Lewdog Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Mike Wallace poodles now trending world wide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1329695300' post='1097311'] it has nothing to do with him "helping to fuck over the only team he ever knew". It's about as a player getting the most for your services as you can. If that's not the stealers, he may just move on. It's a business, and its about money. Personally I'm not a fan of that side of the sport and wish there was more loyalty, but that's not the case. If it comes down to $2.75 million guaranteed from the stealers or $20 million guaranteed from another team, he's going to take the latter, and I don't think he's going to feel bad at all that he signed a deal that the stealers couldn't match. If the stealers want him that bad, they'll clear up the space to keep him, or they'll let him walk. By tendering him and not signing him to a new deal prior to the march 5th deadline, they are taking that chance. You think justin smith or eric steinbach felt bad about the deals they took? [/quote] You are again assuming he can't get 20 million guaranteed from the Steelers. That has been my discussion point the entire time. You are building a straw man and then tearing it down. You dont see the glaring difference between Justin Smith and Mike Wallace. Smith was offered more money at another location. If it comes down to it and someone offers more money Mike Wallace is probably going to go for sure and that would be similar to Smith. Now in this instance he is fucking over his previous team not by leaving for more money, but by signing a contract that is frontloaded so they can't match. He is in affect using rules to ensure that he leaves his old team. People who want to leave their old teams do that. Now your discussion about the team signing him only offering a high amount if it is frontloaded to ensure they get him is a great point, here I was just responding to the differences between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewdog Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1329696189' post='1097324'] You are again assuming he can't get 20 million guaranteed from the Steelers. That has been my discussion point the entire time. You are building a straw man and then tearing it down. You dont see the glaring difference between Justin Smith and Mike Wallace. Smith was offered more money at another location. If it comes down to it and someone offers more money Mike Wallace is probably going to go for sure and that would be similar to Smith. Now in this instance he is fucking over his previous team not by leaving for more money, but by signing a contract that is frontloaded so they can't match. He is in affect using rules to ensure that he leaves his old team. People who want to leave their old teams do that. Now your discussion about the team signing him only offering a high amount if it is frontloaded to ensure they get him is a great point, here I was just responding to the differences between the two. [/quote] No you are missing the point. The Steelers CAN get $20 million but they only have a certain period of time to do it once he signs the tender, and they HAVE to have the money freed up front before he signs it. They are already way over the cap and have to cut quality players to get where they can even sign draft picks. With a huge offer they are going to be cutting into the core group of players to keep one guy. It's not going to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CougarQuest Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1329696189' post='1097324'] You are again assuming he can't get 20 million guaranteed from the Steelers. That has been my discussion point the entire time. You are building a straw man and then tearing it down. You dont see the glaring difference between Justin Smith and Mike Wallace. Smith was offered more money at another location. If it comes down to it and someone offers more money Mike Wallace is probably going to go for sure and that would be similar to Smith. Now in this instance he is fucking over his previous team not by leaving for more money, but by signing a contract that is frontloaded so they can't match. He is in affect using rules to ensure that he leaves his old team. People who want to leave their old teams do that. Now your discussion about the team signing him only offering a high amount if it is frontloaded to ensure they get him is a great point, here I was just responding to the differences between the two. [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1329696189' post='1097324'] [b]You are again assuming he can't get 20 million guaranteed from the Steelers. [/b]That has been my discussion point the entire time. You are building a straw man and then tearing it down. You dont see the glaring difference between Justin Smith and Mike Wallace. Smith was offered more money at another location. If it comes down to it and someone offers more money Mike Wallace is probably going to go for sure and that would be similar to Smith. Now in this instance he is fucking over his previous team not by leaving for more money, but by signing a contract that is frontloaded so they can't match. He is in affect using rules to ensure that he leaves his old team. People who want to leave their old teams do that. Now your discussion about the team signing him only offering a high amount if it is frontloaded to ensure they get him is a great point, here I was just responding to the differences between the two. [/quote] [color=#ff0000][size=8][b]BECAUSE HE CAN'T[/b][/size][/color] [size=3]I don't know if you're trying to troll or what, but its really not that difficult and at this point its like you're purposely ignoring the point. As evidenced by you completely misconstruing the whole justin smith point.[/size] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewdog Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1329698553' post='1097334'] [color=#FF0000][size=8][b]BECAUSE HE CAN'T[/b][/size][/color] [size=3]I don't know if you're trying to troll or what, but its really not that difficult and at this point its like you're purposely ignoring the point. As evidenced by you completely misconstruing the whole justin smith point.