Biggest Needs seem to be OL, S, LB

[MichaelWeston]

Who are they? Please give insight

From Walter Football

T
Anthony Costanzo-BC
Derek Sherrod-Miss St
Joseph Barksdale-LSU (Like him the most from what I have read)
Darius Morris-Temple
Gabe Carimi-Wisconsin
Matt Reynolds-BYU

G
Mike Pouncey-Florida (C)
Marcus Cannon-TCU
John Moffitt-Wisconsin

C
Stefen Wisniewski-Penn State
Kristofer O'Dowd-USC

If we could trade down and some how end up with Barskdale and Pouncey that would cure alot of things on offense

On D
OLB
Travis Lewis-Oklahoma
Bruce Carter-NC
Von Miller-Texas AnM
Akeem Ayers-UCLA
Greg Jones-Mich State

MLB
Quan Sturdivant-NC
Chris Marve-Vandy

S
Duenta Williams-NC
Rahim Moore-UCLA

[akiliMVP]

Barksdale is not a good player. He's the typical unathletic college lineman who has a ton of experience but doesn't translate well to the NFL. He's more of a late round pick at this point.

Castanzo and Sherrod are the consensus #1 and #2. I have Sherrod #1 because he's a better run blocker. I also like DeMarcus Love from Arkansas. Good size and could also be a guard.

For the guards I really like Marcus Cannon from TCU. He's huge and mows bitches down with his strength. Would be a good replacement for Bobbie. Rodney Hudson from Florida State is arguably the #1 guard. He's got everything you want except size. Pouncey is a good player when he's not snapping the ball. Won't have to worry about that at guard though.

Center wise Kris O'Dowd and Steven Wisnieski are 1 and 2. O'Dowd has every tool to be an elite NFL center, he just can't stay healthy for shit. Wisnieski has been a guard to PSU this season and from what I've read hasn't been very impressive.

On defense I like Akeem Ayers from UCLA. Good size and is a playmaker from the strong side. Don'ta Hightower from Alabama could be a MLB or SLB. No coverage skills at all but a helluva pass rusher. Carter, Lewis and Jones are all weakside guys at the next level. #1 MLB is probably going to end up being Martez Wilson from Illinois, if he declares.

Wouldn't be surprised or disappointed if the top pick is an end. Looking to be the deepest spot in the draft and there should be a few good ones at the top of round 1. Robert Quinn from UNC is a physical marvel, Bowers is the most well rounded pass rusher and run stopper, Clayborn is very Justin Smith like (not a bad thing), Heyward fits more into a 3-4 but is a damn good player.

[JC]

We could fix the line by trading down for a late first rounded early 2nd rounder (Hello New England) and grab Pouncey, O'Dowd, and Greg Jones with our first three picks.

How sweeeet that would be.

[Jason]

Agree that O-line is one of the top 2 needs. But I would have pass rushing DE, and possibly WR over S and LB.

[MichaelWeston]

[quote name='Jason' timestamp='1288121560' post='934891']
Agree that O-line is one of the top 2 needs. But I would have pass rushing DE, and possibly WR over S and LB.
[/quote]

We dont even have talent at S or LB, we have talent at both WR and DE.

[MichaelWeston]

Interesting take on Barksdale. Here is what Walter Football has on him http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2011jbarksdale.php

I added Love but he seems a bit similar to someone we all know pretty well...per walter

Demarcus Love, OT, Arkansas
Height: 6-5. Weight: 315.
Projected 40 Time: 4.96.
Projected Round (2011): 3-4.
10/2/10: Love is a developmental tackle at the next level. He has the physical tools, but he gets out of control and has no balance. He doesn't know how to use his hands, has bad instincts and has poor footwork.

So guys to watch would be
T
Anthony Costanzo-BC v Clemson @ noon
Derek Sherrod-Miss St v Kentucky @ 7
Joseph Barksdale-LSU (Like him the most from what I have read) Bye
Darius Morris-Temple v Akron @ 1
Gabe Carimi-Wisconsin Bye
Matt Reynolds-BYU
DeMarcus Love-Arkansas v Vandy @ 7

G
Mike Pouncey-Florida © v Georgia @ 3:30
Marcus Cannon-TCU v UNLV
John Moffitt-Wisconsin Bye

C
Stefen Wisniewski-Penn State v Michigan @ 8
Kristofer O'Dowd-USC v Oregon @ 7

[Bengals1181]

I'd change the priorities some. This team needs to build a dominant oline and dline. LB is not a top 3 need. Safety is a need, but the lines are bigger needs. Also need a big physical WR to groom.

