8 hours ago, Sox said:

If he's there my personal pick is Arvell Reese. Great LB and great pass rusher. You can move him all over. I'd use him like Micah Parsons. Second pick would be Caleb Downs, if there. FWIW, I am NOT an Ohio State fan.

Agree but looks to be a top 5 pick.

he's that valuable...

I have concluded that the Bengals front office is just a bit mixed up - all through the years they misunderstood and thought every team had a dart board and not an actual draft board...

What would be interesting to see is a table of each Bengals’ draft pick in the first three or four rounds over the last few years right beside the players that Mel Kiper thought the Bengals should draft…and the same for Rich Eisen, Mike Mayock, and other “experts”.

We all think Kiper is awful, but I’d like to see how his “suggestions” would look compared to the Bengals’ frequent WTF picks.

I'd like to see the Bengals take a new approach to drafting.

Rather than their usual way of waiting to see what falls in their lap no

matter where they pick, number 5 or number 15, take players other teams

have passed on, and fall to us (Murphy, Stewart for example)

pick a player they think will have real value and trade up for him.

Picking 10th and want Downs?

Why sit there wishing in one hand and shitting in the other only to

see him go at 9, for example.

Maybe the guy is worth a first and a second if he is going to impact

and improve the team that much.

1 hour ago, Cricket said:

What would be interesting to see is a table of each Bengals’ draft pick in the first three or four rounds over the last few years right beside the players that Mel Kiper thought the Bengals should draft…and the same for Rich Eisen, Mike Mayock, and other “experts”.

We all think Kiper is awful, but I’d like to see how his “suggestions” would look compared to the Bengals’ frequent WTF picks.

This is something "the AI' is actually good at - a Google on steroids.

It seems from general searches it couldn't find whatever Kiper or others were actually suggesting for the pick in flight while the pick came up... I figure you'd have to watch video to get that, but it was able to generate a summary of the pre-draft suggestions for R1 (later rounds it couldn't find anything reliable). It produced Kiper and Jeremiah on a generic "experts" prompt :

Year	Actual R1 Pick	Kiper R1 Prediction	Jeremiah R1 Prediction
2021	No.5 – Ja’Marr Chase (WR)	Penei Sewell (OT)	Kyle Pitts (TE)
2022	No.31 – Daxton Hill (S)	George Karlaftis (EDGE)	David Ojabo (EDGE)
2023	No.28 – Myles Murphy (EDGE)	Brian Bresee (DL)	Keeanu Benton (DT)
2024	No.18 – Amarius Mims (OT)	Taliese Fuaga (OT)	Byron Murphy II (DT)
2025	No.17 – Shemar Stewart (EDGE)	Shemar Stewart (EDGE)	Jahdae Barron (CB)

3 minutes ago, HavePityPlease said:

This is something "the AI' is actually good at - a Google on steroids.

It seems from general searches it couldn't find whatever Kiper or others were actually suggesting for the pick in flight while the pick came up... I figure you'd have to watch video to get that, but it was able to generate a summary of the pre-draft suggestions for R1 (later rounds it couldn't find anything reliable). It produced Kiper and Jeremiah on a generic "experts" prompt :

Year	Actual R1 Pick	Kiper R1 Prediction	Jeremiah R1 Prediction
2021	No.5 – Ja’Marr Chase (WR)	Penei Sewell (OT)	Kyle Pitts (TE)
2022	No.31 – Daxton Hill (S)	George Karlaftis (EDGE)	David Ojabo (EDGE)
2023	No.28 – Myles Murphy (EDGE)	Brian Bresee (DL)	Keeanu Benton (DT)
2024	No.18 – Amarius Mims (OT)	Taliese Fuaga (OT)	Byron Murphy II (DT)
2025	No.17 – Shemar Stewart (EDGE)	Shemar Stewart (EDGE)	Jahdae Barron (CB)

Now add it guys that were actually available Karlaftis was already take for example.

1 hour ago, Jamie_B said:

Now add it guys that were actually available Karlaftis was already take for example.

Yeah that's the "in flight" part, to form your own opinion you can just look at the draft results. The question was what did the "experts" think.

