LostInDaJungle

With 3 weeks left to go before training camp.... Which one of these scenarios do you see happening first? My guess is that Trey's contract is not going to be the hill they die on. But if Trey is insisting that he has to have multi-year guarantees to suit up this year.... My guess is that they'll work out a way to "pay" him for this year and he'll walk next year. The big question is... Is Trey even interested in making $32M this year with no multi-year guarantees? I think eventually he figures out that it's best for him to keep playing at a high level. The Bengals have the cap space and nowhere else to spend it. I do think Stewart's contract is a hill they will die on. So... The question becomes if Stewart is going to back down. Right or wrong, Katie is not going to let a Rookie tell her what she can and can't do. Plus they have WAY more leverage against Stewart.

It would be less frustrating if it wasn't a pattern of behavior on the part of Katie and Co. Every year it's some camp holdout. Every year we're one of the last to get our rookies signed. I mean - Is the agent the problem? Sure, that's his job. But it's not like other agents aren't problems for other teams. Tee changed agents to find someone more compatible with the Bengals and there was still some teeth pulling. Is Trey just greedy? Then so is Chase, Higgins... The NFL pays out a lot in salary because it makes a lot of money off these guys. Meh. Should Stewart just roll over and accept new language because other teams do it? Sure, maybe, but Mims was the last to sign... Hill didn't go down smooth either. All of the names change in these very similar stories except those of the Blackburn clan. I mean.... Damn. What a run of bad luck, hunh? I guess nice guys really do finish last. What are the odds that both of our RDE's have idiot agents and would rather talk to the media than play football. Why us? Life is unfair. Everyone's judged by their mistakes divided by how much money they make.

You complain just like the rest of us during the season. Some of us just understand that the moves we make in May have a lot to do with us losing to the Patriots in September. Call it "butt hurt" if you must... But I'm not turning on the players I supposedly root for on the weekends, and I'm sure not rooting for our front office to squander what has been the best chance in 50 years of finally winning a super bowl despite ourselves. You've your own lil' "butt hurt" you've been peddling for 30 pages too. So... Pot, meet kettle. Kinda weird to come to a message board and be upset people are talking about things. But you do you.

I'm glad you find it funny. I'm guessing the last 40 years have been a straight up party for ya.

And you can enjoy rooting for the league's 25th ranked defense I guess.

I am glad YOU feel that way. 😆

Good lord. You can't draft a guy at #17 and then go "But you suck so accept this crappy contract." WTF???

Most of those guys weren't even playing by the end of last year when our defense did the dead cat bounce. I hardly even consider that turnover.

Just like it was obvious that Bell was a step slow last year, the learning curve for Stone was also pretty easy to see. In a deep cover system, the responsibility is primarily covering receivers. Perhaps even their top receiver in a cover 2. A single high safety is interchangeable... More of s SS than a true FS. Depending on which side the Offense lines up as strong, that safety has to drop into the box and become a 3rd/4th LB. Combine that with the injuries that we suffered last year... By the time we had our starting DT's back, we we're down to our Backup CB's. Better luck with health alone makes us better. I for one never really bought the whole "Everyone lost all of their talent in one offseason" narrative. Injuries compound. Germaine Pratt can't have as good of a game behind Joe Schmoe as he could DJ Reader. And he's going to look silly passing guys off to Joe's brother playing CB in week 10. I think Jordan Battle is a promising young player... Did Lou not know that Bell was a step slow? If not, why not? The decision to trot out Sam Hubbard on two knees held together with chewing gum? And the defense struggled to a much lesser degree the year prior. He blamed it on "being too complex for a rookie" and then brought in a FS that had only ever played Cover 1? How complex a scheme is this that it takes veterans even over 8 months to understand it? That only Sam Hubbard is smart enough to master "Kill guy with ball". So, bad luck aside... Many of Lou's decisions were headscratchers. Who do you blame if not the coach when a team comes out looking flat and uninspired? Lou got a lot of credit for "bending but not breaking" when guys made big plays for him... But he never captained a top ten defense in yards. He had guys step up in big moments. And it masked some of the flaws. Sam Hubbard doesn't knock a ball out at the one yard line... Germaine Pratt doesn't have a game winning pick... We're having this convo about Lou two years earlier. About how he's still in the lower half of the league in yards allowed every year. Go look at what the margins are... Give up 3 points less a game and you're top ten. Give up 8ypg less in the running game last year and we're the best running defense. We also saw 50 more rushing attempts due to not getting off the field on third down. Lou fielded a middle of the pack defense... If we can get back to that, we're good. It doesn't require a miracle. Golden is at least willing to work with what he has. I would not be surprised at all to see the Bengals come out in a primary 3-4 next year. That's WHY it makes sense to take two MLB's fairly high. I'm not necessarily HOPEFUL that the Bengals defense will be great, but I do look forward to seeing what Golden has for us.

