Nati Ice Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [quote name='Bunghole' post='425816' date='Jan 12 2007, 12:25 AM']So Beckham may sell in excess of 300 shirts?[/quote] dude, they sold over 1000 new season tickets in the first couple hours following this announcements alone. that just netted them a profit of about 500k-600k in a matter of minutes, and i am sure several times that many people will be buying them in the up and coming weeks. in all honesty that place will probably sell out every game (it almost did so already) because of season ticket holders alone. i dont think you people really grasp the size of this signing. the dude does 50 mill in advertising for the likes of gillette, pepsi, adidas, motorola, and some more of the biggest names in the world. he will most doubtable be in commercials all over the place, not just in the us, europe, and the far east, and will be featured in his jersey for plenty of them. hell, mls was just recently picked up by espn and fsc, and im willing to bet the bank that it passes the nhl in the next 5-10 seasons since its already averaging as much, if not more in attendance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nati Ice Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [quote name='#22' post='425821' date='Jan 12 2007, 12:44 AM']MLS drew around 15,000 per game last year over the course of 190 games (http://www.kenn.com/soccer/mls/basic.html). By comparison the worst team in MLB, the Kansas City Royals drew just over 17,000 to each of their 82 home games. The Royals have been consistently bad (finishing at least 15 games back in 10 of their last 11 seasons), and [b]still[/b] averaged higher than all but 3 of the 14 MLS teams (the exceptions were clubs in the two largest cities in the US, and Salt Lake City's team, which can be attributed to the inherently flukey Mormons). The MLS has dropped in attendance by 10% since its inaugural season, and has failed just like all of the attempts at pro soccer in this country before it. In addition, they have already experimented with fundamental changes to the rules, which (according to your perceptions of hockey) is a characteristic deathknell of a sport's popularity. What I'm saying, if it isn't simple enough for you to see, is that you can't build a solid house on a poor foundation. Beckham's introduction into American Soccer will be quite like his wife's brief success-characterized by temporary media hype, then quickly forgotten. Once again, I really don't care. What I do care about is this misconception held by a few prancing elitists in this country that sports sensibilities will degrade far enough to widely accept (or even, as you remarked earlier, endorse more than "American Football") watching a sport on television so boring and devoid of action.[/quote]so let me get this straight, youre initially comparing a league that is only 10 years old to a league that is over a hundred years old, and then pointing out that attendance has dropped when you compare this year to its inaugural season? you cant be serious. mlb is a hundred years in the making and is failing due to steroids and the younger generation not having the patience to watch a game. heres a quick side note, which game was watched more in the united states, game seven of the world series featured on prime time tv with a whole season of buildup and commercials and having both competitors come from the usa, or the world cup final with two foreign teams playing each other int he middle of the day. ill give you a hint, the bigger ball one. it just seems to me that the VAST majority of people in the usa, even the vast majority of people who watch soccer do not know what the hell they are talking about. as ive mentioned before, neither the league or the owners are paying becks that much money, these stadiums allow 100% of the income to be given back to the franchises, these stadiums also host other events which sell out consistently, these players get paid a lot less than the nasl or any other sport and do not need the same kind of profits to sustain them, the owners of the mls could buy and sell the nasl several times over, and most of the owners of other sports teams, and the heads of this league consist of several of the most highly respected businessmen in america. so when you put all of that together, plus the new rules this year that allow for 2 players like becks to be signed per team, uniform advertising rights (millions), and exclusive tv rights to fsc and espn. this league has very little chance of actually failing. the guys who run this league are doing everything that they can to not run it into the ground like the nasl, they are not worried about initial attendance or profits, they are instead focused on the back end and the long term implications of every rule, signing, and strategy formed by their group. the mls will be around for a long time, and like ive said there little chance it ever passes the nfl in sheer numbers, but there is certainly no reason it cant compete with everyone else. it may take awhile but who cares, this league was not created to be a short term sensation, and its owners are not looking for this becks signing or any other big signings to do that. all they are looking for are some bigger names to help spark all of this, just like valderrama, etc. did when the league was an infant (which it technically still is). i just think youre way too focused on the short term here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JC Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 So watching FSC last night...Houston's coach was on and he mentioned Crespo as a interesting prospect he would love to coach. But he is under contract until 2008 so he won't be out of it until he is 33. He was also born in flordia and might have some interest of coming back and playing in the states. Also didn't england not invite beck back for the next WC...if so couldn't he play for the U.S. or some sort of that nature...or would that be just total disloyalty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest #22 Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [quote name='Nati Ice' post='425838' date='Jan 12 2007, 03:14 AM']so let me get this straight, youre initially comparing a league that is only 10 years old to a league that is over a hundred years old, and then pointing out that attendance has dropped when you compare this year to its inaugural season? you cant be serious. mlb is a hundred years in the making and is failing due to steroids and the younger generation not having the patience to watch a game. heres a quick