Bengals Defense has been sloppy and mediocre.

[-GoBengals-]

I didnt see much talk about it in the threads ive hopped in, if this has been addressed specifically let me know.

 

The defense, is far underperforming my expectations. and I think perhaps its my expectations that are misguided.

 

Seems opposing offsenses can just double and attack away from reader in the run game and while he is a MOSTER, those around him arent, and making him slightly less effective. we have face some really solid and unique run offenses so far so im not all in on this take just yet, but lots of 3rd and short plays im like "year just try to run up the middle" and they did... and they got it. but i see reader being mauled and them running 2 slots down. 

 

Cheeto has been average, which i guess is what i expected his top end to be coming off the injury, but that leaves us without a #1 corner really. CTB is a lot more effective as a solid #2 vs being ANOTHER #2 level guy. we have also faced some TALENT in the pass game the first two weeks, so again, not too hot on this take, but so far im unempressed, we arent getting that big stop we need to hand the ball back to joe. and frankly with the state of joe and the offense, we need those BADLY to compete. 2 3rd down stops that SHOULD have happened against baltimore and i feel we win that game. Cleveland is what it is, every aspect wasnt gonna work for us too well.

 

Pass rush has been slow, but with guys open often its a lack of coverage lack of sack it seems. i see trey or murphy beating a guy like "oh shit here comes a sack" and the QB is able to pass quickly and get out of the situation. im not a fan of the pass rush but im willing to let that simmer a few more weeks. also the offense has hung them out to dry not sustaining drives and giving them a break.

 

i dont have a ton to say about the LB's mostly good play but seems like they are a tick late on plays, but only two games in and the offenses we have faced i dont actually have a complaint here just yet.

 

It feels like we are missing some dont think-quick reaction guys we lost in free agency and have some new guys in the defense and young guys in important roles. which we do, but somehow i expected more. Hill has been playing really well. he is the only one in the secondary i have been pleased with i think.

 

am i off on anything? thoughts? ideas?

[Inigo Montoya]

Bengals 27th in the league in time of possession and have been worn down both times this year in the second half by teams that primarily run the the ball.  Offense hasn’t been able to to ANYTHING in first half either game.  

[Le Tigre]

I can’t judge on the CFT game—weather and all. 
 

But—from my in-person perch last Sunday—the defense was on its heels all day. As many times as they have played the Rats and their “run-around” offense…they had no answer for it. Yeah Lamar…Lamar…Lamar..but never an adjustment to contain his out of pocket movement. Lou may have dialed something up, but there was no result. 
 

The 50-yarder Lamar tossed after the turnover, was about as perfectly placed as anyone would want. That wasn’t a defensive lapse…it was just a great throw. 
 

The new deep backfield is so-so. Nick Scott tries hard—and is fearless—but was always just a step behind. Battle had a few good snaps—so would be interested in seeing more. Dax was just OK…although he flashed a bit also. 
 

CTB was definitely being picked on. Incomplete assessment. Chido also just OK. 
 

Figure they will get it figured out. But they do need to stamp down the run. 

[IKOTA]

I think it’s a combination of new players, 2 games together only, no preseason together. DBs have to get a feel for each other just as any position group and their communication has to be constant. Play calling has to be adjusted as a result. Many variables. 
 

I think D improves as the year goes on but there will certainly be some growing pains. The offense was supposed to make up for this inexperience together until they could gel but that obviously hasn’t been the case due to all of the offenses issues they’re currently facing (Joe’s calf, offensive line being utter crap) 

[-GoBengals-]

3 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

Bengals 27th in the league in time of possession and have been worn down both times this year in the second half by teams that primarily run the the ball.  Offense hasn’t been able to to ANYTHING in first half either game.  

 

it really does make sense, and its usually the opposite, offense always driving, rarely a 3 and out in the past, so this is probably a huge huge factor, which makes sense.

 

3 hours ago, Le Tigre said:

I can’t judge on the CFT game—weather and all. 
 

But—from my in-person perch last Sunday—the defense was on its heels all day. As many times as they have played the Rats and their “run-around” offense…they had no answer for it. Yeah Lamar…Lamar…Lamar..but never an adjustment to contain his out of pocket movement. Lou may have dialed something up, but there was no result. 
 

The 50-yarder Lamar tossed after the turnover, was about as perfectly placed as anyone would want. That wasn’t a defensive lapse…it was just a great throw. 
 

The new deep backfield is so-so. Nick Scott tries hard—and is fearless—but was always just a step behind. Battle had a few good snaps—so would be interested in seeing more. Dax was just OK…although he flashed a bit also. 
 

CTB was definitely being picked on. Incomplete assessment. Chido also just OK. 
 

Figure they will get it figured out. But they do need to stamp down the run. 

 

agreed all around, how long does figuring it out take? honestly i think we are safe keeping Loud another year with the way the defense is performing.

