Who Are You Scouting? 2013 Draft

[EnglishBengal]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1359591750' post='1212111']
WR Keenan Allen: found some better video of him. I still prefer Hopkins, but I'd put him above Patterson.
[/quote]

Agreed. I think Hopkins is more dynamic, and gets more YAC which is better suited to Gruden's WCO. Patterson is still raw and we cannot waste a 1st round pick on this kind of guy and what a year for things to bear fruit. Time to have polished guys ready to make an immediate impact and push this team over the top.

[EnglishBengal]

Just looked at Alex Okafor in more detail.

The more I watch the more I want him with the Raiders' pick at 37.

This guy is like Ansah but with a lot more polish.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='EnglishBengal' timestamp='1359643448' post='1212258']
Agreed. I think Hopkins is more dynamic, and gets more YAC which is better suited to Gruden's WCO. Patterson is still raw and we cannot waste a 1st round pick on this kind of guy and what a year for things to bear fruit. Time to have polished guys ready to make an immediate impact and push this team over the top.
[/quote]


I also think Robert Woods at pick #37 could come in and start right away. He's not as talented as the other guys being talked about, but IMO he's more pro ready than a Patterson or Hunter.

[quote name='EnglishBengal' timestamp='1359643650' post='1212259']
Just looked at Alex Okafor in more detail.

The more I watch the more I want him with the Raiders' pick at 37.

This guy is like Ansah but with a lot more polish.
[/quote]

I don't think they will need to go DE high, but he wouldn't be a bad pick there at all.

[Marvin]

Alec Ogletree- A bit of a conundrum. Elite physical talent. Really struggles when someone gets their hands on him. Doesn't seem to finish most of his hits. Seems pretty good in coverage. May fit at WLB, where he'll have some space to work.

Khaseem Greene- Not ideal physical talent. Always around the ball, violent hits, causes turnovers. May be outmatched by large linemen in the NFL.

It was interesting watching these guys back to back. Put them together and you have a HOF type player. I think Greene is the safer, albeit lower upside prospect.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1359654204' post='1212295']
Alec Ogletree- A bit of a conundrum. Elite physical talent. Really struggles when someone gets their hands on him. Doesn't seem to finish most of his hits. Seems pretty good in coverage. May fit at WLB, where he'll have some space to work.

Khaseem Greene- Not ideal physical talent. Always around the ball, violent hits, causes turnovers. May be outmatched by large linemen in the NFL.

It was interesting watching these guys back to back. Put them together and you have a HOF type player. I think Greene is the safer, albeit lower upside prospect.
[/quote]


I think you hit on both. I'm a fan of Greene, but he's not fast, which you'd hope for out of an undersized LB.

Ogletree is a top 20 talent, but IMO a 2nd round player based on play.

[Bengals1181]

Here's how I'd rank the safeties I've seen. IMO Vacarro and Elam are pretty close, its a matter of what a team wants more. Vacarro is better in coverage and a little more athletic IMO, Elam is a bigger hitter and probably offers a little more in the run game.


1a. Kenny Vacarro - IMO the best of the group in coverage, offers a lot of versatility. Texas used him like Polamalu
1b. Matt Elam - big hitter, solid in coverage, better in run support
3. DJ Swearinger - always making plays when you turn on the tape. good enough in coverage for the pros.
4. Tony Jefferson - probably neck and neck with swearinger, I gave DJ a slight edge due to cover ability
5. Eric Reid - was very high on him a year ago. Didn't do as much in 2012 but still very talented
6. Baccari Rambo - a good center field safety, but not something the Bengals need. They have that in Nelson already.
7. TJ McDonald - I've heard him described as a better covering Taylor Mays. Don't know if that's how I'd put it. Better in coverage yes, but not nearly as physical as Mays.
8. Johnathan Cyprien - solid, but nothing special IMO. If you're playing bottom rung competition, you should stand out.
9. Phillip Thomas - misses far too many tackles. I mean, A LOT.



IMO I'd be pretty happy with one of the top 5 guys. Overall a pretty solid safety class. One of the best in recent memory.

[sparky151]

What about Robert Lester?

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='sparky151' timestamp='1359744571' post='1212543']
What about Robert Lester?
[/quote]

haven't really watched him yet. I know he had a horrible Senior Bowl week. Some have said the worst of any player there.

[spicoli]

[quote name='sparky151' timestamp='1359744571' post='1212543']
What about Robert Lester?
[/quote]

covers about like Taylor Mays.