side note, which game was watched more in the united states, game seven of the world series featured on prime time tv with a whole season of buildup and commercials and having both competitors come from the usa, or the world cup final with two foreign teams playing each other int he middle of the day. ill give you a hint, the bigger ball one. it just seems to me that the VAST majority of people in the usa, even the vast majority of people who watch soccer do not know what the hell they are talking about. as ive mentioned before, neither the league or the owners are paying becks that much money, these stadiums allow 100% of the income to be given back to the franchises, these stadiums also host other events which sell out consistently, these players get paid a lot less than the nasl or any other sport and do not need the same kind of profits to sustain them, the owners of the mls could buy and sell the nasl several times over, and most of the owners of other sports teams, and the heads of this league consist of several of the most highly respected businessmen in america. so when you put all of that together, plus the new rules this year that allow for 2 players like becks to be signed per team, uniform advertising rights (millions), and exclusive tv rights to fsc and espn. this league has very little chance of actually failing. the guys who run this league are doing everything that they can to not run it into the ground like the nasl, they are not worried about initial attendance or profits, they are instead focused on the back end and the long term implications of every rule, signing, and strategy formed by their group. the mls will be around for a long time, and like ive said there little chance it ever passes the nfl in sheer numbers, but there is certainly no reason it cant compete with everyone else. it may take awhile but who cares, this league was not created to be a short term sensation, and its owners are not looking for this becks signing or any other big signings to do that. all they are looking for are some bigger names to help spark all of this, just like valderrama, etc. did when the league was an infant (which it technically still is). i just think youre way too focused on the short term here.[/quote] I'm talking about MLS attendance, which has dropped substantially since its inauguration. Soccer is every bit as old as baseball, so I fail to see that comparison. More people watched the World Cup Finals than Game Seven Last year because [i]they only played five games[/i] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/24.gif[/img] The rest of this argument is still just the same old ugly hooker put in a little bit nicer of a dress. The league [b]is[/b] currently failing. It is a financial disaster, only saved by the donations of Lamar Hunt (who just died) and Robert Kraft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Go Tory Go! Posted January 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [quote name='JC' post='425879' date='Jan 12 2007, 09:18 AM']So watching FSC last night...Houston's coach was on and he mentioned Crespo as a interesting prospect he would love to coach. But he is under contract until 2008 so he won't be out of it until he is 33. He was also born in flordia and might have some interest of coming back and playing in the states. Also didn't england not invite beck back for the next WC...if so couldn't he play for the U.S. or some sort of that nature...or would that be just total disloyalty.[/quote] Hernan Crespo was indeed born in Florida, but not the state...it was actually Florida the suburb of Buenos Aires, Argentina. Still, Chelsea owns his contract as he is a 2 year loan to Inter Milan right now, and after his contract expires, it will be unlikely that Chelsea will want a 33 year old striker on the squad, especially with how badly Shevchenko has performed for them in his relatively-elevated age. (If you're looking for a Chelsea-owned striker who would come to MLS, I'd actually put my money on Shevchenko, as his wife, Kristen Pazik, is a model from Minnesota.) When Steve McClaren took over as England's national team manager, he dropped Beckham from the team, as it was well-agreed that young Aaron Lennon outperformed Beckham at the World Cup, and others such as Stewart Downing and perhaps Shaun Wright-Phillips are also capable wingers to play opposite Joe Cole. It is currently unlikely that Beckham will join the team for the European Championships in '08, and even less likely he'll be there in '10; however, under FIFA regulations, a player may play for only one national side, so there is no chance of him playing for the US. What would be nice, however, is if Manchester United's striker Giuseppe Rossi, New Jersey-born but Italian-bred, could be convinced to play for the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JC Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [quote name='Go Tory Go!' post='426137' date='Jan 12 2007, 04:25 PM']What would be nice, however, is if Manchester United's striker Giuseppe Rossi, New Jersey-born but Italian-bred, could be convinced to play for the US.[/quote] Nati said somehting about him...i however haven't heard of him. I thought Man U's strikes still consisted of Rooney and saha. How good is this guy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nati Ice Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [quote name='#22' post='426062' date='Jan 12 2007, 03:13 PM']I'm talking about MLS attendance, which has dropped substantially since its inauguration.[/quote]umm, duh? it was a multi million dollar entertainment investment... of course the initial offerings would draw more people than in the coming years. the mls was never set up to compete with the big 3 in the short term. the goal has always been expansion to 16 teams and league profitability by 2010. in fact, even comparing its current attendance to baseball is absurd and foolish, but i see that apparently you dont think so VVVVVV [quote name='#22' post='426062' date='Jan 12 2007, 03:13 PM']Soccer is every bit as old as baseball, so I fail to see that comparison.[/quote]the age of a sport is entirely irrelevant to any point being presented here, and to be more specific the age of a sport has nothing to do with attendance or profitability within a new leagues infancy. with that type of thinking the professional lacrosse league should be drawing millions by now. [quote name='#22' post='426062' date='Jan 12 2007, 03:13 PM']More people watched the World Cup Finals than Game Seven Last year because [i]they only played five games[/i] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//24.gif[/img][/quote]5-7-32, the point still stands unchanged. sorry, but your little icon did little to disprove the fact that it is true. [quote name='#22' post='426062' date='Jan 12 2007, 03:13 PM']The rest of this argument is still just the same old ugly hooker put in a little bit nicer of a dress. The league [b]is[/b] currently failing. It is a financial disaster, only saved by the donations of Lamar Hunt (who just died) and Robert Kraft.