Guest Bengal_Smoov Posted March 3, 2005 Report Share Posted March 3, 2005 The latest death toll figures for the war in Iraq have 1,500 AMERICAN soldiers dead, that's not counting the wounded. The question is, are the loss of American lives worth it? Do you feel safer now than you did 3 years ago? Bin Laden is still on the loose, there is more anti-America sentiment in the Middle East now than there was 3 years ago, and we still don't have any real homeland security to prevent another terrorist attack. Besides invading Iraq and settling a personal beef with Saddam Hussien, what has the bush adminstration done to secure America except for spending billions of dollars and sending 1,500 young men and women to their deaths? Nothing, we are worse off today then we were on 9/12/01. With this admistration setting their sights on Iran and Syria, it only going to get worse. [url="http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2003/iraq/forces/casualties/"]Click Here.....[/url] I sure know how to make friends, don't I? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatScratchFever Posted March 3, 2005 Report Share Posted March 3, 2005 Funny how CNN fails to mention the positive side to the story (if there is a positive side to US troops getting killed): [url="http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/casualties/2005-03-02-troop-death_x.htm?csp=34"]U.S. Troop deaths fall in Feb.[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted March 3, 2005 Report Share Posted March 3, 2005 [quote name='Bengal_Smoov' date='Mar 3 2005, 11:39 AM']The latest death toll figures for the war in Iraq have 1,500 AMERICAN soldiers dead, that's not counting the wounded. The question is, are the loss of American lives worth it? Do you feel safer now than you did 3 years ago? Bin Laden is still on the loose, there is more anti-America sentiment in the Middle East now than there was 3 years ago, and we still don't have any real homeland security to prevent another terrorist attack. Besides invading Iraq and settling a personal beef with Saddam Hussien, what has the bush adminstration done to secure America except for spending billions of dollars and sending 1,500 young men and women to their deaths? Nothing, we are worse off today then we were on 9/12/01. With this admistration setting their sights on Iran and Syria, it only going to get worse. [url="http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2003/iraq/forces/casualties/"]Click Here.....[/url] I sure know how to make friends, don't I? [right][post="55397"][/post][/right][/quote] So, tell me, how many people died in Detroit and Washinton DC in the past 15 months? Not to minimize the value of the life of 1 American soldier, but 1,500 in a little over a year is pretty damn low. I'm sure there were [b]DAYS[/b] in WWII where more Americans died! But, to answer your question, yes, I feel safer. Not a single successful terrorist strike on American soil SINCE 9-11. Pretty impressive! But, here's what I am curious about. I always thought liberals cared about human rights, and women's rights. I dare say the Iraqi people, and the women in particular, have a LOT MORE rights now THAN THEY EVER HAD!!!! Admit it. It just burns you that it was a Republican behind it all rather than a Democrat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nati Ice Posted March 3, 2005 Report Share Posted March 3, 2005 [quote]So, tell me, how many people died in Detroit and Washinton DC in the past 15 months?[/quote] who cares? that is besides the point and is a whole seperate problem all together [quote]Not to minimize the value of the life of 1 American soldier, but 1,500 in a little over a year is pretty damn low. I'm sure there were DAYS in WWII where more Americans died![/quote] yes, 1500 is miraculous, and i am being serious, for this style of war i am amazed at the actual low amount of u.s. lives that we have lost [quote]But, to answer your question, yes, I feel safer. Not a single successful terrorist strike on American soil SINCE 9-11. Pretty impressive![/quote] i sure dont, and you shouldnt either, there were no connections between 9-11 and iraq, our reason for war is wrong, just admit it, it is now a fact, its not even debatable quit connecting the two, there is no connection, our increased security, if it has even increased which im not so sure of, has little to nothing to do with thsi war [quote]But, here's what I am curious about. I always thought liberals cared about human rights, and women's rights. I dare say the Iraqi people, and the women in particular, have a LOT MORE rights now THAN THEY EVER HAD!!!![/quote] good for them [quote]Admit it. It just burns you that it was a Republican behind it all rather than a Democrat![/quote] you are right, it burns me that a democrat can not take credit for going to a war based on a false pretense that has resulted in the death of over 1500 u.s. soldiers, many soldiers from other nations, as well as a countless number of iraqis you are right, it burns me so that a democrat can not take credit for costing us the lives of 1500 u.s. soldiers in an attempt to free another country you are right, it burns me sooooooo much that a democrat can not take credit for this unneccessary war we freed the iraqis, yyyaaaaaaaaaayyyy for them, yay iraqis, yay iraqi women, yay shiites, yay kurds, yay everyone we have our own problems, and as a result of this war we are now no more secure than we were before the war, and have in fact stirred up more trouble in the proccess