9 minutes ago, GoBengals said:

everyone has oline problems, everyone has trash draft picks, everyone has dud FA signings, everyone is pining to get a set of guys..

No, everyone does not have OL problems. Not everyone went 6-11, you know? The teams that won last weekend, they all have good-to-great OL's. Even some of the teams that lost - the Texans OL are fun as hell to watch.

But the Bengals can't do that because, what? It's too hard? Not saying the Bengals revert to suck without Risner but he's definitely a band-aid solution that was necessary because of poor drafting. What else would you call it?

2 minutes ago, T-Dub said:

No, everyone does not have OL problems. Not everyone went 6-11, you know? The teams that won last weekend, they all have good-to-great OL's. Even some of the teams that lost - the Texans OL are fun as hell to watch.

But the Bengals can't do that because, what? It's too hard? Not saying the Bengals revert to suck without Risner but he's definitely a band-aid solution that was necessary because of poor drafting. What else would you call it?

yeah some teams defense dragged them to the #1 seed.

the bengals had the #1 pass protecting Oline the last 8 games of the season. and were 3-5 in those games...the defense being bad means our oline was bad?

we had a HORRIBLE oline and were in the superbowl.......

good and great teams can have oline problems.

there are 18 66+ pass block rating centers in the nfl...

so just over half the teams can have one of those...

the bengals had one of those....12th best in the nfl.

Mims was a 66.6 pass block tackle.

OBJ got worked in a few games and was a 57 pass block tackle...

so the bengals had 4/5 oline be a average or better pass blocking player.

boy the patriots are in the AFCC game........ but

1. the patriots, have the 2nd worst graded center in the nfl.

2. the new england patriots have the 68th graded LG in the nfl. (there are 64 starting guard positions)

the seahawks, obviously they dont have any oline issues..

HOLD THE FUCK ON....

the seahawks..

1. have the 70th ranked RG (again, 64 starting positions)

2. the 46th ranked LG in the league... a 58 pass block grade.

thats 2 teams in the conference championships with two below average or BAD linemen EACH...

you are telling lies, and at this point i cant tell if you are trying to convince me or yourself, but this information is available.

but i think we both know you dont actually care about the truth of anything. as long as you can mindlessly mock something and pretend its true... its all the same...

37 minutes ago, GoBengals said:

but i think we both know you dont actually care about the truth of anything. as long as you can mindlessly mock something and pretend its true... its all the same...

🙄

& I think you're trying very hard to convince yourself that the team we both follow is run by competent professionals.

All those other teams that had better OL's, that didn't have to sign someone off the street a week before the season started.. They all got lucky, I guess?

Y'know.. If there's one thing they excel at, it's making excuses. You really don't need to keep trying to do it for them.

6 hours ago, GoBengals said:

everyone has oline problems, everyone has trash draft picks, everyone has dud FA signings, everyone is pining to get a set of guys.

Which means a team who has a descent one should do everything in its power to keep him. In the past we have not done that, lets see if that has changed. This whole "less valuable' position crap has to chnage in terms of OL thinking. You need 5 good players so if you have some, keep them.

59 minutes ago, I_C_Deadpeople said:

Which means a team who has a descent one should do everything in its power to keep him. In the past we have not done that, lets see if that has changed. This whole "less valuable' position crap has to chnage in terms of OL thinking. You need 5 good players so if you have some, keep them.

Cosign

2 hours ago, I_C_Deadpeople said:

Which means a team who has a descent one should do everything in its power to keep him. In the past we have not done that, lets see if that has changed. This whole "less valuable' position crap has to chnage in terms of OL thinking. You need 5 good players so if you have some, keep them.

You can’t argue with the fact though that over the last 8 games of the season, the Bengals OL was a top 5 unit.

11 minutes ago, spicoli said:

You can’t argue with the fact though that over the last 8 games of the season, the Bengals OL was a top 5 unit.