[EnglishBengal]

[quote name='sparky151' timestamp='1359744571' post='1212543']
What about Robert Lester?
[/quote]

He's on the same level if not worse than Crocker.

[texbengal]

[quote name='spicoli' timestamp='1359398765' post='1211392']
I think Chase Thomas is one of those guys that regardless of where he ends up at or what kind of system he ends up in, he's gonna always make plays.

3-4 DE/OLB or 4-3 OLB he'll end up being a core player for someone either way.
[/quote]

I agree. Really like him. From what I've read, he might be a 2nd or even 3rd round guy... which would surprise me, but I'd take him for sure.

[texbengal]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1359729591' post='1212438']
Here's how I'd rank the safeties I've seen. IMO Vacarro and Elam are pretty close, its a matter of what a team wants more. Vacarro is better in coverage and a little more athletic IMO, Elam is a bigger hitter and probably offers a little more in the run game.


1a. Kenny Vacarro - IMO the best of the group in coverage, offers a lot of versatility. Texas used him like Polamalu
1b. Matt Elam - big hitter, solid in coverage, better in run support
3. DJ Swearinger - always making plays when you turn on the tape. good enough in coverage for the pros.
4. Tony Jefferson - probably neck and neck with swearinger, I gave DJ a slight edge due to cover ability
5. Eric Reid - was very high on him a year ago. Didn't do as much in 2012 but still very talented
6. Baccari Rambo - a good center field safety, but not something the Bengals need. They have that in Nelson already.
7. TJ McDonald - I've heard him described as a better covering Taylor Mays. Don't know if that's how I'd put it. Better in coverage yes, but not nearly as physical as Mays.
8. Johnathan Cyprien - solid, but nothing special IMO. If you're playing bottom rung competition, you should stand out.
9. Phillip Thomas - misses far too many tackles. I mean, A LOT.



IMO I'd be pretty happy with one of the top 5 guys. Overall a pretty solid safety class. One of the best in recent memory.
[/quote]

Good list.

I'd actually switch Jefferson and Swearinger b/c I think the opposite - Swearinger is more physical while I think TJ is better in coverage. Both nice players. And I like Reid more than a number of folks here seem to.

I think McDonald blows. He can't cover at all - really stiff.

And I think Cyprien will probably be one of those guys who really rises prior to the draft. Physical guy who made plays in a conference (Sun Belt) that's been sending a number of productive guys to the NFL lately. Fla International has a pretty good program. I'll be interested to see how he runs at the Combine; he really impressed a lot of folks at the Sr. Bowl during the week.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='texbengal' timestamp='1359855318' post='1212732']


Good list.

I'd actually switch Jefferson and Swearinger b/c I think the opposite - Swearinger is more physical while I think TJ is better in coverage. Both nice players. And I like Reid more than a number of folks here seem to.

I think McDonald blows. He can't cover at all - really stiff.

And I think Cyprien will probably be one of those guys who really rises prior to the draft. Physical guy who made plays in a conference (Sun Belt) that's been sending a number of productive guys to the NFL lately. Fla International has a pretty good program. I'll be interested to see how he runs at the Combine; he really impressed a lot of folks at the Sr. Bowl during the week.
[/quote]


A year ago Reid would have been my top safety. IMO guys have emerged and passed him though.

IMO there is a gap between the top two and the next three. The order in each group may be interchangeable depending on preference.

[Bengals1181]

LB Gerald Hodges - like him, but don't love his lack of great speed. Still think his running mate Mauti was better. Probably a late 3rd guy like NaVorro Bowman, who was a little faster and better.

LB Jamie Collins - not what the Bengals need IMO. More DE than SLB at this point.

LB Alec Ogletree - still not feeling him at #21. Doesn't use his talent enough, would be a nice pick if they traded down, but I think he'll get overdrafted by someone.

LB Trevardo Williams - not at all what the Bengals need.

[EnglishBengal]

I think a lot of Ogletree's not shedding blocks at the point of attack could be resolved by him adding a further 5-10 pounds.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='EnglishBengal' timestamp='1360056025' post='1213133']
I think a lot of Ogletree's not shedding blocks at the point of attack could be resolved by him adding a further 5-10 pounds.
[/quote]


maybe, but IMO its more an effort issue. I did watch a couple games from 2011 last night and IMO he was better at attacking the line in 2011 than what I've watched from 2012.

