cincyjon Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 From the USA today. [url="http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/bengals/2005-05-11-palmer-harrison_x.htm"]USA Today[/url] Copy cats: Palmer, Johnson try to mirror Manning, Harrison By Jim Corbett, Sports Weekly Like the Delta House frat brothers in Animal House, Carson Palmer and Chad Johnson were inspired last Nov. 8 to call for a road trip. Only there was no beer-swilling, car-crashing wildness involved. Carson Palmer and Chad Johnson should be an electrifying tandem for years to come. By Tom DiPace, Sports Weekly and AP Palmer and Johnson took a scouting trip to Indianapolis to watch Colts quarterback Peyton Manning and receiver Marvin Harrison work their telepathic, pitch-and-catch magic against Minnesota's defense. The 230-mile round trip from Cincinnati went a long way toward forging a steel-belted chemistry between one of the NFL's up-and-coming passing combinations. Palmer and Johnson experienced an Indy epiphany. They were inspired to begin audibling on their own, something they hadn't done until studying Manning and Harrison in person on their field trip, and a development that encourages Bengals coach Marvin Lewis. "Those are the two best guys in the league at our positions, the best quarterback and the best receiver," Palmer says. "Watching on film, you don't get to see what happens when those guys go to the sideline. You don't get to see Peyton talking to his linemen or to Marvin on the sideline, going over pre-snap pictures of coverages they're seeing. "It gave us a good perspective on how those guys work so well together. You watch those guys on the sideline, they're never just drinking Gatorade, they're always going over something, always talking about what each other is seeing out there. Those are two guys Chad and I can both emulate." Johnson and Palmer long talked about going to watch Manning and Harrison perform. But after Cincinnati got off to a 3-5 start, the time was right. Johnson contacted Colts running back and fellow Miami native Edgerrin James about getting a couple of tickets, and James hooked up his NFL fraternity brothers. Johnson and Palmer sat among James' family members inside the RCA Dome about 10 rows behind the Colts bench. From that vantage point, they were able to peer under the hood of the high-performance Indianapolis big-play machine. Seven years of practice passes and situational recall under every game condition have resulted in the kind of familiarity that breeds jaw-dropping success: Manning and Harrison have combined for 82 touchdowns, 701 completions and 9,404 passing yards. Only Steve Young and Jerry Rice have collaborated for more touchdowns in NFL history with 85. The Colts beat the Vikings 31-28 as Manning threw for four touchdowns and 268 yards, including a game-high six catches for 81 yards by Harrison. "We just sat there and watched how Peyton and Marvin interact," Johnson says. "There were little hand signals between them. But it was always the eye contact they made before the snap that made the play." Johnson and Palmer were inspired by the level of non-verbal communication between the league's 2004 MVP and his Pro Bowl receiver. "After that trip, Carson and I started to get more on that same page," Johnson says. "We got more into changing our own plays. We did it eight times and went 7-for-8 on third down. "We changed the plays ourselves the way Peyton and Marvin did based on the defense we saw together. That's something we're continuing to work on in the offseason, the eye contact and the hand signals. "It's just a matter of Carson and I gaining more consistency." Palmer is fully recovered from a sprained knee suffered in a 35-28 Dec. 12 loss to the Patriots. That loss ended his inaugural starting season just when he was finding his groove. Palmer and Johnson say this season they'll go through a pregame route tree just like Manning and Harrison do. "Chad and I always had good communication, but we wanted to just grow in our communication," Palmer says. "That's so much of this game. "That opportunity helped Chad and I grow." Lewis attended Manning's workout for NFL scouts at the University of Tennessee before Colts president Bill Polian selected Manning first overall in the 1998 draft. Lewis was struck by Manning's exceptional leadership, work ethic, focus and good-guy nature. The two have kept in touch, and when Lewis named Palmer his starter last April over 2003 Comeback Player of the Year Jon Kitna, he encouraged Palmer to seek out Manning. "I've talked with Peyton a couple of times and encouraged Carson to spend time around Peyton, and I've encouraged Peyton to seek him out when he can," Lewis