024 at 4:20 PM, UncleEarl said:

 

Yeah, guys at 25 who have played in pro style offenses for years in college and after.   Iosivas played Ivy League football for crying out loud.  On one hand he probably doesn't have nearly the miles on him as someone from say the SEC.  He's also drinking from a firehose as compared to a player coming from a high end football program.  Poor comparison.

 

he played in the ivy league because he wasn't very good. 

 

part of my point there, was he may have MORE miles on him playing in the ivy league, as he had to play there for 4 years to even get on a teams radar at all, and its not like he killed it there. he was drafted seemingly under the idea of "this kid is. a freak athlete, maybe he could be great at something"

 

if he balled out at Princeton, he would be a 3-4th rounder, he sat in the 6th round, with punters and kickers going ahead of him, because he never balled out.

 

a killer WR in the SEC would have been in the league 1-2 years before Iosivas, because they were far more talented. 

 

On 9/20/2024 at 9:21 AM, High School Harry said:

Any thoughts to Burton surpassing Yoshi?

Perhaps sooner than expected?  If expected?

 

might be a crazy toss up. or a game by game or opponent by opponent decision. need chunks in a hurry down big late? Burton in there stretch the field, Need a first down at the sticks? red zone game winner? Iosivas to the rescue.

 

glad to have both

 

On 9/20/2024 at 9:31 AM, claptonrocks said:

I think Burton stays at wide out.

Iosivas will be inserted in the slot.

I have high hopes for both

 

 

it would be cool for one to pull away as a clear leader, Chase/Burton/iosivas would be a fine combo IF Burton can be trusted completely in all aspects of the offense.

 

if not, we need to go back to the well at WR in the first two rounds in the draft.

[UncleEarl]

8 hours ago, GoBengals said:

 

he played in the ivy league because he wasn't very good. 

 

part of my point there, was he may have MORE miles on him playing in the ivy league, as he had to play there for 4 years to even get on a teams radar at all, and its not like he killed it there. he was drafted seemingly under the idea of "this kid is. a freak athlete, maybe he could be great at something"

 

if he balled out at Princeton, he would be a 3-4th rounder, he sat in the 6th round, with punters and kickers going ahead of him, because he never balled out.

 

a killer WR in the SEC would have been in the league 1-2 years before Iosivas, because they were far more talented. 

 

 

 

 

There are a lot of reasons why kids go Ivy League that have nothing to do  with how good they are or are not.  For some people education is the reason.  Families of immigrants tend to value education far more than the average joe born in the State.  The kid has a degree from Princeton.  That's probably going to earn him more money down the road than football unless he signs a big contract at some point.  Also, Iosivas played HS in Hawaii.  Not exactly a scouting hotspot.  Was football even his #1 sport coming to college? 

 

As far as the Ivy League goes they generally play and practice less in every sport.  They have limits on when they can even start.  Princeton has played all of one game so far this season.  A couple of Iosivas' seasons were cut short by Covid.  He doesn't have that many miles on him. 

[esjbh2]

On 9/23/2024 at 10:02 AM, UncleEarl said:

 

There are a lot of reasons why kids go Ivy League that have nothing to do  with how good they are or are not.  For some people education is the reason.  Families of immigrants tend to value education far more than the average joe born in the State.  The kid has a degree from Princeton.  That's probably going to earn him more money down the road than football unless he signs a big contract at some point.  Also, Iosivas played HS in Hawaii.  Not exactly a scouting hotspot.  Was football even his #1 sport coming to college? 

 

As far as the Ivy League goes they generally play and practice less in every sport.  They have limits on when they can even start.  Princeton has played all of one game so far this season.  A couple of Iosivas' seasons were cut short by Covid.  He doesn't have that many miles on him. 

100%...a degree from Princeton is 1000x better and more valuable than a degree in sports therapy from LSU IMHO...no offense to the therapists out there.

[|BlackJesus|]

[Homer_Rice]

On 9/23/2024 at 10:02 AM, UncleEarl said:

...Was football even his #1 sport coming to college?

He was an All-American Heptathelete at Princeton. I think he went there with track as a priority, but that's just a dreg from my possibly faulty memory.

[|High School Harry|]

Q: What's the difference between The Cincinnati Bengals and The Girl Scouts?

 

A: Adult Leadership 

 

 carry on...

[T-Dub]

2 minutes ago, High School Harry said:

Q: What's the difference between The Cincinnati Bengals and The Girl Scouts?

 

A: Adult Leadership 

 

 carry on...