PFF Rankings over the full season, I wish there were ways we could get the over the course of a number of games stats. Because I do think they were better than a few teams PFF has us below.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2025-nfl-offensive-line-rankings

28. Cincinnati Bengals

Best lineup:

LT Orlando Brown Jr.
LG Dylan Fairchild
C Ted Karras
RG Dalton Risner
RT Amarius Mims

The Bengals' offensive line began the season as arguably the worst unit in the NFL, largely because of their rookie guard duo: Dylan Fairchild and Jalen Rivers. However, by inserting guard Dalton Risner back in the lineup, they were able to solidify the unit.

Left tackle Orlando Brown Jr. had a down year, tallying a career-low 62.6 PFF pass-blocking grade and giving up a career-high nine sacks.

Best player: Dalton Risner

Risner’s 71.5 PFF overall grade this season led the Bengals.

1 hour ago, Jamie_B said:

PFF Rankings over the full season, I wish there were ways we could get the over the course of a number of games stats. Because I do think they were better than a few teams PFF has us below.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2025-nfl-offensive-line-rankings

28. Cincinnati Bengals

Best lineup:

LT Orlando Brown Jr.
LG Dylan Fairchild
C Ted Karras
RG Dalton Risner
RT Amarius Mims

The Bengals' offensive line began the season as arguably the worst unit in the NFL, largely because of their rookie guard duo: Dylan Fairchild and Jalen Rivers. However, by inserting guard Dalton Risner back in the lineup, they were able to solidify the unit.

Left tackle Orlando Brown Jr. had a down year, tallying a career-low 62.6 PFF pass-blocking grade and giving up a career-high nine sacks.

Best player: Dalton Risner

Risner’s 71.5 PFF overall grade this season led the Bengals.

Obv not a PFF fan but I looked at 5-6 different sites with OL rankings & they all had the Bengals around mid to upper 20's.

That means, since there seems to be some confusion, that 20+ teams had a better OL.

Meaning - stay with me here - not every team has a bad OL.

What a ridiculous argument.

1 hour ago, spicoli said:

You can’t argue with the fact though that over the last 8 games of the season, the Bengals OL was a top 5 unit.

I don't think they were high on run blocking

Pass protection was good later

Jelling I suppose...

I'd decline anything more than 2yr 13 mil for Risner.

Like Go said about his I love it here and the team blah blah.

Probably his last chance to cash in for whatever.

2 yrs 13 mil..6.5 per.

I'm not really even liking that for a player

who I feel may be iffy for 17 games let alone 34 in 2 yrs..

36 minutes ago, claptonrocks said:

I'd decline anything more than 2yr 13 mil for Risner.

Like Go said about his I love it here and the team blah blah.

Probably his last chance to cash in for whatever.

2 yrs 13 mil..6.5 per.

I'm not really even liking that for a player

who I feel may be iffy for 17 games let alone 34 in 2 yrs..

Not pointing at you...but this fan nickle/diming is actually supporting the FO that they claim is "inept".

One needs to look at present as opposed to years down the road. So what if he is in his 30's...he will still be akin to what he was in 2025 in 2026. And who knows--or cares--what he would be at 35-36? The "investment" is more immediate. If he got 3/20/10 guaranteed, what does it matter in 3 years? The "investment" dollar goes up anyway.

If this were a Super Bowl team already stocked--then the "years down the road" argument might hold water due to wishing to stockpile young players. But it isn't...and if there ever was a definition to "win now", it's these guys.

2 hours ago, Jamie_B said:

PFF Rankings over the full season, I wish there were ways we could get the over the course of a number of games stats. Because I do think they were better than a few teams PFF has us below.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2025-nfl-offensive-line-rankings

28. Cincinnati Bengals

Best lineup:

LT Orlando Brown Jr.
LG Dylan Fairchild
C Ted Karras
RG Dalton Risner
RT Amarius Mims

The Bengals' offensive line began the season as arguably the worst unit in the NFL, largely because of their rookie guard duo: Dylan Fairchild and Jalen Rivers. However, by inserting guard Dalton Risner back in the lineup, they were able to solidify the unit.

Left tackle Orlando Brown Jr. had a down year, tallying a career-low 62.6 PFF pass-blocking grade and giving up a career-high nine sacks.