says. "Peyton's been helpful with that. I told Carson he has a great role model right up the road." Manning, who studied Troy Aikman and Michael Irvin when he joined the league, credits Palmer and Johnson for wanting to get better. "That's two guys who've really taken it the extra mile," Manning says. "That's a great sign of respect for myself and Marvin from Carson and Chad." WANT A QUARTERBACK and a team poised for a breakout season? Look no further than Palmer and the Bengals. The proof is in the steady improvement the 25-year-old Palmer made in the second half of last season; the confidence he gained; the weight he lost and the supporting cast the Bengals return from a second consecutive 8-8 season. Before he suffered that season-ending sprained knee in the third quarter against the Patriots, he was one of four quarterbacks in the league to take every snap through the first 12 games. In his first eight starts last season, Palmer had six TD passes and 10 interceptions. In his final five games, he threw 12 TDs and eight interceptions. If Palmer's passer rating of 96.8 in his last six games had been his rating for the season, he would have ranked fourth in the AFC. Johnson, 27, caught 80 of his 95 passes and seven of his nine TDs last season from Palmer. "Carson was on a roll until he hurt his knee," Johnson says. "We ended up missing the playoffs by the margin of that Buffalo game (a 33-17 loss Dec. 19 the week after Palmer was lost)." The week before his injury, Palmer threw three fourth-quarter TD passes in a 27-26 comeback win against Baltimore's highly regarded defense. Palmer posted a career-high 127.1 passer rating in completing 29 of 36 passes for 382 yards. Johnson had a career-best 161 receiving yards with two of his 10 TD catches. "Last year, his presence in the huddle was like he's been playing the NFL game for 10 years," Johnson says. "Everybody feeds off Carson." He enters his second season as Cincinnati's starter 12 pounds lighter and light years ahead of where he was last year in confidence. The 6-5, 235-pound Palmer played at 247 last season and feels quicker on his feet now. "I had a couple of opportunities later on in the year to make a play outside the pocket where you realize you're capable of doing it," Palmer says. "I had never done it at the NFL level. You're not sure if you can fit certain balls into certain windows on the run until you do it." Palmer played lots of pickup basketball and tennis, ate more chicken and fish and less of his beloved steak. Now he and the Bengals hunger to end Cincinnati's 14-year playoff drought. "The expectations couldn't be higher," he says. "We talk about winning a world championship every single day. There's no reason why we can't. "We had a chance to beat the Patriots. We hung in there with them right to the end. I remember the feeling in the locker room afterward was, 'That team's not better than us.' It came down to us not making mistakes." Palmer continues to go out of his way to foster team chemistry. He still hosts paintball games in the woods behind his suburban Cincinnati home. "We just played paintball yesterday, and I've got a couple of welts from that," Palmer says. "We play pickup basketball every day. It's not always about football. It's about being with the guys and creating a bond that will carry over to the field." AFTER OVERHAULING the Bengals' attitude and their roster while going 16-16 his first two seasons in Cincinnati, Lewis had his strongest offseason. He re-signed Johnson's running mate, T.J. Houshmandzadeh, who had a breakout 73-catch, four-touchdown season. He re-signed running back Rudi Johnson, who rushed for 1,454 yards and 12 TDs. Running back Chris Perry, last April's first-round pick, is recovered from an abdominal strain that limited him to two games. He adds another weapon to an already impressive offense that averaged 23.6 points per game. Then, the defensive-minded Lewis used the draft to patch the gaping hole in the league's 26th-ranked run defense. He used Cincinnati's first two picks on hard-hitting Georgia teammates David Pollack and Odell Thurman. Pollack will likely convert from defensive end to outside linebacker, while Thurman gives Lewis the type of sideline-to-sideline hitter he's missed since he coached Ray Lewis on Baltimore's Super Bowl XXXV championship defense. Suddenly, the Bengals have an immodest trash talker on defense to give Johnson a run for his mouth. "I can honestly say that I feel Cincinnati has the best defense in the NFL right now," Thurman says. "Two of the best defensive players in the draft and (the Bengals) got them both." Lewis tapped into the Bulldog pipeline last April for defensive end Robert Geathers, a fourth-round