[/quote]wrong, the league is not currently profitable, but is far from failing or in need of a major investor to act as a temporary savior. in fact, mls is doing better than anticipated and many of its clubs became profitable years ago. kraft and hunt started and supported the league a great deal (just like the afl and every other league in the history of sport), but your statements indicating a financial disaster is the most wholly inaccurate statement ive ever seen come out your posts. that is so wrong its laughable and as such, another man probably wouldnt even respond to it... but since i like arguing points to people who know nothing about which they speak, i will go ahead and beat a dead horse. the mls has announced major deals with espn/abc, fsc, fox sports spanish, hdnet, and univision, allowed multi-million dollar jersey sponsorship, increased advertising revenue exponentially, signed a gigantic flagship sponsorship from adidas, seen a 20% increase in season ticket sales over last year in just the 2 months since the season ended (and this is not taking into account the thousands that will be sold simply bc of the beckham signing), increased revenue from merchandising, and built sss that allow all club owned or operated stadiums that not only feature mls games but matches from other international clubs, concerts, american football games, and conventions which allow all, if not most, of its profits to be absorbed by the individual clubs. nearly every single mls team with a sss turns a profit and even some of those without them do the same. the fact that you are even trying to compare this to any other american major league speaks volumes to the amount for which you know on this subject. believe me, you do not know jack squat about this league and its financial standings, and your misguided comparisons have clearly demonstrated that. oh, and by the way, since youre so concerned with attendance number (which are not a very good indicator in terms of profitability), it took the nfl 22 years to get the average attendance up to 16,000 per game and it took them nearly 40 years to get their average attendance up to 40,000 per game, and nearly 50 years to get them up to 50,000... damn, maybe the nfl should have just folded! youre severe lack of foresight leads me to believe that you are either the most fickle person ive ever met, or the least knowledgeable on subjects for which he speaks... i just cant figure it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nati Ice Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [quote name='Go Tory Go!' post='426137' date='Jan 12 2007, 04:25 PM']What would be nice, however, is if Manchester United's striker Giuseppe Rossi, New Jersey-born but Italian-bred, could be convinced to play for the US.[/quote]unless italys manager tells him to suck a dick it wont ever happen... much to the chagrin of all of us usmnt fans he has "dreams" however, kenny cooper is tha truth! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieselman44 Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Beckham's thinking before coming to the US. "You mean to tell me them yankees are gonna pay me(a guy who is riding the bench for Real, because everyone in europe knows hes old) 250 mil over 5 years? They must be crazy. Ill go over to the US kick a couple balls around and act like im trying to popularize soccer in the US. Meanwhile laughing inside that the MLS is THAT desperate. Wow, I think i can hear the real soccer fans in Europe laughing at the MLS, all the way across the Atlantic Ocean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nati Ice Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [quote name='dieselman44' post='426233' date='Jan 12 2007, 05:58 PM']Wow, I think i can hear the real soccer fans in Europe laughing at the MLS, all the way across the Atlantic Ocean.[/quote] for what? a 10 million $ contract, or for being idiots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest #22 Posted January 13, 2007 Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 Yeah, bantering with a retarded OSU fan about a league that will be defunct in 5 years isn't a good use of my time, so I am conceding this thread to those hopeless romantics. But, like the Beckham signing, any sense of victory you feel will be extremely short-lived. As for your weak little TV Ratings point, the World Series brought in a 10.1 share of the ratings, while the FIFA World Cup Final brought in a 7 share. So you'll have to do better than that. Let me part with one final question to all of you who are harping about soccer merchandising, et. al. Do any of you own as much (or more) Soccer Merchandise as you do Baseball/Football stuff? And by the way, your dumb little point about football leaves out this fact: Pro Football was founded in 1920, before Televisions, Merchandising, or [i]any[/i] kind of popular vehicle of support. [quote name='Nati Ice' post='401194' date='Dec 4 2006, 10:00 PM']im pretty sure i have no clue whos being serious in this thread and whos just joking around ohio state should murder florida, and in spite of what may actually happen, anyone who predicts anything less than a 3 point osu win has no feet to stand on.[/quote] And yet you tell me I have no feet to stand on in this thread. hey, maybe you should change your avatar to something a little bit more successful, like LaToya Jackson or the Hindenburg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieselman44 Posted January 13, 2007 Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 Red Alert Red Alert, folks we have a defensive soccer fan!! Im just trying to give a second view on the subject and within the first line of your rant you take a shot at me being a "retarded" OSU fan, your pretty classy. I guess since my sig says im a bengals fan i must be a retarded bengals fan also. Get a life man. My point is Beckham is not being brought into the MLS for his play right now. Everyone who knows anything about soccer knows he is washed up. He is being brought in to be the glorified overhyped face of a league that is desperate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.