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Micheal Richards Racial tirade.


Bengals_12th_Man

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"I like using the word 'cracker' a little in my act because alot of black comics use the N word, I like using the C word. Like 'Me and my cracker friends were driving down the street in my Volvo Station Wagon, when I said 'Hey cracker, pass the sun chips.' And he says 'Not til we get to the picnic, cracker.' And I say 'cracker, please.' And he's like 'cracker whaat?' When I said that at a show this black guy came up to me and he was like 'My cracker.' And I was like 'Actually, you can't call me a cracker. Only we can call each other crackers. You can say 'crackA' but not 'crackER.' And he was like 'It's ok, I got white friends and they're cool with it.'"

-Mike Birbiglia
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[quote name='creechnasty' post='392342' date='Nov 22 2006, 05:00 PM']Well i know they can't be crackers.. hence my utter dismay when i said it..
But, in that moment in time, I thought that perhaps everything had come full circle, and racism in all its forms would come crashing down, starting a new age bringing about global harmony.
And you know... even though that probably didn't happen, a part of me, deep down, likes to think it did.[/quote]

I understand completley.
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[quote name='Jamie_B' post='392346' date='Nov 22 2006, 05:01 PM']Show me where anyone said it was. Show me where the original point of this thread had anything to do with "black on white" racism.

The original point of this thread was about Richard's comments and how they were racist, and people, yourself included, are trying to turn it on its ear and make it about "black on white" racism.[/quote]

Mully brought it up and I agreed that it existed. I in no way stated it in defense of what Kramer did.
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[quote name='Tigers Johnson' post='392339' date='Nov 22 2006, 04:59 PM']He said it on the Dan Patrick show....what he said is in the quote I posted which was in the www.profootballtalk.com weekly ten pack and then again in the rumor mill.[/quote]

Ok, again, I have not read or heard the interview, but just speculating.......

I imagine that irvin's comments were a joke. A stupid one but a joke no less. It was some silly ass way of
giving Romo a compliment, by implying that Romo has some "black slave" lineage thus
that explains his positive production on the field.

I doubt ESPN will act on this because if they did, it may cause more problems.

Yes, Irvin should not have went there with the "black slave" thing but keep
in mind Irvin is black himself. The joke that Romo must have had black
people in his family tree can be viewed both ways.... a jab at the slow white athlete
stereotype or a really dumb way of giving Romo a compliment.

Irvin still has inside ties to the Cowboy organization, so he may be pretty cool
with Romo.

Either way if ESPN fires or suspends him, Irvin's defenders would say his firing was because he
implied that a white man could have had a black man in his lineage and his firing is a
message that says ESPN feels it's a insult to say that blacks could be in white people's
family tree.

And then you could have a huge racial shitstorm.

It would be just to dicey to fire Irvin for that.

See where I'm coming from?
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Guest A-Men-HouseofPain

[quote name='Jamie_B' post='392151' date='Nov 22 2006, 11:42 AM']This is stupid, Irvin may or may not have been joking around. But really to say that he just is adding to the "black people can only know music and sports" sterotype.
Now that aside, why is it that word comes up and someone is offended by it, a select crowd always plays the "well you guys do it too" card then proceed to talk about how racism comming from blacks with words like cracker is exactly the same.

Im sorry but its not, yes both are wrong (and I still dont get offended by cracker) but the N word hold more weight and has a far more hatefull history behind it. Is this really so difficult to understand? Perhaps we [b]do[/b] need more than the shortest month of the year to delve into black history in schools.[/quote]
idk what other people are arguing but i could care less about using the word nigger or nigga ever. I think people that use the word (black or not) are dipshits and should increase their intelligence and vocabulary and use something else. There is no point to ever call someone a nigga or nigger. All it does is show a lack of intelligence.


[quote name='bengalrick' post='392291' date='Nov 22 2006, 03:38 PM']i almost don't want to do this and act like a broken record, [b]but fuck it[/b]...

:lmao:[/quote]
:blink: WHOA :o


[quote name='Jamie_B' post='392299' date='Nov 22 2006, 03:47 PM']There is a point to me saying that, and that is that words have power and that sometimes words have more power based in how they are said or who is saying them, and that some words have more power than others. If it was coming from a black guy someone who is reading this thread who is a racist might say "well there goes another case of Angry Black Man" and the words would ring hollow. But Im not black.