i am sincerely happy for the iraqi people, and for the small amount of insurgents that will now get to paradise with allah and there hundred virgins a little bit sooner this war was a sham i am not a liberal, i am conservative in the majority of my beliefs, but this war was wrong and this war is wrong we were mislead and there have been no reprecussions, and nobody has had to pay for this injustice had we gone to war and been told that it was to finish off what gw's daddy didnt do, then i wouldnt have been for it, the same thing goes for if we would have been told that we were going there to free the iraqi people, but the fact of the matter is we were not, we were told this was necessary to capture terrorists and remove the threat comming from iraq, what did they have that could touch us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 [quote name='Nati Ice']quit connecting the two, there is no connection, our increased security, if it has even increased which im not so sure of, has little to nothing to do with thsi war[/quote] Oh, but there is. That is not to say Iraq was responsible in any way for 9-11. They were not. But, here's the thing. With the democracy being established in Iraq, that is ONE LESS PLACE for terrorists to hide. One less nation to be a state sponsor for terrorism. In addition, while the soldiers are in Iraq, middle eastern terrorists are attacking there. Not here! That is preferable. And what about the other middle eastern nations? Qadafi in Lybia has given up his weapons! Syria has pulled out of Lebanon. After 9-11, Bush did not declare war on al-Qaida, but on terrorism. Iraq is part of that war. Deaths in DC and Detroit are to make a comparison. It is a matter of proportion. So, what, if any, reason would be sufficient for you to support this war? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-GoBengals- Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 fuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nati Ice Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 there were terrorists in iraq, but not as many as people believe, most of the people who are now considered iraqi insurgents (terrorists) were not the same terrorists that we were supposedly going after im glad that there will be one less place for terriorists to live i stated my reasoning already, if we said it was to free the iraqi people from a ruthless dictator (saddam) then i would have been fine with it, the problem was that it was not the original reasoning for the war it was a war that was gone about the wrong way and under false reasoning, thats the main problem i have with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRAYCAT Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 I think 1 soldier killed is a shame. BUT! I am glad we have the men and woman we have serving to keep me and you safe so we CAN bitch about this. If we had some of the BS that goes on now back in WII we would have lost setting up democracy in europe,japan,and south korea.Wake the fuck up. This day and age people couldn't handle what our grandparents went through. Give up or ration fuel,food,etc,HELL NO. People couldn't handle giving up use of a cell phone now,or lowering your use of electricity because it might make them miss watching Survivor! 1500 hurts. But it has to be done,there are factions wanting to kill us all if they had the chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bengalrick Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 lets get past the iraq-al quaeda connection... i say there was a connection, but there were many things that caused iraq... it wasn't only wmd's but that was part of it... we know that they had it b/c they have used it, but where it is now, we don't know? but do you think that saddam volunteered to safely dispose and destroy the wmd's? i sure as fuck don't... we went for many reasons: 17 un resolutions (what is the good of threatening, if you never follow through?), wmd's (he was at least telling everyone he had them b/c he thought that would make us think twice about attacking), and not too mention the lack of freedom and human rights that the iraqis were suffering... there were many of things, more than i mentioned, why we went into iraq... but lets get over all that b/c freedom is on the march... lebanon, ukraine, iraq, possibly palestine, and all across the middle east, the dictators are shitting their pants b/c the people are seeing iraqis take the first step of freedom... i thought democrats fought for human rights... we had more reasons than that, but since it was bush and not gore, libs are pissed about the one thing that wasn't true yet... but like i said, do u (anyone against the iraq war) think that saddam destroyed the weapons on his own, or did he hide/transport them somewhere?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nati Ice Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 [quote]but lets get over all that b/c freedom is on the march... lebanon, ukraine, iraq, possibly palestine, and all across the middle east, the dictators are shitting their pants b/c the people are seeing iraqis take the first step of freedom...[/quote] u left out korea, china, russia, and france [quote]i thought democrats fought for human rights... we had more reasons than that, but since it was bush and not gore, libs are pissed about the one thing that wasn't true yet... but like i said, do u (anyone against the iraq war) think that saddam destroyed the weapons on his own, or did he hide/transport them somewhere??