[EnglishBengal]

Just watched some Lavar Edwards. He's unsepctacular but solid imo. He plays a Fanene type role. I think he would be an excellent fit in our d-line rotation. Possibly in rounds 3-4.

Heres the vid:

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWqheZP-rHI[/media]

[spicoli]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1359729591' post='1212438']
9. Phillip Thomas - misses far too many tackles. I mean, A LOT.
[/quote]

I've been doing a lot more research on Thomas over the last couple of days and you are right, the kid definitely was missing a lot of tackles in 2012....in his defense however, he was coming back from a pretty gruesome leg injury from '11 and was probably still pretty tentative to get real physical...before he got hurt he was extremely physical and was considered an excellent tackler, so that tells me that the further behind him that injury gets, the better he'll get as far as being aggressive and making the tackles he's supposed to make....whatever the problem was it definitely didn't affect his ball skills or his ability to cover any, because he was arguably the best S in the country in coverage and in forcing turnovers....his ball skills are elite and I think that'll make him a strong 2nd rd pick.

[spicoli]

DE Damontre Moore- he might actually be the most overrated prospect I've looked at in this entire draft...I think the people that are mocking this guy into their top 10 will be in for a very rude awakening by the time April 25th rolls around....I'll be flat out shocked if he even gets into the first round period, let alone the top 10.....I might take him in the late second and make him an OLB but even then I'd take his teammate Porter first.

[EnglishBengal]

QB Matt Scott, Arizona - Like this guy a lot, seems to have a little Dalton and a little Kaepernick in him.

 

CB Micah Hyde, Iowa - Projected as a late round guy, always seems to be around ball.  Would be good late round pick for us.

 

CB Tharold Simon, LSU - He's quite raw but big updside, tall CB which Zimmer likes.  If we could get him in rounds 5-6 it would be a good depth/developmental prospect, poor tackling really worries me at this point.

[spicoli]

Jonathan Cooper G North Carolina- wow this kid is a freakin stud! I've gotta think that as we get closer to the draft, this is a guy that's gonna get some serious attention as a possible top 20 pick, he's the most athletic G I've seen in a LONG time...IMO he's a better player than both Zeitler and DeCastro were last year when they came out....I'd love to have him at 21, he's got all-pro written all over him for years to come.

[EnglishBengal]

S DJ Swearinger - Like him but his habit of picking up needless penalties on highlight hits worries me a bit.  I honestly can't decide between Elam, Jefferson, Swearinger, Thomas as to who I like best.

 

Also did some research on Vaccaro and he's had off field issues in the past.  Wonder if this is enough to scare off the Bengals from drafting him.  Elam had a couple of DUI charges, in 2011 and 2012.

 

Also, don't like Eric Reid enough, coz he seems too stiff in coverage and his good year last year must have been enhanced playing with a CB like Claiborne imo.  This year he's had no such help this year and his performance has dropped.

[spicoli]

S DJ Swearinger - Like him but his habit of picking up needless penalties on highlight hits worries me a bit.  I honestly can't decide between Elam, Jefferson, Swearinger, Thomas as to who I like best.

 

Also did some research on Vaccaro and he's had off field issues in the past.  Wonder if this is enough to scare off the Bengals from drafting him.  Elam had a couple of DUI charges, in 2011 and 2012.

 

Also, don't like Eric Reid enough, coz he seems too stiff in coverage and his good year last year must have been enhanced playing with a CB like Claiborne imo.  This year he's had no such help this year and his performance has dropped.

 

that and the fact that he can't tackle for shit takes him out of the first round completely IMO. 

[akiliMVP]

Safety Jonathan Cyrpien, FIU: There's very little video of him but his stock is way up after his showing at the Senior bowl practices and game. He's leapfrogged Reid in my eyes and is solidly the #3 safety after Vaccaro and Elam. He has good size, 6'0 210, very physical, solid coverage skills and is a fiery vocal leader. I'd take him in the 2nd.

[EnglishBengal]

Safety Jonathan Cyrpien, FIU: There's very little video of him but his stock is way up after his showing at the Senior bowl practices and game. He's leapfrogged Reid in my eyes and is solidly the #3 safety after Vaccaro and Elam. He has good size, 6'0 210, very physical, solid coverage skills and is a fiery vocal leader. I'd take him in the 2nd.

Yeh I missed him off my list. I'm thinking about him also. Some scouts seem to think he'll take a year to get used to NFL speed. But I think he's more pro ready than many think. The one question mark I have with him is his supposed lack of straight line speed.