WRAPradio Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 If the Pats too our 3rd rounder would you do that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 How could we afford him? He’s $14 million. They already need to cut dalton to make the money work (or get him to massively re-structure). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 14 minutes ago, membengal said: How could we afford him? He’s $14 million. They already need to cut dalton to make the money work (or get him to massively re-structure). Of course we want him..his an allpro... How???..... Forget Daltons contract.. Trade or release Shaun Williams at 4.7 and Gio Bernard. at 4.4... Thats 10mil freeup... Much rather have Thuney than those two ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WRAPradio Posted April 20, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 37 minutes ago, claptonrocks said: Of course we want him..his an allpro... How???..... Forget Daltons contract.. Trade or release Shaun Williams at 4.7 and Gio Bernard. at 4.4... Thats 10mil freeup... Much rather have Thuney than those two ... He'd be better than any OL we could get at the top of the 3rd (I think). At least he's proven in the NFL. Now, olinmen that leave the Pats don't exactly have the best track record, but he's got to be better than MJ, Redmon, XSF or any draft pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snarkster Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 1 hour ago, WRAPradio said: If the Pats too our 3rd rounder would you do that? How about Dalton & a 4th? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WRAPradio Posted April 20, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, snarkster said: How about Dalton & a 4th? I'd take that too...heck, AD for Thuney straight up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 1 hour ago, WRAPradio said: He'd be better than any OL we could get at the top of the 3rd (I think). At least he's proven in the NFL. Now, olinmen that leave the Pats don't exactly have the best track record, but he's got to be better than MJ, Redmon, XSF or any draft pick. Oh he'd br a bit better..for sure.and sure.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 3 hours ago, WRAPradio said: I'd take that too...heck, AD for Thuney straight up. New England is in cap space hell right now.. They have. to trade him.. Taking on Daltons contract doesn't solve that..they need a rook salary to get over the hump and draft a guatd at 3.. We trade our 3rd and cut Shaun Williams and Gio Bernard.. We then have an AllPro guard!!!.( And the Angels wept with joy)....at least in Cinncinati.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky151 Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 Thuney will want a long term deal. He signed his franchise tender so he can be traded but he'll be a free agent again if not extended by July 15. On a long term deal he will likely cost less than the almost 15 mil he's scheduled to make this year. Top guard money is about 12 mil. I doubt he'd take less than 13 but Bengals can certainly afford it. We don't have any expensive O-linemen currently. Alternatively, Oakland has Gabe Jackson on the block and he makes 9.5 mil, signed for 2 more years. I'd rather give NE a player or two instead of picks. They don't need Gio but could maybe use Shawn Williams or Dalton or John Ross. I'd trade all of them for Thuney. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 25 minutes ago, sparky151 said: Thuney will want a long term deal. He signed his franchise tender so he can be traded but he'll be a free agent again if not extended by July 15. On a long term deal he will likely cost less than the almost 15 mil he's scheduled to make this year. Top guard money is about 12 mil. I doubt he'd take less than 13 but Bengals can certainly afford it. We don't have any expensive O-linemen currently. Alternatively, Oakland has Gabe Jackson on the block and he makes 9.5 mil, signed for 2 more years. I'd rather give NE a player or two instead of picks. They don't need Gio but could maybe use Shawn Williams or Dalton or John Ross. I'd trade all of them for Thuney. I dont think the Pats want any more vet salaries at this point.. Trading out 3rd pick to them would alliviate their cap problems plus we receive an allpro guard then draft Isaiah on round two. Make it happen.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky151 Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 I just checked and Pats are right up against the cap, 1.3 mil under. That's not enough to sign their rookies so they either need to negotiate Thuney down on a new deal or move some vets before they can sign their draftees. If we get Wilson in round 2, then I'd trade our 3rd for Thuney and get LBs in rounds 4 and 5. But there's no point in trading for Thuney unless we know he'd sign a long term deal. We'd need to get permission in advance from Pats to talk to Joe and his agent. We'd have to cut Dalton to get Thuney on board, though trades are usually contingent on passing a physical which can take a week or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IsaacCurtis:TheReal#85 Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 If Ruiz is there at 33, he could make Thuney redundant. I am always wary of Pats players (overperform due to Belichek), and he could walk soon due to his contract situation. Still, I am not opposed to getting vet line help (Jason Peters, Thuney). We are right at the cap, with Andy's contract & our picks, if you factor in displacement. Also, we may be able to shave some cash with trades/releases: Williams or Gio (hope not); or