[/quote] human rights was not the reason for the war i met gore... i wanted to smack him i dont think he had them, he had mustard gas and things of that nature, thats about it, do we have any evidence of him possesing anything else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRAYCAT Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 You right Rick. The one thing I think Bush and I hope we as a nation is looking at in the big picture if we can plant the seed of freedom in one country(iraq) maybe just maybe the others will see and say hey this is ok for me and my family and a domino effect would occur..Syria backing out of lebanon? who would have thought. Elections in afganastan,who knew 5 yrs ago? We started freedom in 1776,why should we stop and just let others suffer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 Yeah and the city of Cincinnati is on pace for the same amount of deaths as Bahgdad [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/27.gif[/img] Might be safer in Bahgdad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRAYCAT Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 [quote name='Storm' date='Mar 3 2005, 09:37 PM']Yeah and the city of Cincinnati is on pace for the same amount of deaths as Bahgdad [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/27.gif[/img] Might be safer in Bahgdad! [right][post="55952"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote] That's because we have a weakass city council and they are afraid they may offend the criminals if the law is enforced as it should be. [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/3.gif[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 [quote name='STRAYCAT' date='Mar 4 2005, 02:40 AM']That's because we have a weakass city council and they are afraid they may offend the criminals if the law is enforced as it should be. [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//3.gif[/img] [right][post="55958"][/post][/right][/quote] Aint that the truth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest steggyD Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 With the latest news on Grand Central Terminal in NYC, I'm a little frightened, but not really. I just kind of think about it. The people responsible for the bombings in Madrid had maps of Grand Central. I go into Grand Central almost daily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest oldschooler Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 [quote name='Nati Ice' date='Mar 3 2005, 08:32 PM']u left out korea, china, russia, and france human rights was not the reason for the war i met gore... i wanted to smack him i dont think he had them, he had mustard gas and things of that nature, thats about it, do we have any evidence of him possesing anything else? [right][post="55943"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote] The reason for the war was to make Saddam [b]finally[/b] comply. [b]After[/b] 9/11 we gave Saddam an ultimatum....[b]HE[/b] took it as a bluff. We went to War over intelligence that OTHER COUTRIES HAD TOO. The [b]entire[/b] Congress (Democrats and Republicas) declared War on Iraq. [b]Saddam[/b] could have avoided all of this ...why do people keep overlooking those [b]FACTS[/b] ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bengal_Smoov Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 The issue of whether or not Saddam possessed WMD's has already been decided, he didn't. A 1,000+ member investagative body said no and their sole purpose was to find WMD's and they found nothing. The truth is Bush lied about the reasons for going to war and our soldier are dying becuase of his lying. Democracy can't be forced on people by the barrell of an invading armies gun, it must come from a movement within the country. It's very arrogant of the US to assume that every country wants to be a democracy, not everyone wants be apart of the western civilization. To compare this invasion to WWII is crazy, the circumstances are completely different. My issue is my didn't we focus on capturing the man we said was responsible for 9/11 instead of attacking a country with whom our president has a personal grudge against. Bin Laden should have been the focus and we shouldn't hvae deviated from him until he was captured, toppling Saddam has only increased terrorism in the middle east. Since everyone is so glad Iraq is a demcracy, how do you feel about the man that was elected? Here's a guy who won't shake hands with women and has ties to Iranian terrorist organizations, is that what our soldiers are dying and getting wounded for? Democracy for the worlds oppressed nations shouldn't come at the expense of American lives, it's not our price to pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalsCat Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 LMAO... they didnt find any WMP BECAUSE THEY PROVED THEY WERE CARTED OFF BEFORE WE GOT THERE INTO ANOTHER HOSTILE COUNTRY>>> FUCKING KERRY TRIED TO SAY WE LOST THEM RIGHT BEFORE THE ELECTION.. << u dont remember any of that.... bush loses 90 tons of high explosive << WHICH IS A WEAPON OF MD>.ohh wait they were illegaly summgled out of the country Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalsCat Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 Say Something... WHAT WHAT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 [quote name='Bengal_Smoov' date='Mar 4 2005, 11:15 AM'][b]The issue of whether or not Saddam possessed WMD's has already been decided, he didn't. A 1,000+ member investagative body said no and their sole purpose was to find WMD's and they found nothing.