Best player: Dalton Risner

Risner’s 71.5 PFF overall grade this season led the Bengals.

They were so bad to start the season their overall rankings weren’t going to change all that much from a really good 8 game stretch. During that stretch however, they were playing about as well as any unit in the league.

1 hour ago, claptonrocks said:

I don't think they were high on run blocking

Pass protection was good later

Jelling I suppose...

They were averaging about 5 yards a carry during that stretch.

Just now, spicoli said:

They were so bad to start the season their overall ranking weren’t going to change all that much from a really good 8 game stretch. During that stretch however, they were playing about as well as any unit in the league.

Oh yeah not disagreeing, I mean hell Risner who we are all hoping comes back, is basically the guy who got Joe hurt. That at least imo is the Bengals fault for not getting Risner signed until so late that he was starting (due to injury) before he really knew the playbook for the most part. So he obviously turned it around.

3 hours ago, spicoli said:

You can’t argue with the fact though that over the last 8 games of the season, the Bengals OL was a top 5 unit.

Which is why many of us are worried the team will fuck that up somehow 🤪

1 hour ago, Le Tigre said:

Not pointing at you...but this fan nickle/diming is actually supporting the FO that they claim is "inept".

One needs to look at present as opposed to years down the road. So what if he is in his 30's...he will still be akin to what he was in 2025 in 2026. And who knows--or cares--what he would be at 35-36? The "investment" is more immediate. If he got 3/20/10 guaranteed, what does it matter in 3 years? The "investment" dollar goes up anyway.

If this were a Super Bowl team already stocked--then the "years down the road" argument might hold water due to wishing to stockpile young players. But it isn't...and if there ever was a definition to "win now", it's these guys.

There's this general misconception that "other teams will overpay" for our FA's. That's not overpaying. That is their market value, and the Bengals aren't willing to pay market value.

It's a narrative that runs through all their decisions - they think they're smarter than everyone else. Why, just look at how they lost that one Super Bowl a few years ago! Clearly they are head and shoulders above all these other mismanaged, idiot teams that are in the playoffs almost every year. Tobin is just the more recent glaring example. Where else could someone stay in his position for 25 years with so little to show for it?

4 hours ago, spicoli said:

You can’t argue with the fact though that over the last 8 games of the season, the Bengals OL was a top 5 unit.

I would accept top 10-ish. They also played 3 winning teams in that span. I would say average at best in losing to the Stealers. They didn't look top anything getting shut out in the 2nd Ravens game, either. Doubts aside though, they did look plenty good enough to make a deep playoff run. Fairchild & Mims both look like solid long-term starters to build around. Karras is clearly wearing down but those are big shoes to fill & they've had a run of bad centers before him. OBjr, mostly ok, gets pantsed by better DE's and worse, seems to take plays off. He's struggling as an LT when he was a Pro Bowl RT, which is kind of a bummer.. and that leaves Risner.

To kind of reel it back in here.. My doubts were in their ability to replace him, specifically. If he really expects top 10 guard money they should probably go sign a top 10 guard instead, because I don't think he's all that individually. Kind of a perfect fit here but now he's trying to use that against them and it's likely to backfire. Not the move with an arrogant, obstinate ownership-led FO. Not doing himself any favors.

I don't think they can count on Rivers, not yet anyway. There are top 10 guard prospects into the middle rounds of the draft, but that's one less defensive pick, not to mention the exact sort of gambling that forced them to sign Risner in the first place (among other "decision points"). That leaves him, or some other free agent - when we're talking about how hard it is to find OL anywhere, let alone for this team in FA.

Just get it done, write some kind of out into the contract & keep it moving. $3-4 mil one way or the other seems like a cost of doing business thing that really doesn't matter on an NFL budget. Meanwhile keep trying to draft his replacement & try to get ahead of this need to start rookies out of desperation before they're ready to take on that responsibility. Like, on a team with a couple of decent DE's where Stewart had to work his way into a rotation I don't think anyone would be calling him a bust halfway through his rookie season. Maybe a year from now Rivers looks like a decent starter. Until then, though...