You have a lot more control over your coaches than your players. And when you find a talented player, you need to work to his strengths. You don't draft/sign Mike Vick and then expect him to be a pocket passer. It's easy as a fan to say "Well, Geno should be as comfy in Cover 2 as anything else..." But that's like saying that we could run a Lamar Jackson offense with Joe Burrow. Are you looking forward to seeing slow ass Joe out there running the wildcat? Is Joe Burrow the best in the league if he's running it 8-10 times a game? This is also why the FO needs to pay attention to what their coaches need. We don't know, did Lou endorse signing Stone? Was Stone his first choice or his 10th? And there's also the "Moneyball" aspect. Do you need a LOLB that can do everything? Or do you just need a guy who can rush the passer and defend the run? If so, you can get a less well rounded player for cheaper. At the end of the day, coaches are expected to get the most out of the players on the roster even if they're complete scrubs. It's also worth noting... We talk about the defense lacking talent last year... But they we're being asked to do things that went against what their strengths were. Combine that with our poor injury luck leading to having more guys on the field who are limited in the versatility... If anything was damning about Lou last year... He tried to run the same defense with wildly different personnel.

A few months ago he went 144 when he was supposed to be going 25.

Being petty with your first round pick and hopefully franchise cornerstone is not a wise choice either.

So... Are they not lazy in covering the other 31 teams? https://bengalswire.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/bengals/2025/06/17/bengals-crushed-earned-reputation-contract-standoffs-hendrickson-shemar-stewart/84245705007/ Their history overshadows the fact that Hendrickson signed a short contract extension recently, is 30 years old, was granted permission to seek a trade and has walked back previous holdout threats. Cincinnati’s history also, ironically enough, overshadows the fact that attempting to revise contract leverage, starting with Stewart, is another attempt at modernizing, considering some reporting says the language they want to insert is pretty standard for other teams. The media has always been lazy. This golden age where these guys did leave their office chair is something from Nick at Nite. If that age did exist, you'd need to be in your 80's to remember it. A lazy media will always fall back to what Cincy's reputation is... And this is a team not 15 years removed from having their Franchise QB refuse to play for them for non-monetary reasons. You want fair media.... Bengalswire seems to get that we're victims of our reputation. Paul Dehner takes the team's side quite often because that's his source. Are you mad that ALL Bengals coverage isn't slanted the way you prefer? The Family are Billionaires in a VERY public enterprise. The fact that they can't manage their PR is not good. It's not a sign that they're more down to earth, or more "real". It's more of a sign that the NFL's worst FO doesn't "get it". Are the Bengals losing in the court of public opinion? Yes. Is that fair? I think so. Is the Judge who convicts you unfair when you show up without a lawyer and refuse to speak on your own behalf? Or do you say "What a lazy judge! He should have left his bench and gone and done an investigation! He can't expect me to hire a guy to give him my side of the story!" You've watched MacAfee... They read shit off the wire and then talk about it. That has been "Journalism" since the 80's when people read shit off the wire and talked about it. Now we just have a lot more sources than the AP. Frankly, you're a lil' dim if you think they're doing much else. You think 6 brohams sitting around are supposed to have Katie on Speed Dial? And what would she say if she did answer? How do you know they didn't call her? Adam Schefter is the "rumor" guy. His job is to report juicy rumors... Is it his job to NOT post what an agent tells him because Katie refuses to talk to him? Do you think he's refusing to talk to Katie? The Bengals have an earned reputation and have done nothing to change the narrative. The coverage they get is fair. Everything else is people whining because they're hearing things they don't like.

