OL Offseason 2024

[T-Dub]

Always a few guys at each position that end up being good in the pros but aren't really on the media radar, usually because they're not at one of the football factory schools.

 

Unfortunately for us they tend to get scooped up by teams with good scouting departments. 

[sparky151]

There are always some good athletes to be found at lower division schools. But we're a long ways from Kenny Anderson of Augustana. I'm generally in favor of using at least picks in rounds 1-5 for FBS guys, mostly from the power 5. They're easier to evaluate as at least a few of their games each year they'll face future NFL opponents.

 

The OT from Northern Michigan who blew up the RAS last year hasn't been heard from in the NFL. 

[dex]

Fashanu/Fautanu/Fuaga -  so weird (and confusing) that 3 of the OL names the Bengals could select in the 1st round sound so remarkably similar.

[Jamie_B]

2 hours ago, sparky151 said:

Murphy and Newton are 3Ts and we have a pair of them already. There aren't any NTs worthy of day 1 selection. Sweat is probably the only one for day 2, unless you want Jenkins at NT at 300 lbs. There are several who will go on day 3. 

 

NT is the immediate need but with BJ Hill a FA next year too, I don't think we can say 3 Tech is off the table either.

[|BlackJesus|]

56 minutes ago, sparky151 said:

we're a long ways from Kenny Anderson of Augustana.

 

... A case can be made for not even drafting outside of the SEC, Big 10, or College Football Playoff teams at this point. Especially in rounds 1-4. 

[T-Dub]

40 minutes ago, BlackJesus said:

 

... A case can be made for not even drafting outside of the SEC, Big 10, or College Football Playoff teams at this point. Especially in rounds 1-4. 

 

Probably the smart move when your draft room is one big bowl of questionable coleslaw away from also serving as your family reunion.

[Inigo Montoya]

22 hours ago, BlackJesus said:

 

... A case can be made for not even drafting outside of the SEC, Big 10, or College Football Playoff teams at this point. Especially in rounds 1-4. 

You can thank the transfer portal for that.  Anyone can play just about anywhere now and promising talent from the smaller conferences can be easily poached by the big names.  You also see guys switching between top programs, which was much more rare previously.

[MichaelWeston]

I think RAS and production is good at all levels. the Toledo CB is probably a stud. 

[T-Dub]

1 hour ago, MichaelWeston said:

I think RAS and production is good at all levels. the Toledo CB is probably a stud. 

 

Think the big difference is experience, that same CB coming from Auburn is probably more ready for the pro game.  How big a deal that is to the team depends on how much they trust their coaches.

 

If they think the OL coach has made a 4th round pick into a starting LG, maybe they don't feel pressed to take that OT in the first 2 rounds.  If on the other hand they think he's made Pro Bowl vets look like 4th round picks, well,.  that's a bigger problem when he's also your only dedicated OL scout and keeps mumbling to himself about wide zones and ketchup.

 

To put it bluntly I'm going to be both a little surprised and more than a little relieved if they do manage to draft a good long-term RT.  At this point I have to hope they're due for one at random, not so much by being more capable.

[MichaelWeston]

 

LT	Brown 27	Carman 25	Cochran 25
LG	Volson 26	Ford 25
C	Karras 25	Lee 28	Gilliam
RG	Cappa 26	Hill 25	Kirkland
RT	Brown 25	Mims 29	Smith 25	Miller 27

 

Added Brown to replace Williams. Drafted Mims for a longterm starter at Tackle, Drafted Lee who actually seems really good despite the late pick. 48 starts at Miami and UCF. Added Eric Miller who had 42 career starts. Carman-Hill and Smith are all in their final year. I'd like them to add Scharpring back. 

 

Brian Allen is still out there, Greg Van Roten, Elfein, Feiler...lots of veterans. I hope we add one. 

[dex]

17 minutes ago, MichaelWeston said:

 

LT	Brown 27	Carman 25	Cochran 25
LG	Volson 26	Ford 25
C	Karras 25	Lee 28	Gilliam
RG	Cappa 26	Hill 25	Kirkland
RT	Brown 25	Mims 29	Smith 25	Miller 27

 

Added Brown to replace Williams. Drafted Mims for a longterm starter at Tackle, Drafted Lee who actually seems really good despite the late pick. 48 starts at Miami and UCF. Added Eric Miller who had 42 career starts. Carman-Hill and Smith are all in their final year. I'd like them to add Scharpring back. 

 

Brian Allen is still out there, Greg Van Roten, Elfein, Feiler...lots of veterans. I hope we add one. 

The reason why Lee was still available in the 7th was because of his size. He is a pure center, not big or strong enough to play guard. So they will need to have a center-guard combo guy to be active on gamedays even if Lee makes the 53 man roster. In that case, Lee would likely be a gameday active if Karras was unable to play in that game.

[sparky151]

I expect them to sign an inexpensive vet, most likely Scharping. I also wouldn't be surprised if Karras is extended for a year, maybe even two.

 

The starting 5 are clear unless Mims balls out in camp and wins the job before game 1. More likely they start Trent Brown as long as he's healthy while getting Mims as much action as he can absorb. The 4 backups on the 53 will likely be Mims, Ford, a vet like Scharping, and Carman. Lee, Kirkland, and at least 1 more will be on the PS. 

[T-Dub]

8 minutes ago, sparky151 said:

Ford, a vet like Scharping, and Carman

 

Have to think they can upgrade at least one of those between now & September

[MichaelWeston]

Probably 8 locks on the roster already?

 

Mims-Brown-Brown-Karras-Volson-Cappa-Lee-Ford

[dex]

8 minutes ago, MichaelWeston said:

Probably 8 locks on the roster already?