These are all situations they've created for themselves, is the recurring point here.

1 hour ago, Jamie_B said:

Oh yeah not disagreeing, I mean hell Risner who we are all hoping comes back, is basically the guy who got Joe hurt. That at least imo is the Bengals fault for not getting Risner signed until so late that he was starting (due to injury) before he really knew the playbook for the most part. So he obviously turned it around.

I might be delusional, but I remember something being thrown out on the internet that they tried to sign him a couple of weeks prior to when they actually did but that the delay was on his end. The team will never really talk about it publicly, but there was this: https://www.si.com/nfl/bengals/onsi/news/dalton-risner-had-opportunities-play-elsewhere-before-signing-with-bengals

"There were offers out there," Risner said. "You weigh your options and you compare contracts. We could get in the weeds about it all, but when you kind of realize, for example, another team might be where the Bengals are at, the Cincinnati Bengals is where I want to be. But, you've always got to do your due dilligence. It's the NFL. You're not going to be in the NFL forever, so you want to always weigh your options and see what type of contracts are being offered to you and your agent and make the decision from there. But, as soon as I kind of felt like that's where things were at, I was like, 'Man, let's go to Cincinnati.'"
"

What I remember was something more point blank about how the Bengals wanted him here before the end of training camp but it didn't happen from his end.

According to: https://overthecap.com/player/dalton-risner/7832
The Bengals only paid him a little bit over the vet minimum for a player with 6 accrued seasons (that was his guaranteed signing bonus of $167,500).

Apparently, the other teams that had shown interest were not willing to pony up more than the Bengals or he probably would have gone there (I think the Stealers and Seahawks are usually mentioned for the other teams that had interest in him). There were probably others like the Browns who ended up signing Teven Jenkins for a bit more than what Risner signed for.

I'll be completely honest, I wasn't sure if he was going to be a good signing and I'm even more confused about why he was a free agent now than I was before the season. I didn't doubt the talent (especially at LG) but thought there must have been reasons that he bounced around. Something like he's an asshole in the locker room or doesn't practice hard or argues with coaches but it seems like absolutely none of that is the case. Everyone assumed he didn't want to do the whole training camp thing, but that was the case with the other guys out there too (like Tevin Jenkins). I don't think the Bengals are good at hiding things, so it looks like he got here in-shape, was never a problem, and did a great job. The team could not have asked for more than what they got from him and he was honestly a steal.

Hopefully they sign him for a few years. He's definitely not going to be as cheap no matter where he signs though. The only good news if the Bengals don't resign him is that this should be a good year for guards in the draft and tackles that get converted to guard. Especially the guys that meet their traditional measurements for RG (6'4" to 6'6" and 320 to 350 lbs.). Risner is actually on the lighter side of guards.

8 minutes ago, BBR said:

I might be delusional, but I remember something being thrown out on the internet that they tried to sign him a couple of weeks prior to when they actually did but that the delay was on his end. The team will never really talk about it publicly, but there was this: https://www.si.com/nfl/bengals/onsi/news/dalton-risner-had-opportunities-play-elsewhere-before-signing-with-bengals

"There were offers out there," Risner said. "You weigh your options and you compare contracts. We could get in the weeds about it all, but when you kind of realize, for example, another team might be where the Bengals are at, the Cincinnati Bengals is where I want to be. But, you've always got to do your due dilligence. It's the NFL. You're not going to be in the NFL forever, so you want to always weigh your options and see what type of contracts are being offered to you and your agent and make the decision from there. But, as soon as I kind of felt like that's where things were at, I was like, 'Man, let's go to Cincinnati.'"
"

What I remember was something more point blank about how the Bengals wanted him here before the end of training camp but it didn't happen from his end.