Do I know you or know if your a racist? No. The words you use in this thread paint a very disapointing picture of you, (even more so the words you deleted) but your right I dont know for sure. My hope is that you begin to get the point and why you are wrong but I somehow doubt it.
[b]"The Pen Is Mighter Than The Sword."

-Edward Bulwer-Lytton[/b][/quote]
nope.


[quote name='sneaky' post='392322' date='Nov 22 2006, 04:37 PM'][b]Technically, black people cannot be "crackers"..........

However, if they are from the south, talk with a twang, and they like country music or NASCAR,
they can be considered as "graham crackers"[/b][/quote]
:lol: :lol: :lol:

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Guest Coy Bacon

[quote name='Jamie_B' post='391417' date='Nov 20 2006, 11:16 PM']:lol:[/quote]


Contrary to the claim that I saw on a presumedly Jewish site, Richards is evidently not Jewish, so I apologize for calling him a "kike". He was raised Catholic.

Richards is also a 33rd degree Scottish Rite Mason and very involved in studying the philosophy and history of the craft. As such, he must be very aware of, and embrace the anti-black positions of the lodge. Blacks are barred from the lodge. Prince Hall Masonry is considered spurious, and members of the white lodges - who may be almost anything but black - are forbidden from even discussing masonic subjects with Prince Hall masons. When the Massachusetts and Wisconsin lodges proposed initiating exploratory discussions with the Prince Hall lodges, the rest of the white masons in the US threatened to revoke their chartrs.

The Scottish Rite was behind the pro-Confederate activities of the Knights of the Golden Circle, which was founded on the banks of the Ohio in Cincinnati. After the Slave Owners' Rebellion, the Knights of the Golden Circle spawned the Ku Klux Klan. Confederate General Albert Pike was the head of the Southern District of the Scottish Rite (the more powerful division within the rite), and authored "Morals and Dogma", which Richards cites as one of his influences in approaching masonry.

Richards is very deeply involved in a militantly anti-black organization, so he meant what he said. He claims that masonry is responsible for him undergoing a lot of self development. Either it doesn't work or he's a bad student, because even the most ardent black-haters have more self-control to publicly say the things he said as loudly, repeatedly and soberly as he did.

The nice thing about it is that now he's a marked man, and us niggers will be fucking with him for the rest of his life. Oh what fun!

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[quote name='Coy Bacon' post='392420' date='Nov 22 2006, 08:51 PM']Contrary to the claim that I saw on a presumedly Jewish site, Richards is evidently not Jewish, so I apologize for calling him a "kike". He was raised Catholic.

Richards is also a 33rd degree Scottish Rite Mason and very involved in studying the philosophy and history of the craft. As such, he must be very aware of, and embrace the anti-black positions of the lodge. Blacks are barred from the lodge. Prince Hall Masonry is considered spurious, and members of the white lodges - who may be almost anything but black - are forbidden from even discussing masonic subjects with Prince Hall masons. When the Massachusetts and Wisconsin lodges proposed initiating exploratory discussions with the Prince Hall lodges, the rest of the white masons in the US threatened to revoke their chartrs.

The Scottish Rite was behind the pro-Confederate activities of the Knights of the Golden Circle, which was founded on the banks of the Ohio in Cincinnati. After the Slave Owners' Rebellion, the Knights of the Golden Circle spawned the Ku Klux Klan. Confederate General Albert Pike was the head of the Southern District of the Scottish Rite (the more powerful division within the rite), and authored "Morals and Dogma", which Richards cites as one of his influences in approaching masonry.

Richards is very deeply involved in a militantly anti-black organization, so he meant what he said. He claims that masonry is responsible for him undergoing a lot of self development. Either it doesn't work or he's a bad student, because even the most ardent black-haters have more self-control to publicly say the things he said as loudly, repeatedly and soberly as he did.

The nice thing about it is that now he's a marked man, and us niggers will be fucking with him for the rest of his life. Oh what fun![/quote]

Wow, .....interesting indeed. [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/39.gif[/img]
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Guest Coy Bacon

[quote name='sneaky' post='391800' date='Nov 21 2006, 04:25 PM']Reading this thread just makes me realize how much I love my dad, Coy.