Price, Redmond, Erickson, etc. Plus, if Williams' arms are too short, then he'll have to move to guard, and Ruiz could be our best value at 33. Then we need OTs, not guards. All in all, I'd say no. No long term $$ at G until I know Williams works at T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cricket Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 26 minutes ago, IsaacCurtis:TheReal#85 said: If Ruiz is there at 33, he could make Thuney redundant... The comparison should be Ruiz (and whatever is given up to get him) vs. Thuney AND pick 33. [I’m not saying that we should or should not get Thuney. It just bugs me when someone says that we don’t need to sign a certain free-agent, because we can get an equally good player for that position with pick number so-and-so. But if you get the free-agent, you still have that pick in the draft to shore up another position.] /rant 🦗 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 1 hour ago, IsaacCurtis:TheReal#85 said: If Ruiz is there at 33, he could make Thuney redundant. I am always wary of Pats players (overperform due to Belichek), and he could walk soon due to his contract situation. Still, I am not opposed to getting vet line help (Jason Peters, Thuney). We are right at the cap, with Andy's contract & our picks, if you factor in displacement. Also, we may be able to shave some cash with trades/releases: Williams or Gio (hope not); or Price, Redmond, Erickson, etc. Plus, if Williams' arms are too short, then he'll have to move to guard, and Ruiz could be our best value at 33. Then we need OTs, not guards. All in all, I'd say no. No long term $$ at G until I know Williams works at T. The supposed NFL league wide minimum standard is 34" and Jonah was measured at 33 5/8" , even though only some teams totally rely on this guideline as a standard. I am not that concerned over 3/8", are you? I think his tape says he has the qualifications and makeup to be a good left tackle in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 3 hours ago, bengaled said: The supposed NFL league wide minimum standard is 34" and Jonah was measured at 33 5/8" , even though only some teams totally rely on this guideline as a standard. I am not that concerned over 3/8", are you? I think his tape says he has the qualifications and makeup to be a good left tackle in the league. And...you'd be right... Bookends come as pairs.. Find the other now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 1 hour ago, claptonrocks said: And...you'd be right... Bookends come as pairs.. Find the other now... The more film I watch of the guy you've been promoting (Wilson), the more I am liking what I see. I know I wasn't here earlier, I'd be fine with taking him at #33....him or Zack Baun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 10 minutes ago, bengaled said: The more film I watch of the guy you've been promoting (Wilson), the more I am liking what I see. I know I wasn't here earlier, I'd be fine with taking him at #33....him or Zack Baun. Ive been an advocate of Willie Gay as well....i believe hes going to be a big playmaker and bring some energy to the defense ..like Boyd and Mixon exuberated on offense.. Dont think we ll get tham both though.. Stocks are rising on them.. Id take Isaiah by his position first.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, claptonrocks said: Ive been an advocate of Willie Gay as well....i believe hes going to be a big playmaker and bring some energy to the defense ..like Boyd and Mixon exuberated on offense.. Dont think we ll get tham both though.. Stocks are rusing on them.. Id take Isaiah by his position first.. Yeah, I'd do that too, mainly because we need to take the running game to a higher level. The best thing possible for a rookie QB to get his feet under him is a damned good running attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IsaacCurtis:TheReal#85 Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 We have more holes than we can possibly fill in one off-season (QB, RT, OG, TE, WR, LB, d-line depth, o-line depth). And this is AFTER signing 5-6 likely starters in FA (Reader, Waynes, Bynes, Bell, Alexander, Su'a Filo). Plus, some of our most outstanding and longest tenured guys are getting a bit long in the tooth (Atkins, Dunlap, Green, Shawn Williams). A couple things on draft strategies for teams with a lot of holes, IMHO, at least. 1) Don't reach or gamble, especially early (1st through mid 4th). We should be avoiding raw guys, red flag guys, and upside guys early. After #1, we do not need HRs, we need singles & doubles. Guys we know bring something to the table and who were productive (high footy IQ, coverage skills, run stuffer, great hands, route runner, work ethic, etc). Not a lot of HRs at #33 anyway. We are behind, we need baserunners. 2) Some positions have more impact than others. Top tier = QB, OT, CB. Mid tier = WR, DE/Edge, DT. Lower tier = RB, TE, OG, C, LB, S. Does not mean you cannot take a guy from a low impact spot high. But if you are, he needs to be a stud/starter type. On the flip side, taking a guy from a premier position late and expecting anything other than depth is foolhardy. Unless there is high risk involved. Thus, I tend to feel 33 is kind of a reach for a starting OT. LT for sure. RT? Right on the edge. If you want a real stud, a mid first (or better) is usually required. Though there are exceptions (Whit). This is a deep class, and I do like Wilson (or Jones), but I'd prefer to wait till next year and land a Wirfs level guy to bookend Williams. I'd do my immediate OT upgrade by signing Jason Peters. Once we jettison Andy's contract (or Gio's), we should have some space. Then use 33 to trade down for more picks & get more guys on base. Of course, if Peters wants a contender, then the plan is moot. But most contenders are already set at tackle. Cleanup will be in 2021. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky151 Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 I think there's a decent chance Gay is available at pick 65. If he had no red flags, he'd probably go early 2nd so a drop of a round seems reasonable. This draft should be about getting Burrow off to a good start in his career. We need upgrades at RG and RT and could use a receiving TE too. I'm fine with slipping a LB in for round 3 because it's such a need but fixing the O-line should be the top priority before Burrow gets Klingerized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky151 Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, IsaacCurtis:TheReal#85 said: We have more holes than we can possibly fill in one off-season (QB, RT, OG, TE, WR, LB, d-line depth). And this is AFTER signing 5-6 likely starters in FA (Reader, Waynes, Bynes, Bell, Alexander, Su'a Filo). Plus, some of our most outstanding and longest tenured guys are getting a bit long in the tooth (Atkins, Dunlap, Green, Shawn Williams). A couple things on draft strategies for teams with a lot of holes: 1) Don't reach or gamble, especially early (1st through mid 4th). We should be avoiding raw guys, red flag guys, and upside guys early. After #1, we do not need HRs, we need singles & doubles. Guys we know bring something to the table and who were productive (high footy IQ, coverage skills, run stuffer, great hands, route runner, work ethic, etc). Not a lot of HRs at #33 anyway. 2) Some positions have more impact than others. Top tier = QB, OT, CB. Mid tier = WR, DE/Edge, DT. Lower tier = RB, TE, OG, C, LB, S. Does not mean you cannot take a guy from a low impact spot high. But if you are, he needs to be a stud/starter type. On the flip side, taking a guy from a premier pisition late and expecting anything other than depth is foolhardy. Unless there is high risk involved. Thus, I tend to feel 33 is kind of a reach for a starting OT. LT for sure. If you want a real stud, a mid first (or better) is usually required. This is a deep class, and I do like Wilson (or Jones), but I'd prefer to wait till next year and land a Wirfs level guy to bookend Williams. I'd do my immediate OT upgrade by signing Jason Peters. Once we jettison Andy's contract (or Gio's), we should have some space. Then use 33 to trade down for more picks & get more guys on base. Of course, if Peters wants a contender, then the plan is moot. But most contenders are already set at tackle. Cleanup will be in 2021. I'd be happy taking Wilson at 33. If he'd stayed in school, he'd likely be a top 10 pick next year and he'll learn more in 2020 in the NFL than in college. Then next year we can draft a Micah Parsons or Devonta Smith level player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 6 minutes ago, sparky151 said: Lower tier = RB, TE, OG, C, LB, S. It might be lower tier on some teams but lb certainly isnt on ours this year.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IsaacCurtis:TheReal#85 Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 10 minutes ago, sparky151 said: I'd be happy taking Wilson at 33. If he'd stayed in school, he'd likely be a top 10 pick next year and he'll learn more in 2020 in the NFL than in college. Then next year we can draft a Micah Parsons or Devonta Smith level player. There is that. If we feel really good about Wilson being not just starter level, but likely star level, then take him. Just OK is usually not good enough for title contenders at QB and OT. Plus, like you say, if both OTs and QB are set, we can then focus on stud defenders (or a stud WR) next year. I got nothing against Wilson, I am fine with taking him. I just think Peters is a cheap, quality bridge guy that both helps Burrow (and Williams), and lets us spend #33 on another spot, or feel better about trading down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengaled Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 21 minutes ago, sparky151 said: This draft should be about getting Burrow off to a good start in his career. We need upgrades at RG and RT and could use a receiving TE too. I'm fine with slipping a LB in for round 3 because it's such a need but fixing the O-line should be the top priority before Burrow gets Klingerized. This, this, this...damnit a million times THIS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claptonrocks Posted April 21, 2020 Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 28 minutes ago, sparky151 said: I think there's a decent chance Gay is available at pick 65. If he had no red flags, he'd probably go early 2nd so a drop of a round seems reasonable. This draft should be about getting Burrow off to a good start in his career. We need upgrades at RG and RT and could use a receiving TE too. I'm fine with slipping a LB in for round 3 because it's such a need but fixing the O-line should be the top priority before Burrow gets Klingerized. I dont think its even a decent chance Willie is there at 65... Now therer may be a few teams that might consider that but not a whole round.. 6'1 243lbs 4.46 40..39.5 vertical.. Sideline to sideline tackling..can cover.. Played elite competion in collage... Im guessing before pick 50.. But if he was there at 65 the angels wouldnt have to cry with joy for the team... I would... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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