sois Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 Come on now, Mexico would be at least 5 or 6 states. We can add a new row to the flag! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bengalrick Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 [quote name='sois' post='499824' date='Jun 13 2007, 02:39 PM']Come on now, Mexico would be at least 5 or 6 states. We can add a new row to the flag![/quote] now that i think about it, the flag would look cooler w/ another row of stars....... [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//39.gif[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sois Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 Alright I got a good idea: Everyone in the US without a SSN would be given a no strings attached work visa. Anyone who uses a service (emergency room, welfare... etc) will now be documented. Workers with visas can now openly apply for jobs and be documented. Businesses don't have to pay SS taxes for these workers. Win win for the workers and businesses. This removes the fear of the workers from getting deported. Workers can now also go to clinics/dr office/dentist... etc instead of the emergency room. This also will show Americans that there is some order to this Chaos and they don't have to fear hiring the cheap labor. Here is the kicker: Since every worker is now documented, when they go to the hospital or jail... etc. we can bill their country for the services rendered. Mike Mexico wants to get a splinter removed at the emergency room? Mexico gets a bill for $2,000. Tyrone Canada can't afford to feed his family this month? Canada receives a bill for $300 bucks or the food stamps Tyrone incurred. Mexico will notice who is productive and who is not. If they notice a freeloader who just went to USA for services, they can come to the US and get them. Otherwise, the bill keeps piling up! What about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 [quote name='sois' post='500426' date='Jun 14 2007, 07:54 PM']Alright I got a good idea: Everyone in the US without a SSN would be given a no strings attached work visa. Anyone who uses a service (emergency room, welfare... etc) will now be documented. Workers with visas can now openly apply for jobs and be documented. Businesses don't have to pay SS taxes for these workers. Win win for the workers and businesses. This removes the fear of the workers from getting deported. Workers can now also go to clinics/dr office/dentist... etc instead of the emergency room. This also will show Americans that there is some order to this Chaos and they don't have to fear hiring the cheap labor. Here is the kicker: Since every worker is now documented, when they go to the hospital or jail... etc. we can bill their country for the services rendered. Mike Mexico wants to get a splinter removed at the emergency room? Mexico gets a bill for $2,000. Tyrone Canada can't afford to feed his family this month? Canada receives a bill for $300 bucks or the food stamps Tyrone incurred. Mexico will notice who is productive and who is not. If they notice a freeloader who just went to USA for services, they can come to the US and get them. Otherwise, the bill keeps piling up! What about that?[/quote] No ex-pat country is going to pay for US healthcare for its ex-citizens. This is a crack pipe dream. Either come into the country legally like my ancestors did, or go home. There is no other [i]legal [/i]option. Companies hiring illegal workers should be fined like crazy. but it will never happen. every un-documented immigrant will be given amnesty, and the companies that hired them will get a fucking tax break. welcome to america. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sois Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 [quote name='WhoDeyUK' post='500438' date='Jun 14 2007, 02:09 PM']No ex-pat country is going to pay for US healthcare for its ex-citizens. This is a crack pipe dream.[/quote] WDUK, what would be the hold up with this? I don't really know why this couldn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 [quote name='sois' post='500444' date='Jun 14 2007, 08:17 PM']WDUK, what would be the hold up with this? I don't really know why this couldn't work.[/quote] You think the country of Mexico would want to pay for the healthcare of people who no longer consider themselves citizens of that country? Please send a sample of whatever you are smoking to WDUK, London, UK. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bengalrick Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 [quote name='sois' post='500426' date='Jun 14 2007, 02:54 PM']Alright I got a good idea: Everyone in the US without a SSN would be given a no strings attached work visa. Anyone who uses a service (emergency room, welfare... etc) will now be documented. Workers with visas can now openly apply for jobs and be documented. Businesses don't have to pay SS taxes for these workers. Win win for the workers and businesses. This removes the fear of the workers from getting deported. Workers can now also go to clinics/dr office/dentist... etc instead of the emergency room. This also will show Americans that there is some order to this Chaos and they don't have to fear hiring the cheap labor. Here is the kicker: Since every worker is now documented, when they go to the hospital or jail... etc. we can bill their country for the services rendered. Mike Mexico wants to get a splinter removed at the emergency room? Mexico gets a bill for $2,000. Tyrone Canada can't afford to feed his family this month? Canada receives a bill for $300 bucks or the food stamps Tyrone incurred. Mexico will notice who is productive and who is not. If they notice a freeloader who just went to USA for services, they can come to the US and get them. Otherwise, the bill keeps piling up! What about that?