 

1 hour ago, IKOTA said:

I think it’s a combination of new players, 2 games together only, no preseason together. DBs have to get a feel for each other just as any position group and their communication has to be constant. Play calling has to be adjusted as a result. Many variables. 
 

I think D improves as the year goes on but there will certainly be some growing pains. The offense was supposed to make up for this inexperience together until they could gel but that obviously hasn’t been the case due to all of the offenses issues they’re currently facing (Joe’s calf, offensive line being utter crap) 

 

yea, agreed, a perfect storm of suck, what is the timeframe you predict before everyone is settled and running smoothly on that side of the ball?

 

i cant decide if its 2-3 more weeks or like week 12. maybe it takes a few wins to get the confidence up in some guys, if you give up a big play and lose, it can eat at you, and lose confidence, if you give up a big play and get the win still, you can learn and grow faster for some people. 

[|High School Harry|]

10 hours ago, Le Tigre said:

 

CTB was definitely being picked on. Incomplete assessment. Chido also just OK. 
 

Someone whose moniker shall not be mentioned 

tagged in Taylor Target-Britt earlier for this reason.

 

He and the entire Kindervelt defensive backfield

are suffering from immaturity, lack of playing time together

and lack of push from the defensive line.

 

That said... why are they pulling Hendrickson to play

Myles Murphy and watch him pillow fight and do the moon

walk backwards?  Not down on him but this seems to be one of

the Bengals' biggest weaknesses... trying to pound square pegs 

into round hole.

[-GoBengals-]

8 hours ago, High School Harry said:

Someone whose moniker shall not be mentioned 

tagged in Taylor Target-Britt earlier for this reason.

 

He and the entire Kindervelt defensive backfield

are suffering from immaturity, lack of playing time together

and lack of push from the defensive line.

 

That said... why are they pulling Hendrickson to play

Myles Murphy and watch him pillow fight and do the moon

walk backwards?  Not down on him but this seems to be one of

the Bengals' biggest weaknesses... trying to pound square pegs 

into round hole.

 

 i hadnt really noticed this, though i have been a bit distracted during the games, ill have to watch for it when i rewatch the games later today

[IKOTA]

20 hours ago, GoBengals said:

 

yea, agreed, a perfect storm of suck, what is the timeframe you predict before everyone is settled and running smoothly on that side of the ball?

 

i cant decide if its 2-3 more weeks or like week 12. maybe it takes a few wins to get the confidence up in some guys, if you give up a big play and lose, it can eat at you, and lose confidence, if you give up a big play and get the win still, you can learn and grow faster for some people. 

Hard to forecast, depends on the players. I’m hoping sooner than later because this isn’t the defense we’re used to seeing. Not even close. Lou has had to simplify like crazy thus far. 

[-GoBengals-]

24 minutes ago, IKOTA said:

Hard to forecast, depends on the players. I’m hoping sooner than later because this isn’t the defense we’re used to seeing. Not even close. Lou has had to simplify like crazy thus far. 

 

 

and man could we really use last years defense, with last years defense we are 1-1 right now.

[claptonrocks]

On 9/22/2023 at 6:56 PM, GoBengals said:

I didnt see much talk about it in the threads ive hopped in, if this has been addressed specifically let me know.

 

The defense, is far underperforming my expectations. and I think perhaps its my expectations that are misguided.

 

Seems opposing offsenses can just double and attack away from reader in the run game and while he is a MOSTER, those around him arent, and making him slightly less effective. we have face some really solid and unique run offenses so far so im not all in on this take just yet, but lots of 3rd and short plays im like "year just try to run up the middle" and they did... and they got it. but i see reader being mauled and them running 2 slots down. 

 

Cheeto has been average, which i guess is what i expected his top end to be coming off the injury, but that leaves us without a #1 corner really. CTB is a lot more effective as a solid #2 vs being ANOTHER #2 level guy. we have also faced some TALENT in the pass game the first two weeks, so again, not too hot on this take, but so far im unempressed, we arent getting that big stop we need to hand the ball back to joe. and frankly with the state of joe and the offense, we need those BADLY to compete. 2 3rd down stops that SHOULD have happened against baltimore and i feel we win that game. Cleveland is what it is, every aspect wasnt gonna work for us too well.

 

Pass rush has been slow, but with guys open often its a lack of coverage lack of sack it seems. i see trey or murphy beating a guy like "oh shit here comes a sack" and the QB is able to pass quickly and get out of the situation. im not a fan of the pass rush but im willing to let that simmer a few more weeks. also the offense has hung them out to dry not sustaining drives and giving them a break.

 

i dont have a ton to say about the LB's mostly good play but seems like they are a tick late on plays, but only two games in and the offenses we have faced i dont actually have a complaint here just yet.