 

Mims-Brown-Brown-Karras-Volson-Cappa-Lee-Ford

I don't know if I would classify Lee as a lock. He was a late 7th round draft pick who can only play center. I feel like Lee would have to prove himself to be a truly promising center in training camp to get a roster spot over a decent center-guard who can cover multiple positions.

[dex]

Fan poll from The Athletic:

 

What is your confidence level in the offensive line?

ANSWER	2024	2023	2022
5 (most confident)	2.7	3.2	8.7
4	35.4	47.1	66.3
3	52.3	45.4	24.6
2	8.6	3.9	0.3
1 (least confident)	1	0.4	0.1

I used to say the Bengals don’t need the 1988 offensive line to protect Burrow for the offense to thrive. As the years go on, I’m confident the 1988 Bengals’ offensive line could go out there in front of Burrow and Bengals fans would still vote three as their level of confidence. There’s just too much scar tissue from the early Burrow years and too much fear of injury to ever feel great about the state of the starting five. That said, for the second straight year this looks like the best offensive line to play in front of Burrow. Add in the potential of Amarius Mims on the outside and the Bengals have done a solid job keeping professional protection in front of the franchise quarterback. These results should probably be higher, but given the recent history, I understand the reaction.

[T-Dub]

I'd say about 2.5 

 

They replaced one guy but his replacement gets hurt every year. The rest are the same guys that were bad last year. Aside from Mims there's not much upside to be found anywhere among the backups.

 

I suspect the biggest improvement will come from the new OC if he indeed runs a more balanced scheme.

[sparky151]

My concern is that we were mediocre last year despite excellent injury luck. If we're less lucky on that front this year, it could hurt. If Karras or Cappa miss an extended period, we're hosed. Ford is a backup for a reason, Hill hasn't earned playing time after 3 years and Lee is a rookie 7th rounder.

[T-Dub]

3 hours ago, sparky151 said:

My concern is that we were mediocre last year despite excellent injury luck. If we're less lucky on that front this year, it could hurt. If Karras or Cappa miss an extended period, we're hosed. Ford is a backup for a reason, Hill hasn't earned playing time after 3 years and Lee is a rookie 7th rounder.

 

Not to be all doomsayer about it but teams can't really count on starting the same 5 OL the entire season + playoffs. Capable backups are a necessity, even more so when two of the starters are over 30 & 2 others aren't far behind.

 

Once again hard to understand why they're trying to be 7 deep at WR yet don't have a backup guard that's not a liability.

[dex]

Most NFL analysts have the Bengals OL ranked as middle of the pack...14-18 range. Warren Sharp has them ranked 9th, although it doesn't specify whether it is just starters are not. Either way seems a little too high to me.

 

 

[T-Dub]

5 minutes ago, dex said:

Most NFL analysts have the Bengals OL ranked as middle of the pack...14-18 range. Warren Sharp has them ranked 9th, although it doesn't specify whether it is just starters are not. Either way seems a little too high to me.

 

 

 

Tied for 7th in sacks allowed last year.  I don't think we can blame all of that on Jonah. Bottom 10 to top 10 does seem overly optimistic, scheme-related or not.

[dex]

Excerpt from The Athletic - Paul Dehner:

 

Offensive line play is still hard to pin down — and good news for the Bengals

To the eye, the Bengals have fixed their offensive line issues with serviceability. They haven’t attacked it with stars, but rather with midlevel signings and investment. They rank 14th in spending on the offensive line despite dipping into free agency for starters each of the past three seasons.

Bengals OL salary rankings

POS ▼	PLAYER	AAV	POS AAV RANK
RT	Trent Brown	$4.8M	25th
RG	Alex Cappa	$8.8M	12th
LT	Orlando Brown Jr.	$16.0M	10th
LG	Cordell Volson	$1.1M	Rookie deal
C	Ted Karras	$6.0M	9th

No Bengals starter is paid in the top eight of their position, but the investment has lived in that next tier.

Putting a ranking on offensive line play is still a considerable challenge and is being studied closely by the league right now.

Sharp plotted a rosy picture of the offensive line, ranking it ninth in the league by his values. Over at Pro Football Focus, it ranked Cincinnati 21st, specifically pointing to concern about Orlando Brown Jr.’s dip to a career-low 66.1 grade in its system last year. The FTN Almanac points to Alex Cappa showing signs of decline at 29 years old, coming off a year he dropped to 16th in pressure rate allowed and 24th in blown block rate in run game.

The Bengals know what poor offensive line play looks like, and this projected group is a far cry from the days of the 2021-22 playoff run. The analytics hinting at both good and bad sides of the spectrum suggest somewhere in the middle is probably what we should expect.

[Le Tigre]

Why are so many “evaluations” based on what a player is paid? 
 

I get the “not worth the amount paid” argument…but if the guy(s) play well…the amount of coin in his pocket doesn’t matter a lick. 
 

My 20-year old car might not be worth the money put into it…but it runs like an MVP. 

[dex]

35 minutes ago, Le Tigre said:

Why are so many “evaluations” based on what a player is paid? 
 

I get the “not worth the amount paid” argument…but if the guy(s) play well…the amount of coin in his pocket doesn’t matter a lick. 
 

My 20-year old car might not be worth the money put into it…but it runs like an MVP. 

Primarily this is just about how much of the available salary cap space is spent on a particular position group (compared to the rest of the NFL teams).  

[T-Dub]

5 hours ago, dex said:

Primarily this is just about how much of the available salary cap space is spent on a particular position group (compared to the rest of the NFL teams).  

 

Which I'll worry about when and if this team ever comes within rock throwing distance of the salary cap.  So long as they're maintaining a $50 million-plus cushion for birthday ponies kinda DGAF who is making what.  They can play or they can't, if not then no discount pricing is going to excuse putting them on the field.