[MichaelWeston]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1288135899' post='934954']
I'd change the priorities some. This team needs to build a dominant oline and dline. LB is not a top 3 need. Safety is a need, but the lines are bigger needs. Also need a big physical WR to groom.
[/quote]

I am going to have to disagree here. We have both of our WR's and gaping holes at MLB and S. I would love to get a WR but you don't start working on a broken arm when you have a gaping chest wound. DE we have 2 potential studs.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1288136648' post='934957']
I am going to have to disagree here. We have both of our WR's and gaping holes at MLB and S. I would love to get a WR but you don't start working on a broken arm when you have a gaping chest wound. DE we have 2 potential studs.
[/quote]


you have 3 players on the team who can play MLB. Plus, LB's look infinitely better behind a solid dline. As for the WR's, I don't think they're a huge need, but you still have to prepare for the future. In two years both Chad and TO are gone, if not next year.


Games are won in the trenches. The Dline is losing us games and the oline is keeping them from being a dominant offense.

[Jason]

[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1288132674' post='934947']
We dont even have talent at S or LB, we have talent at both WR and DE.
[/quote]

Two of our talented WRs are both over 30, one is on a one year contract and the other would be in an option year, and is not playing well. NONE of the other WRs on the roster are even close to a #1.

The "talent" we have at DE is generating [b]ZERO[/b] pass rush. That, not LB is the biggest problem we have on defense right now.

As for safety, I would really like to see what Reggie Nelson can do at FS, and I think Crocker would make a decent SS. Plus a healthy Gibril Wilson wouldn't be bad.

At LB, Rivers has played better this year, and Maualuga is playing out of position. I also think either MJ or Muck would be fine at SAM. Or a good SAM could be found in later rounds.

[akiliMVP]

My early rankings:

[u][b]Quarterback[/b][/u]
1. Andrew Luck, Stanford *
2. Jake Locker, Washington
3. Ryan Mallet, Arkansas *
4. Blaine Gabbert, Missouri *
5. Nick Foles, Arizona *

[u][b]Runningback[/b][/u]
1. Mark Ingram, Alabama *
2. Mikel Leshoure, Illinois *
3. Ryan Williams, Virginia Tech *
4. DeMarco Murray, Oklahoma
5. LaMichael James, Oregon *

[u][b]Wide Receiver[/b][/u]
1. A.J. Green, Georgia *
2. Julio Jones, Alabama *
3. Michael Floyd, Notre Dame *
4. Jonathan Baldwin, Pittsburg *
5. Ryan Broyles, Oklahoma *

[u][b]Tight End[/b][/u]
1. Kyle Rudolph, Notre Dame *

[u][b]Offensive Tackle[/b][/u]
1. Derrek Sherrod, Mississippi State
2. Anthony Castonzo, Boston College
3. Tyron Smith, Southern Cal *
4. Matt Reynolds, Brigham Young *
5. DeMarcus Love, Arkansas

[u][b]Offensive Guard[/b][/u]
1. Rodney Hudson, Florida State
2. Marcus Cannon, Texas Christian
3. Mike Pouncey, Florida

[u][b]Center[/b][/u]
1. Kris O'Dowd, Southern Cal
2. Steven Wisniewski, Penn State

[u][b]Defensive End[/b][/u]
1. Robert Quinn, North Carolina *
2. Da'Quan Bowers, Clemson *
3. Adrian Clayborn, Iowa
4. J.J. Watt, Wisconsin *
5. Cameron Heyward, Ohio State

[u][b]Defensive Tackle[/b][/u]
1. Marcel Dareus, Alabama *
2. Nick Fairely, Auburn *
3. Stephen Paea, Oregon State
4. Jared Crick, Nebraska *
5. Drake Nevis, Louisiana State

[u][b]Outside Linebacker[/b][/u]
1. Akeem Ayers, UCLA *
2. Aldon Smith, Missouri *
3. Bruce Carter, North Carolina
4. Travis Lewis, Oklahoma *
5. Von Miller, Texas A&M

[u][b]Inside Linebacker[/b][/u]
1. Don'ta Hightower, Alabama *
2. Martez Wilson, Illinois *
3. Greg Jones, Michigan State
4. Quan Sturdivant, North Carolina
5. Nate Irving, North Carolina State