I asked why. If there's unfair Bengals hate, explain to me why.

I remember when I worked for a newspaper... I was coming back from lunch and there were like 15 Swat vans across the street. I thought, "I work for the local paper! I can just go ask!" So I walked up to the city desk. We had a reporter whose job it was to monitor the police scanner. I'm like "Why are there a ton of police across the street?" Dude goes "Where?" I can hear them all talking on the police radio about it. He grabbed his lil' notepad and ran.

That is a common reaction people have to hearing anything bad about their side. It's the same phenomena that creates the "fake news" dialog. Assuming that 100's of people have some personal beef with Mike Brown, or by extension, the Bengals... If they do, it's because Mike Brown is an asshole. Sure, maybe they don't like us... Because our ownership is so UNLIKEABLE. Sure, Jerry Jones probably finds Mike Brown to be an obstinate prick who cheaps out and collects all that sweet revenue sharing... Because he is. It's not unfair for people to dislike the Bengals when they are unlikeable. Do I think there's some Illuminati conspiracy to... What exactly? Do I think that Paul Dehner, Lance McAlister and Pat McAfee are all in some text chain saying "Guys, lets all spread these lies about the Bengals!" Put down the crack pipe bro. I worked in various forms of news media for 20 years. They're mostly just lazy and incompetent. Paul Dehner is going to be a little more "pro-team" because that's his source... And frankly, this still comes back on the FO for not doing the PR. If it's a "one sided story", it's because the FO refuses to tell their side. They famously don't talk to the media. However, MANY posters like to just sweep all valid criticism of the NFL's most useless FO under that same "fake news" banner. Attack the source, not the reporting. Sure everything they say sounds true... But Pat McAfee said it and he has a dumb haircut. And that guy has never liked the NFL's most incompetent franchise! Fake news! It's not a conspiracy... It's the Bengals having a reputation. They're calling your girlfriend a slut because she's slept with half of Toledo, not because they have some agenda against her purity. I'd be curious... Why? Why do you think "The Media" has it out for Mike Brown and the Bengals? Because they've been historically shitty owners? They just hate small market teams? Revenge of Art Modell? Why? Because they've made themselves easy punching bags for half a century? I'd bet that your reasons are going to be that the Bengals have a BAD reputation. It's earned criticism/hate. And then maybe you'll start to see that it's not a conspiracy - it's something the Bengals FO earned over 40 years. It's a reputation. And you're sitting here going "How dare they keep assuming that the village idiot is going to do idiotic things??" "Fake news, so unfair." "Adam Schefter only talks to agents." This is a team with $32M in cap space who can't decide IF they want to sign the league's best pass rusher. And in the middle of THAT holdout, they decided to play contract games with his replacement. But yes, the Media is sooooo unfair to assume the Bengals are idiots for being in this situation. How dare they call a spade a spade. And somehow... You're in here defending not wanting to sign the league's best pass rusher?? So, explain to me why the Media and the NFL have always had it out for the Bengals in a way that is "unfair". Because I think it's a biggol' serving of cope.

I'm going to hazard a guess that Stewart's team would have no problem giving permission to make that clause public. I'm dying to see the clip of Katie with 15 microphones in her face asking when Stewart will be signed over and over for a half an hour... Then Paul Dehner can "tsk, tsk" about her saying something innocuous.