:wub:
whodey85,

technically he is your grandpa.[/quote]


Ah! My progeny. The fruit of my verbal loins. I'm so proud.

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[quote name='Coy Bacon' post='392420' date='Nov 22 2006, 08:51 PM']Contrary to the claim that I saw on a presumedly Jewish site, Richards is evidently not Jewish, so I apologize for calling him a "kike". He was raised Catholic.

Richards is also a 33rd degree Scottish Rite Mason and very involved in studying the philosophy and history of the craft. As such, he must be very aware of, and embrace the anti-black positions of the lodge. Blacks are barred from the lodge. Prince Hall Masonry is considered spurious, and members of the white lodges - who may be almost anything but black - are forbidden from even discussing masonic subjects with Prince Hall masons. When the Massachusetts and Wisconsin lodges proposed initiating exploratory discussions with the Prince Hall lodges, the rest of the white masons in the US threatened to revoke their chartrs.

The Scottish Rite was behind the pro-Confederate activities of the Knights of the Golden Circle, which was founded on the banks of the Ohio in Cincinnati. After the Slave Owners' Rebellion, the Knights of the Golden Circle spawned the Ku Klux Klan. Confederate General Albert Pike was the head of the Southern District of the Scottish Rite (the more powerful division within the rite), and authored "Morals and Dogma", which Richards cites as one of his influences in approaching masonry.

Richards is very deeply involved in a militantly anti-black organization, so he meant what he said. He claims that masonry is responsible for him undergoing a lot of self development. Either it doesn't work or he's a bad student, because even the most ardent black-haters have more self-control to publicly say the things he said as loudly, repeatedly and soberly as he did.

The nice thing about it is that now he's a marked man, and us niggers will be fucking with him for the rest of his life. Oh what fun![/quote]


Damn what's next are you guys gonna take his golf courses away? [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/3.gif[/img]
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POSTED 6:51 p.m. EST; UPDATED 7:14 p.m. EST, November 22, 2006

ESPN "SCARED SH-TLESS" ABOUT IRVIN FLAP

An industry insider tells us that the powers-that-be at ESPN currently are "scared sh-tless" about the growing firestorm of criticism regarding Michael Irvin's recent genetics lecture on The Dan Patrick Show.

On Monday, Irvin suggested that the athletic prowess of quarterback Tony Romo of the Cowboys (who by all appearances is a half-shade lighter than Jim Nabors) might be attributable to some African-American ancestry.

Said Irvin of Romo, per our most recent Ten-Pack feature: "He doesn't look like he's that type of an athlete. But he is. He is, man. I don't know . . . some brother down in that line somewhere. . . . I don't know who saw what or where, his great-great-great-great-grandma ran over in the 'hood or something went down."

Recognizing the idiocy of Irvin's comments, Dan Patrick said, "Oh, that's the only way he can be a great athlete?"

"That's not the only way, but it's certainly one way," Irvin said. "If great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great grandma pulled one of them studs up out of the barn [and said], 'Come on in here for a second,' you know, and they go out and work in the yard. You know, back in the day."

As of Wednesday morning, there was quiet outrage in league and media circles regarding Irvin's comments. But now the poop is hitting the propeller, and it's going to be very hard for ESPN to ignore this one.

Mike Freeman of CBSSportline.com, who latest book is advertised on this site, has made Irvin's comments the subject of an entire column.

"I don't call for firings much," Freeman writes. "Not my style. But if racial bomb throwers like Rush Limbaugh are penalized for their insensitive remarks, shouldn't Irvin be?"

Jason Whitlock of AOL has sounded off as well. As have our friends at Deadspin.com, TheBigLead.com, and AOL's Fanhouse.

We know that the looming Thanksgiving holiday could take some of the steam out of this one. But with prominent commentators like Freeman and Whitlock calling Irvin out for his comments, it could be that the time has come to dump the double standard that metes out punishment for racially discriminatory speech in a manner that discriminates on the basis of race.

