Jump to content

Most wins in a QB's first 5 years. :-)

bammorrisgotmehigh

Recommended Posts

oftt4 Pro Bowler

oftt4

Posted
Posted
[quote name='Jamie_B' post='728842' date='Dec 1 2008, 09:57 AM']Must be nice to be on a good [b]team[/b].

As far as hof though...

[img]http://blogs.king5.com/seahawks/images/chad%20johnson%20hof%203.jpg[/img][/quote]

Yes, yes. We've been through this.

That good team was 6-10 the year before he got there, had only made the playoffs twice in the previous 6 years, and hadnt won the Superbowl in decades.

Since he got there they are 53-23 in the regular season, 5-2 in the playoffs (only missing the playoffs after he was hit by a car), and have won a SB. Meanwhile he broke several NFL rookie records, several team records, made the ProBowl, and is 8th all time in passer rating.

It must be a coincidence.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Jamie_B Hall Of Fame

Jamie_B

Posted
Posted
[quote name='oftt4' post='728872' date='Dec 1 2008, 12:29 PM']Yes, yes. We've been through this.

That good team was 6-10 the year before he got there, had only made the playoffs twice in the previous 6 years, and hadnt won the Superbowl in decades.

Since he got there they are 53-23 in the regular season, 5-2 in the playoffs (only missing the playoffs after he was hit by a car), and have won a SB. Meanwhile he broke several NFL rookie records, several team records, made the ProBowl, and is 8th all time in passer rating.

It must be a coincidence.[/quote]


Wasnt also that good team full of injuries on the Oline which put them in the spot of being able to draft that high? But then again, injuries never effect the "good teams".
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Jamie_B Hall Of Fame

Jamie_B

Posted
Posted
[quote name='bammorrisgotmehigh' post='728944' date='Dec 1 2008, 03:01 PM']What?[/quote]


What do you mean "what?" you were 6-10 in '03 allowing you to take ben at the #11 spot. Why were you 6-10 in one year and go to be the AFC champ the next? (give me a break that was not all Ben, you had the talent on the TEAM otherwise ben wouldnt have done a damned thing.)

I cant read the scout article without paying for it, but google gave me this...

[url="http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&pwst=1&q=2003+steelers+injuries&start=10&sa=N"]http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&pws...art=10&sa=N[/url]

[quote]"The biggest part of the Steelers' turnaround from 2003 to 2004 was the play of its offensive line. A unit that struggled with injuries and poor play in 2003 .."[/quote]


Offt's trying to convince us that good teams overcome injuries even when its ALOT of injuries, Im saying ... you guys are the "mighty steelers; owners of this division, to which all other teams in it must bow down", if injuries dont matter what happened to you in '03?

Maybe, juuuuuuust maybe Offt is full of it and just wants bragging rights over a beaten up team full of injuries, but saying its a beaten up team full of injuries just doesnt have the satisifying ring to it that he wants.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Jamie_B Hall Of Fame

Jamie_B

Posted
Posted
[quote name='Elflocko' post='728979' date='Dec 1 2008, 03:46 PM']Jen wouldn't be at the top of the list had either Elway or Marino been supplied with a Defense like Jen's got.


[color="#FF0000"]Hell, without that defense Jen wouldn't even be on that list...[/color][/quote]


:shh:
Link to comment
Share on other sites
bammorrisgotmehigh Pro Bowler

bammorrisgotmehigh

Posted
  • Author
Posted
[quote name='Jamie_B' post='728952' date='Dec 1 2008, 04:12 PM']What do you mean "what?" you were 6-10 in '03 allowing you to take ben at the #11 spot. Why were you 6-10 in one year and go to be the AFC champ the next? (give me a break that was not all Ben, you had the talent on the TEAM otherwise ben wouldnt have done a damned thing.)

I cant read the scout article without paying for it, but google gave me this...

[url="http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&pwst=1&q=2003+steelers+injuries&start=10&sa=N"]http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&pws...art=10&sa=N[/url]




Offt's trying to convince us that good teams overcome injuries even when its ALOT of injuries, Im saying ... you guys are the "mighty steelers; owners of this division, to which all other teams in it must bow down", if injuries dont matter what happened to you in '03?

Maybe, juuuuuuust maybe Offt is full of it and just wants bragging rights over a beaten up team full of injuries, but saying its a beaten up team full of injuries just doesnt have the satisifying ring to it that he wants.[/quote]




[img]http://www.corporate-aliens.com/quotes/scarlettohara.jpg[/img]



[b]"As God is my witness, as God is my witness I will never give him any credit!!!They're not going to lick me! I'm going to live through this and when it's all over, He will have no credit! No, nor any of his folk. If I have to lie, steal, cheat or kill! As God is my witness, I will never give him any credit, he will always be a game manager!!!!"[/b]
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Jamie_B Hall Of Fame

Jamie_B

Posted
Posted
[quote name='bammorrisgotmehigh' post='728987' date='Dec 1 2008, 03:59 PM'][img]http://www.corporate-aliens.com/quotes/scarlettohara.jpg[/img]



[b]"As God is my witness, as God is my witness I will never give him any credit!!!They're not going to lick me! I'm going to live through this and when it's all over, He will have no credit! No, nor any of his folk. If I have to lie, steal, cheat or kill! As God is my witness, I will never give him any credit, he will always be a game manager!!!!"[/b][/quote]


Uhm, No Ive said ben is a good qb.