According to: https://overthecap.com/player/dalton-risner/7832


I'll be completely honest, I wasn't sure if he was going to be a good signing and I'm even more confused about why he was a free agent now than I was before the season. [snip]

yeah I thought he had the rep of being a prick or something. Can only assume he was holding out for top dollar & this was it. Maybe this exact situation of potentially getting BTFO trying to extend him was what other teams wanted to avoid? But again, with $75 million plus in cap space WTF do I care if they have to pay him a couple more than they'd prefer. Very hard to muster any sympathy for this FO.

5 hours ago, claptonrocks said:

I'd decline anything more than 2yr 13 mil for Risner.

Like Go said about his I love it here and the team blah blah.

Probably his last chance to cash in for whatever.

2 yrs 13 mil..6.5 per.

I'm not really even liking that for a player

who I feel may be iffy for 17 games let alone 34 in 2 yrs..

That would be penny wise and pound foolish. Risner made about a third of Alex Cappa's salary in 2025. And played much better. If we let Risner walk and replace him with a free agent, that player is highly likely to cost more and has a good chance of being a lesser player than Risner. If we try to replace him with a rookie draft pick, that would be repeating the Volson mistake and probably lead to Burrow taking extra punishment as opponents scheme their best rushers vs the rookie.

Or we could, you know pay Risner fair value and move on to fixing the defense. But that's not the Bengals way, to be proactive.

3 hours ago, T-Dub said:

There's this general misconception that "other teams will overpay" for our FA's. That's not overpaying. That is their market value, and the Bengals aren't willing to pay market value.

It's a narrative that runs through all their decisions - they think they're smarter than everyone else. Why, just look at how they lost that one Super Bowl a few years ago! Clearly they are head and shoulders above all these other mismanaged, idiot teams that are in the playoffs almost every year. Tobin is just the more recent glaring example. Where else could someone stay in his position for 25 years with so little to show for it?

Who thinks other teams will "overpay" for any of the Bengals 2026 free agents? Hendrickson will get a nice contract from some team and my fear is the Bengals will tie their own hands as they wait through free agency to avoid losing the 2027 comp pick for Hendrickson. They could avoid that entirely by doing a tag and trade with Trey but it would be very Bengalesque for them to botch it and let him hit the market, then they miss out on free agents who they can easily afford and who would improve the team because they are determined not to sign as many free agents as they lose so they can keep the 2027 3rd round comp pick they hope for.

2 hours ago, BBR said:

I might be delusional, but I remember something being thrown out on the internet that they tried to sign him a couple of weeks prior to when they actually did but that the delay was on his end. The team will never really talk about it publicly, but there was this: https://www.si.com/nfl/bengals/onsi/news/dalton-risner-had-opportunities-play-elsewhere-before-signing-with-bengals

"There were offers out there," Risner said. "You weigh your options and you compare contracts. We could get in the weeds about it all, but when you kind of realize, for example, another team might be where the Bengals are at, the Cincinnati Bengals is where I want to be. But, you've always got to do your due dilligence. It's the NFL. You're not going to be in the NFL forever, so you want to always weigh your options and see what type of contracts are being offered to you and your agent and make the decision from there. But, as soon as I kind of felt like that's where things were at, I was like, 'Man, let's go to Cincinnati.'"
"

What I remember was something more point blank about how the Bengals wanted him here before the end of training camp but it didn't happen from his end.

According to: https://overthecap.com/player/dalton-risner/7832
The Bengals only paid him a little bit over the vet minimum for a player with 6 accrued seasons (that was his guaranteed signing bonus of $167,500).

Apparently, the other teams that had shown interest were not willing to pony up more than the Bengals or he probably would have gone there (I think the Stealers and Seahawks are usually mentioned for the other teams that had interest in him). There were probably others like the Browns who ended up signing Teven Jenkins for a bit more than what Risner signed for.

I'll be completely honest, I wasn't sure if he was going to be a good signing and I'm even more confused about why he was a free agent now than I was before the season. I didn't doubt the talent (especially at LG) but thought there must have been reasons that he bounced around. Something like he's an asshole in the locker room or doesn't practice hard or argues with coaches but it seems like absolutely none of that is the case. Everyone assumed he didn't want to do the whole training camp thing, but that was the case with the other guys out there too (like Tevin Jenkins). I don't think the Bengals are good at hiding things, so it looks like he got here in-shape, was never a problem, and did a great job. The team could not have asked for more than what they got from him and he was honestly a steal.