Meanwhile, we've received more than 200 hundred reader e-mails about this topic, and we'll soon be posting some of them. Many are calling for Irvin to be fired. The guy has gotten away with plenty during his tenure in Bristol, and it's possible that one of the terms of his suspension from last year (when he failed to disclose an arrest for drug paraphernalia) was that his next mistake would be his last.
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Guest Coy Bacon
[quote name='Jamie_B' post='392426' date='Nov 22 2006, 09:05 PM']Damn what's next are you guys gonna take his golf courses away? [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/3.gif[/img][/quote]

All we have to do when we see him is point either at him, away from him, at ourselves, or whatever and yell, "Look! He's a NIGGER!!!!!"

Or we can ask him, "Hey, Kramer! Am I a nigger?"

Or say, "Hey nappy-head mofo, who's a nigger now?"

Or just say, "nigger."

Or say, "You talk; you talk; you talk."

Or just smirk at his ass, or run an index finger down our black cheek and smile.

Or in a restaurant, pick up our fork and point it at our ass, and then laugh and laugh.
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[quote name='creechnasty' post='392347' date='Nov 22 2006, 05:04 PM']"I like using the word 'cracker' a little in my act because alot of black comics use the N word, I like using the C word. Like 'Me and my cracker friends were driving down the street in my Volvo Station Wagon, when I said 'Hey cracker, pass the sun chips.' And he says 'Not til we get to the picnic, cracker.' And I say 'cracker, please.' And he's like 'cracker whaat?' When I said that at a show this black guy came up to me and he was like 'My cracker.' And I was like 'Actually, you can't call me a cracker. Only we can call each other crackers. You can say 'crackA' but not 'crackER.' And he was like 'It's ok, I got white friends and they're cool with it.'"

-Mike Birbiglia[/quote]

Well this got overlooked. This is damn funny. Almost as funny as space shuttle escape pods.

:lol:

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Guest Coy Bacon

[quote name='sneaky' post='392316' date='Nov 22 2006, 04:21 PM'][b]The unwritten rules of today's society.......[/b]

[b]1.[/b]if you make a tasteless joke, insult or critical comment about a race or ethnic group
that you don't belong to, you will be condemned for it.

[i]Example: Micheal Richards, who is a white jew, calls a black member of the audience a "nigger" [b]and
implies that 50 years ago he would have been killed if he tried to heckle a white man.[/b][/i]

[b]2.[/b] If you make a tasteless joke, insult or critical comment about a race or ethnic group, you
will recieve very little scrutiny if any if you belong to the same race or ethnic group.

[i]Examples: Dave Chappelle can do a comedy skit, where a white family has the sirname..."Niggar" and
Jeff Foxworthy can do his "You may be a redneck if....." routine.[/i]

[b]3.[/b] White people will recieve more critisim and scrutiny if they make a tasteless joke, insult
or critical comment about any other race or ethnic group. For these main reasons, (1) white people are
the majority in this country have historically oppressed virtually every other race or ethnic goup. (2) no race
or ethnic group has historically opressed white people in this country, so by contrast, tasteless jokes,
insults or critical comments coming from non-whites, are less hollow and holds less of a "punch" to it.

[i]Example: Read about American History from 1700 to present.[/i]

[b]4.[/b] Non-white people will recieve less critisim and scrutiny if they make a tasteless joke, insult
or critical comment about whites. For these main reasons, (1) white people are
the majority in this country have historically oppressed virtually every other race or ethnic goup. (2) no race
or ethnic group has historically opressed white people in this country, so by contrast, tasteless jokes,
insults or critical comments coming from non-whites, are less hollow and holds less of a "punch" to it.

[i]Example: Read about American History from 1700 to present.[/i][/quote]


That's my boy......er....young man. :thumbsup:

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Guest Coy Bacon
[quote name='Tigers Johnson' post='392150' date='Nov 22 2006, 11:28 AM']7. Michael Irvin Pulls A Michael Richards.

Okay, folks. We're officially confused about this whole racism thing.

We get the part that calls for white guys to be severely punished and/or fired if they make bigoted, ignorant statements. Al Campanis, Rush Limbaugh, Jimmy "The Greek" Snyder.

And the latest chapter in this history of racial prejudice comes courtesy of Michael Richards, whom most people know not as "Michael Richards" but as Cosmo Kramer, the hilarious hipster doofis who lived across the hall from Jerry Seinfeld.

Each made unfortunate statements, and each paid the price.

