Olbermann: Special Comment on Geraldine Ferraro

[Vol_Bengal]

[quote name='Lucid' post='643398' date='Mar 14 2008, 02:32 PM']You mean like Falwell saying the gays and heathens caused Katrina?


Religeous leaders say crazy shit all the time... Because religeon, is, well, kinda crazy.[/quote]
Name me the last presidential candidate that had a spiritual mentor (or whatever term you'd like to use) spouting the "crazy shit" that Obama's is...

Doesn't happen.

And, if it did, I'd be against that candidate just as much as I am Obama. He goes to church every Sunday (or did for 20+ years) and listens to this guy preach, or whatever term you'd like to use, and gives his money to the offering plate, etc.

Isn't that condoning what "the crazy old guy" says??? Especially when he's giving the type of money he has, just last year even...

Or, do you make a practice of making donations (at your own discretion of course not required by law) to various groups, etc. that you don't agree with their message? That spouts hatred, "we deserved 9/11", etc.

Your answer to that question would explain a lot.

[quote name='bengalrick' post='643401' date='Mar 14 2008, 02:37 PM']If a presendential candidate has Falwell as his pastor, i would personally be very weary of that candidate... especially a candidate that hasn't said shit (a good strategy, but still) about what his true feelings on most things are... and his wife said that comment about the "first time being proud to be an american"... Just is odd, is all...[/quote]

Exactly.

[|Lucid|]

[quote name='ScarletKnight' post='643403' date='Mar 14 2008, 02:39 PM']Read a few history books about Presidents, Reagan was a puppet to others. Not to mention the affects of Reagan economics aren't as sexy as we would like to think. People can inspire you with bullshit just as easily as they can inspire you with the real deal. I mean do we need to take a trip down history's lane to see where "inspiring" rhetoric has gotten certain countries?

What we need is real substance and we don't have it. You say the people eat that other stuff up and it is the truth they do and that is why you see what you see today. I am not "one of those" whom screams for substance and then rejects it when I get it. I take a lot of really awesome political science classes and I am often depressed as all hell when I walk out of them. Politics is just not the same and I think your better off being one of those who goes for fun campaign slogans and doesn't care about substance, because when you care about substance and your aware of what the hell is going on you see how messed up things are and no matter who you vote for you know your still getting screwed.[/quote]

To clear things up.. I'm not a Reagan fan.. But he posessed "it"... Whatever that is, that makes someone a great leader (to be fair, Hitler also had "it".. Being a great leader does not make a you a good person). And I'm not going to argue that he wasn't a puppet in some regards, because I also beleive this to be true.

And sadly, too often what we "need" and what we "want" are not only different, but are in direct opposition.

[|Lucid|]

[quote name='Vol_Bengal' post='643407' date='Mar 14 2008, 02:53 PM']Name me the last presidential candidate that had a spiritual mentor (or whatever term you'd like to use) spouting the "crazy shit" that Obama's is...

Doesn't happen.

And, if it did, I'd be against that candidate just as much as I am Obama. He goes to church every Sunday (or did for 20+ years) and listens to this guy preach, or whatever term you'd like to use, and gives his money to the offering plate, etc.

Isn't that condoning what "the crazy old guy" says??? Especially when he's giving the type of money he has, just last year even...

Or, do you make a practice of making donations (at your own discretion of course not required by law) to various groups, etc. that you don't agree with their message? That spouts hatred, "we deserved 9/11", etc.

Your answer to that question would explain a lot.



Exactly.[/quote]


This "crazy" preacher's sermons are all available to the public.. I think a mountain is being made out of a mole hill here.

As far as I can tell, him saying that America is run by rich white people is about as bad as it gets. Can anyone show me something worse? Besides, alot of people think America is at least partly responible for the attacks on 9/11.. I don't think they are crazy at all, regardless of what I personally think on the matter.

This isn't Farakhan we are talking about.

Anyone ever been to a Black Southern Babtist service? I have, I wasn't surprised to see what video I have of this man. Seems pretty par for the course TBH.

I guess Obama should have picked a nice white church to go to so people wouldn't get the wrong idea.

[Actium]

[quote name='Lucid' post='643410' date='Mar 14 2008, 02:00 PM']This "crazy" preacher's sermons are all available to the public.. I think a mountain is being made out of a mole hill here.

As far as I can tell, him saying that America is run by rich white people is about as bad as it gets. Can anyone show me something worse? Besides, alot of people think America is at least partly responible for the attacks on 9/11.. I don't think they are crazy at all, regardless of what I personally think on the matter.