[u][b]Cornerback[/b][/u]
1. Patrick Peterson, Louisiana State *
2. Prince Amukamara, Nebraska
3. Brandon Harris, Miami FL *
4. Aaron Williams, Texas *
5. Ras-I Dowling, Virginia Tech

[u][b]Safety[/b][/u]
1. Rahim Moore, UCLA *
2. Mark Barron, Alabama *
3. DeAndre McDaniel, Clemson
4. Deunta Williams, North Carolina
5. Jeron Johnson, Boise State

[MichaelWeston]

Love JJ Watt. Every year I have a hand full of players I really want. Shipley and Collie fell into that group. Justin Tuck long ago. Jordy Nelson too (for self disclosure that I am wrong at times ). I am leaning toward Watt being that guy for me this year. His motor is always running, is a great story. coming from nothing so you know he will always work hard. Would love to nab him and see what his influence could be on Johnson and Dunlap.

[Bengals1181]

I really like Watt too.


I wouldn't be too down on Jordy Nelson. I think his biggest issue is that Green Bay has too many other weapons. I think he'd flourish somewhere else.

[Jason]

[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1288148481' post='935002']
Love JJ Watt. Every year I have a hand full of players I really want. Shipley and Collie fell into that group. Justin Tuck long ago. Jordy Nelson too (for self disclosure that I am wrong at times ). I am leaning toward Watt being that guy for me this year. His motor is always running, is a great story. coming from nothing so you know he will always work hard. Would love to nab him and see what his influence could be on Johnson and Dunlap.
[/quote]

I thought you said we didn't need a DE?

[MichaelWeston]

[quote name='Jason' timestamp='1288194240' post='935095']
I thought you said we didn't need a DE?


[/quote]
I simplified it for this thread, but in another thread I stated that I thought it was a second tier need, after LG/LT, S and LB. I think we have talent there but have not had production. At the other spots we have no talent. Also if DE is as loaded as people say, and Watt performs as badly as I assume he will in drills at the combine we could be talking about a 3rd round pick maybe? This post was meant to be for the upper tier guys. I dont want to spend a higher draft pick on a DE when we have other more gaping holes.

http://forum.go-bengals.com/index.php?showtopic=57152

Tier A: LG/LT, S, SLB
Tier B: G, C, DE
Tier C: QB, FB (Got talent but questions exist)
Tier D: Blocking TE, WR

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1288198488' post='935115']
I simplified it for this thread, but in another thread I stated that I thought it was a second tier need, after LG/LT, S and LB.
[/quote]


This team is talented enough in areas that if you build up the offensive and defensive lines, the other holes are second tier needs.

The LB's have talent, but don't have a good dline in front of him. WR/TE/QB/RB positions are all good enough currently to win, though WR needs depth for the future.

Safety is a need certainly, but I'd like to see what Nelson and Wilson (who's back next year) can do along with Crocker and Duke.

Resign JJ and you're set at corner.


As for the Dline, Geathers is a shell of himself, Odom may be a shell of himself, Rucker's a backup, Fanene's a quality backup, Tank's having a bad year, Peko's not as good as we thought he was, Atkins is promising, and Sim's isn't consistent. Dunlap and MJ have the talent but aren't performing.

Nothing on the Dline is settled, and IMO no starter outside of maybe Peko should feel their job is safe. Even Peko I think isn't the stud we thought he'd become.

Oline, Whit is a good LT but would be a better LG. Livings looks great sometimes and really bad others. Andre I think will be ok but could lose another 10-15lbs. Bobbie is over the hill. Cook isn't too bad. Depth behind the starters is awful outside of Collins.


Fix the lines and everyone else will look a lot better.

[MichaelWeston]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1288201540' post='935134']
This team is talented enough in areas that if you build up the offensive and defensive lines, the other holes are second tier needs.

The LB's have talent, but don't have a good dline in front of him. WR/TE/QB/RB positions are all good enough currently to win, though WR needs depth for the future.

Safety is a need certainly, but I'd like to see what Nelson and Wilson (who's back next year) can do along with Crocker and Duke.

Resign JJ and you're set at corner.


As for the Dline, Geathers is a shell of himself, Odom may be a shell of himself, Rucker's a backup, Fanene's a quality backup, Tank's having a bad year, Peko's not as good as we thought he was, Atkins is promising, and Sim's isn't consistent. Dunlap and MJ have the talent but aren't performing.