The best example for present purposes is Snyder, who once quipped (while possibly half in the bag) that blacks are better at sports than whites due to the selective breeding practices of slave owners.

In each case, we agree with the outcry that ensued, although we still think Limbaugh's punishment resulted more from his right-wing beliefs than from the actual content of his comments.

But what of the African-American public figure who makes comments just as idiotic, and arguably as blatantly racist? Why is a pass granted in this regard?

The most recent incident? ESPN's Michael Irvin. Appearing Monday on ESPN Radio's The Dan Patrick Show, Irvin pulled a Jimmy "The Greek" when suggesting that one possible explanation for Cowboys quarterback Tony Romo's strong performance is that one of his ancestors got it on with one of those big man slaves to which Snyder referred nearly 20 years ago.

Said Irvin of Romo: "He doesn't look like he's that type of an athlete. But he is. He is, man. I don't know . . . some brother down in that line somewhere. . . . I don't know who saw what or where, his great-great-great-great-grandma ran over in the 'hood or something went down."

Recognizing the idiocy of Irvin's comments, Dan Patrick said, "Oh, that's the only way he can be a great athlete?"

"That's not the only way, but it's certainly one way," Irvin said. "If great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great grandma pulled one of them studs up out of the barn [and said], 'Come on in here for a second,' you know, and they go out and work in the yard. You know, back in the day."

Irvin likely would claim that he was joking, if the standard that has been applied to white men who have made similar comments were also applied to the Playmaker. He was, after all, laughing through some of his comments.

But does that make the comments any less ignorant, or any less racist? Irvin basically is saying that, when a white man is a great athlete, there must be something out of the ordinary occurring, because the average white man simply can't do the same things that the average black man can.

Can someone please explain to us why Irvin hasn't been fired or suspended or even called out for his comments?

In doing so, please tell us what you think would have happened if Steve Young or Chris Berman or Dan Patrick or any other white guy working for ESPN had uttered the exact same words.
This just adds fuel to the fire...[/quote]


I'd be more than willing to sacrifice Irvin's stupid ass to protect my tactical position. That stupid motherfucker should never let himself feel so comfortable and accepted that the can say shit like that even if he thinks it's innoccuous. If the white folks want to take this particular fool down, more power to them. That'll teach his ass that this shit isn't a game. People are dying behind this shit even today. Quit fucking around.
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Guest Coy Bacon

[quote name='Bunghole' post='392444' date='Nov 22 2006, 09:34 PM'][quote]QUOTE(creechnasty @ Nov 22 2006, 05:04 PM)

"I like using the word 'cracker' a little in my act because alot of black comics use the N word, I like using the C word. Like 'Me and my cracker friends were driving down the street in my Volvo Station Wagon, when I said 'Hey cracker, pass the sun chips.' And he says 'Not til we get to the picnic, cracker.' And I say 'cracker, please.' And he's like 'cracker whaat?' When I said that at a show this black guy came up to me and he was like 'My cracker.' And I was like 'Actually, you can't call me a cracker. Only we can call each other crackers. You can say 'crackA' but not 'crackER.' And he was like 'It's ok, I got white friends and they're cool with it.'"

-Mike Birbiglia[/quote]


Well this got overlooked. This is damn funny. Almost as funny as space shuttle escape pods.

:lol:
[/quote]


That is pretty good.

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Guest Coy Bacon
[quote name='steggyD' post='392284' date='Nov 22 2006, 03:27 PM']Not to get too far off topic here, but back to this Irvin issue. I'm going to change the scenario by reversing roles and substituting athleticism with another parameter:

"Black quarterback" is a good quarterback, isn't he?

Yes, he reads the defense well.