I'd like to see the Bengals take a new approach to drafting.

Rather than their usual way of waiting to see what falls in their lap no

matter where they pick, number 5 or number 15, take players other teams

have passed on, and fall to us (Murphy, Stewart for example)

pick a player they think will have real value and trade up for him.

Picking 10th and want Downs?

Why sit there wishing in one hand and shitting in the other only to

see him go at 9, for example.

Maybe the guy is worth a first and a second if he is going to impact

and improve the team that much.

Good teams do that but they have fewer holes to fill. Bengals probably aren't in position to trade up in 2026. But maybe we have a great free agency and fill all our holes before the draft, right? A man can dream. Someday the Bengals will focus on drafting good football players rather than filling holes via the draft. We took Stewart because they didn't want to pay Trey. Maybe he becomes a good player but they could have taken guys like Starks or Campbell or Morrison or Pearce or even Egbuka who were already good players and not developmental prospects.

14 minutes ago, HavePityPlease said:

Yeah that's the "in flight" part, to form your own opinion you can just look at the draft results. The question was what did the "experts" think.

I'm mostly just curious if the guys that were mocked to us, were even there when we picked.

4 minutes ago, Jamie_B said:

I'm mostly just curious if the guys that were mocked to us, were even there when we picked.

Ok, just for you, I asked the stupid AI to add this information 😄

Edit: Note that it is wrong about Pitts (at least, I didn't verify anything but that one is obvious)

Year	Actual R1 Pick	Kiper R1 Prediction	Kiper Player Available?	Jeremiah R1 Prediction	Jeremiah Player Available?
2021	No.5 – Ja’Marr Chase (WR)	Penei Sewell (OT)	Yes	Kyle Pitts (TE)	Yes
2022	No.31 – Daxton Hill (S)	George Karlaftis (EDGE)	No	David Ojabo (EDGE)	No
2023	No.28 – Myles Murphy (EDGE)	Brian Bresee (DL)	Yes	Keeanu Benton (DT)	Yes
2024	No.18 – Amarius Mims (OT)	Taliese Fuaga (OT)	No	Byron Murphy II (DT)	No
2025	No.17 – Shemar Stewart (EDGE)	Shemar Stewart (EDGE)	Yes	Jahdae Barron (CB)	Yes

1 minute ago, HavePityPlease said:

Ok, just for you, I asked the stupid AI to add this information 😄

Year	Actual R1 Pick	Kiper R1 Prediction	Kiper Player Available?	Jeremiah R1 Prediction	Jeremiah Player Available?
2021	No.5 – Ja’Marr Chase (WR)	Penei Sewell (OT)	Yes	Kyle Pitts (TE)	Yes
2022	No.31 – Daxton Hill (S)	George Karlaftis (EDGE)	No	David Ojabo (EDGE)	No
2023	No.28 – Myles Murphy (EDGE)	Brian Bresee (DL)	Yes	Keeanu Benton (DT)	Yes
2024	No.18 – Amarius Mims (OT)	Taliese Fuaga (OT)	No	Byron Murphy II (DT)	No
2025	No.17 – Shemar Stewart (EDGE)	Shemar Stewart (EDGE)	Yes	Jahdae Barron (CB)	Yes

I will say that picking Bresee would have made a lot of future picks look a whole lot different...

8 hours ago, HavePityPlease said:

Ok, just for you, I asked the stupid AI to add this information 😄

Edit: Note that it is wrong about Pitts (at least, I didn't verify anything but that one is obvious)

Year	Actual R1 Pick	Kiper R1 Prediction	Kiper Player Available?	Jeremiah R1 Prediction	Jeremiah Player Available?
2021	No.5 – Ja’Marr Chase (WR)	Penei Sewell (OT)	Yes	Kyle Pitts (TE)	Yes
2022	No.31 – Daxton Hill (S)	George Karlaftis (EDGE)	No	David Ojabo (EDGE)	No
2023	No.28 – Myles Murphy (EDGE)	Brian Bresee (DL)	Yes	Keeanu Benton (DT)	Yes
2024	No.18 – Amarius Mims (OT)	Taliese Fuaga (OT)	No	Byron Murphy II (DT)	No
2025	No.17 – Shemar Stewart (EDGE)	Shemar Stewart (EDGE)	Yes	Jahdae Barron (CB)	Yes

Awesome thanks

13 hours ago, High School Harry said:

I'd like to see the Bengals take a new approach to drafting.