[b]This isn't Farakhan we are talking about.[/b]

Anyone ever been to a Black Southern Babtist service? I have, I wasn't surprised to see what video I have of this man. Seems pretty par for the course TBH.

I guess Obama should have picked a nice white church to go to so people wouldn't get the wrong idea.[/quote]

No, but he's got his endorsement too.

[|Lucid|]

[quote name='Actium' post='643412' date='Mar 14 2008, 03:03 PM']No, but he's got his endorsement too.

[/quote]


Which he rejected [b]and[/b] denounced

[Actium]

[quote name='Lucid' post='643414' date='Mar 14 2008, 02:05 PM']Which he rejected [b]and[/b] denounced



[/quote]

Rejected, then later denounced after some said he didn't go far enough

[url="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/02/opinion/02freedman.html"]http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/02/opinion/02freedman.html[/url]

And Louis wasn't mad anyway

[url="http://dailyherald.com/story/?id=144292"]http://dailyherald.com/story/?id=144292[/url]



All of this will blow over anyway. The only think that can save Hillary is the superdelegates.

The general election is another story. Personally I think Obama-mania cools significantly by November.

[|Lucid|]

[quote name='Actium' post='643419' date='Mar 14 2008, 03:12 PM'][b]Rejected, then later denounced after some said he didn't go far enough [/b]

[url="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/02/opinion/02freedman.html"]http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/02/opinion/02freedman.html[/url]

And Louis wasn't mad anyway

[url="http://dailyherald.com/story/?id=144292"]http://dailyherald.com/story/?id=144292[/url]



All of this will blow over anyway. The only think that can save Hillary is the superdelegates.

The general election is another story. Personally I think Obama-mania cools significantly by November.[/quote]


I watched the debate.. I watch all the debates (both paries) and read every candidates web sites. I'm wierd, politics (geo and local) are somewhat an absession of mine. I think for me it's as much about the spectacle and watching brilliant manipulators (generally not the candidates) ply their craft.

The process if kingmaking is pretty fucking interesting.

[Vol_Bengal]

[quote name='Lucid' post='643410' date='Mar 14 2008, 03:00 PM']This "crazy" preacher's sermons are all available to the public.. I think a mountain is being made out of a mole hill here.

As far as I can tell, him saying that America is run by rich white people is about as bad as it gets. Can anyone show me something worse? Besides, [b]alot of people think America is at least partly responible for the attacks on 9/11[/b].. I don't think they are crazy at all, regardless of what I personally think on the matter.

This isn't Farakhan we are talking about.

Anyone ever been to a Black Southern Babtist service? I have, I wasn't surprised to see what video I have of this man. Seems pretty par for the course TBH.

I guess Obama should have picked a nice white church to go to so people wouldn't get the wrong idea.[/quote]

But those folks aren't the spiritual mentors, etc. of a presidential candidate, unless of course you're Barack Obama...

[quote name='Actium' post='643412' date='Mar 14 2008, 03:03 PM']No, but he's got his endorsement too.

[/quote]

And, this same David Wright is bosom buddies with Farakhan...

[Vol_Bengal]

[quote name='Actium' post='643419' date='Mar 14 2008, 03:12 PM']Rejected, then later denounced after some said he didn't go far enough

[url="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/02/opinion/02freedman.html"]http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/02/opinion/02freedman.html[/url]

And Louis wasn't mad anyway

[url="http://dailyherald.com/story/?id=144292"]http://dailyherald.com/story/?id=144292[/url]



All of this will blow over anyway. The only think that can save Hillary is the superdelegates.

The general election is another story. [b]Personally I think Obama-mania cools significantly by November[/b].[/quote]
Please, lord, be right...

Not that McCain is anything to write home about. I'm not a fan of any of these final 3.

[|Lucid|]

[quote name='Vol_Bengal' post='643424' date='Mar 14 2008, 04:26 PM']But those folks aren't the spiritual mentors, etc. of a presidential candidate, unless of course you're Barack Obama...



And, this same David Wright is bosom buddies with Farakhan...[/quote]

You are assuming Barrack looks to this man for more than spiritual leadership. To assume that his political leanings mirror his pastor is sort of strange...


Do you think just like your parents/teachers/religeous leader?

I don't.

I don't think many intelligent people work that way.. Like I said.. John McCains mother has said some *interesting* things... I don't hold John accountable to the viewpoints of his mother..