Well, his great-grandmother must've been taken into the home and banged by one of the slave-owners. There's no way he would be smart enough to read the defenses unless he had some of that white blood in him.[/quote]


That's pretty good too - it's also what a lot of people assume. <chuckle>
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Guest Coy Bacon

Oh, dig this. Michael Richards worked for an Army training video production unit in Germany during the Viet Nam war. He produced and directed training films dealing with drug abuse and - you guessed it - race relations. :blink:

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[quote name='Coy Bacon' post='392458' date='Nov 22 2006, 10:01 PM']Oh, dig this. Michael Richards worked for an Army training video production unit in Germany during the Viet Nam war. He produced and directed training films dealing with drug abuse and - you guessed it - race relations. :blink:[/quote]
Where are you getting all this information about him? Masonic Baal worshipper, race relations documentary-maker....?
:o

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[quote name='A-Men-HouseofPain' post='391735' date='Nov 21 2006, 02:21 PM']Side note:

Another beef of mine is what the fuck is up with white people using the term "brotha/brother" so much now. That is a term that I associate with the black population and feel they should use that term instead of "nigga" and now I go around and here all of these retarded ass white kids AND ADULTS!!! using it. It sounds so fucking stupid. If anyone has seen the movie The Squid and the Whale, think about the Tennis instructor. Thats how stupid the use of the term "brotha/brother" by white people is.[/quote]
Hulk Hogan has been saying that for years. I see no problem with it, brotha! :angry:

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[size=5][b]The incident.......[/b][/size]

[center][img]http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Land/4801/Mr_Mackey.jpg[/img]
[b]....and thats why the chicken crossed the road ![/b]

[img]http://www.thehighsign.net/hsimages/mr_hankey.jpg[/img]
[b]Boo! You suck, we want our money back![/b]

[img]http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Land/4801/Mr_Mackey.jpg[/img]
[b]Oh yeah, well 50 years ago pal, they used to flush your kind down the toilet !!![/b]

[img]http://www.thehighsign.net/hsimages/mr_hankey.jpg[/img]
:o

[img]http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Land/4801/Mr_Mackey.jpg[/img]
[b]You're a piece of shit! You're a piece of shit !
Yes I said it, its shocking but now you know what lies underneath.

[/b][img]http://www.thehighsign.net/hsimages/mr_hankey.jpg[/img]
[b]That was uncalled for.[/b]

[img]http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Land/4801/Mr_Mackey.jpg[/img]
[b]The truth hurts, doesn't it you piece of shit !!!![/b]

[img]http://www.thehighsign.net/hsimages/mr_hankey.jpg[/img]
[b]You big head mother fucker, I'll beat yo ass !!![/b]

[img]http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Land/4801/Mr_Mackey.jpg[/img]
[b]Is that a threat? Is that a threat, you fuckin shit![/b][/center]

[size=5][b]The discussion....[/b][/size]

JamieB: That was horrrible

WhoDeyForever: I thought it was pretty damn funny, but it's not funny to make fun of me for getting
thrown out of a movie theatre before the movie starts.

Fulcher33: Mr Mackey was wrong for calling Mr hankey a "shit" but Mr Hankey was wrong for
calling Mr Mackey a "big head". Both remarks were equally racist........MULLY

Amen House of Pain: Why is it ok for Mr Hankey and other Christmas pooh to call each other
"shit" and "sheeot" and substitute teachers like Mr Mackey can't?

Hooky: They control what you call them or say to them, if not, they scream fecisism. At first, it was: Don't call us Shit, we want to be called crap, then don't call us crap, call us ca-ca, make that a dump, make that Poo. Anything else is unacceptable.
It's all about controlling what people say.



Tiger Johnson: What Mr Mackey did was wrong but Mr Hankey should have been the bigger man
and not have called Mr Mackey a "big head".

Coy: Fuck that handkerchief-head Mr. Hanky, I would have called that piece of shit, "A piece of shit" too!!!
thats what that shit gets, paying to see that big water head Amerikkkan son of a bitch!!!

sneaky: If you are a teacher with a large head, then you can get away with calling another teacher
with a large head, a "big head mother fucker" but if you are a teacher with a large head, if you
call some Christmas pooh a "piece of shit", then you will be subject to more scrutiny because it
was the large head people who used to flush the Christmas pooh down the toilet, not the other way
around. :contract:


[size=5][b]The apology.....[/b][/size]


[img]http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Land/4801/Mr_Mackey.jpg[/img]

[b]I want to apologize...........Mmmmmm-Kay?

I am not a fecist..........Mmmmmm-Kay?

I dont know what came over me, I got heckled and I went into a rage and I called
a Mr Hankey, who happens to be Christmas pooh......the S word. For that I am sorry......Mmmmm-Kay?[/b]

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