Rather than their usual way of waiting to see what falls in their lap no

matter where they pick, number 5 or number 15, take players other teams

have passed on, and fall to us (Murphy, Stewart for example)

pick a player they think will have real value and trade up for him.

Picking 10th and want Downs?

Why sit there wishing in one hand and shitting in the other only to

see him go at 9, for example.

Maybe the guy is worth a first and a second if he is going to impact

and improve the team that much.

The problem with this idea is - our drfat board overall is clearly weak so if you move up and target someone (and give up other drfat capital) you likely do so for another meh player. We traded up for Cartman I think?

There is no issue with leeting the drfat come to you so to speak AS LONG AS you have a very good draft board. If you trade up or stand pat it is the same draft board and thus the same inadequate scouting to build it.

I have proposed we always trade down and get more picks if we stay with the same crack scouting staff - only because more picks increases the odds of being lucky with picks.

Scouting is really all about increasing the odds. All teams have picks that dont pan out but with better scoting you increase the odds of more and better picks. Instead of 2 good players in a 7 round draft you look at 3 or 4 and then over a few year period you have a much better roster. What would our tem look like if just one of our shite defensive picks from each draft was a good player over the past 3 or 4 years.

It is just about increasing the odds. The Bengals dont think like that though which is why the have the cheap scouting staff approach. It is the incremental value you need - a bit better drafting, a bit better coaching, a bit better free agency, a bit better cap managemnet and then it all adds up.

1 minute ago, I_C_Deadpeople said:

The problem with this idea is - our drfat board overall is clearly weak so if you move up and target someone (and give up other drfat capital) you likely do so for another meh player. We traded up for Cartman I think?

There is no issue with leeting the drfat come to you so to speak AS LONG AS you have a very good draft board. If you trade up or stand pat it is the same draft board and thus the same inadequate scouting to build it.

I have proposed we always trade down and get more picks if we stay with the same crack scouting staff - only because more picks increases the odds of being lucky with picks.

And drafted Carman over Creed Humphrey which has to go down as one of the biggest Bengal

draft fuck ups in the last decade.

I think we traded up for Logan Wilson and there is still a hella story there, somehow.

Traded up to the first pick in the first round for Ki-Jana Carter.

Whatever... I guess the equation would be Is X player worth a first and a second round pick?

Ain't gonna happen but would be interesting to see a defensive player who is a difference maker

and makes other teams plan around him.

Ain't gonna happen and we will draft another putz with potential and three years later still

waiting for his break out like Mild Murphy or Cam Taylor-Swift.

4 minutes ago, High School Harry said:

And drafted Carman over Creed Humphrey which has to go down as one of the biggest Bengal

draft fuck ups in the last decade.

I think we traded up for Logan Wilson and there is still a hella story there, somehow.

Traded up to the first pick in the first round for Ki-Jana Carter.

Whatever... I guess the equation would be Is X player worth a first and a second round pick?

Ain't gonna happen but would be interesting to see a defensive player who is a difference maker

and makes other teams plan around him.

Ain't gonna happen and we will draft another putz with potential and three years later still

waiting for his break out like Mild Murphy or Cam Taylor-Swift.

We would be trading up though for the likes of Shemale Stewart instead of a Micah Parsons though becuse of our inconsistent draft board.

No one with any mind at all, inside or outside the organization, can argue we draft well. So to do the same thing over and over is futile.

14 hours ago, High School Harry said:

Ain't gonna happen and we will draft another putz with potential and three years later still

waiting for his break out like Mild Murphy or Cam Taylor-Swift.

