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rudi32

war of northern aggression

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[quote name='CincyInDC' post='607298' date='Dec 10 2007, 11:22 PM']Weren't there 2 capitols in Kentucky during the war? One in Frankfort and one in Bowling Green?[/quote]
No, awesome basketball has always resided in Lexington.
:lol:
2007 season aside...

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From what I understand, the northerners really wanted to fight in that war. Yeah, the Union only had to kill their own men to get them to sign up and free some slaves.

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[quote name='rudi32' post='607338' date='Dec 11 2007, 03:37 AM']22 some points u make are correct and some were not.

cincy in DC was right

there were 2 capitols in KY during the war. The govenor was pro south and wanted to leave the union , but the leg didnt.

I have the stats around somewhere, but if i recall from memory KY sent 35000 to the south and around 45000 to the north. each border state sent troops to both sides, it really depended on where u lived.[/quote]
No, not exactly. There was only one capitol--Frankfort. It is true that there was an attempt to pull the state towards the south and that there was a convention of secessionist-minded folks who met for that purpose. Concentrated in the western part of the state, Lincoln eventually declared the region to be in rebellion. But, and my memory is poor here, that was after the legislature passed a resolution of neutrality telling both Union and Secessionist forces to stay off KY soil. In fact, Kentucky was invaded by the south and I think this is when Lincoln made the determination. When that happened, the legislature became overtly pro-Union.

Thus, the soldiers from KY who enlisted and fought in Union armies were patriots. Those who enlisted and fought for the South were traitors to the Union. And that's a fact. :lol:

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[quote name='Homer_Rice' post='607437' date='Dec 11 2007, 11:51 AM']No, not exactly. There was only one capitol--Frankfort. It is true that there was an attempt to pull the state towards the south and that there was a convention of secessionist-minded folks who met for that purpose. Concentrated in the western part of the state, Lincoln eventually declared the region to be in rebellion. But, and my memory is poor here, that was after the legislature passed a resolution of neutrality telling both Union and Secessionist forces to stay off KY soil. In fact, Kentucky was invaded by the south and I think this is when Lincoln made the determination. When that happened, the legislature became overtly pro-Union.

Thus, the soldiers from KY who enlisted and fought in Union armies were patriots. Those who enlisted and fought for the South were traitors to the Union. And that's a fact. :lol:[/quote]


[quote name='rudi32' post='607449' date='Dec 11 2007, 12:50 PM']lincohn was so worried about losing KY that he sent troops there. that made some people mad, that were on the fence so to speak, and made some go south. I do know for a fact that the Govenor wanted to leave the union, and was pro south, but the leg was wishy washy about it, so they decided to remain nutral. i disagree with your statement that KY was union, in fact is was neither union or confederate. they voted to remain nutral during the war.[/quote]

I used to live in Frankfort, and there's a park on Fort Hill (the Union fort to defend Frankfort), which overlooks the crack (FYI, Frankfort lies in a giant, gaping crack in the Earth). Interesting stuff at the Fort...earthworks remain but they're pretty eroded, and all the wooden fencing is gone. I don't believe they ever really needed to defend much.

Several years ago while working at the University of Kentucky it was my job to go through old county deed records from the Mammoth Cave area to look for American chestnut data (surveyors note "witness trees" at the corners of plots). Anyway, the deed books are not just for land. There were slave transactions here and there, too. Kind of freaky. But apparently, slaves make great wedding presents. [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//31.gif[/img]

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Some of Kentucky's finest met in Russellville (Now famous for Kige Ramsey) for a confederate convention, but it was a sham.

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[quote name='#22' post='607616' date='Dec 11 2007, 06:07 PM']Some of Kentucky's finest met in Russellville (Now famous for Kige Ramsey) for a confederate convention, but it was a sham.[/quote]
That's it, Russellville. A different ancestor of mine (not the one associated with the letters posted earlier) took part in that lashup.

Also among the stuff from my grandfather's estate, which was passed to me, was an 1847 edition of the Federalist Papers, originally owned by this other relative. Once I got it, I opened it up and was leafing through it and I found this bookmark:

[img]http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/4425/bookmarksx2.jpg[/img]

Clearly just some scribbled ciphers.... Then I turned it over:

[img]http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/7940/bookmarkreversevq5.jpg[/img]

Curious, eh? What were the "members" up to? Who were they? This is one example of why I love history!

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Right, but why were they concerned with Franklin county, which (as you know) is in central Kentucky, far removed from any semblance of the confederacy? and on January 15th? This sounds like a job for Lowell Harrison.

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[quote name='#22' post='607976' date='Dec 12 2007, 03:09 PM']Right, but why were they concerned with Franklin county, which (as you know) is in central Kentucky, far removed from any semblance of the confederacy? and on January 15th? This sounds like a job for Lowell Harrison.[/quote]
Lots of Southern sympathizers in the Lawrenceburg area, my relative (another great-great grandfather) being one.... I suspect that it was an early attempt to rally like-minded folks in the area for Secession. I do know that he participated in the Russellville confab, as well as having attended the Montgomery Convention, too. He was a lawyer, devoted to States Rights, so, speaking in terms of historical processes, that might partially explain why he was attracted to the southbound end of a northbound horse!

Edit to add: I've read some of Harrison's work, and miss Tom Clark.