pick. Geathers produced 3½ sacks and led the defensive line with four passes defended. While scouting Geathers, he took note of the leadership and intensity of Pollack and Thurman. They give Lewis more of the athleticism and physicality he's lacked in a front seven that has often been pushed around in an AFC North ruled the last two seasons by the running games of Pittsburgh and Baltimore. It helps that Pollack and Thurman bring intensity and swagger to the side of the ball that needed more of both. "I told David Pollack and Odell, there's no time for a learning curve," Johnson says. "You're a first-round and second-round pick, I need you to come in and play sound football. They're talking trash already, so that's great. "Now we're solid all the way across the board. We have two Pro Bowl corners in Tory James and Deltha O'Neal, and Madieu Williams is a super athlete back there at safety, and we have Kim Herring, who played on Marvin's Super Bowl defense in Baltimore, at the other safety." FORGET THAT ROAD TRIP to Indianapolis; talking to Johnson is a trip unto itself. The guy who sent a bottle of Pepto-Bismol to each member of the Cleveland Browns' starting secondary before a game against them last season is human Red Bull. Houshmandzadeh, who played with Johnson at Oregon State, says Johnson has so much energy that he reminds him of a 6-year-old who has eaten too much chocolate. Beneath the flamboyant taunts and quotes, there's a hard-working player. Johnson used to sleep at the complex on Thursday nights of game week after watching video until his eyeballs glazed over. Johnson offered last offseason to go to NFL Europe, so he could continue improving. Johnson toned down his end-zone antics and trash talk last season. He has gone to two Pro Bowls in five years and has his sights fixed on a Super Bowl. "Chad Johnson is willing to make sacrifices to be great, and that's important," Lewis says. "It's encouraging to see him do those things." He vowed never again to pull a stunt like his "Pepto abysmal" game, when the stoked Browns held him to three catches for 37 yards in a humiliating 34-17 Oct. 17 loss. "I love Marvin as a coach," says Johnson, who led the AFC with 1,274 receiving yards. "He's somewhat of a father figure to me. We have the right man at the head of this organization. "This year, it's all about reaching the playoffs. We missed the playoffs by one game. If we start fast, we're there." Lewis hired a yoga instructor this offseason to help players develop more flexibility and durability, making every effort to help his team finally reach the playoffs. Johnson has taken third-round pick Chris Henry, a 6-4, 225-pound receiver out of West Virginia, under his wing to accelerate his learning curve. "He's going to join me in Los Angeles at our three-week training camp. It's called, The Phenom Factory," Johnson says. "I told him, 'After July 1, you take three days off and we're going to train together because you have to be able to come in and make a difference right now.' "We're about to do something special around here." Maybe someday other quarterbacks and receivers will be taking road trips to Cincinnati to catch the Palmer-Johnson show. "The sky's the limit for us," Palmer says. "We have all the key people in the right places. "It's time." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-GoBengals- Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 sweet.. very VERY long article though... i have the attention span of a fruit fly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cincyjon Posted May 12, 2005 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 [quote name='GoBengals' date='May 11 2005, 10:57 PM']sweet.. very VERY long article though... i have the attention span of a fruit fly. [right][post="91268"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote] Is long, but gets you pupmed up for whats to come! [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/42.gif[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BadassBengal Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Wow. Nice, NICE long article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jungle1 Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Good stuff. I hope everyone can stay healthy this season. Then, if the D comes together....watch out!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jophis Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 [quote name='GoBengals' date='May 11 2005, 08:57 PM']sweet.. very VERY long article though... i have the attention span of a fruit fly. [right][post="91268"][/post][/right][/quote] um, what did you say- I wasn't paying attention. [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//24.gif[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palmer4HOF Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 I can't believe I read the whole article... but i must say, it got me extremely pumped for this upcoming season!! WHO DEY!