Have to wonder how Murphy would've fared on a team where a 3rd round pick can't hang around on the sideline in sweats for 2 years like someone's problem child. They've obviously created a culture of doing the bare minimum. Obviously they've got a few players that hold themselves to a higher standard but the average 22 year old millionaire is not going to be that motivated. The expectations are low so that's the performance they get.

The Althetic has an article on Murphy (Dehner) and the so called light coming in. Murphy himself states he was a full effort guy in HS and College but was not for the first two years here. That to me speaks about culture and coaching.

On 12/3/2025 at 9:54 AM, I_C_Deadpeople said:

The problem with this idea is - our drfat board overall is clearly weak so if you move up and target someone (and give up other drfat capital) you likely do so for another meh player. We traded up for Cartman I think?

There is no issue with leeting the drfat come to you so to speak AS LONG AS you have a very good draft board. If you trade up or stand pat it is the same draft board and thus the same inadequate scouting to build it.

I have proposed we always trade down and get more picks if we stay with the same crack scouting staff - only because more picks increases the odds of being lucky with picks.

Er, who have the Bengals been "lucky" with lately? My view is we need quality more than quantity. The latter we already have.

17 hours ago, sparky151 said:

Er, who have the Bengals been "lucky" with lately? My view is we need quality more than quantity. The latter we already have.

Chase Brown, I would also argue for Jalen Rivers as two examples.

But it is hard to argue (IMHO) for quality over quantity if the scouting staff has trouble determing quality in the right order. Regardless of how many picks we have the drfat board has been of late weak so trading up for quality may just be trading up and overdrafting.

If we actually had a good draft board year after year we could easily do both trades upward and downward. But our board is weak so more picks increases our chances on hitting. Essentially we are playing darts blindfolded so more darts increases the chnaces of hitting the dart board.

Update...

How are the Vikings ahead of us?

5 minutes ago, Jamie_B said:

How are the Vikings ahead of us?

Good catch, I honestly don't know. The Athletic could definitely be wrong for all I know

Found this on USA Today

1. New York Giants: 2-11 record; .534 strength of schedule

2. Las Vegas Raiders 2-11; .548 SOS

3. Tennessee Titans: 2-11; .573 SOS

4. Cleveland Browns: 3-10; .486 SOS

5. New Orleans Saints: 3-10; .498 SOS

6. Washington Commanders: 3-10; .511 SOS

7. New York Jets: 3-10; .541 SOS

8. Arizona Cardinals: 3-10; .570 SOS

9. Atlanta Falcons (pick belongs to Los Angeles Rams): 4-9; .502 SOS

10. Cincinnati Bengals: 4-9; .523 SOS

11. Minnesota Vikings: 5-8; .523 SOS

12. Miami Dolphins: 6-7; .482 SOS

13. Baltimore Ravens: 6-7; .509 SOS

14. Kansas City Chiefs: 6-7; .511 SOS

15. Dallas Cowboys: 6-6-1; .447 SOS

16. Carolina Panthers: 7-6; .516 SOS

17. Detroit Lions: 8-5; .498 SOS

18. Indianapolis Colts (pick belongs to Jets): 8-5; .518 SOS

19. Pittsburgh Steelers: 7-6; .511 SOS

20. Tampa Bay Buccaneers: 7-6; .514 SOS

21. Houston Texans: 8-5; .541 SOS

22. Los Angeles Chargers: 8-4; .466 SOS

23. Philadelphia Eagles: 8-4; .489 SOS

24. Chicago Bears: 9-4; .448 SOS

25. Buffalo Bills: 9-4; .468 SOS

26. San Francisco 49ers: 9-4; .489 SOS

27. Jacksonville Jaguars (pick belongs to Browns): 9-4; .495 SOS

28. Green Bay Packers (pick belongs to Cowboys): 9-3-1; .475 SOS

29. Seattle Seahawks: 10-3; .484 SOS

30. New England Patriots: 11-2; .376 SOS

31. Los Angeles Rams: 10-3; .518 SOS

32. Denver Broncos: 11-2; .436 SOS

It is funny when I go through these drfat sites, I now look for guys who have 'huge potential but only shown flashes'; just our type. That and the club footed cornerbacks.