After YEARS of hating on Carson... Turns out he was right. The Bengals have a history of not getting their best players signed. They have a history of telling Paul Dehner that they've made him a GREAT offer... And so on. Heck the media has been practically apologizing to us for having to tell us how bad our FO is over and over. If you want to blame the media... More power to you. But when something gets stolen, I'm going to look at the guy who has a history of stealing things. And frankly with all of the smoke we've been seeing for... God knows how long... I'm going to think you're kind of a dim bulb for telling me that the Media just made up the fire.

If someone steals your wallet, are you going to accuse the Nun, the Priest, or the Ex-Con? After all, the Ex-Con SWEARS that the Nun did it. He even offered me some crack he'd just bought with some money he "found". Since Carson forced his way out of Cincy, this has been the status quo for the club... Why do you expect people to still have faith that the Bengals know what they're doing? That after numerous players have straight up called them liars over multiple years, why do you expect the Media to blindly trust them? Trey is lying. Stewart is lying. Tee was lying last year, and so was Jamarr. Bates lied, Whitworth is still lying... The only person we can trust is the cold reclusive billionaire who refuses to talk to the media. Got it. Because Katie could clear up this confusion if she cared to... But it seems the club prefers to leak anonymously to Paul Dehner. Heck, their lack of response invites the speculation.

It was discussed in this thread a page or so ago. When the default language of some other contract was shown. You can still earn the gameday checks if you're on the active roster. But it does void the guarantees. Which is important if you pay for a personal trainer, still have to show up to practice... I think the real answer is this - No one outside of the Bengals and Shemar's agent knows the exact wording of the deal. The Bengals have always been very secretive about their contracts, and anything relayed by Shemar's agent is automatically discounted as propaganda. (Although, I think some of the trust placed in the Family telling the truth is BADLY misplaced.) So, if you're Paul Dehner, you go talk to Duke and he says "Oh, heck no. Plenty of teams have default language in their contracts." Adam Schefter talks to Shemar's agent and he says "That's not true. No other team had default clauses like this in their contracts." And we're on the sidelines wondering who to believe. It's worth noting that Stewart is considered a high character guy. 0 off the field issues. He doesn't go skydiving on the weekend.

But it's the implications.... I, for one, am not going to celebrate the system that allows a team to choose a player, bend him over a barrel, and take advantage. Shemar Stewart didn't choose to come to a team that was going to sabotage his career to prove a point. "If he doesn't want us fucking him over by signing a contract, he can choose to get fucked over even harder by not signing a contract" is a shitty way to do business. Especially for someone you hope to have a long and productive relationship with. And what do we gain from fucking him over even harder?? We still lose a much needed first round pick. Not to mention the reputation damage we're currently seeing the effects of. You wonder why the national media "picks on us" and then come in here and defend the stupid and petty BS they do. News flash: The petty/dumb stuff is why they pick on us. It's gotten to the point where they go "Sorry to keep picking on you, but other teams don't do this stuff!" The Bengals are playing a game of chicken that is lose/lose. Well, would be lose/lose if Katie considered not making the playoffs losing. $36M in cap space sounds pretty sweet! Katie will be buying the 90% ground beef this week!

Worth a read: https://defector.com/the-rookie-wage-scale-has-poisoned-the-nfl And THAT is why the rookie wage scale sucks. The cynicism it breeds is contagious. I don’t wanna be an ignorant fan. No NFL diehard does; it’s the original fan sin. So I find myself cheering for my team to draft players who will wildly outperform their contracts, let those players walk before they get too expensive, and then repeat the process into infinity. I love my team’s players but can never be as loyal to them as I once was, because loyalty costs you wins down the road. This is how you get even some non-racist Ravens fans cheering for Lamar to leave town. No sane fan should ever want to lose a player like Lamar Jackson, but the wage scale and its repercussions graft so much additional context onto that relationship that the “love” part becomes almost invisible.

Yes. Save that $32M to pick up a guy who couldn't make another team's roster. Should replace Trey JUST fine.