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodey365 Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 playoffs baby... here we come. damn i wish i could sleep til august. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals_12th_Man Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Nice read. Good find Cincyjon. I havent heard this much playoff talk with the Bengals in a long time. The last time Bengals and playoffs were mentioned was when the D finished in the top 10 and the offense sparked towards the end of the season. What year was that, 01? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BengalsOwn Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 That is an excellent article. It gave me chills. [quote]The week before his injury, Palmer threw three fourth-quarter TD passes in a 27-26 comeback win against Baltimore's highly regarded defense. Palmer posted a career-high 127.1 passer rating in completing 29 of 36 passes for 382 yards. Johnson had a career-best 161 receiving yards with two of his 10 TD catches.[/quote] I will never forget this game as long as I live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals_12th_Man Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 [quote name='BengalsOwn' date='May 11 2005, 11:38 PM']That is an excellent article. It gave me chills. I will never forget this game as long as I live. [right][post="91320"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote] I was all sulking around at the close of the third... That was an awesome come back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BengalBacker Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 That was a GREAT FUCKING ARTICLE !!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 What an inspiring article! OK, someone has to play party pooper, and it's me! The ONLY issue I had with it was this (with apologies to TJ's twin, BengalsOwn...) "re-signed Johnson's running mate, T.J. Houshmandzadeh, who had a [b]breakout[/b] 73-catch, [b]four-touchdown [/b]season." I guess a "breakout" season for TJ is set by lower standards....4 TD's...phhht... But I nitpick...the article is VERY confidence inspiring and thanks for posting... I'm happy to report that Kitna was NEVER mentioned....again, I nitpick... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BengalsOwn Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 [quote name='Bunghole' date='May 12 2005, 01:41 AM']What an inspiring article! OK, someone has to play party pooper, and it's me! The ONLY issue I had with it was this (with apologies to TJ's twin, BengalsOwn...) "re-signed Johnson's running mate, T.J. Houshmandzadeh, who had a [b]breakout[/b] 73-catch, [b]four-touchdown [/b]season." I guess a "breakout" season for TJ is set by lower standards....4 TD's...phhht... But I nitpick...the article is VERY confidence inspiring and thanks for posting... I'm happy to report that Kitna was NEVER mentioned....again, I nitpick... [right][post="91373"][/post][/right][/quote] Hines Ward has scored 4 touchdowns in 3 of his NFL seasons, including last year, when he went to the pro-bowl. He's about to become the next WR who isn't as good as Chad Johnson to get a contract worth more than Chad Johnson's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Link me, big boy... I bet he's scored more than that...and even if he hasn't, his yardage and reception totals (not to mention his toughness---ewww! Did I just say that about a crying Steeler?) far exceed TJ's.... I knew you'd respond to that....hook, line, sinker.... I was only quasi-serious...I don't hate TJ...he is mediocre but has become important to our offense...I give him props, his biggest asset suddenly has become hanging onto the ball over the middle while sustaining vicious hits..