Xombie Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 [quote name='hocuspocus' post='630110' date='Feb 4 2008, 08:08 PM']Thanks Xombie - as a new poster to the boards I appreciate the kind words. I'm pretty thick skinned yet very surprised at the level vitriol on the boards. Besides, I'm not sure I can even hocuspocus myself as Scarlet suggests - never tried it. Sounds kinky. If others (ahem Scarlet Knight) would read my posts they would know I was not what I'm portrayed to be by her post and for the most part have been thoughtful and respectful. I actually did suggest that we should should be doing things (like development of alternate energy) earlier. My comments on Phil were simply related to my lack of buying into the urgency of it all and this absurd idea that we must take extreme measures today or else. I'd think that the progress and change in attitude we've already seen is a great start and over the years will add up to an effective approach. Best regards,[/quote] Well, thank you, and I am fairly new here as well... And I do believe Tigers is right, this board is so polarized and vehement in their own beliefs, that it really retards the exchange of ideas due to a fear of being shouted down rather than being spoken to... For example, I have called myself Libertarian for all the uncool reasons (meaning not just legalizing weed... ), but I have a tendency to lean a bit more conservatively, while keeping an open mind and listening to more liberal points of view; I can be swayed by sound logic, experience, and common sense, not by name-calling and propaganda. As pompous as it may sound, I am kind of hoping to help usher in a more moderate sense to these threads and stymie the overcompensating of some members who utilize nothing but shock value argument points and militant close-mindedness... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer_Rice Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 [quote name='Xombie' post='630192' date='Feb 5 2008, 07:58 AM']Well, thank you, and I am fairly new here as well... And I do believe Tigers is right, this board is so polarized and vehement in their own beliefs, that it really retards the exchange of ideas due to a fear of being shouted down rather than being spoken to... For example, I have called myself Libertarian for all the uncool reasons (meaning not just legalizing weed... ), but I have a tendency to lean a bit more conservatively, while keeping an open mind and listening to more liberal points of view; I can be swayed by sound logic, experience, and common sense, not by name-calling and propaganda. [i]As pompous as it may sound, I am kind of hoping to help usher in a more moderate sense to these threads and stymie the overcompensating of some members who utilize nothing but shock value argument points and militant close-mindedness...[/i][/quote] In other words, you're on a crusade, too... Just of a different kind. Seriously, welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer_Rice Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 Couple of good reads: [url="http://www.slate.com/id/2183606/"]The Case for CFLs[/url] [url="http://www.economist.com/science/displaystory.cfm?story_id=10601407"]Electricity Storage[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xombie Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 [quote name='Homer_Rice' post='630221' date='Feb 5 2008, 09:35 AM']Couple of good reads: [url="http://www.slate.com/id/2183606/"]The Case for CFLs[/url] [url="http://www.economist.com/science/displaystory.cfm?story_id=10601407"]Electricity Storage[/url][/quote] That reminds me of a debate article I read that claimed that, potentially, hybrids could produce more pollution before they leave the showroom floor than a Hummer produces throughout its average lifetime. Evidently, the batteries in some hybrids contain nickel foam, and the process of making it causes signifigant run-off and other enviromental red flags... Damned if you do, damned if you don't... And, yeah, Homer, you got me! But I hope my zealotry won't demean others that do want to worship the golden calf of a thread's original poster! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatScratchFever Posted February 8, 2008 Report Share Posted February 8, 2008 Interesting... [url="http://ibdeditorial.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=287279412587175"]http://ibdeditorial.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=287279412587175[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hocuspocus Posted February 8, 2008 Report Share Posted February 8, 2008 [quote name='CatScratchFever' post='631017' date='Feb 8 2008, 12:09 PM']Interesting... [url="http://ibdeditorial.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=287279412587175"]http://ibdeditorial.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=287279412587175[/url][/quote] Good article. You mean the sun is actually more powerful than little ole me? You know those who worship man and reason as a god will be saying nasty things about your intelligence for posting such an obviously wrong article! Thanks for sharing an alternate point of view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Scales Posted February 9, 2008 Report Share Posted February 9, 2008 This planet earth, shes a big girl - tough to boot - and I'll say that she and all her friends will whirl for as long as it is to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hocuspocus Posted February 9, 2008 Report Share Posted February 9, 2008 [quote name='The Scales' post='631118' date='Feb 9 2008, 06:00 AM']This planet earth, shes a big girl - tough to boot - and I'll say that she and all her friends will whirl for as long as it is to be.