[/size] [/quote] What if the Omaha Nighthawks offer him a contract for less than the Steelers and Wallace refuses to sign the Steeler's tender in order to play for them? Does the contract the Nighthawks offer have to follow the rules of the NFL CBA? Can the Nighthakws put a poison pill into it's contract saying that if Wallace plays the Bengals twice a year he gets $1 Zillion guarenteed so that the Steelers can't afford to sign him? This could really be a benefit to all the UFL teams out there if they can use poison pills in their contracts with players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1329698553' post='1097334'] [color=#ff0000][size=8][b]BECAUSE HE CAN'T[/b][/size][/color] [size=3]I don't know if you're trying to troll or what, but its really not that difficult and at this point its like you're purposely ignoring the point. As evidenced by you completely misconstruing the whole justin smith point.[/size] [/quote] As long as its not a roster bonus he can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1329699335' post='1097336'] As long as its not a roster bonus he can. [/quote] at least we know now that you ARE just trolling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1329699757' post='1097338'] at least we know now that you ARE just trolling. [/quote] Im not trolling. You are assuming more then is assumable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewdog Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1329701070' post='1097342'] Im not trolling. You are assuming more then is assumable. [/quote] We have been saying for the last 50 posts that it only applies to a roster bonus that is worded to count against the first year of the contract. JUST now you are saying you understood that yet kept going on like you didn't. If that isn't trolling then what was it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Lewdog' timestamp='1329701211' post='1097343'] We have been saying for the last 50 posts that it only applies to a roster bonus that is worded to count against the first year of the contract. JUST now you are saying you understood that yet kept going on like you didn't. If that isn't trolling then what was it? [/quote] You are assuming that the only thing he will possibly sign is a contract with a roster bonus. I think thats wrong. We shall see what happens but I expect some apologies from you little bitches when that time comes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Numbers| Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 In regards to Mike Wallace, I was wondering if it occured that Dwayne Bowe WR with the KC Chiefs is a possibility ? KC may be under the cap but they are also trying to keep Brandon Carr CB. They may lose one or the other but probably not both. If the Chiefs were in negotiations with Routt that would mean Carr might be on his way out. However, if the Chiefs keep Carr and bring in Routt, that might mean Bowe is on his way out... Is it also possible the Bengals are driving up the price on Routt to make Carr's contract that much larger and by default forcing the Chiefs to deal ?... Just curious. Mike Wallace seems like an afterthought when driving up the price on Bowe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewdog Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1329701574' post='1097344'] You are assuming that the only thing he will possibly sign is a contract with a roster bonus. I think thats wrong. We shall see what happens but I expect some apologies from you little bitches when that time comes. [/quote] You assume the sun will rise tomorrow...you assume that the season will start this year...you assume that Mike Wallace won't just quit the NFL for a career in dog grooming, since he loves poodles so much...you assume Ben Roethlisberger won't rape Wallace in the showers putting Wallace on injured reserve with a torn rectum. You sir are assuming more than any of us, and you know what happens when you assume? You keep trolling and annoying the fuck out of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Numbers' timestamp='1329701777' post='1097346'] In regards to Mike Wallace, I was wondering if it occured that Dwayne Bowe WR with the KC Chiefs is a possibility ? KC may be under the cap but they are also trying to keep Brandon Carr CB. They may lose one or the other but probably not both. If the Chiefs were in negotiations with Routt that would mean Carr might be on his way out. However, if the Chiefs keep Carr and bring in Routt, that might mean Bowe is on his way out... Is it also possible the Bengals are driving up the price on Routt to make Carr's contract that much larger and by default forcing the Chiefs to deal ?... Just curious. Mike Wallace seems like an afterthought when driving up the price on Bowe. [/quote] They are going to hae to make a big decision on Carr v Bowe. Would not mind going after either guy. What kind of offense will the Cheifs be running? How important will the WRs be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldcat Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 That might be an interesting strategy - sign Wallace to a contract that the Steelers can match, but with difficulty. That way they are in cap hell, and you don't have to give up anything. Of course, you take the risk of having to pay that contract yourself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Numbers| Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1329702451' post='1097349'] They are going to hae to make a big decision on Carr v Bowe. Would not mind going after either guy. What kind of offense will the Cheifs be running? How important will the WRs be? [/quote] Romeo Crennel (interview on 15th of February) [quote] CRENNEL: “I think some of it will be the same, but I think Brian [Daboll] will add his touch to it. He’s already said that he wants to attack a little bit more, so I think that probably in his game plan he’s going to devise [b]ways to try to get the ball down the field maybe a little bit more often than we did last year.”[/b] In 2009, Daboll joined Eric Mangini's staff in Cleveland as offensive coordinator. Under Daboll the Browns had the NFL's 32nd ranked offense in 2009 [2] and the 29th ranked offense in 2010 [3]. Daboll was named Offensive Coordinator of the Miami Dolphins under Tony Sparano in 2011, with his Dolphins improving from 30th in the league to 20th in overall offense[4]. On February 6, 2012 the Kansas City Chiefs announced the hiring of Daboll as offensive coordinator, replacing the retired Bill Muir. Daboll had previously worked with Chiefs head coach Romeo Crennel, general manager Scott Pioli and quarterback Matt Cassell in the New England Patriots organization. Scored 212 points (13.2/g), 31st of 32 in the NFL. Allowed 338 points (21.1/g), 12th.