Jamie_B Posted December 26, 2007 Report Share Posted December 26, 2007 [quote name='oftt4' post='613885' date='Dec 26 2007, 08:00 AM']How can you say that it isnt? Do you have any year to compare when Palmer didnt have Johnson (gamebreaker) - TJ (strong possession reciever) - etc? It is no coincidence when a QB's numbers are off the charts when they have a Chad Johnson/Terrel Owens/Randy Moss kind of deep threat (see the ridiculous spike in Brady's numbers this year). I think Ben's year this year is more impressive, given the lack of a gamebreaking WR, than Palmer's year was in 2005 (2400 yards and 16 TD's between CJ and TJ). But that is just my opinion. It is called denial. They just cant admit that Ben is a more successful QB than Palmer. Palmer may be more "talented", but talent alone doesnt win you ball games....ask Ryan Leaf (and no I am not saying Palmer = Leaf).[/quote] Ryan Leaf wasnt even talented, its a stupid comparison. And NO BEN is not more successfull than Palmer, the STEELERS have been more successfull thant the Bengals. Where is the denial in that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oftt4 Posted December 26, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2007 [quote name='Jamie_B' post='613917' date='Dec 26 2007, 10:13 AM']he also had a running game last year, we have had I think (im not going to look it up) two games of over 100 yards and both were against bad defenses.[/quote] Jesus. Your running game isnt great, but it isnt like it is the worst of all time. It isnt even the worst this season. 21st in yards per game. 25th in yards per attempt. You guys average the same yards per attempt as Indianapolis, they seem to do ok. [quote name='Jamie_B' post='613918' date='Dec 26 2007, 10:14 AM']Ryan Leaf wasnt even talented, its a stupid comparison. And NO BEN is not more successfull than Palmer, the STEELERS have been more successfull thant the Bengals. Where is the denial in that?[/quote] Ben hasnt been more successful than Palmer? How do you measure success? Because I am pretty sure that you measure it differently than the rest of the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted December 26, 2007 Report Share Posted December 26, 2007 [quote name='oftt4' post='613941' date='Dec 26 2007, 10:54 AM']Jesus. Your running game isnt great, but it isnt like it is the worst of all time. It isnt even the worst this season. 21st in yards per game. 25th in yards per attempt. You guys average the same yards per attempt as Indianapolis, they seem to do ok. Ben hasnt been more successful than Palmer? How do you measure success? Because I am pretty sure that you measure it differently than the rest of the world.[/quote] It isnt JUST the running game, havent I said that all the time. The defense isnt good either. The Colts do have a good defense, we dont. BIG DIFFERENCE. I measure success on an individual basis, and team success on a team basis. Is that really a tough concept for you to grasp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oftt4 Posted January 3, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 [quote name='Jamie_B' post='614056' date='Dec 26 2007, 05:18 PM']It isnt JUST the running game, havent I said that all the time. The defense isnt good either. The Colts do have a good defense, we dont. BIG DIFFERENCE. I measure success on an individual basis, and team success on a team basis. Is that really a tough concept for you to grasp?[/quote] So how do you measure a QB's individual success? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 3, 2008 Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 [quote name='oftt4' post='617944' date='Jan 3 2008, 08:48 AM']So how do you measure a QB's individual success?[/quote] How many times do we have to rehash this argument? Go do a search Ive discussed it before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oftt4 Posted January 3, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 [quote name='Jamie_B' post='617989' date='Jan 3 2008, 10:01 AM']How many times do we have to rehash this argument? Go do a search Ive discussed it before.[/quote] Just give me the cliff's notes version. Is it wins or winning percentage? Nope, because Ben has the advantage. Is it TD%? Nope, because Ben has the advantage. Is it passer rating? Nope, because Ben has the advantage. Is it post season success? Is it championships won? Is it a comparison of best single seasons? Is it NFL records held? Is it a measure of improving their team's record? Nope. I am guessing you measure QB success by quantity...not by quality. Palmer throws 7-8 more times a game, therefore he is more successful...right? Outside of Bengals fans, I dont think I could find a single person who would say that Palmer has had a more successful career (thus far) than Ben. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 3, 2008 Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 [quote name='oftt4' post='618045' date='Jan 3 2008, 11:06 AM']Just give me the cliff's notes version. Is it wins or winning percentage? Nope, because Ben has the advantage. Is it TD%? Nope, because Ben has the advantage. Is it passer rating? Nope, because Ben has the advantage. Is it post season success? Is it championships won? Is it a comparison of best single seasons? Is it NFL records held? Is it a measure of improving their team's record? Nope. I am guessing you measure QB success by quantity...not by quality. Palmer throws 7-8 more times a game, therefore he is more successful...right? Outside of Bengals fans, I dont think I could find a single person who would say that Palmer has had a more successful career (thus far) than Ben.[/quote] Ive coverd all this, and if I was in the argumentive mood I'd rehash it, im not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oftt4 Posted January 4, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 [quote name='Jamie_B' post='618146' date='Jan 3 2008, 01:42 PM']Ive coverd all this, and if I was in the argumentive mood I'd rehash it, im not.[/quote] It's OK. There is really nothing to "cover". There is no way to stretch the facts in order to make Palmer's career appear more successful. Like I've said, he may be more physically talented...but that doesnt necessarily make him the better QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 [quote name='oftt4' post='618594' date='Jan 4 2008, 07:20 AM']It's OK. There is really nothing to "cover". There is no way to stretch the facts in order to make Palmer's career appear more successful. Like I've said, he may be more physically talented...but that doesnt necessarily make him the better QB.[/quote] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/37.gif[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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