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[quote name='Jamie_B' post='608058' date='Dec 12 2007, 06:12 PM']Homer you dont happen to be a Mason do you?


:ninja:[/quote]
If you ever saw this fat, bearded old man riding one of those mini-bikes, you'd laugh your ass off.

No.

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[quote name='#22' post='607098' date='Dec 10 2007, 04:33 PM']Not to sound exceedingly Marxist, but the Civil War was waged by southern slaveholders (who made up the upper echelon of the population), and the media and army were controlled by these people to keep the rest of the population in line. The South was the most un-American institution in its day, and not just because of the obvious problems that enslaving fellow human beings brings up. Southerners could only read Southern newspapers that promoted pro-Slavery, pro-Democrat ways of thinking, and anything else was illegal and extremely dangerous to have around.

This is the reason that folks in the mountains of Tennessee, North Carolina, Virginia (who split off and formed a new state), and other areas where the ground wasn't suitable for short-staple cotton production were forced by conscription (which the South began in this country) to fight for policies that they didn't believe in. People in East Tennessee (when they were still able to vote) voted against secession 3-1, but the "Lost Cause" myth and its pervasive effect on our historiography makes it so that people down there are just as like to fly the confederate flag as the correct one.[/quote]

This pretty much summed it up for me. I'm not sure what's so "honorable" about fighting a war for a few rich people, who of course never saw the front lines, manipulating the masses. Maybe it's just me. -_-

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[quote name='slim15' post='646742' date='Mar 27 2008, 11:38 PM']I think the war of northern ag fits.

they attacked


[url="http://www.lewrockwell.com/dilorenzo/dilorenzo44.html"]http://www.lewrockwell.com/dilorenzo/dilorenzo44.html[/url][/quote]
Dance, Christian!

(NSFW)

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wow fast response there home..lol

I was trying to edit my post to show how stupid this topic is. (edit it to say the war of north ag doesnt fit...forgot dosnt..haha)

just googlr war of north ag and u see what u get.

U copied and pasted before I could edit. u gotta give me time, I had a long day, worked 14 hours in the factory.

please edit ur post for me to show the real meaning that I meant, thx

oh yea, im new, and been reading a few post here. I dont claim to be a college boy, im a blue collar worker so my opinions may seem simple. But I agrre with ya, please remove that racist video cause thats not what im about.

ynk u kind sir

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[quote name='Homer_Rice' post='607748' date='Dec 12 2007, 07:43 AM'][img]http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/4425/bookmarksx2.jpg[/img]

Clearly just some scribbled ciphers.... Then I turned it over:[/quote]

Just saw this thread, and this bookmark. Some are illegible, but most of the writing is just long division. So, congratulations - your ancestor correctly determined that 10685 / 60 = 178!

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[quote name='Go Tory Go!' post='646757' date='Mar 28 2008, 01:33 AM']Just saw this thread, and this bookmark. Some are illegible, but most of the writing is just long division. So, congratulations - your ancestor's correctly determined that 10685 / 60 = 178![/quote]
Then at least he was right about one thing... .

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[quote name='slim15' post='646750' date='Mar 28 2008, 12:38 AM']wow fast response there home..lol

I was trying to edit my post to show how stupid this topic is. (edit it to say the war of north ag doesnt fit...forgot dosnt..haha)

just googlr war of north ag and u see what u get.

U copied and pasted before I could edit. u gotta give me time, I had a long day, worked 14 hours in the factory.

please edit ur post for me to show the real meaning that I meant, thx

oh yea, im new, and been reading a few post here. I dont claim to be a college boy, im a blue collar worker so my opinions may seem simple. But I agrre with ya, please remove that racist video cause thats not what im about.

ynk u kind sir[/quote]
Anyone who does economics and history knows that Tom DiLorenzo is pretty much full of shit.

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[quote name='Homer_Rice' post='646788' date='Mar 28 2008, 08:19 AM']Anyone who does economics and history knows that Tom DiLorenzo is pretty much full of shit.[/quote]


Ok, thats cool, cause I dont claim to know anything. I barely made it through high school. I look forward to adding my input, but take it with a grain of salt, cause I am no college man.

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[quote name='Homer_Rice' post='646787' date='Mar 28 2008, 08:17 AM']Then at least he was right about one thing... .[/quote]

Aww, C'mon, give him more credit. How do you know the South won't rise again? :ninja:

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[quote name='Go Tory Go!' post='646917' date='Mar 28 2008, 06:29 PM']Aww, C'mon, give him more credit. How do you know the South won't rise again? :ninja:[/quote]
Seriously, I'm more charitable to the folks who went through that period than I am to folks who celebrate the "Confederate South" in the present. That particular ancestor was relatively accomplished, but also a product of the times.

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[quote name='slim15' post='646896' date='Mar 28 2008, 03:51 PM']Ok, thats cool, cause I dont claim to know anything. I barely made it through high school. I look forward to adding my input, but take it with a grain of salt, cause I am no college man.[/quote]
I dropped out of high school. It doesn't define me. I also went to college. That doesn't define me either. What does define me, even as I get older and am starting to slow down some, is hard work. Sweat, physical or mental, can make up for lack of smarts or lack of talent--at least partly so.

Oh, and I'm sure that Tom DiLorenzo would tell me that I'm full of shit. :D

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