 

 

They reward people based on merit?

[claptonrocks]

2 hours ago, BlackJesus said:

Iosivas has all the big intangibles to make him a valuable weapon.

 

Seems he the type that absorbs good coaching to elevate his game

 

With Chase, Higgins and Gesicki to worry about he could produce big number..

[claptonrocks]

4 hours ago, Homer_Rice said:

He was an All-American Heptathelete at Princeton. I think he went there with track as a priority, but that's just a dreg from my possibly faulty memory.

It's worked out well for him as he continued to work hard to become 

Valuable asset to the pass game

 

[|High School Harry|]

12 hours ago, T-Dub said:

 

 

They reward people based on merit?

Maybe our defensive tackles would do better selling cookies.

I'm down for a couple boxes of Thin Mints... speaking of which,

were victims of shrinkflation last year.

[T-Dub]

7 hours ago, High School Harry said:

Maybe our defensive tackles would do better selling cookies.

I'm down for a couple boxes of Thin Mints... speaking of which,

were victims of shrinkflation last year.

 

Dollar General sells a "Clover Valley" knock-off that are passable but I find the Scouts are worth supporting when they're available

[-GoBengals-]

On 9/23/2024 at 8:02 AM, UncleEarl said:

 

There are a lot of reasons why kids go Ivy League that have nothing to do  with how good they are or are not.  For some people education is the reason.  Families of immigrants tend to value education far more than the average joe born in the State.  The kid has a degree from Princeton.  That's probably going to earn him more money down the road than football unless he signs a big contract at some point.  Also, Iosivas played HS in Hawaii.  Not exactly a scouting hotspot.  Was football even his #1 sport coming to college? 

 

As far as the Ivy League goes they generally play and practice less in every sport.  They have limits on when they can even start.  Princeton has played all of one game so far this season.  A couple of Iosivas' seasons were cut short by Covid.  He doesn't have that many miles on him. 

 

lol, he was on the JV princeton football team his freshman year, he didnt play, his redshirt freshman year, he has 18 receptions....didnt play in 2020. 41 catches his junior year.

 

how are you possibly sitting here pretending he is some WR phenom who was only at princeton to hit the books?

 

this is getting out of control. he was a mediocre college WR who is a freak athlete that 1 of 32 teams took. a flyer on in the draft due to the athleticism. 

 

theres nothing wrong with that. but his pedigree is that of a special teams or bench player, him being a stout reliable #3 WR is incredible

 

he is an awesome kid who is fun to root for.

 

there is nothing else there.

 

22 hours ago, Homer_Rice said:

He was an All-American Heptathelete at Princeton. I think he went there with track as a priority, but that's just a dreg from my possibly faulty memory.

 

cant tell, his BIO from recruiting interviews says he enjoys track and doesnt mention football, but i dont know if thats because he was a WR prospect so it was obvious or vice versa. 

 

20 hours ago, High School Harry said:

Q: What's the difference between The Cincinnati Bengals and The Girl Scouts?

 

A: Adult Leadership 

 

 carry on...

 

... 

 

19 hours ago, claptonrocks said:

Iosivas has all the big intangibles to make him a valuable weapon.

 

Seems he the type that absorbs good coaching to elevate his game

 

With Chase, Higgins and Gesicki to worry about he could produce big number..

 

probably not, though. fun red zone weapon, possesion guy.. im continuously shocked at how not strong he seems upon contact, he isnt fighting through ANYTHING. the 4th down, the goal line, and one other play, i expected him to roll, but he just keeps getting taken backwards. he does have incredible hands and footwork. like watching him play.

 

18 hours ago, claptonrocks said:

It's worked out well for him as he continued to work hard to become 

Valuable asset to the pass game

 

 

 

for sure. glad they took the shot on him, love his interviews too, Hoard interviewed him this past week again, such a smart happy kid. cant help but to root for him.

 

8 hours ago, High School Harry said:

Maybe our defensive tackles would do better selling cookies.

I'm down for a couple boxes of Thin Mints... speaking of which,

were victims of shrinkflation last year.

 

[Griever]

 

[claptonrocks]

 

 

18 minutes ago, Griever said:

Another young Bengal with the   mindset to exceed 

Like to see him have a lil bust out against the Rats especially Red Zone...

 

 

 

 

[-GoBengals-]

cool video, his interviews he keeps doing are good. good personality.

 

he has the knack for making the random big play when needed like Boyd did, he is currently averaging 4.5 catches per games and 28.5 yards per game if my math is correct.