[Actium]

[quote name='Vol_Bengal' post='643425' date='Mar 14 2008, 02:28 PM']Please, lord, be right...

[b]Not that McCain is anything to write home about. I'm not a fan of any of these final 3.[/b][/quote]

agree wholeheartedly. These jokers are the best our country can come up with. We're in trouble.

[|BlackJesus|]

[b]Every "Controversy" about Obama ... makes me like him even more



.... Damn ... this guy is turning out to be a dream candidate [/b]


[i](Supporter with a Che Flag, honest pastor who speaks the truth on blowback) [/i]

[Actium]

[quote name='BlackJesus' post='643450' date='Mar 14 2008, 03:04 PM'][b]Every "Controversy" about Obama ... makes me like him even more



.... Damn ... this guy is turning out to be a dream candidate [/b]


[i](Supporter with a Che Flag, honest pastor who speaks the truth on blowback) [/i][/quote]

I wonder if your support of candidates will have the same effect as your DT dreams

[Xombie]

[quote name='Nati Ice' post='643326' date='Mar 14 2008, 10:53 AM']i have a sneaking suspicion this is the first forum youve encountered during your journeys along the intartubes.[/quote]

Nope. I just do not think some half-cocked game of one-upmanship is a necessity to discussing things like adults.

[Jamie_B]

[quote name='BengalBacker' post='643368' date='Mar 14 2008, 01:12 PM']Can someone explain to me what was so egregious about Ferraro's quotes that sent Olbermann over the edge? More to the point, what did she say that wasn't arguably true?

Can anyone argue that a major reason Obama is where he's at, isn't indeed because he's black? That's not a racist thing to say.

And people who worship Olbermann and despise O'Riley kill me. Those guys are all peas in a pod. The inability of so many people to see through their self-agrandizing bullshit amazes me.[/quote]


[quote name='bengalrick' post='643369' date='Mar 14 2008, 01:14 PM']what do you mean? 3 year freshman senators win the presidency ALL the time... [/quote]


Just to address this "black thing"...if his race was the reason he was doing as well as he is doing, expain Jessie Jackson or Al Sharpton.

[quote name='Actium' post='643464' date='Mar 14 2008, 04:36 PM']I wonder if your support of candidates will have the same effect as your DT dreams[/quote]

:rofl:

[Xombie]

[quote name='DontPushMe' post='643344' date='Mar 14 2008, 12:02 PM']Dont buy into his bullshit. He tries to act independent, but when was the last he ran a negative story about a republican? He loves throwing dirt on democrats but when its a conservative he either breezes over the story or ignores it complete. Or misstates the facts. Even if he doesnt come out and say negative things about the democrats, he knows what his fans will think when they see stories he runs. Its a tired format. Air a negative story (most of the time more like gossip, a lot of the time without real facts) insulting democrats, then he quickly says "Im not sure i believe this whole thing but here it is" and proceeds to bring on 2 people to rip the democrats for him.[/quote]

I never said he was independent, I believe his views and records tend to mark him as a moderate conservative who is not opposed to listening to a philosophical opponent and be willing to compromise to actually create political momentum to accomplish his agenda and rely on pork-filled bills to squeeze through his plans.

And, just to clarify something, there is a difference between 'old' and out of touch. Just because someone has a few decades on you, life experience wise, does not mean the latter. In fact, it used to be sought after.

[Homer_Rice]

Q: "Why did God give women legs?"
-pause-
A: "So they wouldn't leave a trail on the ground like a snail."

Now that's an offensive joke. But I bet the menfolk around here who haven't heard it before find it amusing. It's the sort of thing that makes you feel guilty for laughing about it. And, sick as it is as a joke, it's not truly mean-spirited, like use of the term, "cunt" is. But, you keep it in the locker room, so to speak.

So, it's the blind, mean-spiritedness aspect which causes the pain, imo. If a woman called Bung a "faggot" during the course of a disagreement it would probably carry the same kind of "hurt."

So, I'm curious to hear why Bung is so dead set against Clinton, policy-wise. Not to single him out, but I've been hearing a lot of what I consider to be sexist-oriented bias against Clinton this campaign season, from a number of people. In some respects, imo, while the racial taboo is more overt and therefore more easy to drive out of one's conscious, there seems to be less circumspection with respect to a female as a leader, and epecially as "the" leader. (I've seen this bias in company politics, too, btw.)

Now, Edwards was my candidate of choice. But, given my choices now, come KY primary day, I'm voting for Clinton. I think she would be a better President than Obama.