[/quote] It seems after looking at the stats and his words, Crennel is more interested in improving his offense and not his defense. However, Daboll would be on a very short leash as an OC after viewing his past record as an OC (this guy blows). He'd be an idiot to give up a guy like Bowe who still had 1159 yards last season and is only one year removed from a 15 TD season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewdog Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Numbers' timestamp='1329703462' post='1097354'] Romeo Crennel (interview on 15th of February) It seems after looking at the stats and his words, Crennel is more interested in improving his offense and not his defense. However, Daboll would be on a very short leash as an OC after viewing his past record as an OC (this guy blows). He'd be an idiot to give up a guy like Bowe who still had 1159 yards last season and is only one year removed from a 15 TD season. [/quote] The problem might not be the targets in KC, but instead the gun so to speak. Cassel hasn't exactly lived up to hi hype coming from the Patriots. If Jamal Charles can come back after injury this year, and with fan favorite Jackie Battle backing him up. Throw Thomas Jones and Dexter McCluster into the mix as well. I can't really see the Chiefs becoming a pass happy team. It would just be a stupid move on Crennels part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Lewdog' timestamp='1329703707' post='1097356'] The problem might not be the targets in KC, but instead the gun so to speak. Cassel hasn't exactly lived up to hi hype coming from the Patriots. If Jamal Charles can come back after injury this year, and with fan favorite Jackie Battle backing him up. Throw Thomas Jones and Dexter McCluster into the mix as well. I can't really see the Chiefs becoming a pass happy team. It would just be a stupid move on Crennels part. [/quote] Fan favorite Jackie Battle? Do they like him that much? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Numbers| Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Oldcat' timestamp='1329702803' post='1097352'] That might be an interesting strategy - sign Wallace to a contract that the Steelers can match, but with difficulty. That way they are in cap hell, and you don't have to give up anything. Of course, you take the risk of having to pay that contract yourself [/quote] Yes that is true but would it not just take a simple leak of what the Bengals were offering and not an actual contract ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Numbers' timestamp='1329703462' post='1097354'] Romeo Crennel (interview on 15th of February) It seems after looking at the stats and his words, Crennel is more interested in improving his offense and not his defense. However, Daboll would be on a very short leash as an OC after viewing his past record as an OC (this guy blows). He'd be an idiot to give up a guy like Bowe who still had 1159 yards last season and is only one year removed from a 15 TD season. [/quote] Seems Dwayne Bowe makes more sense for the tag. They also have Cassell at QB who I think needs the best WRs possible. Carr might be an easier guy to resign because he is returning to their same defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewdog Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1329704187' post='1097361'] Fan favorite Jackie Battle? Do they like him that much? [/quote] People just seem to love an underdog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldcat Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Numbers' timestamp='1329704222' post='1097362'] Yes that is true but would it not just take a simple leak of what the Bengals were offering and not an actual contract ? [/quote] Without any other offers, they can just pay him the tender amount and laugh. If we make an offer they can't match, we gain Wallace and lose the draft pick. If we make an offer that they can match and they decide to do so....then they are stuck with that cap hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Numbers| Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Lewdog' timestamp='1329703707' post='1097356'] The problem might not be the targets in KC, but instead the gun so to speak. Cassel hasn't exactly lived up to hi hype coming from the Patriots. If Jamal Charles can come back after injury this year, and with fan favorite Jackie Battle backing him up. Throw Thomas Jones and Dexter McCluster into the mix as well. I can't really see the Chiefs becoming a pass happy team. It would just be a stupid move on Crennels part. [/quote] Cassell hasn't lived up to the hype but Orton won 2 of his 3 games last year (also coincides with Crennels takeover). They may decide to go that route. Note: During two of those last three games, KC's offense opened up and their passing attack under Orton in those games more than doubled their running yards (did not happen in the prior games). KC has a very powerful run game even if Charles never comes back. However, alot of the mock drafts seem to have KC drafting a RB for some reason. As far as WR goes, Breaston can be a thousand yard receiver and has been in the recent past but it seems as if most balls went Bowe's way and not his. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Numbers' timestamp='1329705874' post='1097374'] Cassell hasn't lived up to the hype but Orton won 2 of his 3 games last year (also coincides with Crennels takeover). They may decide to go that route. Note: During two of those last three games, KC's offense opened up and their passing attack under Orton in those games more than doubled their running yards (did not happen in the prior games). KC has a very powerful run game even if Charles never comes back. However, alot of the mock drafts seem to have KC drafting a RB for some reason. As far as WR goes, Breaston can be a thousand yard receiver and has been in the recent past but it seems as if most balls went Bowe's way and not his. [/quote] KC has no backup RB. Battle and Jones are really poor and McCluster is too small to be a major player. They will certainly address the position this offseason. With Charles in place I doubt they take one round 1 but I would not be surprised any time after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unleashed Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 KC has a terrible offense altogether without Charles. Bowe not returning would be a huge blow to any hopes they have of getting their offense going this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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