[/b] The truth is Bush lied about the reasons for going to war and our soldier are dying becuase of his lying. Democracy can't be forced on people by the barrell of an invading armies gun, it must come from a movement within the country. It's very arrogant of the US to assume that every country wants to be a democracy, not everyone wants be apart of the western civilization. To compare this invasion to WWII is crazy, the circumstances are completely different. My issue is my didn't we focus on capturing the man we said was responsible for 9/11 instead of attacking a country with whom our president has a personal grudge against. Bin Laden should have been the focus and we shouldn't hvae deviated from him until he was captured, toppling Saddam has only increased terrorism in the middle east. Since everyone is so glad Iraq is a demcracy, how do you feel about the man that was elected? Here's a guy who won't shake hands with women and has ties to Iranian terrorist organizations, is that what our soldiers are dying and getting wounded for? Democracy for the worlds oppressed nations shouldn't come at the expense of American lives, it's not our price to pay. [right][post="56230"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote] Well, if you want to claim that Bush "lied", then so did John Kerry, Al Gore, Bill Clinton, Ted Kennedy, and a host of other people, including Europeans, and the UN, [b]ALL OF WHOM HAVE SAID AT ONE TIME OR ANOTHER THAT SADDAM DID HAVE WMD!!![/b] Thus the [b]17[/b] UN resolutions. It just so happens that we (the USA) finally decided, in a post 9-11 era, that it was time to ENFORCE those resolutions. While it is true that we haven't FOUND any WMD yet, I still believe it is too early to say he didn't have them. By the way, we are still after Bin Laden. We have made huge progress in Afghanastan. We haven't forgotten about Osama, just the main stream media has, because they can't give Bush any free, positive publicity. They focus on Iraq because they know people out there want reason to hate Bush, and they want to give them every reason to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bengal_Smoov Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 [quote name='BengalsCat' date='Mar 4 2005, 10:19 AM']Say Something... WHAT WHAT [right][post="56234"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote] Patience is a virture. If that is the case then why didn't we go after them, since that is what we were after to begin with. I honestly never heard of 90 tons of explosives being smuggled out of Iraq, do you have a link to an old article? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalsCat Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 [url="http://forum.go-bengals.com/index.php?showtopic=439&hl="]http://forum.go-bengals.com/index.php?showtopic=439&hl=[/url] <<< WMD THERE BUDDY! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 Smoov: In answer to your question, yes I feel safer. I had asked my Dad about this (he used to be an intelligence officer in the Army in Vietnam--twice--) very thing and his response was: "The intelligence community doesn't broadcast their successes. When they accomplish thwarting a threat, you never hear about it. It is only when there is an intelligence failure that you hear about it." Take it for what it's worth. As for Iraq: We could argue all day abour the reasoning behind this war. I look at it as a come-one, come-all open invitation for terrorists from all over the Middle East to take their best shot at the US military, and they have, and we kicked their asses. Our military is accomplishing much--but the media doesn't report any of it. Ultimately, reasons for going aside, this "new Iraq" will be a better place than what they had before--improved infrastructure, better schools, free elections and no walking , talking, raping human-rights-violator named Saddam running the show anymore. The majority of Iraqis support what's been happening. And so so I. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 [quote name='oldschooler' date='Mar 4 2005, 08:32 AM']The reason for the war was to make Saddam [b]finally[/b] comply. [b]After[/b] 9/11 we gave Saddam an ultimatum....[b]HE[/b] took it as a bluff. We went to War over intelligence that OTHER COUTRIES HAD TOO. The [b]entire[/b] Congress (Democrats and Republicas) declared War on Iraq. [b]Saddam[/b] could have avoided all of this ...why do people keep overlooking those [b]FACTS[/b] ? [right][post="56209"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote] Great post! How quickly people who don't want to hear the truth forget this "big nugget" of information! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted March 4, 2005 Report Share Posted March 4, 2005 [quote name='bengalrick' date='Mar 4 2005, 11:10 AM']since this thread is starting to lean towards, "is giving more money to the school systems, the solution or the problem?" i found this article: [url="http://www.freedomworks.org/newsroom/press_template.php?press_id=1015"]freedomworks.org[/url] how should we spend the extra money? [right][post="56322"][/post][/right][/quote] Did you mean to post this in the "As The Dollar Drops..." thread? I think you're getting so passionate arguing with Smoov that you're getting your posts mixed up, my dude... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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