[Jamie_B]

[quote name='Homer_Rice' post='643493' date='Mar 14 2008, 05:53 PM']Q: "Why did God give women legs?"
-pause-
A: "So they wouldn't leave a trail on the ground like a snail."

Now that's an offensive joke. But I bet the menfolk around here who haven't heard it before find it amusing. It's the sort of thing that makes you feel guilty for laughing about it. And, sick as it is as a joke, it's not truly mean-spirited, like use of the term, "cunt" is. But, you keep it in the locker room, so to speak.

So, it's the blind, mean-spiritedness aspect which causes the pain, imo. [color="#FF0000"]If a woman called Bung a "faggot"[/color] during the course of a disagreement it would probably carry the same kind of "hurt."

So, I'm curious to hear why Bung is so dead set against Clinton, policy-wise. Not to single him out, but I've been hearing a lot of what I consider to be sexist-oriented bias against Clinton this campaign season, from a number of people. In some respects, imo, while the racial taboo is more overt and therefore more easy to drive out of one's conscious, there seems to be less circumspection with respect to a female as a leader, and epecially as "the" leader. (I've seen this bias in company politics, too, btw.)

Now, Edwards was my candidate of choice. But, given my choices now, come KY primary day, I'm voting for Clinton. I think she would be a better President than Obama.[/quote]



Bung was never in the navy.

[|Bunghole|]

[quote name='Homer_Rice' post='643493' date='Mar 14 2008, 04:53 PM']Q: "Why did God give women legs?"
-pause-
A: "So they wouldn't leave a trail on the ground like a snail."

Now that's an offensive joke. But I bet the menfolk around here who haven't heard it before find it amusing. It's the sort of thing that makes you feel guilty for laughing about it. And, sick as it is as a joke, it's not truly mean-spirited, like use of the term, "cunt" is. But, you keep it in the locker room, so to speak.

So, it's the blind, mean-spiritedness aspect which causes the pain, imo. If a woman called Bung a "faggot" during the course of a disagreement it would probably carry the same kind of "hurt."

So, I'm curious to hear why Bung is so dead set against Clinton, policy-wise. Not to single him out, but I've been hearing a lot of what I consider to be sexist-oriented bias against Clinton this campaign season, from a number of people. In some respects, imo, while the racial taboo is more overt and therefore more easy to drive out of one's conscious, there seems to be less circumspection with respect to a female as a leader, and epecially as "the" leader. (I've seen this bias in company politics, too, btw.)

Now, Edwards was my candidate of choice. But, given my choices now, come KY primary day, I'm voting for Clinton. I think she would be a better President than Obama.[/quote]
If a woman called me a faggot I would immediately attempt to demean said woman with accusations of discrimination against homosexuals....

And it's one thing to "let loose" with some behavior/language on an uncensored internet messageboard and entirely another to say it or mean it in real life.

As far as Hillary goes, here are some of the things I don't like about her:

She is extremely polarizing. If she is president, the right wing will fight her tooth and nail on EVERYTHING. She is beholden to big business, they are her primary funders, she's no different in that regard. George Soros. She is calculating and manipulative, she does not even seem real. She has reached her current level in the national spotlight due to her being married to a former president rather than to her own hard work and merit, despite having been an attorney and a Senator.

She was inconsistent on the Iraq War, and panders on the Iranian issue depending on whom she's addressing.
What does Hillary want? A smarter, smoother, better-planned interventionism, one that our allies find more amenable and yet is, in many ways, more militant than the Republican version,one that "levels with the American people" about the costs of empire and yet doesn't dispute the alleged necessity of American hegemony.

I don't like her idea of socialized healthcare. There are enough reports of failures in the system Canada uses (long waits for necessary procedures, government dictating which doctors you can visit, immediacy of care) that I don't think it would work very well here.

I dislike her personality, she comes off to me as an ingratiating grouse, an abject liar and insincere.

I also do not support her gun-control legislation regarding semi-automatic weapon ownership.

[Homer_Rice]

[quote name='Jamie_B' post='643502' date='Mar 14 2008, 07:51 PM']Bung was never in the navy. [/quote]
But he probably wishes he had been; look at his choice of moniker!

Plus, Navy chow is the best!

[Homer_Rice]

[quote name='Bunghole' post='643507' date='Mar 14 2008, 08:08 PM']If a woman called me a faggot I would immediately attempt to demean said woman with accusations of discrimination against homosexuals....