Hopefully they sign him for a few years. He's definitely not going to be as cheap no matter where he signs though. The only good news if the Bengals don't resign him is that this should be a good year for guards in the draft and tackles that get converted to guard. Especially the guys that meet their traditional measurements for RG (6'4" to 6'6" and 320 to 350 lbs.). Risner is actually on the lighter side of guards.

Risner has been on 1 year deals since his rookie contract ended. He's never made more than 3 mil in a season so I think he would take 6 mil per year on a multi-year deal. But the Bengals won't structure it properly to protect themselves if his back issues flare up. We know that.

16 minutes ago, sparky151 said:

That would be penny wise and pound foolish. Risner made about a third of Alex Cappa's salary in 2025. And played much better. If we let Risner walk and replace him with a free agent, that player is highly likely to cost more and has a good chance of being a lesser player than Risner. If we try to replace him with a rookie draft pick, that would be repeating the Volson mistake and probably lead to Burrow taking extra punishment as opponents scheme their best rushers vs the rookie.

Or we could, you know pay Risner fair value and move on to fixing the defense. But that's not the Bengals way, to be proactive.

Who thinks other teams will "overpay" for any of the Bengals 2026 free agents? Hendrickson will get a nice contract from some team and my fear is the Bengals will tie their own hands as they wait through free agency to avoid losing the 2027 comp pick for Hendrickson. They could avoid that entirely by doing a tag and trade with Trey but it would be very Bengalesque for them to botch it and let him hit the market, then they miss out on free agents who they can easily afford and who would improve the team because they are determined not to sign as many free agents as they lose so they can keep the 2027 3rd round comp pick they hope for.

Risner has been on 1 year deals since his rookie contract ended. He's never made more than 3 mil in a season so I think he would take 6 mil per year on a multi-year deal. But the Bengals won't structure it properly to protect themselves if his back issues flare up. We know that.

No way the priority is a late 3rd comp pick, right? They're not that backwards.. Are they?

Just like Risner's not really going to get anything like 15 per.. What are these numbers honestly like let's imagine the worst case scenario & throw up our hands? The annual offseason poor-mouthing has begun! How will poor Troywick afford their Easter ham, oh ruin!

20 minutes ago, T-Dub said:

The annual offseason poor-mouthing has begun! How will poor Troywick afford their Easter ham, oh ruin!

Nailed it. The FO doesn’t have to manufacture poor-mouthing…the couch potato “media” and blog sites will do that for them.

Everyone is shit…until they are not. Everyone is a prick…unless they make sub-seven figures. Everyone is replaceable…until the 6th rounder has to do the replacing.

3 minutes ago, Le Tigre said:

Nailed it. The FO doesn’t have to manufacture poor-mouthing…the couch potato “media” and blog sites will do that for them.

Everyone is shit…until they are not. Everyone is a prick…unless they make sub-seven figures. Everyone is replaceable…until the 6th rounder has to do the replacing.

Imagine a Bengals fan taking the side of the FO in any player dispute. Sure thing - Logan Wilson is an asshole but Mixon was out there mag-dumping a motherfuckin' Draco at some neighbor's kid in his suburban backyard & that's cool because he "smiles every day". 🤣

..and people buy into it. Wild.

1 hour ago, T-Dub said:

No way the priority is a late 3rd comp pick, right? They're not that backwards.. Are they?

It would be more like a 7th rounder

52 minutes ago, spicoli said:

It would be more like a 7th rounder

Heh. We get extra ketchup with that at least?

Should probably just admit it and tag Trey. Missed half the season and still tied for 3rd in sacks but yeh he's washed, definitely. Murphy & Ossai are the future. Maybe not a good one, but whatever. Trey is a big jerk for asking to be paid like a top DE. Never mind that the rest of our DL combined couldn't carry his jock. Fuck that guy because Duke fuckin' Tobin says so! 🤡