|Bunghole| Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 [url="http://www.wimp.com/thegovernment/"]http://www.wimp.com/thegovernment/[/url] Anyone want to poke some holes in this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Elflocko| Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 Homer arrives in 5, 4, 3, 2,.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRAYCAT Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 Speaks the truth and what we are heading for. Thanks Bung. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted February 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 [quote name='Elflocko' post='746590' date='Feb 14 2009, 09:44 PM']Homer arrives in 5, 4, 3, 2,.... [/quote] I know it's overly simplistic...but what I want to know from Homer is whether or not he thinks its basically true...because I do. The parallel between the USA as a republic and Rome as a republic is certainly obvious. Whether or not we go the way of Rome is the question. Nuclear weapons kind of slowed down the erosion of superpowers. If you have them, you are one. Sort of. I am interested in Homer's take. I know it's a stupid video, but I think it's essentially correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted February 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 Any other enlightened minds want to chime in? BJ? #22? GTG? BengalMigration? JamieB? GoBengals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRAYCAT Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 [quote name='Bunghole' post='746801' date='Feb 15 2009, 08:35 PM']Any other enlightened minds want to chime in? BJ? #22? GTG? BengalMigration? JamieB? GoBengals?[/quote] Seems like we are heading down the same path Bung. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 I watched it when you posted it, ill touch on it some tomorrow, for now i'm in wind down no thinking mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted February 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 [quote name='Jamie_B' post='746803' date='Feb 15 2009, 08:45 PM']I watched it when you posted it, ill touch on it some tomorrow, for now i'm in wind down no thinking mode.[/quote] So....business as usual then? [quote name='STRAYCAT' post='746802' date='Feb 15 2009, 08:45 PM']Seems like we are heading down the same path Bung. [/quote] Mutually assured destruction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRAYCAT Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 [quote name='Bunghole' post='746806' date='Feb 15 2009, 08:51 PM']So....business as usual then? Mutually assured destruction?[/quote] Afraid so. Greed will be the downfall for us all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalBacker Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 Seems to me we are, and probably always have been an oligarchy under the guise of a republic. We can vote for whichever candidate "they" give us to choose from. That's probably inevitable though, and in some ways ironically it might be for the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalBacker Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 In other good news, [url="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090216/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/lt_venezuela_referendum"]Chavez forever[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 [quote name='Bunghole' post='746801' date='Feb 16 2009, 11:35 AM']Any other enlightened minds want to chime in? BJ? #22? GTG? BengalMigration? JamieB? GoBengals?[/quote] Sorry I'm slow to the party... I'm in the middle of migrating again Pretty thought provoking video, Bung. I'm inclined to agree with you.. seems to be a pretty accurate reflection of recent history, if not an outright prediction of the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRAYCAT Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 [quote name='BengalBacker' post='746835' date='Feb 16 2009, 01:18 AM']In other good news, [url="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090216/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/lt_venezuela_referendum"]Chavez forever[/url][/quote] bet BJ would love that.....dictatorship at best just like cuba. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTBengalsFan Posted February 17, 2009 Report Share Posted February 17, 2009 My knowledge of Roman history is rather lacking, so I think Homer could be helpful here. But I know that the [url="http://www.unrv.com/early-empire/pax-romana.php"]Pax Romana[/url] occurred during the Roman Empire. I can't say I know much about the Roman Republic, however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted February 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2009 I'm just simply curious as to whether anyone disagrees with thie video's contention, which is, there are really only two forms of government and the rest of the terms are window dressing. I've been hearing and force-fed "Fascism" all my life...now I am to believe that they don't represent the far right as commonly upheld, but just another form of oligarchy? Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bengal Migration| Posted February 17, 2009 Report Share Posted February 17, 2009 [quote name='Bunghole' post='747061' date='Feb 17 2009, 02:26 PM']I'm just simply curious as to whether anyone disagrees with thie video's contention, which is, there are really only two forms of government and the rest of the terms are window dressing. I've been hearing and force-fed "Fascism" all my life...now I am to believe that they don't represent the far right as commonly upheld, but just another form of oligarchy? Interesting.[/quote] Welcome to propaganda. OMG the liberals/fascists/communists/terrorists are going to take our freedoms unless you bend the fuck over and let the oligarchy get further entrenched. Nothing but bullshit. The only dominoes that are falling are the rights of the average citizen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer_Rice Posted February 17, 2009 Report Share Posted February 17, 2009 This is part 2 of a four part series done by the John Birch Society. Specifically on this one: for a brief treatment, it's pretty good. I more or less agree with the faulty "spectrum" criticism in the intro, but I'd caution people not to confuse ideology with where one might wish to place that ideology on a "map." Better to dig in on the ideologies themselves without encumbering oneself with a bunch of "left-right" confusion. For those who are not aware, the left-right business comes from the seating arrangement in France's [i]Parlement[/i] around the time of the French Rev. A fairly arbitrary beginning for something that has taken on ponderous weight. Want to explore a little more deeply, but in a way that is not too much of a burden? The video cites Madison's famous Federalist #10, which is about the dangers of faction. But a reading of the entire Federalist Papers would serve two purposes. First, it would be getting a "horse's mouth" argument for our form of government from (mostly) two of the prime movers in the drive to create the Constitution. (Throw in a little John Jay, too.) Some people kind of poo-poo the Fed Papers because they didn't get wide distribution at the time, but they went through a number of editions in book form in the early Republic and were pretty widespread and influential in that form. Plus they generated a lot of "word-of-mouth" and snail mail among influentials of the time. Second, this may come as a surprise, but you'll get a nice history lesson from both Madison and Hamilton. They review a lot of history in the early numbers (before they go through the Constitution itself) and so you'll get a lot of ancient history as seen from their perspective. Also some more modern examination of Venice, the Dutch, etc... A nice double-bonus, imo. Further, they are pretty accessible. Short essays, not too complicated reading; if you read one a day you would finish in less than three months. I recommend Henry Cabot Lodge's version, printed in the 1880s. He provides a very nice introduction and textual history. This may be my bias showing, but I think if folks are interested in the tyranny-oligarchy-democracy dynamic, you would be better served reading up on the Greek city-states, especially Athens. It's more explicit in Greek history. There are any number of books that'll explore the topic well and there are also the Herodotus/Thucydides/Xenophon histories which are more or less a sequence worth following. Quickly off my bookshelf, these two are pretty good: The Emergence of Greek Democracy: 800-400 BC by W.G. Forrest The Greek State by Victor Ehrenberg In my view, the notion of a republic and a dedication to the "rule of law" is critical to understanding this nation. Sometime earlier, in a thread on this board, I referenced Plato's "Laws," which he referred to as the 2nd best form of government. Somewhere out there, can't remember the specific title now, John Adams makes this connection and elaborates on it. I think it may have even been pre-Constitution era, if my memory serves. As for the Roman Republic, that more or less died around 130 BC when the Gracchi brothers were murdered. It took another 80 years or so to completely kill it off. And yes, the Pax Romana was during the Empire period. The Romans were fair innovators, but not great original thinkers, which is one reason why I recommend going to the Greeks. Oh, and of course: Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus>Society of Cincinnati>City of Cincinnati Another interesting way to approach the topic. Don't be surprised if good ole LQC turns out not to be the sort of fellow you were taught about in the fifth grade... . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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