And it's one thing to "let loose" with some behavior/language on an uncensored internet messageboard and entirely another to say it or mean it in real life.[/quote]

Once there was a nutty professor who used to rail on about "Space Imperialism"--as if our exploring the solar system were some form of "us vs them" kind of analogy. One day, one of the kids in the class asked, "Aren't we in space, too?"

Seems like a similarly artificial distinction between uncensored internet boards and "real life."

[quote]As far as Hillary goes, here are some of the things I don't like about her:

She is extremely polarizing. If she is president, the right wing will fight her tooth and nail on EVERYTHING. She is beholden to big business, they are her primary funders, she's no different in that regard. George Soros. She is calculating and manipulative, she does not even seem real. She has reached her current level in the national spotlight due to her being married to a former president rather than to her own hard work and merit, despite having been an attorney and a Senator.[/quote]
Notwithstanding the fact that she has a history of being a hard worker, I think you undervalue the "work" that it takes to be a political wife. And the fact that that she provokes a fight from some of the people who have totally fucked this country up over the past 2 admins ought to be seen as a good thing. Nothing comes easy. That said, I don't much care for Soros either. He wants to legalize pot.

[quote]She was inconsistent on the Iraq War, and panders on the Iranian issue depending on whom she's addressing.
What does Hillary want? A smarter, smoother, better-planned interventionism, one that our allies find more amenable and yet is, in many ways, more militant than the Republican version,one that "levels with the American people" about the costs of empire and yet doesn't dispute the alleged necessity of American hegemony.[/quote]
I tend to agree with you here. Though I don't think she's a hegemonist of the same caliber as the neocons.

[quote]I don't like her idea of socialized healthcare. There are enough reports of failures in the system Canada uses (long waits for necessary procedures, government dictating which doctors you can visit, immediacy of care) that I don't think it would work very well here.[/quote]
I like the idea. But we've been down that road.

[quote]I dislike her personality, she comes off to me as an ingratiating grouse, an abject liar and insincere.[/quote]
But I bet she'd do well on Dancing With The Stars!

[quote]I also do not support her gun-control legislation regarding semi-automatic weapon ownership.[/quote]
I'm clueless here. What's her stance?

[|Bunghole|]

[quote name='Homer_Rice' post='643515' date='Mar 14 2008, 06:49 PM']But he probably wishes he had been; look at his choice of moniker!

Plus, Navy chow is the best![/quote]
My choice of moniker is the word that describes the opening in a barrel of wine.

And you never had a quality MRE like "Dehydrated Pork Pattie" that needed "reconstituting" in your canteen cup full of water over open flame. You could even floss with the bone chips from the grade D meat afterwards!

[|Bunghole|]

[quote name='Homer_Rice' post='643518' date='Mar 14 2008, 07:03 PM']Once there was a nutty professor who used to rail on about "Space Imperialism"--as if our exploring the solar system were some form of "us vs them" kind of analogy. One day, one of the kids in the class asked, "Aren't we in space, too?"

Seems like a similarly artificial distinction between uncensored internet boards and "real life."


Notwithstanding the fact that she has a history of being a hard worker, I think you undervalue the "work" that it takes to be a political wife. And the fact that that she provokes a fight from some of the people who have totally fucked this country up over the past 2 admins ought to be seen as a good thing. Nothing comes easy. That said, I don't much care for Soros either. He wants to legalize pot.


I tend to agree with you here. Though I don't think she's a hegemonist of the same caliber as the neocons.


I like the idea. But we've been down that road.


[b]But I bet she'd do well on Dancing With The Stars!


I'm clueless here. What's her stance?[/b][/quote]

I bet she'd be a stiff on that show!

and in short, she's against semi-automatic weapons, and I am for their ownership, as well as concealed carry laws for responsible citizens to be able to defend themselves. It's a violent world out there and violent criminals and pyscho campus gunman prey on the weak and the unarmed because they can.

[|BlackJesus|]

[b]I heard McCain doesn't support our right to own concealed bazookas


[/b]

[|Bunghole|]

[quote name='BlackJesus' post='643532' date='Mar 14 2008, 07:31 PM'][b]I heard McCain doesn't support our right to own concealed bazookas


[/b][/quote]
Yeah, because a nutbag like McCain as a former vet has no concept of the difference between a gun that fires bullets as fast as you can squeeze the trigger and a weapon that fires small artillery rounds or rockets that are used to destroy vehicles like fucking tanks. They are the same.