[/quote] I think someone else hit on this earlier but now that the NYT has written it - it most be true. Especially for those beholden by the Times: From The New York Times: Almost all biofuels used today cause more greenhouse gas emissions than conventional fuels if the full emissions costs of producing these “green†fuels are taken into account, two studies being published Thursday have concluded... These plant-based fuels were originally billed as better than fossil fuels because the carbon released when they were burned was balanced by the carbon absorbed when the plants grew. But even that equation proved overly simplistic because the process of turning plants into fuels causes its own emissions — for refining and transport, for example. Whoops! [url="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/08/science/earth/08wbiofuels.html?_r=2&hp&oref=slogin&oref=slogin"]http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/08/science/...amp;oref=slogin[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted February 9, 2008 Report Share Posted February 9, 2008 I suggest we all take a deep breath, step back and put Dennis Leary's song "Asshole" on repeat play for awhile. Pay particular attention to the part about driving really slow in the ultra fast lane, smoking like a chimney and eating greasy burgers and throwing the styrofoam containers out the window while driving a gas-guzzling car. Thanks, Bunghloe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xombie Posted February 10, 2008 Report Share Posted February 10, 2008 [quote name='Bunghole' post='631180' date='Feb 9 2008, 06:42 PM']I suggest we all take a deep breath, step back and put Dennis Leary's song "Asshole" on repeat play for awhile. Pay particular attention to the part about driving really slow in the ultra fast lane, smoking like a chimney and eating greasy burgers and throwing the styrofoam containers out the window while driving a gas-guzzling car. Thanks, Bunghloe[/quote] One of my favorite comedy songs, but (and if I missed the sarcasm, I apologize)) that song is about having the choice to do things that some find repugnant or wrong and being proud that you made the choice when, possibly, a majority disagree with it. Freedom doesn't mean castrating the flavors of life because the smoke from your cig, the gut over your belt, the person you sleep with, etc, etc maybe, arguably be bad for you and, most assuredly, is the hang-up of the person whining next to you because -they- simply don't like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted February 12, 2008 Report Share Posted February 12, 2008 [quote name='hocuspocus' post='631165' date='Feb 9 2008, 04:38 PM']I think someone else hit on this earlier but now that the NYT has written it - it most be true. Especially for those beholden by the Times: From The New York Times: Almost all biofuels used today cause more greenhouse gas emissions than conventional fuels if the full emissions costs of producing these “green†fuels are taken into account, two studies being published Thursday have concluded... These plant-based fuels were originally billed as better than fossil fuels because the carbon released when they were burned was balanced by the carbon absorbed when the plants grew. But even that equation proved overly simplistic because the process of turning plants into fuels causes its own emissions — for refining and transport, for example. Whoops! [url="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/08/science/earth/08wbiofuels.html?_r=2&hp&oref=slogin&oref=slogin"]http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/08/science/...amp;oref=slogin[/url][/quote] Newsweek has done a story about this as well. [url="http://www.newsweek.com/id/110636"]http://www.newsweek.com/id/110636[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Actium Posted February 14, 2008 Report Share Posted February 14, 2008 [url="http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail.asp?pp_cat=11&art_id=61512&sid=17581089&con_type=1"]http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail....&con_type=1[/url] [quote][b]Global warming blamed for unusual cold spell[/b] Nishika Patel [i]Thursday, February 14, 2008[/i] As Hong Kong shivers through its second-longest cold spell since 1885, [b]scientists point to global warming to explain the abnormal cold weather phenomenon worldwide.[/b] Unusually cold weather is gripping a number of countries, including China and Canada. "We are seeing extremely unusual weather across the world," said polar researcher Rebecca Lee Lok-sze. "This is due to human activities and our style of living. Carbon dioxide emissions are heavy, which is changing the weather rapidly. We could see colder winters and hotter summers in the future in Hong Kong." Greenpeace echoed the view, saying mainland scientists had also concluded that the extreme cold weather in China was triggered by climate change. "This does not only cause an increase in global warming but also causes extreme weather patterns," said campaigner Edward Chan. Hong Kong yesterday recorded its second- longest cold spell - 21 days. The longest cold period - when temperatures fall below 12 degrees Celsius - lasted 27 days in 1968. This record is expected to remain intact as the thermometer is forecast to register a low of 13 degrees by Sunday. Hong Kong has also experienced more than 456 hours of cold weather this winter - more than double the 205-hour record in January 2004. Some experts have said the cold weather in China and Canada may be linked to La Nina, a sea-surface cooling pattern in the east Pacific, which leads to a warmer sea surface in the west Pacific near China and Asia. " La Nina is causing warm moist air to move to the south of China," said Professor Yan Yuk- yee, who specializes in climatology at Hong Kong Baptist University. "When this meets the cold air of the monsoon, it causes freezing conditions." The cold spell has led to higher admissions to public hospitals. In most wards, occupancy is already full, the Hospital Authority said. Contingency measures including strengthening of the manpower in accident and emergency departments and medical wards are being implemented to relieve the pressure, its spokesman said.