He's just this godsend you guys try to make him out to be.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
oftt4 Pro Bowler

oftt4

Posted
Posted
[quote name='Jamie_B' post='728952' date='Dec 1 2008, 03:12 PM']Offt's trying to convince us that good teams overcome injuries even when its ALOT of injuries, Im saying ... you guys are the "mighty steelers; owners of this division, to which all other teams in it must bow down", if injuries dont matter what happened to you in '03?

Maybe, juuuuuuust maybe Offt is full of it and just wants bragging rights over a beaten up team full of injuries, but saying its a beaten up team full of injuries just doesnt have the satisifying ring to it that he wants.[/quote]

Well, lets look shall we? Lets compare that "improved" OL play:

In 2003, Tommy Maddox was the quarterback. He was 298/519 for 3414 yards in 16 starts. Threw 18 TD's, 17 INT's, was sacked 41 times. The Steelers went 6-10.

In 2004, Ben was the QB. He was 196/295 for 2621 yards in 13 starts. He threw 17 TD's, 11 INT's, was sacked 30 times. The Steelers went 15-1.

Maddox was sacked every 13.7 dropbacks, and that is with the mobility of a drunken sloth.
Ben was sacked every 10.8 dropbacks.

Yet despite Ben's sack percentage being higher, he had a higher passer rating, a higher YPA, fewer INT's, and many more wins.

Doesnt seem like that OL improved at all does it? Seems like it got even worse, and that Ben was able to overcome it.

So, the answer to "what happened to us in 2003" is....Tommy Maddox happened to us.

And I understand that the Bengals are injured. I dont care, every team has injuries. You guys have sung this same song for YEARS. Enough already. You guys have had ONE good season in the past 18 years. Are we to believe that the 17 years of losing are all due to injuries? or is it a fairly obvious pattern?

Bragging rights. That is a laugher. The Steelers have owned the Bengals, with and without Palmer.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Jamie_B Hall Of Fame

Jamie_B

Posted
Posted
[quote name='oftt4' post='729156' date='Dec 2 2008, 08:12 AM']Well, lets look shall we? Lets compare that "improved" OL play:

In 2003, Tommy Maddox was the quarterback. He was 298/519 for 3414 yards in 16 starts. Threw 18 TD's, 17 INT's, was sacked 41 times. The Steelers went 6-10.

In 2004, Ben was the QB. He was 196/295 for 2621 yards in 13 starts. He threw 17 TD's, 11 INT's, was sacked 30 times. The Steelers went 15-1.

Maddox was sacked every 13.7 dropbacks, and that is with the mobility of a drunken sloth.
Ben was sacked every 10.8 dropbacks.

Yet despite Ben's sack percentage being higher, he had a higher passer rating, a higher YPA, fewer INT's, and many more wins.

Doesnt seem like that OL improved at all does it? Seems like it got even worse, and that Ben was able to overcome it.

So, the answer to "what happened to us in 2003" is....Tommy Maddox happened to us.

And I understand that the Bengals are injured. I dont care, every team has injuries. You guys have sung this same song for YEARS. Enough already. You guys have had ONE good season in the past 18 years. Are we to believe that the 17 years of losing are all due to injuries? or is it a fairly obvious pattern?

Bragging rights. That is a laugher. The Steelers have owned the Bengals, with and without Palmer.[/quote]


Ah so now its you who dissmisses articles. Fair enough.

No we've been singing this tune for the past 3, pre-marvin you'll get no argument from me.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
oftt4 Pro Bowler

oftt4

Posted
Posted
I am not dismissing anything. Great QB's can make their OL look better than they are.

Look at the Pats. Last season nearly their entire offensive line made the pro bowl. This season, they pretty much suck ass.

What is the difference? I'll give you a minute to figure it out.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Jamie_B Hall Of Fame

Jamie_B

Posted
Posted
:lol:

So wait, a guy that hasnt started a game since high school was expected to come in and replace a QB that is without a doubt a first ballot hof'er, and not miss a beat?


Are you really this stupid? I cant believe anyone would be, come on admit it you spin things more than a politician.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
oftt4 Pro Bowler

oftt4

Posted
Posted
There is no spin. God, you are friggin pig headed. You call me stupid, yet you obviously have the reading comprehension of a 2nd grader.

I never said the Pats shouldnt miss a beat with Cassel (even though he has done very well).

What I said was....

When Tom Brady was behind center, every offensive lineman was a pro bowler...as in they all made the fucking pro bowl last year.

When Cassel is behind center, the same exact players are considered a liability. Their fans, the media, etc say that the Pats OL is not very good.

So...did their offensive line suddenly become shit...or was it a function of who was taking the snaps? Use your head.

The QB can make an offensive line look better that it really is. Understand now?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
oftt4 Pro Bowler

oftt4

Posted
Posted
Yes, a line can become shit from one year to the next if good players are replaced with bad ones. The Pats have the same starting 5 as last year.

But back to the original point. Sure Ben has a good team around him. So have countless QB's in the past, and none of them have done what Ben is about to do.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WhoDeyThink Super Bowl Champ

WhoDeyThink

Posted
Posted
[quote name='oftt4' post='728872' date='Dec 1 2008, 01:29 PM']Yes, yes. We've been through this.

That good team was 6-10 the year before he got there, had only made the playoffs twice in the previous 6 years, and hadnt won the Superbowl in decades.

Since he got there they are 53-23 in the regular season, 5-2 in the playoffs (only missing the playoffs after he was hit by a car), and have won a SB. Meanwhile he broke several NFL rookie records, several team records, made the ProBowl, and is 8th all time in passer rating.

It must be a coincidence.[/quote]
That was funny when he was hit by a car.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...