 

It feels like we are missing some dont think-quick reaction guys we lost in free agency and have some new guys in the defense and young guys in important roles. which we do, but somehow i expected more. Hill has been playing really well. he is the only one in the secondary i have been pleased with i think.

 

am i off on anything? thoughts? ideas?

Start with the 3tech..

Double Reader and run at Hill.

He's not making stops 

Backup Zach Carter has been no better.

 

It leaves Pratt to stop it.

If he's on a coverage play 

Wilson's playthen  but leaves ample room for TE or slot openings..

 

Bengals have tough pounding backers that can't cover.

Hill is a big disappointment after 2..

[-GoBengals-]

glad this was settled today. defense made plays, were disruptive, and kept a team to 9 points for 58 minutes. cant ask for much more. the mistakes seem to be geared at the youngsters learning, which is acceptable. 

[stan]

They were very good Monday night,up until they allowed the touchdown.

[IKOTA]

7 hours ago, stan said:

They were very good Monday night,up until they allowed the touchdown.

 

10 hours ago, GoBengals said:

glad this was settled today. defense made plays, were disruptive, and kept a team to 9 points for 58 minutes. cant ask for much more. the mistakes seem to be geared at the youngsters learning, which is acceptable. 

The play where Atwell caught the TD was bad miscommunication (at a critical time), and I expect more of that in the weeks to come until the secondary can get totally used to one another.  
 

Otherwise, they’re coming along but still a work in progress. Also helps when Tre Hendrickson remembers he’s a badass. Hard to judge from last nights game as the DLine absolutely dominated from the point the Rams first TD got called back. From then on, DLine just manhandled the Rams OLine.  There will be games where the pressure isn’t as fierce and the secondary needs to hold up. That will be the real indicator as to where they’re at. 

[stryker57]

i think considering we  now seem to specialize in the 3 plays and a bad punt style of offense...

its hard to really judge the defense. 

i think we could cut them some slack because:

frankly the offense has done nothing to help them. 

no change of field position 

no time to rest 

no points to defend

 

[stryker57]

15 hours ago, stan said:

They were very good Monday night,up until they allowed the touchdown.

yea but  right before that last rams td drive what did the bengals do?

• 1st & 10 at CIN 24

  (6:01 - 4th) (Shotgun) J.Mixon right guard to CIN 22 for -2 yards (E.Jones, A.Donald).
• 2nd & 12 at CIN 22
• (5:14 - 4th) (Shotgun) PENALTY on CIN, Delay of Game, 5 yards, enforced at CIN 22 - No Play.

• 2nd & 17 at CIN 17

  (5:14 - 4th) (Shotgun) J.Mixon left guard to CIN 16 for -1 yards (A.Donald).

• 3rd & 18 at CIN 16

  (4:30 - 4th) (Shotgun) T.Williams right end to CIN 20 for 4 yards (L.Murchison; M.Hoecht).
• the whole world knew we were running, if Burrow cant take a snap from center  and hand off then put Browning in , and whats with a delay of game penalty?  

[-GoBengals-]

2 hours ago, stryker57 said:

i think considering we  now seem to specialize in the 3 plays and a bad punt style of offense...

its hard to really judge the defense. 

i think we could cut them some slack because:

frankly the offense has done nothing to help them. 

no change of field position 

no time to rest 

no points to defend

 

 

yea all that was brought up, they were doodoo from the jump in the first two games. or at least the ravens one, run D was pretty tough, they essentially scored 7 points per qtr. 

 

2 hours ago, stryker57 said:

yea but  right before that last rams td drive what did the bengals do?

• 1st & 10 at CIN 24

  (6:01 - 4th) (Shotgun) J.Mixon right guard to CIN 22 for -2 yards (E.Jones, A.Donald).
• 2nd & 12 at CIN 22
• (5:14 - 4th) (Shotgun) PENALTY on CIN, Delay of Game, 5 yards, enforced at CIN 22 - No Play.

• 2nd & 17 at CIN 17

  (5:14 - 4th) (Shotgun) J.Mixon left guard to CIN 16 for -1 yards (A.Donald).

• 3rd & 18 at CIN 16

  (4:30 - 4th) (Shotgun) T.Williams right end to CIN 20 for 4 yards (L.Murchison; M.Hoecht).
• the whole world knew we were running, if Burrow cant take a snap from center  and hand off then put Browning in , and whats with a delay of game penalty?  

 

yea i dont think two miscommunication/blown coverages by very very very young players had absolutely anything to do with the 6 play drive the bengals had.. what so ever really. they were so tired they forgot the defense? 

 

the point is very valid, just not really in that instance.

[-GoBengals-]

bengals also had+12 minutes time of possession in the rams game, they had decent drives most of the time, they just stalled. 36 minutes to 24. obviously this helped the defense tee off more, but to say one drive that was semi short caused the TD drive is absolutely wild