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BengalsOwn Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 [url="http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/WardHi00.htm"]http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/WardHi00.htm[/url] +--------------------------+-------------------------+ | Rushing | Receiving | +----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+ | Year TM | G | Att Yards Y/A TD | Rec Yards Y/R TD | +----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+ | 1998 pit | 16 | 1 13 13.0 0 | 15 246 16.4 0 | | 1999 pit | 16 | 2 -2 -1.0 0 | 61 638 10.5 7 | | 2000 pit | 16 | 4 53 13.2 0 | 48 672 14.0 4 | | 2001 pit | 16 | 10 83 8.3 0 | 94 1003 10.7 4 | | 2002 pit | 16 | 12 142 11.8 0 | 112 1329 11.9 12 | | 2003 pit | 16 | 11 61 5.5 0 | 95 1163 12.2 10 | | 2004 pit | 16 | 7 25 3.6 1 | 80 1004 12.6 4 | +----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+ | TOTAL | 112 | 47 375 8.0 1 | 505 6055 12.0 41 | +----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+ It looks like TJ Houshmandzadeh's 2004 season is about on par with Hines Ward's average season. Hines wants to be paid like Marvin Harrison. TJ is paid very reasonably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Ward has averaged just under 7 TD's per year since 1999! That's 7 seasons! Often with subpar/makeshift QB situations! Look at the yardage and reception totals! There's hardly a comparison! Ward is second-tier WR, TJ is 4th-tier....based on production from MORE THAN LAST SEASON.... As an aside, FUCK Ward, as he's a Steeler.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vedderlax11 Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 [quote name='Bunghole' date='May 12 2005, 02:24 AM']As an aside, FUCK Ward, as he's a Steeler.... [right][post="91389"][/post][/right][/quote] I hope the crying bitch dies... Did I say that out loud? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BengalsOwn Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 My point is, that the argument that TJ had 4 TD's last year is a pretty pathetic argument when trying to prove that he isn't good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vedderlax11 Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Let's face facts here. In our Offense, TJ works well as a #2 receiver. Why complain about him? Is it because he's an Ay-Rab? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalsCat Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Wow I thought that would never end!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//26.gif[/img] haha good read. I cant wait for the season to start... where is my time machine?? just wanna jump ahead about 2-3 months...... Ohh well just gotta make it till training camp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest oldschooler Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 [quote name='BengalsOwn' date='May 12 2005, 01:33 AM']My point is, that the argument that TJ had 4 TD's last year is a pretty pathetic argument when trying to prove that he isn't good. [right][post="91395"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote] You`re comparing how many TD`s a WR (Ward) that had the #1 ranked rushing Offense, AND Roethlisberger, to a WR (TJ) that had CJ and Palmer on the field ? The Bengals played from behind alot and were forced to throw. The Steelers pounded teams with the run and only threw when they WANTED too. If Ward was the Bengals #2 last year I am positive we would have scored more TD`s than TJ did... Anyway great article ! I expect Palmer to set the NFL on fire this year ! [img]http://www.jochen-hinzer.de/fire/images/foto/clay04/03fireworkg.jpg[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CTBengalsFan Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 awesome article. can the season start soon????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalsCat Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 [quote name='BengalsOwn' date='May 12 2005, 03:33 AM']My point is, that the argument that TJ had 4 TD's last year is a pretty pathetic argument when trying to prove that he isn't good. [right][post="91395"][/post][/right][/quote] Yeah 4 td's isnt very good man...... The minute he puts up 10 and 12 td's in back to back seasons i will cut TJ someslack until then he is just a numba 3 getting paid the big bucks....... He needs to score more for us to win games. AND THERE IS NO COMPARISON BETWEEN HIM AND HINES WARD..... As soon as TJ goes to the probowl and catches 2 seasons that look like | 2002 pit | 16 | 12 142 11.8 0 | 112 1329 11.9 [b]12 [/b]| << TD's more then TJ's put up in his carrer go figure | 2003 pit | 16 | 11 61 5.5 0 | 95 1163 12.2 [b]10 [/b]| That i will offical cut TJ as much slack as he wants then Grow my blonde locks into a pony tail and run around like some crazy arbian mutha fucker ala arbian knights style... but intil then.. no no way... TJ is average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 That was a great article. I love the initiative and teamork between Chad, Carson and Chris Henry (Chad taking him under his wing). When's the last time we have heard about stuff like that in Bengaldom?? I loved the line from TJ saying Chad is like a 6 year old on too much chocolate. I am so PUMPED for this season! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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