[/quote] not a bad idea... this HELPS the economy, doesn't hurt either the immigrants or the businesses, and forces countries to increase security out of their country... there are some flaws (like how realistic is it that the country will pay the bill) but if we could get it done, it would be a smart idea... but, when they sign up for the temp worker permit, they will then be on paper... we can't just hand these out to anyone, b/c that is almost equivalent to a free citizenship card (amnesty)... people will just get that, and not worry about being a citizen... most people don't care about voting, and they can get by w/out going to the doctor or hospital, so we will have a similar problem that we have now, by not knowing millions of people names or information... we just know they are here... overall, i like your ideas and i think we should build on them... but one thing i would add is to add a time limit to sign up for the right programs.. after say 2 or 3 years, we need to make it clear that ICE and the national guard are going to start blindly deporting people that don't follow the rules, b/c chances are there is a reason they didn't sign up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bengalrick Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 [quote name='WhoDeyUK' post='500438' date='Jun 14 2007, 03:09 PM']No ex-pat country is going to pay for US healthcare for its ex-citizens. This is a crack pipe dream. Either come into the country legally like my ancestors did, or go home. There is no other [i]legal [/i]option. Companies hiring illegal workers should be fined like crazy. but it will never happen. every un-documented immigrant will be given amnesty, and the companies that hired them will get a fucking tax break. welcome to america. [/quote] thank God for the crazy right and crazy left that stopped that so far (never thought i'd be saying that) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sois Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 [quote name='WhoDeyUK' post='500445' date='Jun 14 2007, 02:21 PM']You think the country of Mexico would want to pay for the healthcare of people who no longer consider themselves citizens of that country? Please send a sample of whatever you are smoking to WDUK, London, UK. Thanks.[/quote] I think it is a billable service like providing energy or technology. Why wouldn't another country pay? Also maybe we could use it to absolve our debt to some of these countries that we owe money to. It gives us a papertrail. I don't think my idea is to give these people citizenship. I don't know what benefits you get from a visa, but my "permit" idea would be for work only. You get to work here and companies get to hire you on the cheap. No voting rights, no land ownership rights ... etc, but you can work, send money home and then go back when you are done. If you want to stay, go through the paperwork, but thats a different subject. If we can bill countries for other things, why not this? I think it would work. It would bring illegals out of the shadows. The will have rights to rent housing, obtain welfair and health care (billable to home country) and help us in the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bengalrick Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 another problem sois is this: its a good idea to not tax the SS on people that are not official citizens, but think about it... some companies will start to specifically look for these types of workers b/c they will automatically pay less to hire them... on top of that, mexican (and immigrant workers in general) will work for less money than most US citizens... it would be a mess when it comes to US jobs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sois Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 [quote name='bengalrick' post='500467' date='Jun 14 2007, 03:12 PM']another problem sois is this: its a good idea to not tax the SS on people that are not official citizens, but think about it... some companies will start to specifically look for these types of workers b/c they will automatically pay less to hire them... on top of that, mexican (and immigrant workers in general) will work for less money than most US citizens... it would be a mess when it comes to US jobs...[/quote] Quota of non-Americans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 [quote name='sois' post='500466' date='Jun 14 2007, 09:04 PM']I think it is a billable service like providing energy or technology. Why wouldn't another country pay? Also maybe we could use it to absolve our debt to some of these countries that we owe money to. It gives us a papertrail. I don't think my idea is to give these people citizenship. I don't know what benefits you get from a visa, but my "permit" idea would be for work only. You get to work here and companies get to hire you on the cheap. No voting rights, no land ownership rights ... etc, but you can work, send money home and then go back when you are done. If you want to stay, go through the paperwork, but thats a different subject. If we can bill countries for other things, why not this? I think it would work. It would bring illegals out of the shadows. The will have rights to rent housing, obtain welfair and health care (billable to home country) and help us in the process.[/quote] Good lord. Sois, I respect you more than you might realize, but damn this is naive. Do you think the US would pay my medical bills if I were forced to go to a hospital here in Europe? Hell no. Then why on earth would you think that Mexico would pay the medical bills of folks who are in the US? Hell, I at least still pay US taxes. Mexican folks across the border aren't sending home tax $$ to Mexico, much less paying them in the US. Why in the hell would the Mexican gov't want to pay for ex-Mexicans' health care costs in the US? This is a wet dream, my friend. I understand where you are coming from, but reality is a bit farther away, unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='Homer_Rice' post='499734' date='Jun 13 2007, 10:21 AM']Why is it that we do not have a problem with illegal immigrants from Canada? The answer to that question indicates the best, and probably only, long-term solution to border control.