[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Tigers Johnson| Posted February 14, 2008 Report Share Posted February 14, 2008 [quote name='Actium' post='632334' date='Feb 14 2008, 05:29 PM'][url="http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail.asp?pp_cat=11&art_id=61512&sid=17581089&con_type=1"]http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail....&con_type=1[/url] [/quote] I wish they would make up their mind what is going to end the world already....I mean, they have only been predicting it since [size=7]TIME BEGAN[/size]..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScarletKnight Posted February 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Ya"ll is IGnanT and I mean that from the bottom of my heart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xombie Posted February 19, 2008 Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 [quote name='ScarletKnight' post='632828' date='Feb 16 2008, 08:27 PM']Ya"ll is IGnanT and I mean that from the bottom of my heart [/quote] Well, it is certainly nice to be rebutted in such a well-thought and articulate manner; you should have no trouble pushing your agenda forward with blinding success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted February 19, 2008 Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 [quote name='Xombie' post='633480' date='Feb 19 2008, 09:04 AM']Well, it is certainly nice to be rebutted in such a well-thought and articulate manner; you should have no trouble pushing your agenda forward with blinding success. [/quote] :shh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScarletKnight Posted February 19, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 [quote name='Xombie' post='633480' date='Feb 19 2008, 09:04 AM']Well, it is certainly nice to be rebutted in such a well-thought and articulate manner; you should have no trouble pushing your agenda forward with blinding success. [/quote] I can hide behind intelligent language to make a false point, or I can come out and speak the truth in the most basic of ways. Need I write like Shakespeare to get that point accross? When its a waste of time to be well-thought out and articulate I revert back to my infantile rhetoric...sometimes people best understand that type of language. And from what I can tell my point was well taken....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScarletKnight Posted February 19, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 [quote name='Jamie_B' post='633494' date='Feb 19 2008, 09:29 AM']:shh:[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xombie Posted February 20, 2008 Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 [quote name='ScarletKnight' post='633674' date='Feb 19 2008, 05:31 PM']I can hide behind intelligent language to make a false point, or I can come out and speak the truth in the most basic of ways. Need I write like Shakespeare to get that point accross? When its a waste of time to be well-thought out and articulate I revert back to my infantile rhetoric...sometimes people best understand that type of language. And from what I can tell my point was well taken....... [/quote] So, rather engage someone or some group in logical debate with information and opinion that has been formed through learn- ing, research, and experience, to possibly counter the person, or persons, you are trying to sway to your view point, you would prefer to ignore the empirical evidence they provide and fall straight to the common and trite defensive, reflexive rebuttal of 'If you do not think as I do, obviously you are (enter choice derogatory reference to target(s)' backround, education, race, and/or religious viewpoint'... You do your ideals and yourself detriment everytime you post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted February 20, 2008 Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 [quote name='ScarletKnight' post='633675' date='Feb 19 2008, 05:33 PM'][/quote] [quote name='Xombie' post='633724' date='Feb 19 2008, 07:00 PM']So, rather engage someone or some group in logical debate with information and opinion that has been formed through learn- ing, research, and experience, to possibly counter the person, or persons, you are trying to sway to your view point, you would prefer to ignore the empirical evidence they provide and fall straight to the common and trite defensive, reflexive rebuttal of 'If you do not think as I do, obviously you are (enter choice derogatory reference to target(s)' backround, education, race, and/or religious viewpoint'... You do your ideals and yourself detriment everytime you post.[/quote] Testify Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer_Rice Posted February 20, 2008 Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 [quote name='ScarletKnight' post='633674' date='Feb 19 2008, 05:31 PM']I can hide behind intelligent language to make a false point, or I can come out and speak the truth in the most basic of ways. Need I write like Shakespeare to get that point accross? When its a waste of time to be well-thought out and articulate I revert back to my infantile rhetoric...sometimes people best understand that type of language. And from what I can tell my point was well taken....... [/quote] How do you know when you have a truth? It's a germane question because I know, with certainty, that some of the premises from which you argue the case for Global Warming are untenable. On a happier note, a friend of mine [url="http://www.scientificblogging.com/news_releases/poincare_dodecahedral_space_model_gains_support_to_explain_the_shape_of_space"]forwarded this link[/url] to me the other day. He knows of my interest in Plato and that was the basis for why he sent it. He was right and I enjoyed reading the piece. Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScarletKnight Posted February 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 [quote name='Homer_Rice' post='633768' date='Feb 19 2008, 09:46 PM']How do you know when you have a truth? It's a germane question because I know, with certainty, that some of the premises from which you argue the case for Global Warming are untenable. On a happier note, a friend of mine [url="http://www.scientificblogging.com/news_releases/poincare_dodecahedral_space_model_gains_support_to_explain_the_shape_of_space"]forwarded this link[/url] to me the other day. He knows of my interest in Plato and that was the basis for why he sent it. He was right and I enjoyed reading the piece. Why?[/quote] Perhaps you took my last comment out of context, I was not referring at all to anything I posted about global warming or the environment, when I said "truth" I was referencing once specific post. Questioning what is and is not true has its benefits.....you can put into questions those things that are messed up. However, constantly putting out there this idea that there is no wrong or right answer does nothing but allow for everything to be debatable. Thus, when everything is debatable people are often passive instead of proactive. See "truth" itself is an ideal and so is what is "right." Now why you may want to argue that you can never find both things....you can get as close to them as possible. This is much like "true democracy" which is an ideal that we mirror our actions off of, but will probably never attain. In otherwords, some things are infact more true and more right than others. Therefore, the pursuit of what is more true and more right is what ought to be. We can run around constantly questioning what we should do what is right what is wrong, but at some point it has to become clear that something has to be done in some direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScarletKnight Posted February 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 [quote name='Xombie' post='633724' date='Feb 19 2008, 07:00 PM']So, rather engage someone or some group in logical debate with information and opinion that has been formed through learn- ing, research, and experience, to possibly counter the person, or persons, you are trying to sway to your view point, you would prefer to ignore the empirical evidence they provide and fall straight to the common and trite defensive, reflexive rebuttal of 'If you do not think as I do, obviously you are (enter choice derogatory reference to target(s)' backround, education, race, and/or religious viewpoint'... You do your ideals and yourself detriment everytime you post.[/quote] LOL, was this supposed to be an insult? I actually have a lot more to do with my time then write a thesis on a message board. In fact, what you consider empirical evidence might not be as sufficient as you claim it to be. Therefore rendering it pointless for me to keep on arguing back and forth the same thing over and over again. I keep saying one thing, everyone else keeps saying something else. How long are we supposed to keep that up? I don't need to sway anyone on here to feel the way I do and I'm pretty sure I've made that clear. Impressing those on this site with the best of empirical evidence probably won't help to sway anyones opinion anyway and it serves almost no point what so ever. I'd be using my time more wisely to talk with those whom it matters what they think like those in positions of power. Unless those on this board are ready to take action rather than chat for hours then maybe we can start a conversation. Otherwise, this only serves as a tool of entertainment and an eye opener of what people in a different part of the U.S. believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hocuspocus Posted February 20, 2008 Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 [quote name='Homer_Rice' post='633768' date='Feb 19 2008, 09:46 PM']How do you know when you have a truth? It's a germane question because I know, with certainty, that some of the premises from which you argue the case for Global Warming are untenable. On a happier note, a friend of mine [url="http://www.scientificblogging.com/news_releases/poincare_dodecahedral_space_model_gains_support_to_explain_the_shape_of_space"]forwarded this link[/url] to me the other day. He knows of my interest in Plato and that was the basis for why he sent it. He was right and I enjoyed reading the piece. Why?[/quote] Yo HR! I'll bite on this... This is dry stuff by the way (in your link)! It seems on reading the article that the discussion (or dialogue if you will ) is trying to present two ideas where one just may be working its way to the fore. Yet the piece seems to keep the question open for discussion and further research. Are we living in PDS? Like in Plato fashion a series of suggestions and problems about how these ideas are to be interrogated and deployed is presented. I think we are drawn into thinking for ourselves about the issues raised. We are encouraged to consider the plausibility or implausibility of what the characters of this 'dialogue' are saying. I'd say we are to reflect on and potentially accept the arguments and conclusions offered by one or the other - which in Plato's case would normally be the principal interlocutor thus serving an educative function. Not to mention serving as a catalyst to philosophical conversation. The give and take and interchange of ideas is important. I'd say this applies to this post on warming because we have a classic dialogue opportunity on this topic yet not many willing to seriously undertake it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalBacker Posted February 20, 2008 Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 [quote name='ScarletKnight' post='633814' date='Feb 19 2008, 11:50 PM']I actually have a lot more to do with my time then write a thesis on a message board.[/quote] That's what I was thinking. Shouldn't you be cooking or cleaning something? :devil: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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