Nothing on the Dline is settled, and IMO no starter outside of maybe Peko should feel their job is safe. Even Peko I think isn't the stud we thought he'd become.

Oline, Whit is a good LT but would be a better LG. Livings looks great sometimes and really bad others. Andre I think will be ok but could lose another 10-15lbs. Bobbie is over the hill. Cook isn't too bad. Depth behind the starters is awful outside of Collins.


Fix the lines and everyone else will look a lot better.
[/quote]


Interesting, certainly persuasive. Completely agree on offense and on defense I am persuaded slightly. To be honest on D I think its a scheme over personnel aspect.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1288208446' post='935145']
Interesting, certainly persuasive. Completely agree on offense and on defense I am persuaded slightly. To be honest on D I think its a scheme over personnel aspect.
[/quote]


I don't know so much about scheme, but I will say that Dline coaching is an issue.


In re-watching the Falcons game, not a single dlineman uses anything other than a bull rush. In Fact, Pat Sims is the only one I've seen use a spin move all year (and damn it was beautiful too).

[MichaelWeston]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1288208619' post='935148']
I don't know so much about scheme, but I will say that Dline coaching is an issue.


In re-watching the Falcons game, not a single dlineman uses anything other than a bull rush. In Fact, Pat Sims is the only one I've seen use a spin move all year (and damn it was beautiful too).
[/quote]

That was all Justin Smith would do, and I agree. What exactly are they working on when the rest of the team is working on Timing, etc. "OK guys line up and bull rush again"

[The Scales]

Since pretty much everyone but me thinks we should keep the quarterback I'll play your game and go... with these guys - the big and bold in particular.

[quote name='akiliMVP' timestamp='1288147174' post='934999']
My early rankings:



[b][size="5"][u][b]Defensive End[/b][/u]
1. Robert Quinn, North Carolina *
2. Da'Quan Bowers, Clemson *
3. Adrian Clayborn, Iowa
4. J.J. Watt, Wisconsin *
5. Cameron Heyward, Ohio State[/size][/b]

[u][b]Defensive Tackle[/b][/u]
1. Marcel Dareus, Alabama *
2. Nick Fairely, Auburn *
3. Stephen Paea, Oregon State
4. Jared Crick, Nebraska *
5. Drake Nevis, Louisiana State

[u][b]Outside Linebacker[/b][/u]
1. Akeem Ayers, UCLA *
2. Aldon Smith, Missouri *
3. Bruce Carter, North Carolina
4. Travis Lewis, Oklahoma *
5. Von Miller, Texas A&M

[u][b]Inside Linebacker[/b][/u]
1. Don'ta Hightower, Alabama *
2. Martez Wilson, Illinois *
3. Greg Jones, Michigan State
4. Quan Sturdivant, North Carolina
5. Nate Irving, North Carolina State


[/quote]

[Bengals1181]

Robert Quinn please.

[MichaelWeston]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1288266447' post='935243']
Robert Quinn please.
[/quote]

Is Quinn one of the NC headaches?

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1288270063' post='935257']
Is Quinn one of the NC headaches?
[/quote]


wouldn't really call it a headache, but we all know you're the pinnacle of morals. In light of recent revelations about what goes on with College athletes, he didn't do anything that 30% of the players in the NFL didn't also do.

[bengaled]

the position no one seems to be considering....DT.

i don't know who i'd say to select at this point, but if that fairely kid from auburn keeps up the pace he's on, he'd be hard to pass up if he were on the board when we pick. i think our DL is without doubt our biggest concern. i'm not so certain a disruptive tackle that could play all three downs and get consistent penetration wouldn't improve everyone up and down the line and result in a good building block. i've seen a lot of QBs stepping up in the pocket on this defense in the last two years. a lineup of dunlap, atkins, fairely, and MJ/fanene could get to the QB with consistency on passing downs. for all we know, odom makes a complete return next year adding even more DE depth. it's probably too much to ask for, but a two round draft of nick fairely and gabe carimi, the big OLT from wisconsin would certainly change the status of both our lines and give us a helluva good start in next year's draft.

[Bengals1181]

I definitely think DT is a need at some point. Tank has having a bad year, and I like Peko, but he's never going to be a dominant DT. It would great if Sims played to his potential.


I still think they need to go DE before DT though. Robert Quinn is going to be a beast. I want him as a Bengal.