[/quote] Because there aren't any/many compared to the Mexican border? Is this a rhetorical question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='Bunghole' post='500573' date='Jun 15 2007, 01:01 AM']Because there aren't any/many compared to the Mexican border? Is this a rhetorical question?[/quote] Yes. It is a quick glimpse into the difference in the economies of Mexico and Canada, if I may answer for the sage that is Homer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='Bunghole' post='499291' date='Jun 12 2007, 04:46 PM']Hmmmm...some of that could work, although I hardly see the need for putting 50,000 US troops along the Canadian border, because it's so big that if someone wants to risk getting across for nefarious purposes, they will be able to do so. I think that being steadfast about punishing US employers that employ illegals will do the trick. [size=6]If there are no jobs unless they get documented, they won't come here.[/size] [b]Dangle the carrot of worker's amnesty to get documented and it should fall into place. The immigrants would line up to be legal if they knew that there would be no more work if they remained illegal because nobody could hire them....[/b][/quote] I want to see a response that refutes this, ie, the clampdown on employers that hire illegals, either knowingly or unknowingly, with the impetus that we as a country say "Hey, all you have to do is get an ID card and get fingerprinted, pay into the system that you have become a part of, and everything is hunky dory". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='Bunghole' post='500581' date='Jun 15 2007, 01:07 AM']I want to see a response that refutes this, ie, the clampdown on employers that hire illegals, either knowingly or unknowingly, with the impetus that we as a country say "Hey, all you have to do is get an ID card and get fingerprinted, pay into the system that you have become a part of, and everything is hunky dory".[/quote] You won't find in Bung. You've hit the nail on the head. Once (or should I say if) the gov't acutally targets the Co.s that hire the illegals, the problem goes away. But since both parties are fucking whores for big business, it will NEVER FUCKING HAPPEN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='WhoDeyUK' post='500594' date='Jun 14 2007, 06:17 PM']You won't find in Bung. You've hit the nail on the head. Once (or should I say if) the gov't acutally targets the Co.s that hire the illegals, the problem goes away. But since both parties are fucking whores for big business, it will NEVER FUCKING HAPPEN. [/quote] That, or white teenagers in California give up their I-Pod existence to pick strawberries for $10 an hour. It could happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='Bunghole' post='500604' date='Jun 15 2007, 01:22 AM']That, or white teenagers in California give up their I-Pod existence to pick strawberries for $10 an hour. It could happen.[/quote] I would have loved a $10/hr job as a teen. Hells yeah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='WhoDeyUK' post='500610' date='Jun 14 2007, 06:28 PM']I would have loved a $10/hr job as a teen. Hells yeah.[/quote] I bagged groceries and stocked a supermarket (Winn Dixie) in Texas when I was 16 for exactly $3.35 an hour, which was the minimum wage then. $3.35! Texas! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='Bunghole' post='500637' date='Jun 15 2007, 02:14 AM']I bagged groceries and stocked a supermarket (Winn Dixie) in Texas when I was 16 for exactly $3.35 an hour, which was the minimum wage then. $3.35! Texas![/quote] My lowest paying was $4.25/hr, which was the minimum in 86. Nothing more exciting than working in a food court.... Potomac Mills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='WhoDeyUK' post='500642' date='Jun 14 2007, 07:22 PM']My lowest paying was $4.25/hr, which was the minimum in 86. Nothing more exciting than working in a food court.... Potomac Mills [/quote] The sad part is I know where Potomac Mills is....or used to when I lived there.....outlet whore.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='Bunghole' post='500644' date='Jun 15 2007, 02:23 AM']The sad part is I know where Potomac Mills is....or used to when I lived there.....outlet whore....[/quote] Such a beautiful place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='WhoDeyUK' post='500650' date='Jun 14 2007, 07:28 PM']Such a beautiful place [/quote] Are you disparaging the beauty of the Potomac River? The same river that allowed you Brits to burn the White House in 1812? The same river that killed Lincoln's son Willie with typhoid because Union soldiers assigned to DC were shitting in the water? How dare you! Consider this a formal complaint from The Colonies.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='Bunghole' post='500654' date='Jun 15 2007, 02:34 AM']Are you disparaging the beauty of the Potomac River? The same river that allowed you Brits to burn the White House in 1812? The same river that killed Lincoln's son Willie with typhoid because Union soldiers assigned to DC were shitting in the water? How dare you! Consider this a formal complaint from The Colonies..[/quote] A: Potomac mills is NOT on the Potomac B: Iamnotamotherfuckingbritandyouknowitmotherfucker Can't wait to have a beer with you when I get home Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 [quote name='WhoDeyUK' post='500659' date='Jun 14 2007, 07:44 PM']A: Potomac mills is NOT on the Potomac B: Iamnotamotherfuckingbritandyouknowitmotherfucker Can't wait to have a beer with you when I get home [/quote] You're a Brit, admit it, nay, you're an Aussie displaced in time..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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